£100,000,000,000

SnowStorm86SnowStorm86 Posts: 17,273
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Would you spend it on Trident replacement or invest it in other areas of governance, such as education, health, conventional defence, lowering our debt.

Do you think it would be money well spent? Do you think it's money we can even afford to be spending when we're repeatedly being told that austerity is for the good of the Country?

I'm not convinced that we need more WMDs in the world. Especially ones with a price tag like that.
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Comments

  • MC_SatanMC_Satan Posts: 26,512
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    Public services every time. Trident is a waste of money and is of no benefit.
  • john176bramleyjohn176bramley Posts: 25,049
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    That's a lot of zeros. I'd be interested to know how much of that money goes to average British working people and not into the pockets of the great and the good.
  • PrestonAlPrestonAl Posts: 10,342
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    what's that, 1 trillion. Isn't that a little wrong? Perhaps we should not spend anything on defence as we're safe in the EU.
  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 8,916
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    MP expenses.
  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 9,720
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    It's £2bn a year over 50 years. For context, we spend six times that amount on international aid.
  • RichievillaRichievilla Posts: 6,179
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    I agree totally with what Major General Patrick Cordingley, General Lord Ramsbotham, General Sir Hugh Beach and Field Marshall Lord Bramall wrote in a joint letter;
    Nuclear weapons have shown themselves to be completely useless as a deterrent to the threats and scale of the violence that we currently face or are likely to face - particularly international terrorism.

    Our independent deterrent has become virtually irrelevant except in the context of domestic politics

    I would much prefer some of the Trident money being used to strengthen our security services with the rest going towards health/social care or social housing. Most of Western Europe seem to be perfectly happy without nuclear weapons so wasting so much money on this is not something that I can ever agree with.
  • Fixit AgainFixit Again Posts: 1,363
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    Is SnowStorm86 Tony Blair and that the invoice total (less tax of course) for his projected wisdom?
  • VDUBsterVDUBster Posts: 1,423
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    I always wonder if those who want to get rid of Trident disable their house alarm (if they have one) and leave their doors unlocked when they go out since they clearly are against deterrents.
  • deptfordbakerdeptfordbaker Posts: 22,368
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    People act like it's a choice. If we don't have a nuclear deterrent another country will have to provide one for us.

    Imagine if only say Russia had nuclear weapons. How long do you think we would be living in a free country?

    If we gave up Trident, the American taxpayer would have to take up the burden of providing the nuclear umbrella to cover us. Plus if it came to a choice between saving us or American cities they would abandon us.

    Countries without nuclear weapons such as Germany rely on Britain, France and America to defend them from nuclear armed countries via a deterrent.

    Mind you the same people telling us we have a choice and could get rid of Trident are the same people that say austerity is a choice.
  • AxtolAxtol Posts: 8,480
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    I think we need the deterrent so I'd keep Trident. We can't prove that it works because if it works correctly, nothing will happen therefore there will be nothing to point to and prove. The secrets of nuclear weapons are out there and it's worryingly easy to build a nuclear bomb with the only real difficulty being acquiring the radioactive material. Even if every country out there got rid of their nukes, the knowledge of how to build one would still be out there and inevitably someone would build one. Other countries, anticipating this, would either keep some nukes or build more in secret bringing us back to square one. I'd like it if the world was a place where nuclear weapons aren't required but that's not the case.
  • Black SheepBlack Sheep Posts: 15,219
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    Would you spend it on Trident replacement or invest it in other areas of governance, such as education, health, conventional defence, lowering our debt.

    Do you think it would be money well spent? Do you think it's money we can even afford to be spending when we're repeatedly being told that austerity is for the good of the Country?

    I'm not convinced that we need more WMDs in the world. Especially ones with a price tag like that.

    It seems a lot when put like that but it's a drop in the ocean when considered alongside other parts of the budget.

    Even the aid budget is far larger over the same period. Consider the aid budget at ten billion or so a year for 30 years and you would be asking if it wouldn't be better spent on UK Health and duration projects.

    While austerity is for the country's good, I'd also say that defence is too.
  • codebluecodeblue Posts: 14,072
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    PrestonAl wrote: »
    what's that, 1 trillion. Isn't that a little wrong? Perhaps we should not spend anything on defence as we're safe in the EU.

    It's not one trillion, it's 100 billion.

    One trillion is

    £1,000,000,000,000

    So the number quoted is 10% of a trillion. Incidentally, it's less than the current national debt that no politicians have mentioned in the election.

    Thanks labour.
  • MC_SatanMC_Satan Posts: 26,512
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    VDUBster wrote: »
    I always wonder if those who want to get rid of Trident disable their house alarm (if they have one) and leave their doors unlocked when they go out since they clearly are against deterrents.

    I do but then I have conventional troops (3 large dogs).
  • Another POVAnother POV Posts: 2,214
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    MC_Satan wrote: »
    Public services every time. Trident is a waste of money and is of no benefit.

    It gives Britain a permanent seat at the top table at the UN, and by having that seat a veto at the UN - all be it probably when America says so, and a small voice on global matters at the UN via the seat. Without an essentially American nuke with a British sticker on the side of it, Britain whould have to give all that up, and the seat, vote and voice would be given to another country with nukes like India/Pakistan/Isreal/North Korea. Do you still want to give up Trident and our [American] bomb?
  • MC_SatanMC_Satan Posts: 26,512
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    It gives Britain a permanent seat at the top table at the UN, and by having that seat a veto at the UN - all be it probably when America says so, and a small voice on global matters at the UN via the seat. Without an essentially American nuke with a British sticker on the side of it, Britain whould have to give all that up, and the seat, vote and voice would be given to another country with nukes like India/Pakistan/Isreal/North Korea. Do you still want to give up Trident and our [American] bomb?

    Yep..
  • Another POVAnother POV Posts: 2,214
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    MC_Satan wrote: »
    Yep..

    You have just lowered Britain's international standing to the same level as Belgium's. Well done.
  • MC_SatanMC_Satan Posts: 26,512
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    You have just lowered Britain's international standing to the same level as Belgium's. Well done.

    Don't much care.
  • rusty123rusty123 Posts: 22,872
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    VDUBster wrote: »
    I always wonder if those who want to get rid of Trident disable their house alarm (if they have one) and leave their doors unlocked when they go out since they clearly are against deterrents.

    But a home security system that takes out the entire estate along with the burglar could be perceived as a wee bit OTT.
  • MesostimMesostim Posts: 52,864
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    VDUBster wrote: »
    I always wonder if those who want to get rid of Trident disable their house alarm (if they have one) and leave their doors unlocked when they go out since they clearly are against deterrents.

    I always wonder if those using house metaphors for nuclear weapons would escalate a burglary into them going round and blowing the burglars house up, then their own then everyone elses then watching their kids die of starvation or radiation poisining since they clearly are for mutually assured destruction.
  • Another POVAnother POV Posts: 2,214
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    MC_Satan wrote: »
    Don't much care.

    You would if your job depended on Trident/Britains bomb..
  • gulliverfoylegulliverfoyle Posts: 6,318
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    £500,000,000

    on money to govts with aircraft carriers mig 27 fighters and nuclears weapons space programs

    money well spent?
  • gulliverfoylegulliverfoyle Posts: 6,318
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    £1,400,000,000

    for people who eat too much

    http://www.theguardian.com/society/2014/nov/20/obesity-bigger-cost-than-war-and-terror

    see i can multiply numbers together
  • GibsonSGGibsonSG Posts: 23,681
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    MC_Satan wrote: »
    Public services every time. Trident is a waste of money and is of no benefit.

    Hear, hear.
  • MagnamundianMagnamundian Posts: 2,359
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    VDUBster wrote: »
    I always wonder if those who want to get rid of Trident disable their house alarm (if they have one) and leave their doors unlocked when they go out since they clearly are against deterrents.

    Trident is a deterrent and a retaliatory attack. House alarms are only deterrents unless you can show me a house alarm that is capable of blowing up a burglar (and most of the house with it...)

    In addition Trident is only a deterrent against other nuclear powers in the event of a nuclear attack. Even if Putin invited himself and his ground troops into Scotland on the grounds that they are there to facilitate another referendum would we consider using Trident as a deterrent? No of course not.

    Are we going to nuke fundamentalist guerrilla fighters hiding amongst innocent people in the middle east? No of course not.
  • jmclaughjmclaugh Posts: 63,997
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    I think the £100b figure the OP posts is the CND estimate of the cost of replacing Trident, maintaining it and decommissioning it over a period of 40 years which equates to £2.5b p.a.
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