The word ****** is a strange one for me, if i use it im being offensive, and yet, listen to any 50 cent or "MOBO" song and the word is bandied about to, seemingly to describe a mate?
Back on subject and ive avoided the Thatcher debate, but if what i read was right she, on 1-1 convo, said somebody reminded her of a doll she had in her childhood, Now would me saying Katie Price reminds me of my sisters old Barbie doll be racist? Ofcourse not.
How many black people do you honestly know that go around and call white people 'barbie dolls'?
nothing wrong with them at all. collect them, buy them and enjoy them, and feel no guilt. if anybody says anything, or calls you out as a racist, hit them hard over the head with a pool ball filled sock, just not the black ball obviously, no point making a tense situation worse
How can a childrens toy, invented in the 1800's now be an offensive word?!, cant say i know much about its history tbh, but..isnt its shortened term "wog" now used by Australians and Eastern Europeans to describe themselves, im sure there was a film called "Wog Boy/Man" from Australia a few years ago?
Why can't it be? Considering the prevalence of Slavery during the century, it is more likely that offensive toys/objects originate during that era rather than now
Ohh dear! Here we go again. I'm not going to make much comment this time apart from - at this rate in a good few years time the Oxford English Dictionary will be reduced to about fifty pages!! In fact it might have to be re-named just 'The Dictionary' so as not to offend non-English people!:)
nothing wrong with them at all. collect them, buy them and enjoy them, and feel no guilt. if anybody says anything, or calls you out as a racist, hit them hard over the head with a pool ball filled sock, just not the black ball obviously, no point making a tense situation worse
Why can't it be? Considering the prevalence of Slavery during the century, it is more likely that offensive toys/objects originate during that era rather than now
Ohh dear! Here we go again. I'm not going to make much comment this time apart from - at this rate in a good few years time the Oxford English Dictionary will be reduced to about fifty pages!! In fact it might have to be re-named just 'The Dictionary' so as not to offend non-English people!:)
I just don't like gollywogs. They just scared me when I was small. Those horrid stripey trousers - reminded me of that god-awful Black & white Minstrel show. Yuk.
I can just about remember The Black and White Minstrel Show and recall it actually used to be very entertaining. The 'blacking up' of the performers was not intended to ridicule black entertainers, far from it - it was entirely celebratory of black talent and was a big ratings success at the time. Yes, there should have been more representation across the board back in those days, white people were not and are not the only pool from where talent can be drawn, but that wasn't focused upon enough in the 1970's which is shameful for broadcasters all round but to blame the participants in BWMS for something that would not in any way have been their intention I feel is quite wrong. I think the show should be re-run today without a pang of guilt.
Golliwogs, however, are different. Unfortunately around the same time and up until the 1980's the last syllable was used as a derogatory term for black people and it would be impossible to come back from that without causing grave offence for those with not so short memories.
Hypothetical question for those who can't see any issue..
Would you buy a "Golliwog" as a gift for a black friend/colleague?
Personally i wouldnt buy kids toys for anyone i know.
Although my nephew has a cuddly giraffe which is brown and yellow, im sure that will soon be offensive to Africans, Asians, Vegetarians, PETA, Jungle dwellers....:yawn:
can i just ask of anyone here who is black if they found/find the idea of gollywogs, as used innocently as toys by children years ago, offensive?
Plenty of black posters on the other thread have said that it is highly offensive but that fell on deaf ears because "freedom of speech" is more important to some people
I got one for Christmas and I love it.
Collectable are selling them atm, but they're more soft than the older ones, they're also ltd edition ones. Mine is called Lime Girl and has a green dress adn bow in her hair. They've been really popular apparently.
It actually is offensive if you use it in a way to hurt someones feelings.
People used to call me mowgli behind my back or to offend me, that is not ok. @r actually means black, people find that offensive don't they?
It does depend how it's done, the tone of people's voices etc.
Mowgli is a really nice character. There's nothing sinister or bad about him, therefore to be labelled after a friendly, loveable popular character should not be a bad thing.
But in your case, this name was called out behind your back and it was intended to offend. That is definitely out of order.
It is a shame the way some people can take something which is nice and positive and use it to hurt others and cause offence.
At the end of the day a Golliwog is nothing more than a caricature of a black person developed at a time where there was blatant overt racism towards black people and it was acceptable.
It doesn't matter whether it was once a toy, once times have changed we are in the year 2009 and to compare a black person to a Golliwog is going to be seen as offensive and there is no way around it.
Plenty of black posters on the other thread have said that it is highly offensive but that fell on deaf ears because "freedom of speech" is more important to some people
ah, thank you pr. i just wanted to clarify that coz i really did not know. but then if it is offensive then i think we should just forget them (gollywogs). no need to hurt others imo.
Sorry, but i can't stop laughing at this bold part. On what plant are you on?
I've seen it on a TV drama. Someone was asking people how they liked their tea and got all flustered when they got to the black person, apologised and changed the question.
Personally i wouldnt buy kids toys for anyone i know.
Although my nephew has a cuddly giraffe which is brown and yellow, im sure that will soon be offensive to Africans, Asians, Vegetarians, PETA, Jungle dwellers....:yawn:
Ok then, your black friends/neighbours kids birthday let's say.
i have a better hypothetical question, what did black people do for jam before robertson's pulled the golliwog from their range of preserves?
I'm afraid that's not a better question as I have no idea what 'black people' would do.. but maybe they'd invest in one of the many other ranges of jams.
Comments
How many black people do you honestly know that go around and call white people 'barbie dolls'?
About the same amount of people how call black people golliwogs tbh.
Why can't it be? Considering the prevalence of Slavery during the century, it is more likely that offensive toys/objects originate during that era rather than now
Would you buy a "Golliwog" as a gift for a black friend/colleague?
Great advice
Fair point.
How hard is it to not include half a dozen words?
I can just about remember The Black and White Minstrel Show and recall it actually used to be very entertaining. The 'blacking up' of the performers was not intended to ridicule black entertainers, far from it - it was entirely celebratory of black talent and was a big ratings success at the time. Yes, there should have been more representation across the board back in those days, white people were not and are not the only pool from where talent can be drawn, but that wasn't focused upon enough in the 1970's which is shameful for broadcasters all round but to blame the participants in BWMS for something that would not in any way have been their intention I feel is quite wrong. I think the show should be re-run today without a pang of guilt.
Golliwogs, however, are different. Unfortunately around the same time and up until the 1980's the last syllable was used as a derogatory term for black people and it would be impossible to come back from that without causing grave offence for those with not so short memories.
Personally i wouldnt buy kids toys for anyone i know.
Although my nephew has a cuddly giraffe which is brown and yellow, im sure that will soon be offensive to Africans, Asians, Vegetarians, PETA, Jungle dwellers....:yawn:
Plenty of black posters on the other thread have said that it is highly offensive but that fell on deaf ears because "freedom of speech" is more important to some people
i have a better hypothetical question, what did black people do for jam before robertson's pulled the golliwog from their range of preserves?
Collectable are selling them atm, but they're more soft than the older ones, they're also ltd edition ones. Mine is called Lime Girl and has a green dress adn bow in her hair. They've been really popular apparently.
It does depend how it's done, the tone of people's voices etc.
Mowgli is a really nice character. There's nothing sinister or bad about him, therefore to be labelled after a friendly, loveable popular character should not be a bad thing.
But in your case, this name was called out behind your back and it was intended to offend. That is definitely out of order.
It is a shame the way some people can take something which is nice and positive and use it to hurt others and cause offence.
It doesn't matter whether it was once a toy, once times have changed we are in the year 2009 and to compare a black person to a Golliwog is going to be seen as offensive and there is no way around it.
ah, thank you pr. i just wanted to clarify that coz i really did not know. but then if it is offensive then i think we should just forget them (gollywogs). no need to hurt others imo.
I've seen it on a TV drama. Someone was asking people how they liked their tea and got all flustered when they got to the black person, apologised and changed the question.
Totally ludicrous. :rolleyes:
Thats where we are heading
Probably the same thing black people did when they were asked to give up their seat for a white person...put up with it
Ok then, your black friends/neighbours kids birthday let's say.
I'm afraid that's not a better question as I have no idea what 'black people' would do.. but maybe they'd invest in one of the many other ranges of jams.