he doesnt do to bad out of making things up hes a millionaire!
and also if he makes it up then you have to say that the others do too! charlatans!
Lots of charlatans do well. That is because there are a lot of gullible people out there. Then people look at their wealth and conclude that they must be right.
Any claims that they do are just as fake as their information.
I saw that programme (Psychic Challenge) and some of it was convincing but you know that it's all spin and entertainment. But it does give the impression that this does work, which is a sort of fraud.
Any claims that they do are just as fake as their information.
Those replies do NOT state that the UK police have never used psychics. They are full of fudge like "to the best of my knowledge" and "we do not keep records".
The police can never be seen to have used psychics as any ensuing criminal case would likely be thrown out.
Those replies do NOT state that the UK police have never used psychics. They are full of fudge like "to the best of my knowledge" and "we do not keep records".
The police can never be seen to have used psychics as any ensuing criminal case would likely be thrown out.
I probably watch too many TV cop shows, but don't the police have to give their reasons for searching private premises etc? If a psychic said "I see a child in a green building with a sinister clown" would a judge grant a search warrant for the building? Or would they just say, "well, what do you expect to find in a branch of McDonalds?"
Any claims that they do are just as fake as their information.
mmm, strange then that I simply entered "uk police psychics" into google to immediately yield these two results that totally contradict your bald statement.
Could psychic powers be harnessed to help solve crimes?
They soon had their answer when a woman named Nella Jones came to their attention, claiming that she could help locate a priceless Vermeer painting, called The Guitar Player, that had been stolen from Kenwood House in North London in 1974.
Nella told the police that she had been ironing some clothes and idly watching the television when her mind suddenly focused on the whereabouts of the painting.
She hurriedly sketched it out and took it to the police, who were understandably sceptical.
But having nothing else to go on they followed the lead. The painting was eventually recovered from St Bartholomew's churchyard as a result of the information she gave them.
Again, it would be easy to dismiss Nella's guidance to the police as just blind luck.
Easy, that is, if she hadn't spent the following 20 years helping them ensnare murderers and other serious offenders.
"Nella gave invaluable assistance on a number of murders," says Detective Chief Inspector Arnie Cooke. "Her evidence was not the type you can put before a jury. But senior investigating officers have got to take people like her on board and accept what they are saying."
In fact, so useful was Nella to Scotland Yard that in 1993 they publicly thanked her and senior officers hosted a dinner in her honour.
Scotland Yard later wrote to her, saying: "Some police officers may have seemed sceptical of your abilities ... but it is a mark of those abilities that police turn to you time and time again."
I probably watch too many TV cop shows, but don't the police have to give their reasons for searching private premises etc? If a psychic said "I see a child in a green building with a sinister clown" would a judge grant a search warrant for the building? Or would they just say, "well, what do you expect to find in a branch of McDonalds?"
mmm, strange then that I simply entered "uk police psychics" into google to immediately yield these two results that totally contradict your bald statement.
Very easy to solve this one. Anyone with powers just demonstatrate them. I am sure we would all welcome such a demostration. No psychic ever does demonstrate their "powers". It is always stories after the event.
Very easy to solve this one. Anyone with powers just demonstatrate them. I am sure we would all welcome such a demostration. No psychic ever does demonstrate their "powers". It is always stories after the event.
As I mentioned, these came up in a simple google search. I have no prior knowledge of them, so I have no idea if they are true or not. I have an open mind on them, if someone can show them to be true or false I'll readily accept it.
Are you saying they're not true because you have evidence ? Or do you believe they're not true because they don't fit in with your beliefs ?
As I mentioned, these came up in a simple google search. I have no prior knowledge of them, so I have no idea if they are true or not. I have an open mind on them, if someone can show them to be true or false I'll readily accept it.
Are you saying they're not true because you have evidence ? Or do you believe they're not true because they don't fit in with your beliefs ?
As I mentioned, these came up in a simple google search. I have no prior knowledge of them, so I have no idea if they are true or not. I have an open mind on them, if someone can show them to be true or false I'll readily accept it.
Are you saying they're not true because you have evidence ? Or do you believe they're not true because they don't fit in with your beliefs ?
I say they are not true because when challenged to do so psychics can never demonstate their powers. Over two years ago I set up the psychic bureau in this forum. It has remained a cold and lonely place. Is that because no psychic activity has taken place in the last two years?
If there is any truth to these psychics claims then why don't they solve all murders with their "powers"? Or would asking that offend the spirits and make it not work?
I say they are not true because when challenged to do so psychics can never demonstate their powers. Over two years ago I set up the psychic bureau in this forum. It has remained a cold and lonely place. Is that because no psychic activity has taken place in the last two years?
Which still doesn't refute either of the cases I, so easily, found to counter one posters earlier claim that the police don't use psychics. No more, or less, than your opinion.
Which still doesn't refute either of the cases I, so easily, found to counter one posters earlier claim that the police don't use psychics. No more, or less, than your opinion.
Well when you can get a psychic to demonstatre their powers in real time we might begin to believe you.
Which still doesn't refute either of the cases I, so easily, found to counter one posters earlier claim that the police don't use psychics. No more, or less, than your opinion.
Well anyone can use Google. It does not demonstrate any study of the subject. It is not my opinion. It is a fact that in the 25 months the psychic bureau has been in existance no psychic has come forward to rise to the challenge. If there was anyone out there who had powers then they would just show them off.
As I mentioned, these came up in a simple google search. I have no prior knowledge of them, so I have no idea if they are true or not. I have an open mind on them, if someone can show them to be true or false I'll readily accept it.
Nella Jones has been debunked by Randi (no surprise, really).
An article about her in the Psychic News in '82:
"Eighteen months before the police arrested Peter Sutcliffe, the Yorkshire Ripper, Kent medium Nella Jones drew a picture of him, described where he lived and worked and accurately predicted two more murders before he was caught...Eventually Nella went to Yorkshire and accompanied police to help them locate clues and places. Her mental pictures were always accurate. Nella could exactly describe details of a location before they even arrived at the spot. Police were amazed that the psychic could direct them to places she had never seen."
This would of course be remarkable if her claims are true, but researchers are immediately faced with a problem. Although Jones insisted that her major predictions were witnessed, they were made public long AFTER the event. When Melvin Harris - author of Sorry, You've Been Duped!, to which I am indebted for much of this article - wrote to her to suggest that she deposit copies of the relevant items with the Society for Psychical Research she did not respond to his letter. However, it is clear from newspaper reports and Jones' own book Ghost of a Chance that she did NOT provide any worthwhile information to the police. Here's a breakdown of her most impressive "prophecies":
1) Fourteen months before the murder of Jacqueline Hill on 17/11/80 Jones "saw" that "The next victim will be found on a small patch of waste ground". She later added: "I suddenly saw with tremendous clarity the scene of the Ripper's next attack...The girl, I knew without seeing, had dark hair."
Of the Ripper's previous victims six had been found on waste ground, two on grass land, one in a wood yard and one on a rubbish pile. Only one had been killed indoors. Ten of the Ripper's twelve victims had dark hair. Jones hardly needed psychic abilities to predict that the next victim would be a dark-haired woman whose body would be found on waste ground.
2) Back to Jones' own words about the killer: "I believe he lives in Bradford and that he is a long-distance lorry driver...I had the strongest feeling that the police had already spoken to him."
This sounds impressive, but as early as October 1975 the police were already looking for a lorry driver in connection with the murder of Wilma McCann. Two years later, after the murder of Jean Royle, a vital clue was found in her handbag - a £5 note issued from the Shipley and Bingley branch of the Midland bank in Bradford. Detectives from Manchester and Bradford visited factories in Bingley, Shipton and Bradford to interview all male employees, who were also asked to check their wage packets for £5 notes within a short range of serial numbers. The search took three months and over five thousand men were interviewed. DCS Jack Ridgeway didn't need a psychic to tell him that "It is more than likely that we have interviewed the person who received the fiver."
3) According to Jones, "The murders, it was disclosed during the trial, did involve the use of a hammer, among other weapons..." This seems to be a reference to a horrific dream experienced by Jones in August 1979. In fact the Bradford Telegraph and Argus had already revealed the Ripper's choice of a murder weapon. According to the 12/7/79 issue, the Ripper "Kills with an engineers' ball-pein hammer". The article went on to state that the murderer "Wears size 7 boots", an important clue that the Ripper was of small stature, and one that could have suggested to Jones that his height would be 5' 7" or 5' 8".
4) Jones' psychic skills served her no better when it came to a description of the Ripper's house. She saw "...a grey house with a wrought iron gate in front...the impression of a small garage nearby." Most unusually she risked giving an address - 6 Chapel Street.
She struck lucky with the number six, but although there are four Chapel Streets in Bradford (plus Chapel Walk, Chapel Lane, Chapel Place, Chapel Fold and Chapel Lane) Sutcliffe lived in Garden Lane. And the house was painted pink.
5) By means of clairvoyance Jones "saw" the Ripper's face several times in July 1979. She drew a clean-shaven man who would have been capable of disguising himself as a woman (remember that the Bradford Telegraph and Argus had mentioned the Ripper's small shoe size).
In fact, Peter Sutcliffe had a beard and would have been a somewhat unconvincing female impersonator.
6) In July 1979 Jones made her most dramatic prediction to date - the Ripper's next victim would be a boy of fifteen or sixteen.
"He" turned out to be twenty year old Barbara Leach.
7) Jones made the claim: "I don't think he has ever been married, but I believe his mother is dead and that his father was a cripple...I have the feeling that he was taken away from his mother when he was ten or eleven years old."
The only correct statement here is that Peter Sutcliffe's mother was dead.
What about Psychic News' claim that Jones had "accurately forecast two more murders before he was caught?"
In fact there were three more murders - those of Barbara Leach, Marguerite Walls and Jacqueline Hill.
9) Jones came up with a truly bizarre scenario for the murder of Jacqueline Hill in which the Ripper parked his car in the centre of Leeds, walked to Headingley, killed Jacqueline, walked back to Headingley railway station, took a pay-train to Leeds and drove back home.
Needless to say, Jones' account of the killing is sheer nonsense. Sutcliffe was in his car outside the Arndale Centre in Headingley when he saw Jacqueline getting off a bus, followed and eventually overtook her in the car, got out of the car and knocked her unconscious, then dragged her onto a patch of waste ground and stabbed her to death with a sharpened screwdriver. Common sense alone should have told Jones that a killer covered in blood would hardly risk using public transport.
10) In her book, published in early October 1980, she wrote about the Ripper: "He is killing indiscriminately now. But he is coming to the end of the road. He will try to do another, but it will go wrong and he won't finish the job. He will be caught before he gets the chance."
Jones was wrong yet again and continued to contradict herself. The Ripper managed to "finish the job" when he killed Jacqueline Hill on 17/11/80. Only four days later Jones told the Daily Mirror "...he will strike again almost immediately. I see him coming back to claim another victim within the week." According to the Mirror reporter, "She said the next victim would be a youngish woman but refused to give further details. 'I do not want to frighten the life out of some poor young girl with a similar description'". Bearing in mind the fact that the only description she could have offered, based on previous murders, was that the victim would be young (ish) with dark hair, a sizeable proportion of Bradford's female population would have been at risk! In fact Jacqueline Hill would be the Ripper's final victim.
11) Jones did come up with a few rather curious "hits" but none of them were of the slightest use in solving the case. However, they demonstrate that like other psychics Jones revamped mundane scraps of information and coincidences from the past and recast them as predictions of the future.
a) The name 'Peter' was already associated with another sadistic murderer and rapist, Peter Kuerten - the famous "Dusseldorf Vampire". Indeed, the first book about the Yorkshire Ripper, published in 1979, drew a parallel between the two killers. There is nothing mysterious about Jones' choice of the name.
b) Jones had a feeling that the name "Ainsworth" was important in some way, and sure enough she discovered that one of the Ripper's victims had been found on land belonging to a man surnamed Hainsworth. Also, long before Jacqueline Hill was killed Jones had a premonition that the initials "JH" would be of significance in a murder committed in November.
Again, there are no supernatural forces at work here. At the time it was suspected that Joan Harrison, killed in November 1975, may have been the Ripper's second victim (although Sutcliffe later denied killing her). "Harrison" and "Ainsworth" are coupled in the name of the bestselling Victorian novelist Harrison Ainsworth, one of whose books - Preston Fight - may have provided Jones with a coincidental link with the town in which Joan Harrison died. In short, "JH" was a memory of Joan Harrison's murder, not a premonition of Jacqueline Hill's.
c) But what about Jones' apparently successful prediction of the date on which Hill would die - the 17th or 27th of November?
Firstly, most of the Ripper attacks took place in the last fortnight of the month. Secondly, another medium - Reginald du Marius - had already predicted that a murder would take place on the 27th of a month. Jones was not taking too great a risk by choosing the same date as du Marius and adding its ten-day interval partner as another option, and a lucky hit hardly compensates for the rest of her grossly inaccurate information about the Ripper.
Melvin Harrison sums up Jones' claims about the case in a single paragraph:
"It can be said with certainty that at no time did she supply a single name, location, address, or description connected with any of the murders that was of any use to the police. The impression that she in some way co-operated usefully with them and supplied valuable information is false."
As usual, a Psychic who should have a sign around her neck saying 'Nothing Interesting To See Here.'
Nella Jones has been debunked by Randi (no surprise, really).
An article about her in the Psychic News in '82:
As usual, a Psychic who should have a sign around her neck saying 'Nothing Interesting To See Here.'
Which of course is why one needs a psychic bureau so that these psychics can lodge their predictions in advance and in a verifiable way.
Very few are willing to do that with the notable exaception of Joe Coleman who is currently wreaking havoc in Ireland. His predictions involve people looking at the sun with the naked eye. One should NEVER NEVER NEVER look at sun with the naked eye so this totally invalidates this psychic.
Nella Jones has been debunked by Randi (no surprise, really).
An article about her in the Psychic News in '82:
As usual, a Psychic who should have a sign around her neck saying 'Nothing Interesting To See Here.'
The Yorkshire Ripper case was good for exposing so called psychics as it went on long enough for their predictions to recorded. As always those predictions recorded in a verafiable way proved to be totally wide of the mark.
The Madeleine McCann case is another good example of where psychics have been shown to be charlatans. In spite of lots of predictions Madeleine is still missing.
The Yorkshire Ripper case was good for exposing so called psychics as it went on long enough for their predictions to recorded. As always those predictions recorded in a verafiable way proved to be totally wide of the mark.
The Madeleine McCann case is another good example of where psychics have been shown to be charlatans. In spite of lots of predictions Madeleine is still missing.
I believe Nella Jones mentioned in the link above about the Kenwood Vermeer made a number of predictions about the Ripper including at one point that his next victim would be a boy.
Comments
http://www.ukskeptics.com/article.php?dir=articles&article=police_and_psychics.php
Any claims that they do are just as fake as their information.
he doesnt do to bad out of making things up hes a millionaire!
and also if he makes it up then you have to say that the others do too! charlatans!
http://if.weateallthepies.com/2009/11/08/police-waste-20000-listening-to-psychics/
Lots of charlatans do well. That is because there are a lot of gullible people out there. Then people look at their wealth and conclude that they must be right.
Those replies do NOT state that the UK police have never used psychics. They are full of fudge like "to the best of my knowledge" and "we do not keep records".
The police can never be seen to have used psychics as any ensuing criminal case would likely be thrown out.
I probably watch too many TV cop shows, but don't the police have to give their reasons for searching private premises etc? If a psychic said "I see a child in a green building with a sinister clown" would a judge grant a search warrant for the building? Or would they just say, "well, what do you expect to find in a branch of McDonalds?"
mmm, strange then that I simply entered "uk police psychics" into google to immediately yield these two results that totally contradict your bald statement.
dailymail article 28 January 2008 :
Police Turn to Psychics to Solve Crimes
Very easy to solve this one. Anyone with powers just demonstatrate them. I am sure we would all welcome such a demostration. No psychic ever does demonstrate their "powers". It is always stories after the event.
As I mentioned, these came up in a simple google search. I have no prior knowledge of them, so I have no idea if they are true or not. I have an open mind on them, if someone can show them to be true or false I'll readily accept it.
Are you saying they're not true because you have evidence ? Or do you believe they're not true because they don't fit in with your beliefs ?
It's not true because it is absolute nonsense.
Well, thanks for your opinion.
Your welcome.:)
I say they are not true because when challenged to do so psychics can never demonstate their powers. Over two years ago I set up the psychic bureau in this forum. It has remained a cold and lonely place. Is that because no psychic activity has taken place in the last two years?
As all psychic claims are. Just the gullible do not see that. They want to believe.
Which still doesn't refute either of the cases I, so easily, found to counter one posters earlier claim that the police don't use psychics. No more, or less, than your opinion.
Well when you can get a psychic to demonstatre their powers in real time we might begin to believe you.
Well anyone can use Google. It does not demonstrate any study of the subject. It is not my opinion. It is a fact that in the 25 months the psychic bureau has been in existance no psychic has come forward to rise to the challenge. If there was anyone out there who had powers then they would just show them off.
Nella Jones has been debunked by Randi (no surprise, really).
An article about her in the Psychic News in '82:
As usual, a Psychic who should have a sign around her neck saying 'Nothing Interesting To See Here.'
Which of course is why one needs a psychic bureau so that these psychics can lodge their predictions in advance and in a verifiable way.
Very few are willing to do that with the notable exaception of Joe Coleman who is currently wreaking havoc in Ireland. His predictions involve people looking at the sun with the naked eye. One should NEVER NEVER NEVER look at sun with the naked eye so this totally invalidates this psychic.
The Yorkshire Ripper case was good for exposing so called psychics as it went on long enough for their predictions to recorded. As always those predictions recorded in a verafiable way proved to be totally wide of the mark.
The Madeleine McCann case is another good example of where psychics have been shown to be charlatans. In spite of lots of predictions Madeleine is still missing.
I believe Nella Jones mentioned in the link above about the Kenwood Vermeer made a number of predictions about the Ripper including at one point that his next victim would be a boy.
Vid here of her here with Randi
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-sQHYkyq7Hs
So you agree with me - the police do use psychics.