(for those of you who don't recognise this "diff" output, lines starting < are things that have gone missing, and lines starting > are new things that have appeared)
By 5pm that had been put back how it was, and now PIDs 2682/3 were replaced by 3578/9 - and this has been the ongoing change still visible right now -
I suspect there's no changes to the channels that are visible to the public else someone else would have said something by now. I'm not in the region at the moment to be able to check easily. Can anyone see if anything has noticably changed? Assuming nothing has changed, why would they mess with the PID numbers?
LCN57 has appeared in the LCN & SDT tables on all muxes from Winter Hill at 11am this morning. The service is named "HIGH STREET TV" - there are as no video or audio PIDs yet so the channel isn't running.
Surely the Manchester mux is now full, with 6 full time channels??? Wheres this 'local' channel gonna fit in on the mux....or will one of these 6 current channels have to go to make way for 'Local TV'?
Is that - as the name suggests - a shopping channel? edit I guess it's this, a JML type channel?
That seems to be it. The logos match. Video is 4:3 and seems to be a quickly repeating loop of adverts originating from the USA overlayed with UK+IRL graphics.
Surely the Manchester mux is now full, with 6 full time channels??? Wheres this 'local' channel gonna fit in on the mux....or will one of these 6 current channels have to go to make way for 'Local TV'?
The Manchester Television Network multiplex is not to be confused with the new local TV multiplex that will launch with 3 services - the local channel plus two other channels - sometime next year (or early 2014) depending on how the award of the local TV multiplex operator's licence develops. (Roll out speed will depend partly on the winner of the multiplex licence and is subject to the issue of state aid funding being sorted out.)
I've heard via another source that DMOL are aware and are fixing it. I've added another quick perl script that should detect the change and email me when it changes.
There was another reshuffle of video and audio PIDs today around 5:30pm. Wondering why they'd done that, I had a look at the bandwidth stats- and they've had a change around...
Monday @ 22:16
PID Mbps content
---- ---- -----------
1fff 2.62 null packets
090f 2.59 mov4men+1
0909 2.60 movies4men
0904 2.51 ARGOS TV 24/7
090c 2.51 SONY SAB
1930 1.64 HIGH STREET TV
0dfa 1.49 CAPITAL TV
0012 1.37 EIT
Wednesday @ 18:29
PID Mbps content
---- ---- -----------
0d30 3.00 HIGH STREET TV
090f 2.62 mov4men+1
0909 2.64 movies4men
0dfa 2.50 CAPITAL TV
110c 2.00 SONY SAB
1904 2.01 ARGOS TV 24/7
0012 1.36 EIT
1fff 1.14 null packets
So HIGH STREET TV has had a significant boost to its video bandwidth. SONY SAB has lost 0.5 Mbps. CAPITAL TV has also had a bit of a boost. These are all video PIDs apart from EIT and null packets.
I think they've just moved from VBR to CBR. I've always seen the bit rates fluctuate on most of the services until today. Now they seem to be pretty much fixed.
As a result, I question the accuracy of those original figures, unless they've been averaged over a long period of time.
I think they've just moved from VBR to CBR. I've always seen the bit rates fluctuate on most of the services until today. Now they seem to be pretty much fixed.
As a result, I question the accuracy of those original figures, unless they've been averaged over a long period of time.
It depends what you mean by "they". If you mean Capital and Highstreet then I agree. I think that the previous 4 channels were running CBR already - but the latest two had been initially added to the mux as VBR.
The above stats were both taken by running a file containing a 5 minute transport stream dump through TSReader Lite - though I can also get snapshot values with dvbsnoop -s bandwidth on the live data which pretty well agreed with the 5 minute averages.
Having looked again just now 09:35 - it's been tweaked again. High Street now 2.0 Mbps (down by 1.0), Sony 2.5 Mbps (up by 0.5), null packets 1.6Mbps (up by 0.5).
I wonder why they feel the need to have the EIT running so high - it's more than twice the data rate that is used on e.g. BBCA.
All those null packets, all that wasted bandwidth... Also, using CBR in 2012 = fail.
I think "fail" is a little harsh- they may have commercial reasons for running that way- you'd think that the slots would have been sold with the bitrates specified. It's not as simple as one broadcaster being able to statmux across a group of its own channels.
Further on the EIT- if that was halved, it would release something like 850Kbps, add that to null packets (which are no longer VBR headroom) and you have 2.4Mbps - so about one more channel's worth of free space at the rates they are using.
Where in Manchester can receive these channels?
I have family who are on Winter Hill mast and in M9 but no matter how often you rescan their is no movies4men or movies 4men + 1
M9 is certainly within the Ofcom predicted pattern - see page 27 of http://stakeholders.ofcom.org.uk/binaries/consultations/notice524/im.pdf - however the transmission setup appears to have been done to minimum budget just to get something on air at all - so even with a quality aerial and a sensitive receiver you still may struggle.
Given that Canis Media (who now run the current Manchester mux) are behind Comux who won the infrastructure contract for the more national rollout of local tv muxes, I wonder if they'll be in a position to get this mux moved up the WH mast when the new Manchester/Liverpool/Preston petals are setup?
Comments
At approx 4:30pm PIDs 2316/7 were replaced by 2828/9 -
(for those of you who don't recognise this "diff" output, lines starting < are things that have gone missing, and lines starting > are new things that have appeared)
By 5pm that had been put back how it was, and now PIDs 2682/3 were replaced by 3578/9 - and this has been the ongoing change still visible right now -
I suspect there's no changes to the channels that are visible to the public else someone else would have said something by now. I'm not in the region at the moment to be able to check easily. Can anyone see if anything has noticably changed? Assuming nothing has changed, why would they mess with the PID numbers?
edit I guess it's this, a JML type channel?
The Manchester Television Network multiplex is not to be confused with the new local TV multiplex that will launch with 3 services - the local channel plus two other channels - sometime next year (or early 2014) depending on how the award of the local TV multiplex operator's licence develops. (Roll out speed will depend partly on the winner of the multiplex licence and is subject to the issue of state aid funding being sorted out.)
Compare that with Capital TV which looks like other services:
Waves at the Canis Media folks - you might want to fix this if it isn't deliberate...
It's happened before when GMG owned the mux, think someone in London needs to read the instructions that came with the CSI.
Yes- you spotted it before in post #92 of this very thread - March 2011 affecting the then newly launched movies4men. T'is all a bit deja-vu! ( http://forums.digitalspy.co.uk/showthread.php?t=1197918&page=4 )
I've heard via another source that DMOL are aware and are fixing it. I've added another quick perl script that should detect the change and email me when it changes.
So HIGH STREET TV has had a significant boost to its video bandwidth. SONY SAB has lost 0.5 Mbps. CAPITAL TV has also had a bit of a boost. These are all video PIDs apart from EIT and null packets.
As a result, I question the accuracy of those original figures, unless they've been averaged over a long period of time.
It depends what you mean by "they". If you mean Capital and Highstreet then I agree. I think that the previous 4 channels were running CBR already - but the latest two had been initially added to the mux as VBR.
The above stats were both taken by running a file containing a 5 minute transport stream dump through TSReader Lite - though I can also get snapshot values with dvbsnoop -s bandwidth on the live data which pretty well agreed with the 5 minute averages.
Having looked again just now 09:35 - it's been tweaked again. High Street now 2.0 Mbps (down by 1.0), Sony 2.5 Mbps (up by 0.5), null packets 1.6Mbps (up by 0.5).
I wonder why they feel the need to have the EIT running so high - it's more than twice the data rate that is used on e.g. BBCA.
Also, using CBR in 2012 = fail.
I think "fail" is a little harsh- they may have commercial reasons for running that way- you'd think that the slots would have been sold with the bitrates specified. It's not as simple as one broadcaster being able to statmux across a group of its own channels.
Further on the EIT- if that was halved, it would release something like 850Kbps, add that to null packets (which are no longer VBR headroom) and you have 2.4Mbps - so about one more channel's worth of free space at the rates they are using.
Best way to know would be to do 2 short samples and a long sample
52 mov4men+1
53 SONY SAB
54 ARGOS TV 24/7
56 CAPITAL TV
All these have disappeared for me
All still visible here ok.
Still here for me.
I have family who are on Winter hill mast and in M9 but no matter how often you rescan their is no movies4men or movies 4men + 1
M9 is certainly within the Ofcom predicted pattern - see page 27 of http://stakeholders.ofcom.org.uk/binaries/consultations/notice524/im.pdf - however the transmission setup appears to have been done to minimum budget just to get something on air at all - so even with a quality aerial and a sensitive receiver you still may struggle.
Given that Canis Media (who now run the current Manchester mux) are behind Comux who won the infrastructure contract for the more national rollout of local tv muxes, I wonder if they'll be in a position to get this mux moved up the WH mast when the new Manchester/Liverpool/Preston petals are setup?
Not a clue then as to why I cannot get them?
What other channels share the same ( mux < is it called )