This is quite a sad discussion really. Cricket of all forms has been off terrestrial television for almost ten years now, and we are all dreaming if we think Sky will let any of it go. They will renew their contract for all tournaments and Channel 5 will go on showing their absurd 35 mins of home test highlights.
Oh and the BBC losing the six nations rugby has been mentioned in the Guardian and the Times, as I said the BBC only have Wimbledon now, come on Tim, pathetic.
This is quite a sad discussion really. Cricket of all forms has been off terrestrial television for almost ten years now, and we are all dreaming if we think Sky will let any of it go. They will renew their contract for all tournaments and Channel 5 will go on showing their absurd 35 mins of home test highlights.
Oh and the BBC losing the six nations rugby has been mentioned in the Guardian and the Times, as I said the BBC only have Wimbledon now, come on Tim, pathetic.
Don't the BBC have the 6 Nations up to and including 2017??? Surely too soon for any rights packages to be sold for the 2018 tournament.
Counties wanting FTA Domestic highlights.
Also stating that Sky mights pay more for the 2017-19 period and new terms of the contract probably to include FTA domestic highlights and other things counties and ECB want included or removed.
Could it be that Sky want to offload some or all of their County cricket?
I'd say the opposite if anything. The current deal was negotiated before the current changes to the tournament leaving Sky without the usual T20 block of fixtures mid season and I'm guessing less on TV overall with the move to mainly Friday nights. Sky may have wanted to alter the price to reflect this.
County Cricket gives Sky valuable live content during the summer when other main sports are out of season. No way are they looking to give that up.
Could it possibly be that the ECB are currently being painted in a very poor light, what with the England team's poor performances of late and the KP debacle and Sky are sensing a public mood against the ECB - a chance to leverage down the price a bit? Of course, they signed the original extension in January 2012, at the Flower/Strauss era's high watermark and now results are a bit more of an even keel, who knows...?
Could it possibly be that the ECB are currently being painted in a very poor light, what with the England team's poor performances of late and the KP debacle and Sky are sensing a public mood against the ECB - a chance to leverage down the price a bit? Of course, they signed the original extension in January 2012, at the Flower/Strauss era's high watermark and now results are a bit more of an even keel, who knows...?
A fair point but I think it's more than counter balanced by the fact that BT has entered the market since then - causing substantial inflation in sports rights costs.
I think it is almost certain that if the rights for 2018 + 2019 went to auction now then Sky would have to pay a higher price than the actual price they would have to pay under the option they have for 2018 + 2019.
It looks highly likely to me that Sky is trying to leverage the option - ie offering more than the option price for 2018 + 2019 in return for getting a contract through to a later date - probably 2021 or 2023.
A fair point but I think it's more than counter balanced by the fact that BT has entered the market since then - causing substantial inflation in sports rights costs.
I think it is almost certain that if the rights for 2018 + 2019 went to auction now then Sky would have to pay a higher price than the actual price they would have to pay under the option they have for 2018 + 2019.
It looks highly likely to me that Sky is trying to leverage the option - ie offering more than the option price for 2018 + 2019 in return for getting a contract through to a later date - probably 2021 or 2023.
A fair point but I think it's more than counter balanced by the fact that BT has entered the market since then - causing substantial inflation in sports rights costs.
I think it is almost certain that if the rights for 2018 + 2019 went to auction now then Sky would have to pay a higher price than the actual price they would have to pay under the option they have for 2018 + 2019.
It looks highly likely to me that Sky is trying to leverage the option - ie offering more than the option price for 2018 + 2019 in return for getting a contract through to a later date - probably 2021 or 2023.
I'm sure you are right - I was being slightly devil's advocate-ey in the above post. Sky have this one sewn up (WRT BT) if they play their hand right. I would argue that they are more in the pocket of the ECB than any sporting body in the world.
I really don't see putting highlights of county matches on Pick will improve viewing figures that much. They need to be on a higher profile station. The problem is will BBC, ITV, CH4/5 be interested? Maybe ITV4?
You've not seen the experiment have you?!!
The static camera is (eg) at third man, so angled in a way that about 60% of the action is captured, let's say within a 40-yard radius circle of the wicket. Just like sitting there for real.
Now, that means you can't judge LBW's - but you can't if you were sat there anyway, but you do get a better feeling of the bowler's length and pace.
Of course you can't see the ball going over the ropes, but then again it's aimed at the avid fan who will know where the ball's gone by the actions of the batsmen, umpires and fielders. The BBC radio commentary could be added so you get another*eye* and you can have the cricinfo scorebox added to the picture.
Again, I'm an avid fan - at least of Lancashire (couldn't give a tossup about England) and I have a fair knowledge of what's happening on the field even if I get only half a picture.
The webcam at Greater Old Trafford covers 70% of the playing area, but it isn't a live stream, but if it were I would find it more than adequate to follow the game.
Certainly if the Lancs/Middlesex decider hadn't been on "normal" TV, then this system would have been absolutely fine to cover the game. I might not have seen Chappie's 6 go over the rope, but I would have known by the reaction in the middle and the radio commentary that went with it!!!
I stand by what I said, that sounds dreadful, and you could never use that on telly for more than a couple of minutes.
I'd say the opposite if anything. The current deal was negotiated before the current changes to the tournament leaving Sky without the usual T20 block of fixtures mid season and I'm guessing less on TV overall with the move to mainly Friday nights. Sky may have wanted to alter the price to reflect this.
Maybe someone has figures but I would be highly surprised if there was any notable change to the number of matches aired this season compared to last.
The shift to Friday nights was for non-televised matches, and even then some counties still preferred to play them on other nights. It made no difference to Sky's ability to shift matches to other nights.
And with the unusually concentrated nature of the India test series Sky had less slots during the middle of summer anyway, so the earlier start of the T20 Blast benefited them.
Article suggests possible TV contract up to 2022 - refers to Future Tours Programme - but I thought that currently only goes up to 2020.
2022 would be interesting - if Ashes sticks on its new 4 year cycle (ie rebased from 2015) then there would be an Ashes in 2023 - Sky would surely be very keen to include that.
So 2022 either implies ECB wants to keep the 2023 Ashes out of this deal or could there be another home Ashes in 2022?
I'm not sure what use county highlights on BSkyB's Freeview channel would be to restoring any interest in the county game. Even if you put county highlights on BBC Two at 11.20pm or Channel 5 at 11pm or midnight, you'd only get a couple of hundred thousand viewers.
Article suggests possible TV contract up to 2022 - refers to Future Tours Programme - but I thought that currently only goes up to 2020.
2022 would be interesting - if Ashes sticks on its new 4 year cycle (ie rebased from 2015) then there would be an Ashes in 2023 - Sky would surely be very keen to include that.
So 2022 either implies ECB wants to keep the 2023 Ashes out of this deal or could there be another home Ashes in 2022?
2020 was the original date, but when the ICC board changes were decided earlier in the year a new FTP process was agreed.
The new FTP is meant to run from 2015-2023, but as I understand it that could run out with the World Cup in India in early 2023 so 2022 would be the last summer of cricket in England covered by it.
I'm not sure what use county highlights on BSkyB's Freeview channel would be to restoring any interest in the county game. Even if you put county highlights on BBC Two at 11.20pm or Channel 5 at 11pm or midnight, you'd only get a couple of hundred thousand viewers.
If the Telegraph article is correct I strongly doubt that the counties are talking about Sky's Freeview channel.
I think ITV4 would be by far the most likely - if not ITV4 then maybe C5.
I actually think anything is possible here. if Sky can get a renewal of their England rights through to 2022 then that is a very big prize for them indeed - 8 years locked up without having to face BT in an auction.
If the ECB offers that then it can ask for quite a lot in return - it could even ask for, say, the T20 final live FTA.
Who knows - but I suspect Sky would concede pretty much anything re County rights in return for locking up England to 2022.
2020 was the original date, but when the ICC board changes were decided earlier in the year a new FTP process was agreed.
The new FTP is meant to run from 2015-2023, but as I understand it that could run out with the World Cup in India in early 2023 so 2022 would be the last summer of cricket in England covered by it.
Thanks.
Have the tours for 2021 and 2022 been agreed (I can't find anything) - or is there even a draft?
If the Telegraph article is correct I strongly doubt that the counties are talking about Sky's Freeview channel.
I think ITV4 would be by far the most likely - if not ITV4 then maybe C5.
I actually think anything is possible here. if Sky can get a renewal of their England rights through to 2022 then that is a very big prize for them indeed - 8 years locked up without having to face BT in an auction.
If the ECB offers that then it can ask for quite a lot in return - it could even ask for, say, the T20 final live FTA.
Who knows - but I suspect Sky would concede pretty much anything re County rights in return for locking up England to 2022.
Would any new deal start next season? If so, 2015-2022 would be a big commitment for any FTA broadcaster. Even 2018-2022 would be a bit of a gamble, because these highlights have the potential to rate very badly.
Sky's existing contract runs to 2017 and they have the option for 2018 + 2019.
It's perfectly possible any new contract could supercede the existing contract - ie it could start next year - but both Sky and the ECB would have to agree to that.
But we have an example of just that - Sky's Super League contract ran to 2016 and they agreed to vary the terms for 2014 to 2016 as part of the deal extending their rights to 2021.
Sky's existing contract runs to 2017 and they have the option for 2018 + 2019.
It's perfectly possible any new contract could supercede the existing contract - ie it could start next year - but both Sky and the ECB would have to agree to that.
But we have an example of just that - Sky's Super League contract ran to 2016 and they agreed to vary the terms for 2014 to 2016 as part of the deal extending their rights to 2021.
Thanks. It's going to be interesting to see what happens.
South Africa has been rumoured in 2021 and India in 2022
England have been the ones who have kept their plans most under wraps, but the whole FTP is meant to be finalised at the ICC board meeting next month
Thanks.
Major tours to England
2016 - Pak
2017 - SA
2018 - Ind
2019 - Aus
So the rumour per your post looks right - ie it's what we would expect given no messing around.
Pak are here for minor tour in 2018. NZ miss their "expected" in 2019 due to World Cup so NZ must come 2020 (minor) and I suspect SL get the 2020 major with a 3:4 split.
I actually think anything is possible here. if Sky can get a renewal of their England rights through to 2022 then that is a very big prize for them indeed - 8 years locked up without having to face BT in an auction.
What's to say that BT hasn't been in contact with the ECB and said "We'd be interested in a bid if its open"
The ECB would have a hard time to ignore that as a bidding war of sorts would net the ECB more money than an offer from Sky anyway because Sky would offer alot more to try and keep BT out.
I wouldn't mind England games on BT, they did a decent job of the cricket they've shown this far and would make a change from the boring David Gower, who i think has forgotten what a smile or laughing actually is....
What's to say that BT hasn't been in contact with the ECB and said "We'd be interested in a bid if its open"
The ECB would have a hard time to ignore that as a bidding war of sorts would net the ECB more money than an offer from Sky anyway because Sky would offer alot more to try and keep BT out.
Of course the ECB could go down that route but then Sky just exercises the option for 2018 and 2019.
So the first year that the ECB can put out to competitive auction is 2020.
And in the meantime the ECB is stuck for the next 5 years with the contract price for 2015 to 2017, the option price for 2018 + 2019 plus no variation in terms - eg no County cricket FTA etc.
The point is that Sky offers enough extra cash for 2018 + 2019 (+ maybe even a bit more for 2015 to 2017) + enough other concessions (from the existing contract + option terms) up to 2019 to induce ECB to go with Sky post 2020.
However it's entirely possible there won't be an agreement and then BT can bid from 2020 onwards.
Comments
Oh and the BBC losing the six nations rugby has been mentioned in the Guardian and the Times, as I said the BBC only have Wimbledon now, come on Tim, pathetic.
Don't the BBC have the 6 Nations up to and including 2017??? Surely too soon for any rights packages to be sold for the 2018 tournament.
Also stating that Sky mights pay more for the 2017-19 period and new terms of the contract probably to include FTA domestic highlights and other things counties and ECB want included or removed.
I'd say the opposite if anything. The current deal was negotiated before the current changes to the tournament leaving Sky without the usual T20 block of fixtures mid season and I'm guessing less on TV overall with the move to mainly Friday nights. Sky may have wanted to alter the price to reflect this.
County Cricket gives Sky valuable live content during the summer when other main sports are out of season. No way are they looking to give that up.
A fair point but I think it's more than counter balanced by the fact that BT has entered the market since then - causing substantial inflation in sports rights costs.
I think it is almost certain that if the rights for 2018 + 2019 went to auction now then Sky would have to pay a higher price than the actual price they would have to pay under the option they have for 2018 + 2019.
It looks highly likely to me that Sky is trying to leverage the option - ie offering more than the option price for 2018 + 2019 in return for getting a contract through to a later date - probably 2021 or 2023.
They are doing this I was so stupid that I forget to send the link.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/cricket/counties/11175150/Cash-strapped-counties-to-pressure-ECB-over-new-television-deal-with-Sky.html
I'm sure you are right - I was being slightly devil's advocate-ey in the above post. Sky have this one sewn up (WRT BT) if they play their hand right. I would argue that they are more in the pocket of the ECB than any sporting body in the world.
I stand by what I said, that sounds dreadful, and you could never use that on telly for more than a couple of minutes.
Maybe someone has figures but I would be highly surprised if there was any notable change to the number of matches aired this season compared to last.
The shift to Friday nights was for non-televised matches, and even then some counties still preferred to play them on other nights. It made no difference to Sky's ability to shift matches to other nights.
And with the unusually concentrated nature of the India test series Sky had less slots during the middle of summer anyway, so the earlier start of the T20 Blast benefited them.
Thanks.
Article suggests possible TV contract up to 2022 - refers to Future Tours Programme - but I thought that currently only goes up to 2020.
2022 would be interesting - if Ashes sticks on its new 4 year cycle (ie rebased from 2015) then there would be an Ashes in 2023 - Sky would surely be very keen to include that.
So 2022 either implies ECB wants to keep the 2023 Ashes out of this deal or could there be another home Ashes in 2022?
2020 was the original date, but when the ICC board changes were decided earlier in the year a new FTP process was agreed.
The new FTP is meant to run from 2015-2023, but as I understand it that could run out with the World Cup in India in early 2023 so 2022 would be the last summer of cricket in England covered by it.
If the Telegraph article is correct I strongly doubt that the counties are talking about Sky's Freeview channel.
I think ITV4 would be by far the most likely - if not ITV4 then maybe C5.
I actually think anything is possible here. if Sky can get a renewal of their England rights through to 2022 then that is a very big prize for them indeed - 8 years locked up without having to face BT in an auction.
If the ECB offers that then it can ask for quite a lot in return - it could even ask for, say, the T20 final live FTA.
Who knows - but I suspect Sky would concede pretty much anything re County rights in return for locking up England to 2022.
Thanks.
Have the tours for 2021 and 2022 been agreed (I can't find anything) - or is there even a draft?
South Africa has been rumoured in 2021 and India in 2022
England have been the ones who have kept their plans most under wraps, but the whole FTP is meant to be finalised at the ICC board meeting next month
That would be up for negotiation.
Sky's existing contract runs to 2017 and they have the option for 2018 + 2019.
It's perfectly possible any new contract could supercede the existing contract - ie it could start next year - but both Sky and the ECB would have to agree to that.
But we have an example of just that - Sky's Super League contract ran to 2016 and they agreed to vary the terms for 2014 to 2016 as part of the deal extending their rights to 2021.
Thanks.
Major tours to England
2016 - Pak
2017 - SA
2018 - Ind
2019 - Aus
So the rumour per your post looks right - ie it's what we would expect given no messing around.
Pak are here for minor tour in 2018. NZ miss their "expected" in 2019 due to World Cup so NZ must come 2020 (minor) and I suspect SL get the 2020 major with a 3:4 split.
What's to say that BT hasn't been in contact with the ECB and said "We'd be interested in a bid if its open"
The ECB would have a hard time to ignore that as a bidding war of sorts would net the ECB more money than an offer from Sky anyway because Sky would offer alot more to try and keep BT out.
I wouldn't mind England games on BT, they did a decent job of the cricket they've shown this far and would make a change from the boring David Gower, who i think has forgotten what a smile or laughing actually is....
Of course the ECB could go down that route but then Sky just exercises the option for 2018 and 2019.
So the first year that the ECB can put out to competitive auction is 2020.
And in the meantime the ECB is stuck for the next 5 years with the contract price for 2015 to 2017, the option price for 2018 + 2019 plus no variation in terms - eg no County cricket FTA etc.
The point is that Sky offers enough extra cash for 2018 + 2019 (+ maybe even a bit more for 2015 to 2017) + enough other concessions (from the existing contract + option terms) up to 2019 to induce ECB to go with Sky post 2020.
However it's entirely possible there won't be an agreement and then BT can bid from 2020 onwards.