You are honestly trying to make it sound like he did nothing wrong at all "All he did was try to rob them" really that's what you think.
It's a sad world when the robber is thought of as the poor victim
He was going into the bookies to rob money, presumably to feed his drug habit. He wasn't going to kill anyone as he had a replica gun. And now he is dead.
No, of course not. I'm just saying that it is not easy to manage a situation like that. Even in familiar surroundings where it is expected and you have lots of help and trained staff and you don't think that you are about to be killed, it can go wrong.
Some people are. They are proudly exclaiming it in this thread.
He was going into the bookies to rob money, presumably to feed his drug habit. He wasn't going to kill anyone as he had a replica gun. And now he is dead.
Well though luck then isn't it at the time they thought their lives were in danger.
No matter how you try to spin it he is not the victim he tried to push his luck and got called out on it
He was going into the bookies to rob money, presumably to feed his drug habit. He wasn't going to kill anyone as he had a replica gun. And now he is dead.
So when you had the two guns pointed at you, could you tell immediately whether they were real guns or replica?
They didn't even need to let him up. Just letting him breathe would have done.
Did they know they were stopping him do you know that's what killed him should they have really asked this man who for all they know was about to kill them if he was comfortable
Did they know they were stopping him do you know that's what killed him should they have really asked this man who for all they know was about to kill them if he was comfortable
Did they know they were stopping him do you know that's what killed him should they have really asked this man who for all they know was about to kill them if he was comfortable
Well assuming heart attack, stroke, necrotising fascilitis or umbongo fever didn't kill him, it's a fair bet he suffocated.
They had a duty of care to make sure this didn't happen.
They didn't even need to let him up. Just letting him breathe would have done.
IMO opinion they went too far, but I wonder if in that situation they were really thinking straight. With all the adrenaline pumping and every primal instinct telling them they needed to protect themselves would they even be able to stop if they wanted to? Its such a base instinct to protect oneself from a threat, so to what extent was it a conscious action and what was natural instinct. I guess what I am trying to say is to what extent can we really control our behaviour in such a heightened situation?
That only applies to the police not the general public
No it doesn't. If you take it upon yourself to make a citizens arrest and keep someone in custody til the police arrive then you have a duty of care to them.
If there are no criminal proceedings then lawyers4u will have a field day on behalf of his family.
He was going into the bookies to rob money, presumably to feed his drug habit. He wasn't going to kill anyone as he had a replica gun. And now he is dead.
And the moral of the story is that all people behind a cash desk should assume that all robbers have replica guns and so there is no need to hand over the money.
No it doesn't. If you take it upon yourself to make a citizens arrest and keep someone in custody til the police arrive then you have a duty of care to them.
If there are no criminal proceedings then lawyers4u will have a field day on behalf of his family.
If you have training and experience, it is still difficult.
Maybe not in a self defence class where you are trying to restrain your friend who is standing in bare feet on a crash mat. But in real life when someone is trying to hurt you (or themselves) and you are scared and have had no training in it, it must be really difficult.
I'm not saying that what they did was a good thing, but I can understand how it happened. I can't say that if I was in a similar situation, that I could have handled it better.
If there are no criminal proceedings then lawyers4u will have a field day on behalf of his family.
The very very sad thing is maybe for once you are right that is why the country is going down the shitter as if you attack a criminal who maybe trying to rob or hurt you then you can be the one to get into trouble it doesn't matter if he wants to kill you or your family if you touch him/her they will sue
If you have training and experience, it is still difficult.
Maybe not in a self defence class where you are trying to restrain your friend who is standing in bare feet on a crash mat. But in real life when someone is trying to hurt you (or themselves) and you are scared and have had no training in it, it must be really difficult.
I'm not saying that what they did was a good thing, but I can understand how it happened. I can't say that if I was in a similar situation, that I could have handled it better.
I can state with absolute certainty that if I , along with someone else, ever had to restrain someone then they would be able to breathe. It is quite fundamental.
I can state with absolute certainty that if I , along with someone else, ever had to restrain someone then they would be able to breathe. It is quite fundamental.
TBH I seriously doubt at that moment in time that would run though your head you would be to busy thinking and trying to save your own life
Comments
He was going into the bookies to rob money, presumably to feed his drug habit. He wasn't going to kill anyone as he had a replica gun. And now he is dead.
Some people are. They are proudly exclaiming it in this thread.
Well though luck then isn't it at the time they thought their lives were in danger.
No matter how you try to spin it he is not the victim he tried to push his luck and got called out on it
They were in no danger while sat on him. They just couldn't be bothered making sure he stayed alive. Perhaps they were watching their horses.
If they let him up he may of starting hitting them they did what they had to do to stay safe
So when you had the two guns pointed at you, could you tell immediately whether they were real guns or replica?
They didn't even need to let him up. Just letting him breathe would have done.
Did they know they were stopping him do you know that's what killed him should they have really asked this man who for all they know was about to kill them if he was comfortable
If someone has just threatened you with a gun and you have restrained them the last your going to ask them is "Are you comfortable"
Damn I can't type quick enough
Well assuming heart attack, stroke, necrotising fascilitis or umbongo fever didn't kill him, it's a fair bet he suffocated.
They had a duty of care to make sure this didn't happen.
IMO opinion they went too far, but I wonder if in that situation they were really thinking straight. With all the adrenaline pumping and every primal instinct telling them they needed to protect themselves would they even be able to stop if they wanted to? Its such a base instinct to protect oneself from a threat, so to what extent was it a conscious action and what was natural instinct. I guess what I am trying to say is to what extent can we really control our behaviour in such a heightened situation?
Reason can't be bothered anymore
No it doesn't. If you take it upon yourself to make a citizens arrest and keep someone in custody til the police arrive then you have a duty of care to them.
If there are no criminal proceedings then lawyers4u will have a field day on behalf of his family.
And the moral of the story is that all people behind a cash desk should assume that all robbers have replica guns and so there is no need to hand over the money.
That in reality is what you are saying.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Duty_of_care_in_English_law
Now go away and stop wasting everyones time
In your Leftie Looney perfect world do accidents happen and are Humans gifted with hindsight ?
If you have training and experience, it is still difficult.
Maybe not in a self defence class where you are trying to restrain your friend who is standing in bare feet on a crash mat. But in real life when someone is trying to hurt you (or themselves) and you are scared and have had no training in it, it must be really difficult.
I'm not saying that what they did was a good thing, but I can understand how it happened. I can't say that if I was in a similar situation, that I could have handled it better.
Maybe I would have peed myself
The very very sad thing is maybe for once you are right that is why the country is going down the shitter as if you attack a criminal who maybe trying to rob or hurt you then you can be the one to get into trouble it doesn't matter if he wants to kill you or your family if you touch him/her they will sue
I can state with absolute certainty that if I , along with someone else, ever had to restrain someone then they would be able to breathe. It is quite fundamental.
TBH I seriously doubt at that moment in time that would run though your head you would be to busy thinking and trying to save your own life
The gun was already off him. There was no danger.
He still had hands he still had feet you couldn't say for sure if he didn't have a knife of anything in his pocket.
It's ok to say right here right now safe in your house you would make sure he was ok but in the heat of the moment I doubt you would
I would say that as he was waving around a gun albeit a replica it would give even a casual observer a slight hint he may be violent so yes your right