I can't help feeling let down by Doctor Who in 2012. The five episodes that we had were great and I cherished them but the series was over far too quickly. It felt like it was over almost immediately after it began.
I'll reserve judgement on Moffat's "Doctor Who Will Take Over Television In 2013" comment and wait to see what lies ahead because it is a statement that can be interpreted in a number of ways. I hope that it means lots of of quality TV and not lots of Doctor Who themed episodes of series such as Pointless, (no offence to those that like Pointless).
An Anniversary year where we still don't know every single detail because the BBC never fix their schedules this far in advance. What we're given always amounts to more Who because we get new episodes on top of the 789 we've had thus far. By the end of next year, we'll have had 800 episodes of Who altogether.
800>789.
789? including Shada?, including the CIN specials?, including Dimensions in Time?
I can't help feeling let down by Doctor Who in 2012. The five episodes that we had were great and I cherished them but the series was over far too quickly. It felt like it was over almost immediately after it began.
I'll reserve judgement on Moffat's "Doctor Who Will Take Over Television In 2013" comment and wait to see what lies ahead because it is a statement that can be interpreted in a number of ways. I hope that it means lots of of quality TV and not lots of Doctor Who themed episodes of series such as Pointless, (no offence to those that like Pointless).
I have no objection to Doctor Who making its presence felt on other shows next year. Depending on the show, I may or may not watch it, but I like the idea either way
Of course, it's no substitute for more actual episodes of Doctor Who but I'll take what I can get!
The anniversary is rumoured to be 90mins (nothing is actually confirmed regarding it). The Christmas specials are usually 60mins. So the specials equal 3.25 episodes which you argue takes the episode count up to 11.25. However the Christmas special has always been separate to the 13 series.
Except for this year's. Separate in timing, perhaps, but with new things to introduce, not least the new companion, it has to be part of the main run. And if the rumours are true - The Great Intelligence being behind the Snowmen, and being voiced by Sir Ian McKellen who is returning for the finale, as will Richard E Grant - then it's definitely tied up in Clara's personal story.
Except for this year's. Separate in timing, perhaps, but with new things to introduce, not least the new companion, it has to be part of the main run. And if the rumours are true - The Great Intelligence being behind the Snowmen, and being voiced by Sir Ian McKellen who is returning for the finale, as will Richard E Grant - then it's definitely tied up in Clara's personal story.
I agree with the idea that as no alternative to the current broadcastiong situation was seriously proposed let alone implimented, we've missed out on nothing. Things are the way they are, so there's no point mourning 5 imaginary episodes that were never going to happen. As johnny said we are only gaining episodes, not losing.
Losing implies that the number of episodes in existence is shrinking, God forbid that ever happens! :eek:
well he is going around deleting himself from every database in the universe! :eek:
I know they're not obliged to do this (and perhaps even not allowed) but I think the production team might do themselves a few favours by letting people know what the state of the programme is - for good or for bad
My sentiments exactly. I got gunned down on GB for that one :rolleyes:
Wow, you post on GB, you are brave. I'm a member, but I don't post, I'm too scared to. I mean, we can all be a bit sarky and argumentative on here, but on GB they can be downright scary.
Anyway, to be honest it isn't the reduced episode count that winds me up, it's the lies and spin the BBC keep coming out with in justifying it. If they had just said at the beginning that due to financial issues we would get 2 years of reduced episodes but return to normal scheduling in 2014 I would have been OK about it, because at least that would have shown that the BBC were dedicated to the future of the programme.
Instead we got:-
-No private Eye are lying series 7 isn't being split over 2 years.
-The series has moved so it is on during darker evenings.
-Oh, actually the series is being split but the second half will very early in 2013.
-2013 will have more Doctor Who than ever before.
-Oh, actually the second half of the series won't be until April.
-Oh, the next filming is for the November Anniversary special.
-But we're still going to take over television.
All these lies and misinformation just cause worry.
You see some of us remember the lies the BBC told when the series ended in 1989:-
-The series hasn't ended, it's being rested while we find a new production team.
-Oh, the programmes now going over to independent production.
-We're going to have a 40th Anniversary special episode.
-Oh, no we're not.
In all that time the BBC never actually admitted the show was cancelled.
I'm not saying the BBC are trying to kill it off, I'm sure that it is really just down to financial issues and will get back to normal in 2014, it's just that if they simply admitted that it would end the speculation and animosity.
nyder, I think you have unrealistic expectations. Plans change. When a company declares that Widget X will be shipping in December, and scheduling problems come up and they have to push back to February - are they lying, or just wrong? If they were in December and still claiming that they'll ship in December, there would be a case to answer.
The main reason for the show's wonky scheduling is down to the extra time taken to get filming series 7; the version of things on GB is basically that Moffat was knackered after 2 solid years work on 2 different series without a break, and needed to step back for a moment; this gave him time to see the woods for the trees (so to speak), and to focus on storylines, and the direction of the show without having to worry about another solid block of filming. He's said as much in DWM before.
I wish the BBC had put this out, because then I'm sure some would actually feel sympathy for Moffat and not mind at all about what is happening with the show right now.
Well, I've started. I've been through, of late, just about the most gruelling schedule I've ever been through, on Doctor Who, Sherlock... It was going to kill me if I didn't sit down for a minute. So I sat down for a minute. But now I'm back at work, and I've started on Episode 1. Other writers are out there writing. It really is a chance for us to get several scripts -- quite a few scripts, I'd say -- in place before we get anywhere near actual filming. I'm looking forward to just being able to focus on the storytelling for a while. Once you start filming, there are other demands on your time. You feel as though you're planning the series falling down a well. 'Have I remembered to do everything in that story? Have I got the right cliffhanger? Does she know this yet? Does he know that?' Just, aargh! Particularly when you've got River Song experiencing it all backwards. This last year was a nightmare."
The main reason for the show's wonky scheduling is down to the extra time taken to get filming series 7; the version of things on GB is basically that Moffat was knackered after 2 solid years work on 2 different series without a break, and needed to step back for a moment; this gave him time to see the woods for the trees (so to speak), and to focus on storylines, and the direction of the show without having to worry about another solid block of filming. He's said as much in DWM before.
I wish the BBC had put this out, because then I'm sure some would actually feel sympathy for Moffat and not mind at all about what is happening with the show right now.
That's the point isn't it though. In all likelihood either your or my suspicions about things are correct. So why couldn't the BBC have been honest from the start. Even now they're still trying to spin it. And I think that is what is really getting peoples goat (though obviously I can only speak for myself). I think the lies, the lies about the lies and the spin have done nothing for the BBC's and Moffats reputations.
I reckon they think they can salavage things by hyping it up, which has generated a positive response in the past. But it won't work all the time
The trouble is that hype leads to expectations (as we've seen on this forum). If what I expect turns out to be correct, I won't be disappointed because I expect it, but there are a lot here who really expect more because they've been led to believe it. They're the ones that are going to be disappointed. It's not fair on them.
It's like leading your child on to believe you've gotten them something fantastic for Christmas, only for them to end up unwrapping a pair of plain black socks. Oh yes a plain pair of black socks are better than bare feet but that isn't really the point.
That makes sense. If it makes sense to you, I'm expecting both at the same time, so I can afford to be positive, but won't whinge and moan if we just get 10 episodes because I knew it was a possibility
It's like leading your child on to believe you've gotten them something fantastic for Christmas, only for them to end up unwrapping a pair of plain black socks. Oh yes a plain pair of black socks are better than bare feet but that isn't really the point.
(I think that made sense, it did in my head. )
Sure, but there's a big difference in saying you've got them something fantastic, knowing full well that you've only got them socks - and planning to buy something fantastic and realising that actually the credit cards won't stretch that far and just having to do the best you can. I would characterise the former as lying, not the latter.
The BBC can only tell you what they're planning to do six months down the line, it's not a promise or a contract. And for that matter, only because they're constantly getting asked what their plans are. It's easy to get hung up on that and miss all the things they're telling us about more recently, that are definitely happening.
Sure, but there's a big difference in saying you've got them something fantastic, knowing full well that you've only got them socks - and planning to buy something fantastic and realising that actually the credit cards won't stretch that far and just having to do the best you can. I would characterise the former as lying, not the latter.
The BBC can only tell you what they're planning to do six months down the line, it's not a promise or a contract. And for that matter, only because they're constantly getting asked what their plans are. It's easy to get hung up on that and miss all the things they're telling us about more recently, that are definitely happening.
But that's the whole point. They are making promises.
Promise 1 - there will be more Doctor who in 2013 than ever before.
Promise 2 - we will be taking over television.
That's on top of the recent spin regarding series 7. Remember they told us that Private Eye were lying when they knew all along it was the truth.
If they hadn't have produced all the spin and made the above promises I would have agreed with you. But they have.
Please don't misunderstand me. I really hope that I'm wrong and that it does actually live up to all the hype and promises. I want more Doctor Who, don't we all. But if we're not getting it, whether due to financial reasons or Moffats exhaustion then tell us.
Comments
I'll reserve judgement on Moffat's "Doctor Who Will Take Over Television In 2013" comment and wait to see what lies ahead because it is a statement that can be interpreted in a number of ways. I hope that it means lots of of quality TV and not lots of Doctor Who themed episodes of series such as Pointless, (no offence to those that like Pointless).
789? including Shada?, including the CIN specials?, including Dimensions in Time?
I have no objection to Doctor Who making its presence felt on other shows next year. Depending on the show, I may or may not watch it, but I like the idea either way
Of course, it's no substitute for more actual episodes of Doctor Who but I'll take what I can get!
Went with "as of the end of series 7b we will have had 798" then subtracted 7b + the snowmen
Except for this year's. Separate in timing, perhaps, but with new things to introduce, not least the new companion, it has to be part of the main run. And if the rumours are true - The Great Intelligence being behind the Snowmen, and being voiced by Sir Ian McKellen who is returning for the finale, as will Richard E Grant - then it's definitely tied up in Clara's personal story.
Steven Moffat saying Trust me.... Hmmmm
Thanks for that spoiler!!!!!!!!! :mad:
Oh Bugger! I'm really sorry... I thought I'd done the spoiler tags!
I didn't even bother to check.
I'm really really sorry!
OK, no problem if it was a mistake. Apology accepted.
REMEMBER 1989 WHEN THE BLOODY SHOW WAS AXED?!
Sheesh
well he is going around deleting himself from every database in the universe! :eek:
Yeahhhh., good man. Well said
Wow, you post on GB, you are brave. I'm a member, but I don't post, I'm too scared to. I mean, we can all be a bit sarky and argumentative on here, but on GB they can be downright scary.
Anyway, to be honest it isn't the reduced episode count that winds me up, it's the lies and spin the BBC keep coming out with in justifying it. If they had just said at the beginning that due to financial issues we would get 2 years of reduced episodes but return to normal scheduling in 2014 I would have been OK about it, because at least that would have shown that the BBC were dedicated to the future of the programme.
Instead we got:-
-No private Eye are lying series 7 isn't being split over 2 years.
-The series has moved so it is on during darker evenings.
-Oh, actually the series is being split but the second half will very early in 2013.
-2013 will have more Doctor Who than ever before.
-Oh, actually the second half of the series won't be until April.
-Oh, the next filming is for the November Anniversary special.
-But we're still going to take over television.
All these lies and misinformation just cause worry.
You see some of us remember the lies the BBC told when the series ended in 1989:-
-The series hasn't ended, it's being rested while we find a new production team.
-Oh, the programmes now going over to independent production.
-We're going to have a 40th Anniversary special episode.
-Oh, no we're not.
In all that time the BBC never actually admitted the show was cancelled.
I'm not saying the BBC are trying to kill it off, I'm sure that it is really just down to financial issues and will get back to normal in 2014, it's just that if they simply admitted that it would end the speculation and animosity.
-
Maybe you could spoiler it now?
I wish the BBC had put this out, because then I'm sure some would actually feel sympathy for Moffat and not mind at all about what is happening with the show right now.
That's the point isn't it though. In all likelihood either your or my suspicions about things are correct. So why couldn't the BBC have been honest from the start. Even now they're still trying to spin it. And I think that is what is really getting peoples goat (though obviously I can only speak for myself). I think the lies, the lies about the lies and the spin have done nothing for the BBC's and Moffats reputations.
The trouble is that hype leads to expectations (as we've seen on this forum). If what I expect turns out to be correct, I won't be disappointed because I expect it, but there are a lot here who really expect more because they've been led to believe it. They're the ones that are going to be disappointed. It's not fair on them.
It's like leading your child on to believe you've gotten them something fantastic for Christmas, only for them to end up unwrapping a pair of plain black socks. Oh yes a plain pair of black socks are better than bare feet but that isn't really the point.
(I think that made sense, it did in my head.
Sure, but there's a big difference in saying you've got them something fantastic, knowing full well that you've only got them socks - and planning to buy something fantastic and realising that actually the credit cards won't stretch that far and just having to do the best you can. I would characterise the former as lying, not the latter.
The BBC can only tell you what they're planning to do six months down the line, it's not a promise or a contract. And for that matter, only because they're constantly getting asked what their plans are. It's easy to get hung up on that and miss all the things they're telling us about more recently, that are definitely happening.
Please don't let this thread turn into that argument again, I've hated reading the bile posters have been spewing at each other when that happens
But that's the whole point. They are making promises.
Promise 1 - there will be more Doctor who in 2013 than ever before.
Promise 2 - we will be taking over television.
That's on top of the recent spin regarding series 7. Remember they told us that Private Eye were lying when they knew all along it was the truth.
If they hadn't have produced all the spin and made the above promises I would have agreed with you. But they have.
Please don't misunderstand me. I really hope that I'm wrong and that it does actually live up to all the hype and promises. I want more Doctor Who, don't we all. But if we're not getting it, whether due to financial reasons or Moffats exhaustion then tell us.