shame it's been removed. Thanks anyway Kim! is there any link with autism and ADHD does anyone know? a nursery teacher asked me yesterday if one of my grandsons has it or been diagnosed with it? he is 3. I nearly fell through the floor. She didn't say that she thought he had it but it was the way she seemed to say it. I just said he was boisterous and that at his other playschool I have had good reports, I couldn't say much more. He hasn't even started at this nursery yet, she was just observing him as we visited the nursery school for a visit. His mum has asperger's that is why I have just thought about it and about any links. Anyone got any thoughts on it? thanks again Kim.
There was another thread started on the same subject (Eugene). Don't know if that's still there.
Reweaving the Autistic Tapestry: Autism, Asperger's Syndrome and ADHD
Lisa Blakemore-Brown
Synopsis
This text analyzes the links between ADHD (Attention Deficit Hyperactivity Syndrome) and those disorders on the Autistic spectrum. It uses the metaphor of a tapestry to explain to parents and professionals the interwoven nature of these disorders. Case studies are described alongside drawn tapetries toshow how this simple visual method can easily be used as a construct to define rich and unique personal landscapes. The author emphasizes that evidence of combined overactivity and signs of autistic behaviour should lead us to take into greater consideraton early intensive system intervention, which may interfere with the development of autism. There is a chapter explaining what is meant by the use of the various terms and expressions which is very useful to parents and professionals alike.In an informed way Ms Blakemore-Brown explains how mis diagnoses can occur because the wider picture is ignored or the child does not quite fit the criteria for any particular disorder and therefore is never given any diagnoses.Also included is a check list for Autism and ADHD and different interventions, therapies and diets which can help some children.
The ADHD-Autism Connection: A Step Toward More Accurate Diagnoses and Effective Treatments
Diane Kennedy
This book has the historical distinction of unifying ADHD with the autistic spectrum and making it understood how widely the spectrum ranges. I have both attention deficit and asperger's, and this book's comparative tables of their traits are fantastically illuminating. A must for anyone who has yet to be convinced of how closely related they are: you will be.
shame it's been removed. Thanks anyway Kim! is there any link with autism and ADHD does anyone know? a nursery teacher asked me yesterday if one of my grandsons has it or been diagnosed with it? he is 3. I nearly fell through the floor. She didn't say that she thought he had it but it was the way she seemed to say it. I just said he was boisterous and that at his other playschool I have had good reports, I couldn't say much more. He hasn't even started at this nursery yet, she was just observing him as we visited the nursery school for a visit. His mum has asperger's that is why I have just thought about it and about any links. Anyone got any thoughts on it? thanks again Kim.
Wow, 4 pages <beams> I'm so pleased people are finding this a useful thread!
As for the autism/adhd debate - my own view is that they are all part of the same spectrum. They are generally percieved as two separate conditions but there are many children who get a dual diagnosis because neither label exactly fits their "symptoms". One thing though is that it is now widely accepted that ASDs are genetic, so yes, with a mum who has AS there's a better than average chance he will have it, or a related condition.
Fantastic that the nursery teacher spotted it - such a relief to know people are becoming more aware and catching this early - so much better hope for the future if we can put the right support in place in the early stages. It may have come as a bit of a shock to the sysytem but at least you know the nursery are clued up.
Might be worth a word with your grandson's GP if he has a good one, as at this age you stand a better chance of being referred to a child development centre if you have one locally, and seeing professionals under one roof rather than being bounced from hospitals to clinics etc as he gets older. If it turns out the teacher was spot on, while you may not feel particularly happy about it, be grateful for the early warning!
It's so wierd that there are people of my generation out there, trying to get a diagnosis often without parents help or understanding, and there are other parents of younger children, trying desperately to get a diagnosis for their children.
My father had the audacity to say that in his day, 'we didn't have all these excuses for things'. :mad:
No instead you (his generation) turned to drink and other forms of abusive behaviour in order to avoid having to face the problems our generation now has to face.
It must be so nice to have parents that not only care enough to find a reason for thier children's behavioural problems but that go out of their way to not only cope with the problems but to make sure they don't add to them.
I admire all the parents on here, I'm sure your support will help your children not only cope with have AS but will mean they have the chance of becoming fully developed adults who can integrate into society much better than my generation.
There seems to be a school of thought that Autism and ADHD are somehow connected. I can't find any links to websites at the mo but will post if I find one.
Yes, there is a definite link between ADHD & Autism. If you are on the autistic spectrum, you have a higher chance of having ADHD. I don't think it works the other way though (i.e. not mutually exclusive).
My son has Aspergers' , ADHD, a learning disability, Tourette's syndrome and epilepsy. All these, while not common, are far from unusual to have together.
It's so wierd that there are people of my generation out there, trying to get a diagnosis often without parents help or understanding, and there are other parents of younger children, trying desperately to get a diagnosis for their children.
My father had the audacity to say that in his day, 'we didn't have all these excuses for things'. :mad:
No instead you (his generation) turned to drink and other forms of abusive behaviour in order to avoid having to face the problems our generation now has to face.
It must be so nice to have parents that not only care enough to find a reason for thier children's behavioural problems but that go out of their way to not only cope with the problems but to make sure they don't add to them.
I admire all the parents on here, I'm sure your support will help your children not only cope with have AS but will mean they have the chance of becoming fully developed adults who can integrate into society much better than my generation.
Oh, how I can relate to that MrFreeze! My mother-in-law just cannot accept my son's diagonsis of Asperger's etc. She says it is 'a new fandangled excuse for bad behaviour and poor parenting skills'. This has led to a few family arguments, as you can imagine!
I've not said this to anyone else before, but I strongly think I may have Asperger's as well. It has never been diagnosed (I'm 41 now), and, to be honest, I am frightened of broaching the subject with my GP. I suffer with stress, anxiety and depression, and find verbal communication difficult . Crowds are a particular nightmare, as there are so many people talking at once, and I just can't 'tune out' or 'tune in' to anything. This has recently got worse, and I find shopping in cities and shopping malls very stressful.
Oh, how I can relate to that MrFreeze! My mother-in-law just cannot accept my son's diagonsis of Asperger's etc. She says it is 'a new fandangled excuse for bad behaviour and poor parenting skills'. This has led to a few family arguments, as you can imagine!
:eek: Don't talk to me about mother in laws. Mine once said there was nothing wrong with my son that couldn't be cured by me going out to work and letting someone else look after him.... honest! :mad:
Oh, how I can relate to that MrFreeze! My mother-in-law just cannot accept my son's diagonsis of Asperger's etc. She says it is 'a new fandangled excuse for bad behaviour and poor parenting skills'. This has led to a few family arguments, as you can imagine!
Hmm yeah if it is caused by 'poor parenting skills' then it's the Grandparent's poor skills that are the problem.
There is no way my dad is a 'normal' person, if he doesn't have AS he has something wrong with him.
Autism/ Asperger's isn't a problem it's how it's dealt with that is.
I've not said this to anyone else before, but I strongly think I may have Asperger's as well. It has never been diagnosed (I'm 41 now), and, to be honest, I am frightened of broaching the subject with my GP. I suffer with stress, anxiety and depression, and find verbal communication difficult . Crowds are a particular nightmare, as there are so many people talking at once, and I just can't 'tune out' or 'tune in' to anything. This has recently got worse, and I find shopping in cities and shopping malls very stressful.
have you tried any types of medication to help with anxiety? why are you afraid to talk to your GP about it? do you fear his/her reaction or what the consequences may be if you do? or is it the fear of revealing this part of yourself to another person?
I can empathise with you and wish you well, it must be so very stressful for you thinking about this each day and not being able to tell anyone. Good luck with finding some help or support. It's not easy, you are so brave to talk about it here.
Wow, 4 pages <beams> I'm so pleased people are finding this a useful thread!
As for the autism/adhd debate - my own view is that they are all part of the same spectrum. They are generally percieved as two separate conditions but there are many children who get a dual diagnosis because neither label exactly fits their "symptoms". One thing though is that it is now widely accepted that ASDs are genetic, so yes, with a mum who has AS there's a better than average chance he will have it, or a related condition.
Fantastic that the nursery teacher spotted it - such a relief to know people are becoming more aware and catching this early - so much better hope for the future if we can put the right support in place in the early stages. It may have come as a bit of a shock to the sysytem but at least you know the nursery are clued up.
Might be worth a word with your grandson's GP if he has a good one, as at this age you stand a better chance of being referred to a child development centre if you have one locally, and seeing professionals under one roof rather than being bounced from hospitals to clinics etc as he gets older. If it turns out the teacher was spot on, while you may not feel particularly happy about it, be grateful for the early warning!
Yes you have raised a few points. I am not sure about the ADHD and will keep an open mind. The grandson mentioned in my post is one of twins, they are non identical boys aged three. I love them dearly and have parental responsibility and look after them full time. Because I had girls I suppose I have made comparisons, and your memory does fade over a lot of the challenges that were experienced over 26 years. I agree with you that at least the nursery teacher was watching out and observing their behaviour and that can be helpful. It seems these things are talked about more now and that can only help the children. Thank you for your contributions and I must say it's been amazing reading all the posts.
Reweaving the Autistic Tapestry: Autism, Asperger's Syndrome and ADHD
Lisa Blakemore-Brown
Synopsis
This text analyzes the links between ADHD (Attention Deficit Hyperactivity Syndrome) and those disorders on the Autistic spectrum. It uses the metaphor of a tapestry to explain to parents and professionals the interwoven nature of these disorders. Case studies are described alongside drawn tapetries toshow how this simple visual method can easily be used as a construct to define rich and unique personal landscapes. The author emphasizes that evidence of combined overactivity and signs of autistic behaviour should lead us to take into greater consideraton early intensive system intervention, which may interfere with the development of autism. There is a chapter explaining what is meant by the use of the various terms and expressions which is very useful to parents and professionals alike.In an informed way Ms Blakemore-Brown explains how mis diagnoses can occur because the wider picture is ignored or the child does not quite fit the criteria for any particular disorder and therefore is never given any diagnoses.Also included is a check list for Autism and ADHD and different interventions, therapies and diets which can help some children.
The ADHD-Autism Connection: A Step Toward More Accurate Diagnoses and Effective Treatments
Diane Kennedy
This book has the historical distinction of unifying ADHD with the autistic spectrum and making it understood how widely the spectrum ranges. I have both attention deficit and asperger's, and this book's comparative tables of their traits are fantastically illuminating. A must for anyone who has yet to be convinced of how closely related they are: you will be.
thanks again Kim must check these out! you are so helpful!
There seems to be a school of thought that Autism and ADHD are somehow connected. I can't find any links to websites at the mo but will post if I find one.
One thing I wanted to check with Aspies and parents of Aspies.
I find it very difficult to learn certain things from week to week, eg doing a 1hr language class each week.
But if I immerse myself for a whole week or more 24hrs a day, I can learn something faster than other people. It's like the 'dam' of the aspergers doesn't get broken with a week by week trickle but when their is a flood of info (it has to be one type of info or it's too much) I can absorb it like a sponge.
Of course even normal people find it easier to learn things in one go, but they can also learn weekly unlike me.
'Course not Everyone's watching Live8, that's all
I've been trying to stay off DS because I get sucked into the BB forum and end up getting very cross. And I really don't have the time for it at the moment - it's nearly the end of another school year and my son is having the usual meltdown. To add to that, his undiagnosed dad has been given a new project at work, but again only temporarily, and you know how uncertainty about the future affects Aspies... - <sighs> -
I read your post about how you learn best and it makes me wonder if there is something to be said for intensive courses for children with AS rather than short lessons changing subject at regular intervals throughout the day. Maybe even spending a whole day on maths, the next on science, and so on, would help them to learn. Might benefit non-Aspies too. Hmmmmm..... :cool:
At my daughters school every fortnight they have a day of one subject - gives much more scope to really get into something, it can be made more interesting, and there isn't a rush to try and explain everything quickly, with little time for answering questions if someone doesn't understand.
I do know a few kids with AS and they are able to focus for a long time on one thing if its what they want to do. for example, a musical child with AS can work on the same peice of music for 2 hours repeating it over and over to get it right, whereas the majority of children, however keen , would be unlikely to stick to one piece for more than say half an hour.
In answer to mrfreeze, I don't know. I know that in my current line of work, I can learn 85-90% of a process fairly quickly, then I get stuck, and it takes me a long long time to get that last 10-15%.
Even then, I get into problems. I find that I'm fine as long as I get a good start and everything stays fine. Once something goes wrong, however, I find it very difficult to get my rhythm back. It's as though I get clumsier, and things take that little bit longer, so I can't get things back on an even keel. I've also noticed I'm affected far more by equipment problems than my colleagues, some things they seem to take in their stride cause me real troubles.
Thanks for the replies, I forgot Live 8 might have kept people busy, I couldn't get into it for some reason.
I'm not sure if it's just me or the Aspergers but I can't lve life '9 to 5' or 'day to day', like NT's. I need to learn something by immersing myself into it, and the same goes with jobs and relationships. I can't spend 8hrs at work (especially if it's just for the money) and then come home go out for 2 or 3 hrs to do a hobby and then spend 1 or 2 hrs with a partner.
Take the Aspergers support group for example. 1 3hr meeting every month. That's only 36hrs a year. Compare that to the 36hrs of agony I spent last weekend, how can the former be expected to cancel out the other?
Again I think it's the Aspie perception of time that might be the problem.
Altho we all have the same experience I think us Aspie's have an exaggerated perception of time. Probably because we see so much detail and can't filter things out as well as NT's.
My favourite example of learning is the Karate Kid.
The way Mr Miyagi helps Daniel to learn Karate by getting him to Wash cars, paint fences and wax floors, is ow I need to learn things. Not only is he doing something positive and constructive (eg painting the fences) but he is building up stamina and muscle reactions.
Wow, its ages since ive watched the Karate Kid, an excellent film.
Regarding not liking working a normal 8 hours etc etc - I think maybe its not just the apserers that would make you feel like that, as I know people like that, and its something I have struggled with in the past. I always put it down to people being content in different ways, and having different levels of satisfaction. Also, people like musicians tend to find 'normal' hours very tough, maybe a lot of them have Aspergers, or a tendancy, maybe there is a connection.
It does seem crazy that your support group is only once a month, thats a long time to wait. I have been known to spend all night talking through things, and could still have continued longer had the 'normal' things not got in the way.
Regarding not liking working a normal 8 hours etc etc - I think maybe its not just the apserers that would make you feel like that, as I know people like that, and its something I have struggled with in the past.
Yes, I agree with that. I've worked in lots of 9-5 type-environments but I much prefer being self-employed and choosing my own routines (even though I have to work significantly longer hours than average).
Yes, I agree with that. I've worked in lots of 9-5 type-environments but I much prefer being self-employed and choosing my own routines (even though I have to work significantly longer hours than average).
I gave up on a good routine job, and am also self employed, and tho financially it was a crazy decision, it was the best one by far and I am much happier.
I read your post about how you learn best and it makes me wonder if there is something to be said for intensive courses for children with AS rather than short lessons changing subject at regular intervals throughout the day. Maybe even spending a whole day on maths, the next on science, and so on, would help them to learn. Might benefit non-Aspies too. Hmmmmm..... :cool:
I reckon Steiner schools are better for kids with Asperger's (altho I think they are better for everyone full stop).
They seem to be more focused on the child rather than on the subject.
Psychologist Simon Baron-Cohen and his colleagues at Cambridge's Autism Research Centre have created the Autism-Spectrum Quotient, or AQ, as a measure of the extent of autistic traits in adults.Take the test here!
Eighty percent of those diagnosed with autism or a related disorder scored 32 or higher. I scored 14.
Comments
There's a mention here. Haven't read it thoroughly but it may provide further links.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conditions_comorbid_to_autism_spectrum_disorders
Also these books:
Reweaving the Autistic Tapestry: Autism, Asperger's Syndrome and ADHD
Lisa Blakemore-Brown
Synopsis
This text analyzes the links between ADHD (Attention Deficit Hyperactivity Syndrome) and those disorders on the Autistic spectrum. It uses the metaphor of a tapestry to explain to parents and professionals the interwoven nature of these disorders. Case studies are described alongside drawn tapetries toshow how this simple visual method can easily be used as a construct to define rich and unique personal landscapes. The author emphasizes that evidence of combined overactivity and signs of autistic behaviour should lead us to take into greater consideraton early intensive system intervention, which may interfere with the development of autism. There is a chapter explaining what is meant by the use of the various terms and expressions which is very useful to parents and professionals alike.In an informed way Ms Blakemore-Brown explains how mis diagnoses can occur because the wider picture is ignored or the child does not quite fit the criteria for any particular disorder and therefore is never given any diagnoses.Also included is a check list for Autism and ADHD and different interventions, therapies and diets which can help some children.
The ADHD-Autism Connection: A Step Toward More Accurate Diagnoses and Effective Treatments
Diane Kennedy
This book has the historical distinction of unifying ADHD with the autistic spectrum and making it understood how widely the spectrum ranges. I have both attention deficit and asperger's, and this book's comparative tables of their traits are fantastically illuminating. A must for anyone who has yet to be convinced of how closely related they are: you will be.
Wow, 4 pages <beams> I'm so pleased people are finding this a useful thread!
As for the autism/adhd debate - my own view is that they are all part of the same spectrum. They are generally percieved as two separate conditions but there are many children who get a dual diagnosis because neither label exactly fits their "symptoms". One thing though is that it is now widely accepted that ASDs are genetic, so yes, with a mum who has AS there's a better than average chance he will have it, or a related condition.
Fantastic that the nursery teacher spotted it - such a relief to know people are becoming more aware and catching this early - so much better hope for the future if we can put the right support in place in the early stages. It may have come as a bit of a shock to the sysytem but at least you know the nursery are clued up.
Might be worth a word with your grandson's GP if he has a good one, as at this age you stand a better chance of being referred to a child development centre if you have one locally, and seeing professionals under one roof rather than being bounced from hospitals to clinics etc as he gets older. If it turns out the teacher was spot on, while you may not feel particularly happy about it, be grateful for the early warning!
My father had the audacity to say that in his day, 'we didn't have all these excuses for things'. :mad:
No instead you (his generation) turned to drink and other forms of abusive behaviour in order to avoid having to face the problems our generation now has to face.
It must be so nice to have parents that not only care enough to find a reason for thier children's behavioural problems but that go out of their way to not only cope with the problems but to make sure they don't add to them.
I admire all the parents on here, I'm sure your support will help your children not only cope with have AS but will mean they have the chance of becoming fully developed adults who can integrate into society much better than my generation.
Yes, there is a definite link between ADHD & Autism. If you are on the autistic spectrum, you have a higher chance of having ADHD. I don't think it works the other way though (i.e. not mutually exclusive).
My son has Aspergers' , ADHD, a learning disability, Tourette's syndrome and epilepsy. All these, while not common, are far from unusual to have together.
Oh, how I can relate to that MrFreeze! My mother-in-law just cannot accept my son's diagonsis of Asperger's etc. She says it is 'a new fandangled excuse for bad behaviour and poor parenting skills'. This has led to a few family arguments, as you can imagine!
:eek: Don't talk to me about mother in laws. Mine once said there was nothing wrong with my son that couldn't be cured by me going out to work and letting someone else look after him.... honest! :mad:
Hmm yeah if it is caused by 'poor parenting skills' then it's the Grandparent's poor skills that are the problem.
There is no way my dad is a 'normal' person, if he doesn't have AS he has something wrong with him.
Autism/ Asperger's isn't a problem it's how it's dealt with that is.
have you tried any types of medication to help with anxiety? why are you afraid to talk to your GP about it? do you fear his/her reaction or what the consequences may be if you do? or is it the fear of revealing this part of yourself to another person?
I can empathise with you and wish you well, it must be so very stressful for you thinking about this each day and not being able to tell anyone. Good luck with finding some help or support. It's not easy, you are so brave to talk about it here.
Yes you have raised a few points. I am not sure about the ADHD and will keep an open mind. The grandson mentioned in my post is one of twins, they are non identical boys aged three. I love them dearly and have parental responsibility and look after them full time. Because I had girls I suppose I have made comparisons, and your memory does fade over a lot of the challenges that were experienced over 26 years. I agree with you that at least the nursery teacher was watching out and observing their behaviour and that can be helpful. It seems these things are talked about more now and that can only help the children. Thank you for your contributions and I must say it's been amazing reading all the posts.
thanks again Kim must check these out! you are so helpful!
thanks for that! I need to check these out!
I find it very difficult to learn certain things from week to week, eg doing a 1hr language class each week.
But if I immerse myself for a whole week or more 24hrs a day, I can learn something faster than other people. It's like the 'dam' of the aspergers doesn't get broken with a week by week trickle but when their is a flood of info (it has to be one type of info or it's too much) I can absorb it like a sponge.
Of course even normal people find it easier to learn things in one go, but they can also learn weekly unlike me.
I've been trying to stay off DS because I get sucked into the BB forum and end up getting very cross. And I really don't have the time for it at the moment - it's nearly the end of another school year and my son is having the usual meltdown. To add to that, his undiagnosed dad has been given a new project at work, but again only temporarily, and you know how uncertainty about the future affects Aspies... - <sighs> -
I read your post about how you learn best and it makes me wonder if there is something to be said for intensive courses for children with AS rather than short lessons changing subject at regular intervals throughout the day. Maybe even spending a whole day on maths, the next on science, and so on, would help them to learn. Might benefit non-Aspies too. Hmmmmm..... :cool:
I do know a few kids with AS and they are able to focus for a long time on one thing if its what they want to do. for example, a musical child with AS can work on the same peice of music for 2 hours repeating it over and over to get it right, whereas the majority of children, however keen , would be unlikely to stick to one piece for more than say half an hour.
Even then, I get into problems. I find that I'm fine as long as I get a good start and everything stays fine. Once something goes wrong, however, I find it very difficult to get my rhythm back. It's as though I get clumsier, and things take that little bit longer, so I can't get things back on an even keel. I've also noticed I'm affected far more by equipment problems than my colleagues, some things they seem to take in their stride cause me real troubles.
I'm not sure if it's just me or the Aspergers but I can't lve life '9 to 5' or 'day to day', like NT's. I need to learn something by immersing myself into it, and the same goes with jobs and relationships. I can't spend 8hrs at work (especially if it's just for the money) and then come home go out for 2 or 3 hrs to do a hobby and then spend 1 or 2 hrs with a partner.
Take the Aspergers support group for example. 1 3hr meeting every month. That's only 36hrs a year. Compare that to the 36hrs of agony I spent last weekend, how can the former be expected to cancel out the other?
Again I think it's the Aspie perception of time that might be the problem.
Altho we all have the same experience I think us Aspie's have an exaggerated perception of time. Probably because we see so much detail and can't filter things out as well as NT's.
My favourite example of learning is the Karate Kid.
The way Mr Miyagi helps Daniel to learn Karate by getting him to Wash cars, paint fences and wax floors, is ow I need to learn things. Not only is he doing something positive and constructive (eg painting the fences) but he is building up stamina and muscle reactions.
Regarding not liking working a normal 8 hours etc etc - I think maybe its not just the apserers that would make you feel like that, as I know people like that, and its something I have struggled with in the past. I always put it down to people being content in different ways, and having different levels of satisfaction. Also, people like musicians tend to find 'normal' hours very tough, maybe a lot of them have Aspergers, or a tendancy, maybe there is a connection.
It does seem crazy that your support group is only once a month, thats a long time to wait. I have been known to spend all night talking through things, and could still have continued longer had the 'normal' things not got in the way.
Yes, I agree with that. I've worked in lots of 9-5 type-environments but I much prefer being self-employed and choosing my own routines (even though I have to work significantly longer hours than average).
I gave up on a good routine job, and am also self employed, and tho financially it was a crazy decision, it was the best one by far and I am much happier.
I reckon Steiner schools are better for kids with Asperger's (altho I think they are better for everyone full stop).
They seem to be more focused on the child rather than on the subject.
Eighty percent of those diagnosed with autism or a related disorder scored 32 or higher. I scored 14.