I've been thinking about Arthur's motivation about Gwen, because the show really gave us no clear insight into this. I think he's looking for a mother-figure. If you break it down it makes perfect sense. He doesn't really know her, she's sweet, nice, kind, docile, unthreatening, pretty (but not stunningly beautiful) and nurturing.
He's looking for his mum and he's found her in Gwen!
It's the only explanation that fits because I will never believe that he's in love with her. Never.
Not really. Just that she's been lacking in his life since forever and he'd obviously want to find her in some way. It's not that surprising really that someone like Arthur - with mummy issues to the max - would do this.
Not really. Just that she's been lacking in his life since forever and he'd obviously want to find her in some way. It's not that surprising really that someone like Arthur - with mummy issues to the max - would do this.
Hmm.. I do agree actually.
I'm reading "Assassin's Apprentice" by Robin Hobb at the moment and the MC is forcibly taken from his mum aged 6 and "can't remember her". Really he just hates her for letting it happen and has blocked her out.
Aged 16 he sees her in the market (doesn't know who she is) and as she's crying out to him, he turns away and the first person he sees is suddenly his new love interest.
Actually, if I was writing the storyline for this show, I'd have at the end of this series, not the last episode, but the one before that, Arthur and Uther finding out about Merlin and Merlin getting banished from the kingdom.
Then, have the last episode Morgana and Morguese launching an all out successful attack on Camelot, they kill Uther and take over. So, Arthur is king - but he's also lost his kingdom so he's in exile too.
Then, next season would be Arthur and Merlin travelling around trying to rebuild his army to retake Camelot again.
I agree with all of that except for the last episode - I would have Merlin come back to Camelot and save the day
I really liked Gwaine as a character. And the shallow in me thought it was nice to look at a different set of pecs from Bradley James's, for a change. Given that we're probably never going to get another glimpse of shirtless Merlin. Although..now the writers have given a bit of fanservice in having the barmaid fancy the geeky-but-gorgeous one for a change, who knows...?:p
Though it was a good episode with many fine moments. I just cannot shake the feeling though that for some reason, this season isn't quite doing it for me. I cannot put my finger on it . But, it's early days still so I'll reserve judgment.
I, like others here, have to see a magic reveal of some kind soon, I do know that.
I've been thinking about Arthur's motivation about Gwen, because the show really gave us no clear insight into this. I think he's looking for a mother-figure. If you break it down it makes perfect sense. He doesn't really know her, she's sweet, nice, kind, docile, unthreatening, pretty (but not stunningly beautiful) and nurturing.
He's looking for his mum and he's found her in Gwen!
It's the only explanation that fits because I will never believe that he's in love with her. Never.
Very, very harsh
They purposely make Gwen look "like a servant" of that day but Angel is very beautiful. When she gets into her queen role and wears better dresses etc. Her beauty will be there for all to see. Even now in some shots they can't hide it. When someone is beautiful they are beautiful and she is just that.
With Arthur and Gwen it is love. With Gwen and Lancelot its more sexual I think.
When it comes to merlin's magic being exposed, my money is on Gwen finding out first!
They purposely make Gwen look "like a servant" of that day but Angel is very beautiful. When she gets into her queen role and wears better dresses etc. Her beauty will be there for all to see. Even now in some shots they can't hide it. When someone is beautiful they are beautiful and she is just that.
With Arthur and Gwen it is love. With Gwen and Lancelot its more sexual I think.
When it comes to merlin's magic being exposed, my money is on Gwen finding out first!
Sorry, I think Gwen's pretty enough looking - but she's not beautiful in my opinion.
I agree that Arthur and Gwen may love each other, I just don't think it's the love of a husband and wife. I don't think they can give each other what they really want, which is why it's going to end in disaster.
Sorry, I think Gwen's pretty enough looking - but she's not beautiful in my opinion.
I agree that Arthur and Gwen may love each other, I just don't think it's the love of a husband and wife. I don't think they can give each other what they really want, which is why it's going to end in disaster.
She must mean a lot to him, if he'll go against all conventions and rules. Unless he'll be just making a point, which I doubt. Gwen has two choices, both unrealistic for different reasons. I think she will lose hope to get Lancelot, but then he'll be back.
With Arthur and Gwen it is love. With Gwen and Lancelot its more sexual I think.
I agree. That, for me, was always the point of the G/L relationship - that ultimately it degraded them both. They certainly didn't end up together! And the version I'm familiar with has Guinevere leaving L and begging Arthur's forgiveness, with the implication that she would have been reunited with him if he hadn't been killed in battle shortly afterwards.
Now, I've found a description of episode 7 on the BBC Press Office website. It's EXTREMELY SPOILERY, so only uncover it if you don't mind finding out what happens - at least partially...
Gwen faces an impossible dilemma when she is forced to choose between saving the lives of her estranged brother, Elyan, or Arthur, as the mystical adventure series continues.
With one of them certain to die at the hands of Cenred, who will Gwen choose: the love of her life, or her only sibling?
I agree. That, for me, was always the point of the G/L relationship - that ultimately it degraded them both. They certainly didn't end up together! And the version I'm familiar with has Guinevere leaving L and begging Arthur's forgiveness, with the implication that she would have been reunited with him if he hadn't been killed in battle shortly afterwards.
Now, I've found a description of episode 7 on the BBC Press Office website. It's EXTREMELY SPOILERY, so only uncover it if you don't mind finding out what happens - at least partially...
Gwen faces an impossible dilemma when she is forced to choose between saving the lives of her estranged brother, Elyan, or Arthur, as the mystical adventure series continues.
With one of them certain to die at the hands of Cenred, who will Gwen choose: the love of her life, or her only sibling?
Re. the bit I've underlined: I knew it!! Ha!!
Seriously? You're all 'Ha!' over that? You do realise that the press release people have nothing to do with the show, right? Gwen and Arthur aren't going to get together until at least season 5 so it'll be portrayed as a 'Brother vs Future King' thing.
Lame.
Arthur isn't the love of Gwen's life, Lancelot is. The reason he's not a regular is because if he was, he and Gwen would be married by now. "As long as I live my feelings for you will never fade" - pretty decisive.
Gwen and Arthur WILL get married, I absolutely do not doubt it. But they're not in love with each other. Arthur's looking for his mum and Gwen's settling. There's no getting round that.
But whatever, everyone's opinion's different. Merlin at the end of the day is a kid's show and it clearly comes across that way. Proper relationship development will always suffer at the hands of slapstick humour and fart jokes! I'm getting a bit bored of it to be honest. I think I'll stick to the fanfiction - which is infinitely better written than the show!
to me personally, I think the Gwen/Arthur attraction thing at the moment is all about it being forbidden, with the whole "she's not worthy of you because she's only a servent etc"
I dont blame her for looking at Lancelot in later life lol (well if he looked like that i dont hehe)
Seriously? You're all 'Ha!' over that? You do realise that the press release people have nothing to do with the show, right? Gwen and Arthur aren't going to get together until at least season 5 so it'll be portrayed as a 'Brother vs Future King' thing.
Lame.
Arthur isn't the love of Gwen's life, Lancelot is. The reason he's not a regular is because if he was, he and Gwen would be married by now. "As long as I live my feelings for you will never fade" - pretty decisive.
Gwen and Arthur WILL get married, I absolutely do not doubt it. But they're not in love with each other. Arthur's looking for his mum and Gwen's settling. There's no getting round that.
Oh, I don't know (really, don't read this unless you want to hear spoilers)
I saw some on set pictures on Live Journal of Arthur & Gwen kissing in front of the knights (including Lancelot!). Also of Gwen in a very fancy dress kneeling in front of Arthur in the throne room. There are 2 thrones behind Arthur
Gwen and Arthur aren't going to get together until at least season 5 so it'll be portrayed as a 'Brother vs Future King' thing.
Arthur isn't the love of Gwen's life, Lancelot is.
Arthur's looking for his mum and Gwen's settling.
I'm getting a bit bored of it to be honest. I think I'll stick to the fanfiction - which is infinitely better written than the show.
Jenna, honey, you need to chill! It's a shame that you don't like the Gwen/Arthur romance, but you can't obliterate it from our tv screens simply by denying that it exists! But hey, if you want to then you go right ahead and immerse yourself in the world of fanfic. Because if you don't like the tv show, then this is just a waste of your creative energy.
Oh, I don't know (really, don't read this unless you want to hear spoilers)
I saw some on set pictures on Live Journal of Arthur & Gwen kissing in front of the knights (including Lancelot!). Also of Gwen in a very fancy dress kneeling in front of Arthur in the throne room. There are 2 thrones behind Arthur
Um, even though I'd love this to be true, I can't help feeling that it must be a dream sequence or vision. It seems WAY too early to be what you're thinking! Can you provide a link to the pictures? I'd LOVE to see them!
Oh boy! I've never come across anyone so determined to believe ONLY what THEY want to believe, despite plenty of evidence to the contrary!
Jenna, honey, you go right ahead and immerse yourself in the world of fanfic. We'll manage without you somehow.
:rolleyes:
NOW you're getting it!
Ha! And again I say HA!!!! Yes, I am Ha-ing and proud of it!
Seriously, though, is there a link to the pictures? This I HA-VE to see!! (See what I did there?)
Don't roll your eyes at me and call me 'honey', it's extremely patronising.
There is certainly not lots of evidence to the contrary to my opinion. If the spoilers tagged are true and
Arthur and Gwen marry in Season 3 (and it's not a fantasy sequence or some kind of fake-out) then it just indicates that the show is going to fully explore Gwen's infidelity and betrayal of her husband with Lancelot (who the show has made clear she loves and is attracted to more than Arthur).
There's NOTHING in the mythological tale that indicates Arthur and Gwen will have a happy ending. Nothing. The Gwen/Lancelot relationship is inescapable and it's simply not conceivably possible that the show will ignore that.
Jenna, honey, you need to chill! It's a shame that you don't like the Gwen/Arthur romance, but you can't obliterate it from our tv screens simply by denying that it exists! But hey, if you want to then you go right ahead and immerse yourself in the world of fanfic. Because if you don't like the tv show, then this is just a waste of your creative energy.
:rolleyes:
Um, even though I'd love this to be true, I can't help feeling that it must be a dream sequence or vision. It seems WAY too early to be what you're thinking! Can you provide a link to the pictures? I'd LOVE to see them!
Ok dokey! Couldn't be bothered to trawl LJ, but this is a fab site for pics.
I've been wondering why the Dragon's warned Merlin about both Morgana and Mordred being threats to Arther, but hasn't even mentioned the possibility of Arthur/Gwen leading to a massive sh*t storn in the future!
Oh, and I think the
kiss in front of the knights may be "real", more of a spur of the moment, spontaneous celebratory kiss, given the context of the pic, rather than a declaration of an engagement or something, but I agree the "coronation/wedding" pics may be a vision
Poor Lancelot, in the "Once and Future King" he's my favourite character. Always so hard on himself despite being the best knight in Christendom.
I had another theory about the
"Coronation" pic. Maybe Gwen is being rewarded for something, maybe given a status upgrade so she's not a servant anymore? Possibly paving the way for a future relationshp?
Why do people keep refuring to the legand as if its some sort of fact. And all must be based on it. tIn the Legand Arthur has sex with his sister Morgana and they have a son Mordrid.
Merlin is ment to be some old wise council.
The TV show has basical just taken the bit its like from the story. So who knows what gonna end up what were and how. I dont think there was ever a dragon adviseing Merlin.
I think Niamh who died in the first season is ment to be the lady of the lake.
If people dont see a connection between Gwen and Arthur then put in down to bad acting, as I think there is ment to be.
Why do people keep refuring to the legand as if its some sort of fact. And all must be based on it. tIn the Legand Arthur has sex with his sister Morgana and they have a son Mordrid.
QUOTE]
Yes, and Gawain is supposed to be Arthur's nephew & Mordred's half-brother:eek: Glad they didn't try to get that in, Uther's family tree looks like it's getting pretty complicated already!
I think the creators have mis-handled the Gwen character from the start. I can see why, when first writing the show, they thought, "I know, we'll make Guinevere a maid. It'll be really funny seeing the future queen mopping floors."
Then they've realised they can't really do anything with her apart from get her together with Arthur. But then they can't progress that relationship too far until Uther dies & Arthur becomes king, which wasn't planned until the end of the series.
Also means they can't have Lancelot in Camelot as Gwen would be in a relationship with him.
I think they should have kept the Gwen/Arthur relationship on a slower burn, kind of like it was at the end of S1, where Gwen was starting to see Arthur's good qualities and Arthur was kind of "Ha, you see, I'm not the arrogant fool you think I am."
Then two eps into S2 and Arthur's head over heels!
Why do people keep refuring to the legand as if its some sort of fact.
Because if you actually listen to the producers interviewed, that's what they're doing. They've always said that we know who these people are going to be, this is just a new take on how they get there.
Morgana will become estranged from Camelot, Mordred will kill Arthur, Gwen will give in to her feelings to Lancelot, Exacaliber will make its way to Arthur etc... Their end game is pretty well laid out, using the most common version of the legend. It's how they get there that will differ in this version.
Also, bear in mind it is extremely unlikely that we will ever see any of this on screen. I would bet good money that the plan for this show ends with Arthur crowned King.
As for those end of season photos, IIRC the last two episodes deal with
the return to the Crystal Cave that features in tonight's one
so make of that what you will...
The whole Arthur/Gwen, Gwen/Lancelot thing drives me up the wall with all the ridiculous ship wars it promotes. They're not going to throw out one of the most the biggest and most famous love affairs in history to please Arthur/Gwen fans who want a happy ever after. But that doesn't mean that Gwen can't love Arthur too. In the end it seems to me that she'll simply be a good woman who crumbles under the pressure of her feelings.
The great love of Arthur's life is Camelot. He will put his kingdom above everything else in the end. THAT is what makes him a great king. He'll respect Merlin like a brother, love Morgana like a sister (they reconcile eventually) and will of course love Gwen. But Camelot comes first.
Because if you actually listen to the producers interviewed, that's what they're doing. They've always said that we know who these people are going to be, this is just a new take on how they get there.
Morgana will become estranged from Camelot, Mordred will kill Arthur, Gwen will give in to her feelings to Lancelot, Exacaliber will make its way to Arthur etc... Their end game is pretty well laid out, using the most common version of the legend. It's how they get there that will differ in this version.
Also, bear in mind it is extremely unlikely that we will ever see any of this on screen. I would bet good money that the plan for this show ends with Arthur crowned King.
As for those end of season photos, IIRC the last two episodes deal with
the return to the Crystal Cave that features in tonight's one
so make of that what you will...
The whole Arthur/Gwen, Gwen/Lancelot thing drives me up the wall with all the ridiculous ship wars it promotes. They're not going to throw out one of the most the biggest and most famous love affairs in history to please Arthur/Gwen fans who want a happy ever after. But that doesn't mean that Gwen can't love Arthur too. In the end it seems to me that she'll simply be a good woman who crumbles under the pressure of her feelings.
The great love of Arthur's life is Camelot. He will put his kingdom above everything else in the end. THAT is what makes him a great king. He'll respect Merlin like a brother, love Morgana like a sister (they reconcile eventually) and will of course love Gwen. But Camelot comes first.
I think it was a bad idea having Gwen as a servant and having her & Arthur fall in love.
In the legends Guinevere and Arthur pretty much have an arranged marriage (I think in some versions they've met once, briefly), and they grow to love each other, respect each other and are great friends. However, they're not "in love." Guinevere and Lancelot are each others great passions and, as Claire2281 says, Camelot is Arthur's main focus and passion. Kind of felt sorry for Arthur, never having a romantic love.
It's kind of difficult to follow this idea in the BBC version, as they're obviously going to have Gwen & Arthur marry out of love, not arrangement.
Comments
Ewww, Oedipus complex. *shudders*
Not really. Just that she's been lacking in his life since forever and he'd obviously want to find her in some way. It's not that surprising really that someone like Arthur - with mummy issues to the max - would do this.
Hmm.. I do agree actually.
I'm reading "Assassin's Apprentice" by Robin Hobb at the moment and the MC is forcibly taken from his mum aged 6 and "can't remember her". Really he just hates her for letting it happen and has blocked her out.
Aged 16 he sees her in the market (doesn't know who she is) and as she's crying out to him, he turns away and the first person he sees is suddenly his new love interest.
Mummy issues much?
Uther: I'd rather see you marry that manservant of yours than her!
Arthur: OK
Though it was a good episode with many fine moments. I just cannot shake the feeling though that for some reason, this season isn't quite doing it for me. I cannot put my finger on it
I, like others here, have to see a magic reveal of some kind soon, I do know that.
LMAO!!!:D:D:D
Very, very harsh
They purposely make Gwen look "like a servant" of that day but Angel is very beautiful. When she gets into her queen role and wears better dresses etc. Her beauty will be there for all to see. Even now in some shots they can't hide it. When someone is beautiful they are beautiful and she is just that.
With Arthur and Gwen it is love. With Gwen and Lancelot its more sexual I think.
When it comes to merlin's magic being exposed, my money is on Gwen finding out first!
Sorry, I think Gwen's pretty enough looking - but she's not beautiful in my opinion.
I agree that Arthur and Gwen may love each other, I just don't think it's the love of a husband and wife. I don't think they can give each other what they really want, which is why it's going to end in disaster.
I liked that bit
She must mean a lot to him, if he'll go against all conventions and rules. Unless he'll be just making a point, which I doubt. Gwen has two choices, both unrealistic for different reasons. I think she will lose hope to get Lancelot, but then he'll be back.
I agree. That, for me, was always the point of the G/L relationship - that ultimately it degraded them both. They certainly didn't end up together! And the version I'm familiar with has Guinevere leaving L and begging Arthur's forgiveness, with the implication that she would have been reunited with him if he hadn't been killed in battle shortly afterwards.
Now, I've found a description of episode 7 on the BBC Press Office website. It's EXTREMELY SPOILERY, so only uncover it if you don't mind finding out what happens - at least partially...
With one of them certain to die at the hands of Cenred, who will Gwen choose: the love of her life, or her only sibling?
Re. the bit I've underlined: I knew it!! Ha!!
Seriously? You're all 'Ha!' over that? You do realise that the press release people have nothing to do with the show, right? Gwen and Arthur aren't going to get together until at least season 5 so it'll be portrayed as a 'Brother vs Future King' thing.
Lame.
Arthur isn't the love of Gwen's life, Lancelot is. The reason he's not a regular is because if he was, he and Gwen would be married by now. "As long as I live my feelings for you will never fade" - pretty decisive.
Gwen and Arthur WILL get married, I absolutely do not doubt it. But they're not in love with each other. Arthur's looking for his mum and Gwen's settling. There's no getting round that.
I dont blame her for looking at Lancelot in later life lol (well if he looked like that i dont hehe)
Oh, I don't know (really, don't read this unless you want to hear spoilers)
Jenna, honey, you need to chill! It's a shame that you don't like the Gwen/Arthur romance, but you can't obliterate it from our tv screens simply by denying that it exists! But hey, if you want to then you go right ahead and immerse yourself in the world of fanfic. Because if you don't like the tv show, then this is just a waste of your creative energy.
:rolleyes:
Um, even though I'd love this to be true, I can't help feeling that it must be a dream sequence or vision. It seems WAY too early to be what you're thinking! Can you provide a link to the pictures? I'd LOVE to see them!
Don't roll your eyes at me and call me 'honey', it's extremely patronising.
There is certainly not lots of evidence to the contrary to my opinion. If the spoilers tagged are true and
There's NOTHING in the mythological tale that indicates Arthur and Gwen will have a happy ending. Nothing. The Gwen/Lancelot relationship is inescapable and it's simply not conceivably possible that the show will ignore that.
Ok dokey! Couldn't be bothered to trawl LJ, but this is a fab site for pics.
Again, don't click if you don't want spoilers!
http://www.fanpop.com/spots/merlin-on-bbc/images/15701400/title/spoiler-gwen-blue-dress-photo
and
http://www.fanpop.com/spots/merlin-on-bbc/images/15701667/title/spoiler-filming-gwen-blue-dress-photo
Can't seem to find the pic of the kiss, but will have another look tomorrow
Bonus Morgana spoiler pic
http://www.fanpop.com/spots/merlin-on-bbc/images/15590983/title/merlin-series-3-filming-september-photo
I've been wondering why the Dragon's warned Merlin about both Morgana and Mordred being threats to Arther, but hasn't even mentioned the possibility of Arthur/Gwen leading to a massive sh*t storn in the future!
Oh, and I think the
Poor Lancelot, in the "Once and Future King" he's my favourite character. Always so hard on himself despite being the best knight in Christendom.
I had another theory about the
Merlin is ment to be some old wise council.
The TV show has basical just taken the bit its like from the story. So who knows what gonna end up what were and how. I dont think there was ever a dragon adviseing Merlin.
I think Niamh who died in the first season is ment to be the lady of the lake.
If people dont see a connection between Gwen and Arthur then put in down to bad acting, as I think there is ment to be.
Because if you actually listen to the producers interviewed, that's what they're doing. They've always said that we know who these people are going to be, this is just a new take on how they get there.
Morgana will become estranged from Camelot, Mordred will kill Arthur, Gwen will give in to her feelings to Lancelot, Exacaliber will make its way to Arthur etc... Their end game is pretty well laid out, using the most common version of the legend. It's how they get there that will differ in this version.
Also, bear in mind it is extremely unlikely that we will ever see any of this on screen. I would bet good money that the plan for this show ends with Arthur crowned King.
As for those end of season photos, IIRC the last two episodes deal with
The whole Arthur/Gwen, Gwen/Lancelot thing drives me up the wall with all the ridiculous ship wars it promotes. They're not going to throw out one of the most the biggest and most famous love affairs in history to please Arthur/Gwen fans who want a happy ever after. But that doesn't mean that Gwen can't love Arthur too. In the end it seems to me that she'll simply be a good woman who crumbles under the pressure of her feelings.
The great love of Arthur's life is Camelot. He will put his kingdom above everything else in the end. THAT is what makes him a great king. He'll respect Merlin like a brother, love Morgana like a sister (they reconcile eventually) and will of course love Gwen. But Camelot comes first.
I think it was a bad idea having Gwen as a servant and having her & Arthur fall in love.
In the legends Guinevere and Arthur pretty much have an arranged marriage (I think in some versions they've met once, briefly), and they grow to love each other, respect each other and are great friends. However, they're not "in love." Guinevere and Lancelot are each others great passions and, as Claire2281 says, Camelot is Arthur's main focus and passion. Kind of felt sorry for Arthur, never having a romantic love.
It's kind of difficult to follow this idea in the BBC version, as they're obviously going to have Gwen & Arthur marry out of love, not arrangement.