changing ISP's...to a foreign one?

Could I change ISP's - but go with a company outside of the UK? Would I avoid the snooping charter which starts tomorrow? surely since the internet is worldwide and most countries are capitalism driven, they would be lining up to take my money.

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  • MaccaMacca Posts: 18,527
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    Not unless you move to another country.
  • StigStig Posts: 12,446
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    Could I change ISP's - but go with a company outside of the UK? Would I avoid the snooping charter which starts tomorrow? surely since the internet is worldwide and most countries are capitalism driven, they would be lining up to take my money.
    The ISP connects your home to the internet, so no, it has to be a local UK ISP.

    In theory you could have a satellite connection, but they are slow and expensive.
  • call100call100 Posts: 7,278
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    Could I change ISP's - but go with a company outside of the UK? Would I avoid the snooping charter which starts tomorrow? surely since the internet is worldwide and most countries are capitalism driven, they would be lining up to take my money.

    You need to look into VPN's.....
  • radioanorakradioanorak Posts: 4,247
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    Use Chrome Browser Or better still one of its alternatives like Comodo Dragon which does not collect info about you.
    Install the Add On called Browsec VPN which encrypts your traffic.
    When using the browser switch to incognito windows.
  • Fried KickinFried Kickin Posts: 60,132
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    Opera Browser has ablocking and unlimted free VPN built in nowadays. :)
  • radioanorakradioanorak Posts: 4,247
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    I found that the Opera FREE VPN would not allow me to select the UK as my location so its useless to me.
    Browsec does so I can use BBC iplayer, ITV Hub etc even though I live In Rhodes, Greece.
  • effinjeffineffinjeffin Posts: 7
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    Free VPNs generally aren't advised.
  • StigStig Posts: 12,446
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    Free VPNs generally aren't advised.
    You need to decide if you trust a random VPN provider more than your ISP and the UK government. I think I'm safer with the latter.
  • LumstormLumstorm Posts: 447
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    I don't think the charter is just going to start because it became law the infrastructure to hold all that information is going to have to be built first.
  • Thine WonkThine Wonk Posts: 17,190
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    Lumstorm wrote: »
    I don't think the charter is just going to start because it became law the infrastructure to hold all that information is going to have to be built first.

    The law was more about making legal what already happens by agreement in behind the scenes deals I think, read the wording carefully. It is more about writing a law that gives greater transparency to the public and more safeguards. It also reduces the risk of further legal exposure because what they have been doing is now recorded in law.
    The Investigatory Powers Act transforms the law relating to the use and oversight of Investigatory powers. It strengthens safeguards and introduces world-leading oversight arrangements.

    The Act does three key things. First, it brings together powers already available to law enforcement and the security and intelligence agencies to obtain communications and data about communications. It makes these powers – and the safeguards that apply to them – clear and understandable.

    Second, it radically overhauls the way these powers are authorised and overseen.
  • MaxatoriaMaxatoria Posts: 17,980
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    Thine Wonk wrote: »
    The law was more about making legal what already happens by agreement in behind the scenes deals I think, read the wording carefully. It is more about writing a law that gives greater transparency to the public and more safeguards. It also reduces the risk of further legal exposure because what they have been doing is now recorded in law.

    It should be said that the people overseeing the spying are appointed by the government so its hardly an impartial viewer as you wont get the job unless you tow the line so to speak.

    Ok there will be a few errors thrown up to please the crowd and to show the law is 'working' by showing some ambulance trust entered a number wrongly and thus the request was denied.

    But really nothing going to stop the spooks reading our comms traffic before even our destination.
  • call100call100 Posts: 7,278
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    Stig wrote: »
    You need to decide if you trust a random VPN provider more than your ISP and the UK government. I think I'm safer with the latter.

    Really? Is that just this Government or all future Governments? I think the days of trusting the Government has well and truly come to an end.:(
  • Thine WonkThine Wonk Posts: 17,190
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    call100 wrote: »
    Really? Is that just this Government or all future Governments? I think the days of trusting the Government has well and truly come to an end.:(

    Have you seem any signs of abuse of the data? it seems to be it has genuinely been used to arrest terror suspects and keep us safe. I don't see the data being abused. I you disagree then give us an example?

    Some foreign VPN provider could quite well scam you.
  • MaxatoriaMaxatoria Posts: 17,980
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    call100 wrote: »
    Really? Is that just this Government or all future Governments? I think the days of trusting the Government has well and truly come to an end.:(

    There has never been a day where the government/states interest has really been to the public other than to extract the maximum amount of taxes out of them.
  • StigStig Posts: 12,446
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    The VPNs can give a false sense of security. Many of them have weak security:
    http://www.theregister.co.uk/2016/02/26/ssl_vpns_survey/

    A lot of users won't know (or care) if their cheap VPN service uses old technology which is easily hacked. Then you are routing all your traffic through a third party which can decrypt every packet.
  • call100call100 Posts: 7,278
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    Thine Wonk wrote: »
    Have you seem any signs of abuse of the data? it seems to be it has genuinely been used to arrest terror suspects and keep us safe. I don't see the data being abused. I you disagree then give us an example?

    Some foreign VPN provider could quite well scam you.
    There is no evidence that it has or will stop any terrorist act.
    It's bulk surveillance of the the citizens and as a principal should never be allowed in a free society. Using the fear factor to justify it is scraping the barrel.
  • Thine WonkThine Wonk Posts: 17,190
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    call100 wrote: »
    There is no evidence that it has or will stop any terrorist act.
    It's bulk surveillance of the the citizens and as a principal should never be allowed in a free society. Using the fear factor to justify it is scraping the barrel.

    So you can't answer the question then. We do know that dozens of terrorists have been caught by the intelegenge agencies and police. You also have no evidence of the data being misused.
  • LumstormLumstorm Posts: 447
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    Thine Wonk wrote: »
    So you can't answer the question then. We do know that dozens of terrorists have been caught by the intelegenge agencies and police. You also have no evidence of the data being misused.

    The intelligence work can be like looking for a needle in a haystack now they are adding more hay to the stack.

    There is also the concern over back-doors to encryption http://www.theregister.co.uk/2016/11/30/investigatory_powers_act_backdoors/

    Cameron was on about this before that there shouldn't be communications that the government can't see, good encryption is vital to our security and cannot be compromised by people who don't understand what a back-door means.
  • call100call100 Posts: 7,278
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    Thine Wonk wrote: »
    So you can't answer the question then. We do know that dozens of terrorists have been caught by the intelegenge agencies and police. You also have no evidence of the data being misused.

    As you have no evidence that it hasn't, that however is not the point. You also have no evidence that bulk collection has caught any terrorists. In fact many of them that carried out the atrocities were in fact on a watch list
    You have also fallen for the Terrorism line as an excuse to enact any law they see fit.
    You can argue all you like, however, I choose not to blindly trust politicians, who, on a daily basis, prove they are untrustworthy and self serving.
    We will have to agree to disagree as there is no middle ground.
  • TelevisionUserTelevisionUser Posts: 41,415
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    Could I change ISP's - but go with a company outside of the UK? Would I avoid the snooping charter which starts tomorrow? surely since the internet is worldwide and most countries are capitalism driven, they would be lining up to take my money.

    Best advice on that legislation is here: How can I protect myself from government snoopers?
  • cmq2cmq2 Posts: 2,502
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    We still await clarification on the status of VPNs under the new Act
    What’s interesting is that the new act actually calls for “internet connection records” not from Internet service providers (ISPs), but rather from Connection service providers (CSPs). Observers have noted that it is possible and even likely that the Investigatory Powers Act will be used to coerce UK-based VPN companies to start logging Internet connection records.
    https://www.privateinternetaccess.com/blog/2016/11/uk-investigatory-powers-act-forces-collection-internet-connection-records-allows-government-see-one-year-internet-history/

    i don't buy the overseas VPN loophole. Like dodgy websites, if an external VPN will not comply with UK law then UK ISPs will be obliged to block their server IP addresses or, threaten UK users tunnelling to their servers with disconnection/prosecution. Also, PIA stopped offering its services in Russia even though it is based in the US.
  • Thine WonkThine Wonk Posts: 17,190
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    cmq2 wrote: »
    We still await clarification on the status of VPNs under the new Act
    https://www.privateinternetaccess.com/blog/2016/11/uk-investigatory-powers-act-forces-collection-internet-connection-records-allows-government-see-one-year-internet-history/

    i don't buy the overseas VPN loophole. Like dodgy websites, if an external VPN will not comply with UK law then UK ISPs will be obliged to block their server IP addresses or, threaten UK users tunnelling to their servers with disconnection/prosecution. Also, PIA stopped offering its services in Russia even though it is based in the US.

    Don't be silly the internet routes around blocks, I can link you to The Pirate Bay, Extratorrent etc. You also can't block foreign VPNs as there are many legitimate business uses.
  • cmq2cmq2 Posts: 2,502
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    Thine Wonk wrote: »
    Don't be silly the internet routes around blocks, I can link you to The Pirate Bay, Extratorrent etc. You also can't block foreign VPNs as there are many legitimate business uses.
    The ability of some to circumvent a block does not mean it will not be imposed. It just becomes a protracted battle like the Pirate Bay saga.

    Medium and large companies already indefinitely log their employee's emails and web traffic centrally for business purposes so could relatively easily comply with CSP rules. We already have data protection laws so it would be just an additional layer of compliance.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/VPN_blocking
  • MaxatoriaMaxatoria Posts: 17,980
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    cmq2 wrote: »
    We still await clarification on the status of VPNs under the new Act
    https://www.privateinternetaccess.com/blog/2016/11/uk-investigatory-powers-act-forces-collection-internet-connection-records-allows-government-see-one-year-internet-history/

    i don't buy the overseas VPN loophole. Like dodgy websites, if an external VPN will not comply with UK law then UK ISPs will be obliged to block their server IP addresses or, threaten UK users tunnelling to their servers with disconnection/prosecution. Also, PIA stopped offering its services in Russia even though it is based in the US.

    "we" still await clarification....sounds a bit like someone from the spook agencies again has turned up.

    Its probably a double bluff as i've not heard of any spook agencies complaining of VPN's for ages so i'd guess they're easy(ish) to break given a bit of time but not in realtime. The powers now given allow the government to order isp's to turn off any encryption they use on a communication line and with probably a judicial oversight of a nodding donkey with a spud signature on it doesn't really fill me with confidence.
  • LumstormLumstorm Posts: 447
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    This is ridiculous they can't legislate against VPNs as they have a legitimate use without VPN many companies would have to leave the UK in order to protect their business.

    There is a concern that companies have to help the government agencies to access encrypted data, this is why good encryption that can't be broken is vital to our security so when asked by a court for access they can be told that its not technically possible. Similar to the situation between Apple and the FBI with a terrorists phone Apple refused to create a flaw as it would put all their customers at risk.
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