[QUOTE=Servalan;75117443]I wouldn't necessarily use the term 'sex offender' to describe what DLT was accused of doing. 'Sex pest' - maybe. But his crimes were nowhere near as bad as Jonathan King's - and I still fail to understand why King merited inclusion in a Genesis documentary and DLT has to be airbrushed from history. It's hypocrisy - plain and simple. Especially as other sex pests freely walk the corridors of broadcasters and independent production companies.
More to the point, I don't understand why the DLT episodes can't be edited to remove the links, so we can at least see the performances. It's not beyond the realm of imagination, and if episodes can routinely be edited to fit a 30-minute slot on BBC Four, how much trouble would removing the links create?
So I'm not surprised by this Daily Mail-friendly announcement - but there is a way of allowing Licence Fee payers an opportunity of seeing performances will be otherwise be consigned to the archive, never to be seen again. Why not do that?[/QUOTE]
What you choose to call him is neither here nor there. He IS a convicted sex offender.
That said, the decision to broadcast clips of Jonathan King is beyond me, he's an unrepentant, unconscionable pederast and should be airbrushed out of UK Pop History. I highly doubt any of the former Genesis members are particularly happy at having his contribution to the band's formation linked back to him.
What you choose to call him is neither here nor there. He IS a convicted sex offender.
That said, the decision to broadcast clips of Jonathan King is beyond me, he's an unrepentant, unconscionable pederast and should be airbrushed out of UK Pop History. I highly doubt any of the former Genesis members are particularly happy at having his contribution to the band's formation linked back to him.
Yet one is to be removed from our screens and the other, who committed far more serious crimes, is given airtime …
What you choose to call him is neither here nor there. He IS a convicted sex offender.
That said, the decision to broadcast clips of Jonathan King is beyond me, he's an unrepentant, unconscionable pederast and should be airbrushed out of UK Pop History. I highly doubt any of the former Genesis members are particularly happy at having his contribution to the band's formation linked back to him.
Well I think that we won't be missing much of UK pop history if we do airbrush King out. He was always an offender to taste, although his version of I Can't Get No Satisfaction as Bubblerock was OK as was Una Paloma Blanca. We really would not lose much.
I was thinking today though that the really major figure who is being airbrushed out of history is Gary Glitter, who is really important. I think we should just gulp and include him (though I am not saying show his videos or play his music all the time. We just simply can't airbrush him out. We'd lose a key influence on loads of people.:o
I quite liked The Tourists - but was never too keen on Annie Lennox. Then I quite liked the Eurythmics - but was never too keen on Annie Lennox!! I wonder What is up with me?
Then I went to see Kate Bush in concert & who was in the crowd? Annie Lennox !!! Aaaargh!
Snap. I was always the same. The Tourists were quite rated I recall, and their single So Good was in the top ten after I Only Wanna Be With You.:)
I think the BBC is bowing to political pressure here. Rock/Pop is full of convicted sex offenders. Full of horrible characters too. The BBC say they are reviewing these matters on a case by case basis, but they do not answer the question of inconsistency. To apologise to King for a non-inclusion and then to exclude DLT is shockingly inconsistent.>:(
This decision is simply wrong-headed and illogical and it demeans us all. The Corporation needs to reconsider as a matter of urgency.>:(
Yet one is to be removed from our screens and the other, who committed far more serious crimes, is given airtime …
This was a subject for discussion on The Wright Stuff following DLT's trial.
Matthew said that they had contacted the BBC to ask this very question, they were waiting for a spokesperson to get back to them. They kept on trying for the entire programme (2 hours) no one was available to comment. ^_^
Snap. I was always the same. The Tourists were quite rated I recall, and their single So Good was in the top ten after I Only Wanna Be With You.:)
The genre was called powerpop i seem to recall. Rich Kids were powerpop too. I liked it !
Genres came and went quickly back then. Seems strange we had so many back then, reggae,punk,new wave,new romantic,rockabilly,ska seems we are stuck in the same genre now and it hasnt even got a name...Corporate music i would call it.
If the BBC can feature a truly depraved and unrepentant pervert like Jonathan King on a programme on one of their channels, but not DLT, I have to scratch my head in bemusement.
The BBC used to employ a convicted murderer - Leslie Grantham, on Eastenders, but obviously that offence in their view,was minor compared to the DLT offence.
Just cut out the DLT slots, introduce the acts with titles, and continue to show thse TOTP editions.
The genre was called powerpop i seem to recall. Rich Kids were powerpop too. I liked it !
Genres came and went quickly back then. Seems strange we had so many back then, reggae,punk,new wave,new romantic,rockabilly,ska seems we are stuck in the same genre now and it hasnt even got a name...Corporate music i would call it.
Powerpop was a short-lived attempt by the music industry to try and sell some new wave acts as something 'different' - even though they weren't …
It didn't last long - the first six months of 1978, really - so The Tourists would have arrived quite a while after power pop died.
Rich Kids were indeed marketed as power pop - as were Tonight ('Drummer Man') and the New Hearts, whose two singles for CBS got nowhere … then the group rebranded themselves - as mods, and charted in 1979 as Secret Affair.
Unlike the other genres you mention, power pop was entirely the creation of the music industry - which is probably why it never lasted (plus it was neither one thing nor the other, truth be told). But even power pop had more character and individuality than the endless stream of Autotuned R&B-goes-to-Ibiza tripe that clags up the charts now …
Just some quick thoughts on last weeks edition. can't believe it's almost Thursday again already!
The Starjets: "War Stories", I found it a bit bland. Not the best ever start to the show. Robbie mentioned that the lead singer went on to front The Adventures who released "Broken Land". Now that was a great song.
Kate Bush: "Them Heavy People", Totally mesmerising. I love this performance. Kate was, and still is, an intriguing enigma.
The Jags: "Back of my Hand", Don't remember this from the time but pretty good. I can hear the similarities with the Elvis Costello sound though.
The Tourists: "The Loneliest Man in the World", Can't believe this only reached no.32| I really like this. Loved the earlier comment regarding 'Baby Suggs' and Baby Annie"
The Police: "Message in a Bottle", these guys didn't hang about. Entering at no.8 and climbing to no.1 the next week. Great track. I think of The Jam who were about to be huge chart wise with "Eton Rifles" becoming their first top 10 pretty soon. They had to wait so much longer having consistent hits from '77 but never quite reached the higher chart positions until 1979 then blasted it all the way until 1982.
Sad Cafe: "Everyday Hurts", Another great song. I seem to still hear this regularly to this day.
Rainbow: "Since You've Been Gone", Along with Kate Bush this was my other highlight of the show. Have to admit I'm not so familiar with Dio when he was with the band originally and I'm more familiar with Joe Turner in the "I Surrender" early 80's era. But Graham was great. As I mentioned on an earlier post, I loved Graham Bonnet's "Night Games" from 1981. Played that single to death at the time!
Gary Numan: "Cars", Fantastic second no.1 out of 2 releases. Pity he didn't do the hat trick with "Complex" which would have made him the 2nd act to have 3 no.1's with first 3 releases, Gerry and the Pacemakers being the first to achieve that feat. Frankie Goes to Hollywood would get there in 1984.
Wonder if the fact that "Are Friends Electric" was credited to Tubeway Army may have caused any problems on that front?
Forgot to include the brilliant Pamela Stephenson (Not the Nine O'Clock News) spoof of Kate Bush's 'Them Heavy People" from around 1980. I'm sure most of you have seen it. It's hilarious!
Given DLT's sentence was suspended for two years can we presume the BBC will allow his TOTP repeats back on BBC4 once it lapses?
No. The statement posted earlier from the BBC specifies that no DLT TOTP's will now be repeated. I'm not so sure that BBC4 will even be around in 2 years time.
When it was announced that BBC3 was going to be technically axed a while back, the controller was asked if that meant BBC4 was safe. His response was that if funding was still an issue, he couldn't guarantee BBC4's future.
Can someone confirm that we won't even see isolated clips from the Savile & Dlt shows now as that's the impression I'm getting from reading posts elsewhere?
No. The statement posted earlier from the BBC specifies that no DLT TOTP's will now be repeated. I'm not so sure that BBC4 will even be around in 2 years time.
When it was announced that BBC3 was going to be technically axed a while back, the controller was asked if that meant BBC4 was safe. His response was that if funding was still an issue, he couldn't guarantee BBC4's future.
The future of the entire BBC still hangs in the balance, and will do even more so if next year sees a wholly Tory government elected or a Tory/Ukip alliance, as both parties are vehemently anti-BBC and now routinely use the specious arguments that the Corporation is too powerful, distorting the market and limiting opportunities for independent production companies (i.e. restricting private enterprise).
So there is a potential scenario post-2015 where the BBC is shrunk massively, has to reduce the number of channels it has and is forced to sell off even more assets in the shape of programmes (and those are assets that WE own - after all, WE paid for them via the Licence Fee).
And if we do enter that territory, the chances of BBC Four remaining on air, let alone TOTP repeats, will get slimmer and slimmer. It's more likely that the BBC archive would be sold and its contents put online - most likely with some kind of pay-per-view arrangement. Whether or not that would extend to the likes of 'banned' presenters is another matter altogether … but we wouldn't have any kind of communal viewing experience we currently have.
Sorry to go all gloomy and political! I'll put my crystal ball away now …
Rainbow: "Since You've Been Gone", Along with Kate Bush this was my other highlight of the show. Have to admit I'm not so familiar with Dio when he was with the band originally and I'm more familiar with Joe Turner in the "I Surrender" early 80's era. But Graham was great. As I mentioned on an earlier post, I loved Graham Bonnet's "Night Games" from 1981. Played that single to death at the time!
Rainbow started off as a very prog rock take on heavy metal until Richie Blackmore suddenly steered the group in a very different direction in 1978. What triggered Blackmore's move? Was it aimed at the US market? Was it triggered by the mainstream success of heavy rock groups like Thin Lizzy? Had he seen former Deep Purple band member David Coverdale start to make waves with Whitesnake? Or was it just Polydor demanding greater return on their investment?
Given DLT's sentence was suspended for two years can we presume the BBC will allow his TOTP repeats back on BBC4 once it lapses?
Does anybody other than me regard the sentence against DLT a tad unsafe considering the Podcast that the accuser made referencing the said incident. To remind people about that podcast which is available on the web,, She gave a totally different account of events on the recording than she gave in court.
She said she wasn't sure that he meant to do it or not. "It could well have been an accident".
Her quote, not mine.
All I can say is she should be charged with something, not him.
It'll be interesting to see, when we eventually get there, how they treat Jonathan King's weekly US chart round-up.
If we get there, I would happily see those sections edited out.
They were totally unnecessary and added nothing to the show. There was plenty of great music coming out of both the UK and the US at the time - but the odious King's editorial policy and that pointless slot only restricted chances of us seeing it on TOTP.
And, more than anything else, there is no room for double standards. I really hope the BBC gets pulled up for King's inclusion in the Genesis documentary - they can't ban an alleged groper but pardon someone whose crimes were way worse.
Comments
More to the point, I don't understand why the DLT episodes can't be edited to remove the links, so we can at least see the performances. It's not beyond the realm of imagination, and if episodes can routinely be edited to fit a 30-minute slot on BBC Four, how much trouble would removing the links create?
So I'm not surprised by this Daily Mail-friendly announcement - but there is a way of allowing Licence Fee payers an opportunity of seeing performances will be otherwise be consigned to the archive, never to be seen again. Why not do that?[/QUOTE]
What you choose to call him is neither here nor there. He IS a convicted sex offender.
That said, the decision to broadcast clips of Jonathan King is beyond me, he's an unrepentant, unconscionable pederast and should be airbrushed out of UK Pop History. I highly doubt any of the former Genesis members are particularly happy at having his contribution to the band's formation linked back to him.
Yet one is to be removed from our screens and the other, who committed far more serious crimes, is given airtime …
Well I think that we won't be missing much of UK pop history if we do airbrush King out. He was always an offender to taste, although his version of I Can't Get No Satisfaction as Bubblerock was OK as was Una Paloma Blanca. We really would not lose much.
I was thinking today though that the really major figure who is being airbrushed out of history is Gary Glitter, who is really important. I think we should just gulp and include him (though I am not saying show his videos or play his music all the time. We just simply can't airbrush him out. We'd lose a key influence on loads of people.:o
Snap. I was always the same. The Tourists were quite rated I recall, and their single So Good was in the top ten after I Only Wanna Be With You.:)
Bugger all actually, but then she is Scottish. ;-) (joke!).
I think the BBC is bowing to political pressure here. Rock/Pop is full of convicted sex offenders. Full of horrible characters too. The BBC say they are reviewing these matters on a case by case basis, but they do not answer the question of inconsistency. To apologise to King for a non-inclusion and then to exclude DLT is shockingly inconsistent.>:(
This decision is simply wrong-headed and illogical and it demeans us all. The Corporation needs to reconsider as a matter of urgency.>:(
This was a subject for discussion on The Wright Stuff following DLT's trial.
Matthew said that they had contacted the BBC to ask this very question, they were waiting for a spokesperson to get back to them. They kept on trying for the entire programme (2 hours) no one was available to comment. ^_^
The genre was called powerpop i seem to recall. Rich Kids were powerpop too. I liked it !
Genres came and went quickly back then. Seems strange we had so many back then, reggae,punk,new wave,new romantic,rockabilly,ska seems we are stuck in the same genre now and it hasnt even got a name...Corporate music i would call it.
The BBC used to employ a convicted murderer - Leslie Grantham, on Eastenders, but obviously that offence in their view,was minor compared to the DLT offence.
Just cut out the DLT slots, introduce the acts with titles, and continue to show thse TOTP editions.
Powerpop was a short-lived attempt by the music industry to try and sell some new wave acts as something 'different' - even though they weren't …
It didn't last long - the first six months of 1978, really - so The Tourists would have arrived quite a while after power pop died.
Rich Kids were indeed marketed as power pop - as were Tonight ('Drummer Man') and the New Hearts, whose two singles for CBS got nowhere … then the group rebranded themselves - as mods, and charted in 1979 as Secret Affair.
Unlike the other genres you mention, power pop was entirely the creation of the music industry - which is probably why it never lasted (plus it was neither one thing nor the other, truth be told). But even power pop had more character and individuality than the endless stream of Autotuned R&B-goes-to-Ibiza tripe that clags up the charts now …
The Starjets: "War Stories", I found it a bit bland. Not the best ever start to the show. Robbie mentioned that the lead singer went on to front The Adventures who released "Broken Land". Now that was a great song.
Kate Bush: "Them Heavy People", Totally mesmerising. I love this performance. Kate was, and still is, an intriguing enigma.
The Jags: "Back of my Hand", Don't remember this from the time but pretty good. I can hear the similarities with the Elvis Costello sound though.
The Tourists: "The Loneliest Man in the World", Can't believe this only reached no.32| I really like this. Loved the earlier comment regarding 'Baby Suggs' and Baby Annie"
The Police: "Message in a Bottle", these guys didn't hang about. Entering at no.8 and climbing to no.1 the next week. Great track. I think of The Jam who were about to be huge chart wise with "Eton Rifles" becoming their first top 10 pretty soon. They had to wait so much longer having consistent hits from '77 but never quite reached the higher chart positions until 1979 then blasted it all the way until 1982.
Sad Cafe: "Everyday Hurts", Another great song. I seem to still hear this regularly to this day.
Rainbow: "Since You've Been Gone", Along with Kate Bush this was my other highlight of the show. Have to admit I'm not so familiar with Dio when he was with the band originally and I'm more familiar with Joe Turner in the "I Surrender" early 80's era. But Graham was great. As I mentioned on an earlier post, I loved Graham Bonnet's "Night Games" from 1981. Played that single to death at the time!
Gary Numan: "Cars", Fantastic second no.1 out of 2 releases. Pity he didn't do the hat trick with "Complex" which would have made him the 2nd act to have 3 no.1's with first 3 releases, Gerry and the Pacemakers being the first to achieve that feat. Frankie Goes to Hollywood would get there in 1984.
Wonder if the fact that "Are Friends Electric" was credited to Tubeway Army may have caused any problems on that front?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SMXIro1P_7g
No. The statement posted earlier from the BBC specifies that no DLT TOTP's will now be repeated. I'm not so sure that BBC4 will even be around in 2 years time.
When it was announced that BBC3 was going to be technically axed a while back, the controller was asked if that meant BBC4 was safe. His response was that if funding was still an issue, he couldn't guarantee BBC4's future.
The future of the entire BBC still hangs in the balance, and will do even more so if next year sees a wholly Tory government elected or a Tory/Ukip alliance, as both parties are vehemently anti-BBC and now routinely use the specious arguments that the Corporation is too powerful, distorting the market and limiting opportunities for independent production companies (i.e. restricting private enterprise).
So there is a potential scenario post-2015 where the BBC is shrunk massively, has to reduce the number of channels it has and is forced to sell off even more assets in the shape of programmes (and those are assets that WE own - after all, WE paid for them via the Licence Fee).
And if we do enter that territory, the chances of BBC Four remaining on air, let alone TOTP repeats, will get slimmer and slimmer. It's more likely that the BBC archive would be sold and its contents put online - most likely with some kind of pay-per-view arrangement. Whether or not that would extend to the likes of 'banned' presenters is another matter altogether … but we wouldn't have any kind of communal viewing experience we currently have.
Sorry to go all gloomy and political! I'll put my crystal ball away now …
Rainbow started off as a very prog rock take on heavy metal until Richie Blackmore suddenly steered the group in a very different direction in 1978. What triggered Blackmore's move? Was it aimed at the US market? Was it triggered by the mainstream success of heavy rock groups like Thin Lizzy? Had he seen former Deep Purple band member David Coverdale start to make waves with Whitesnake? Or was it just Polydor demanding greater return on their investment?
No but at least an answer to a letter in in Radio Times Feedback page (pg168) says BBC4 is definitely showing TOTP80 next year.
Does anybody other than me regard the sentence against DLT a tad unsafe considering the Podcast that the accuser made referencing the said incident. To remind people about that podcast which is available on the web,, She gave a totally different account of events on the recording than she gave in court.
She said she wasn't sure that he meant to do it or not. "It could well have been an accident".
Her quote, not mine.
All I can say is she should be charged with something, not him.
If we get there, I would happily see those sections edited out.
They were totally unnecessary and added nothing to the show. There was plenty of great music coming out of both the UK and the US at the time - but the odious King's editorial policy and that pointless slot only restricted chances of us seeing it on TOTP.
And, more than anything else, there is no room for double standards. I really hope the BBC gets pulled up for King's inclusion in the Genesis documentary - they can't ban an alleged groper but pardon someone whose crimes were way worse.