I liked Colette in that I think she could be interesting. When I said assuming Chrissie's mantle it was just in her rather superior attitude to some people (noticeably Harry) and appearing to think she knows best. I also didn't particarly like her line at the end about how she was going to ring the Consultant that refused the op to crow - just didn't seem like a nice thing to do - she should just have been happy for the boy that it worked rather than wanting to point score. But...that doesn't mean I won't find her interesting as a character and it was only her first episode - she may be 'nicer' in less extreme circumstances.
I do agree that she seemed to have a good sense of humour.
Ok. Dipped back into Holby (properly) tonight and I have to admit that it was a decent episode where even the terminally annoying characters were tolerable.
Mary-Claire's stuff with Edward was actually really interesting. I'm intrigued as to where its going to go. Harry was a massive arse with his non-commital "I don't know" stance, but the fact that Colette's taken over means that MC could actually annihilate Edward. I'm really hoping she does too because that'd be so satisfying to see him booted by Holby and Serena.
Digby and Secret Escapes? Just no. The fact that they screwed was ridiculous enough, but now she's forcibly moved herself in? Where are they going with this? I seriously hope it's not trying to turn into some sort of bizarre romance because they made a total mess of the pefect fit that could've been Chantelle/Digby so this (if that's the plan) shouldn't even get off the ground! Just a weird pairing on any level.
As for the rooftop screaming; Parasite? He called Chantelle a parasite? And bloody hell, Sacha! Why did he have to blab to Secret Escapes? "She has ways"??? I shudder to think :mad:
Elliot *sigh* pushed into the Herzig stuff and it all went to hell * roll eyes* Should've listened to Jac. Incidentally, I loved their interaction tonight.
It was a decent ep, even Dr Joker and Posh were bearable. There's a chance that I'm not totally giving up on Holby just yet...
I thought this was a good episode. The interaction between Edward and Mary-Claire was interesting, and I like that Edward's incompetence/lying ways are being revealed gradually so that you can understand why Ric etc. are reluctant to believe that he's done anything wrong. It's quite nice to have a "bad" character who's not one-dimensional - you can totally see how Serena ends up charmed by him but that he also has a darker side.
The patient storyline on AAU was quite sweet and I liked seeing Gemma and Harry just being doctors. I even liked Gemma and Mary-Claire together. I just thought it was nice to have an army character who was shown to be really caring - usually they have that sort of character and they tend to be abrasive or stand-offish and then soften towards the end.
Digby and Sacha I liked together. I was a bit at Arthur calling Chantelle a parasite as well! I think it was him making a almost literal analytical/scientific comparison, in the sense of she became attached to him, he was weakened/compromised and then she disappeared...something like that anyway Totally loving his cycling outfit as well. I also hope that they won't do a romance with Zosia and Digby because there's enough couples on/off as it is, I don't think they're that suited and I kind of liked the sort of irritated brother/annoying sister relationship they had going on.
The interplay between Jac and Elliot was good, I like that Jac was looking out for him and supporting him at the same time.
Basically, a better episode than some recently and a welcome distraction from the sodden carpets in our house caused by a burst water pipe
Interesting episode. I did think that there hadn't been enough build up to this Edward / Mary-Claire thing in that although a lot of us speculated that he was interested in her and we've seen them leave for a drink a couple of time, they could have made it a little clearer that they had actually started sleeping together. However, I think just seeing her explain it to Gemma worked quite well. Who didn't need to immediately blab to Harry - maybe MC wanted it kept quiet? Did Harry see that it was Edward's fault and is just staying mum for his career? I was unclear on that. Sorry Ric but when have you been supportive of Marie-Claire except for letting her take part in PD after Edward asked you to? Normally you make it very clear you don't think much of her but then until recently she has seemed fairly rubbish and lazy.
Colette seemed much better this week - not nearly so abrasive though I do hope that she is getting involved out of a genuine desire to find out what is what and make sure everyone has an advocate rather than just assuming the Nurse is right and the Doctor wrong ala Imelda Cousins.
Speaking of whom, think Guy is more of an Imelda or Vanessa than Hansenn. Eye on the bottom line and willing to pressure staff into doing things they shouldn;t without putting the Patient first. Zosia (and it was implied Jac) were right. No patient should agree to something as major as an experimental, robotic heart which means coming off the waiting list without fully understanding all the potential pitfalls and in the case of someone with a diagnosed MHD they should have a Psych counsul. Today was really unlike Elliot though I appreciate he thought funding was about to be pulled. Why is he so determined to steer Zosia away from Psych? The world needs good Shrinks. Surgeon God Complex coming through I guess.
Hate to say it but Jac seems much more relaxed, professional and her old self without Jonny and Bonnie around to distract, upset and annoy her.
I was a bit at Arthur calling Chantelle a parasite as well! I think it was him making a almost literal analytical/scientific comparison, in the sense of she became attached to him, he was weakened/compromised and then she disappeared...something like that anyway
That actually makes sense. I'm happy to go with that
Does anyone know when we're going to find out how Zosia and Guy know each other? It's starting to annoy me lol. I guess they're either father and daughter or ex lovers.
Does anyone know when we're going to find out how Zosia and Guy know each other? It's starting to annoy me lol. I guess they're either father and daughter or ex lovers.
Next week I think and they are..
father and daughter - cat was out the bag a long time ago as it was mentioned on Zosia's cast card
Really hoping that Edward is found out & punished, but why does Mary-Claire put her love life ahead of her job! Interesting that Harry lied about witnessing the theatre incident.
I really enjoyed this episode. The only gripe that I have about it is that from what we have seen of him so far, Edward comes across as utterly incompetent. Whenever we see him in surgery, he nearly always makes an elementary mistake. Okay, I can see how he is able to use his position to palm it off on nurses, but he won't always have been in that position. At one point he would have been a junior doctor, and given that so far his skills have come across as flaky at best, I just do not understand how he has managed to achieve his current position. Other than that I love his characterisation, but I think it would be better if we had seen more of him actually doing his job so that he would come across as a credible physician, no matter how ghastly his general persona might be.
Speaking of whom, think Guy is more of an Imelda or Vanessa than Hansenn. Eye on the bottom line and willing to pressure staff into doing things they shouldn;t without putting the Patient first. Zosia (and it was implied Jac) were right. No patient should agree to something as major as an experimental, robotic heart which means coming off the waiting list without fully understanding all the potential pitfalls and in the case of someone with a diagnosed MHD they should have a Psych counsul. Today was really unlike Elliot though I appreciate he thought funding was about to be pulled. Why is he so determined to steer Zosia away from Psych? The world needs good Shrinks. Surgeon God Complex coming through I guess.
BIB: I understand your comparison with Vanessa, but Imelda? She was a stickler for the rules. I don't think she would ever have let Elliot go ahead with that procedure without all of the protocols being followed.
With the patient, I agree that Jac was right, but I'm not sure about Zosia. I liked the characterisation of the patient called Stephen; he came across as pretty sure of himself to me. I can appreciate that protocol demanded a Psych consult, but I think that in some situations, these things can be quite demeaning to a person's self-esteem. These labels are things that we stick on children whose behaviour some find a little unusual, and once given, they are incredibly difficult to get rid of. I feel strongly that a lot of the time, they reduce a person's individuality and result in the world seeing them by their diagnosis only. Some people get quite frustrated about this. I felt that with this patient; when he was talking to Elliot about people telling him what to do and not letting him make his mind up, my heart went out to him. I feel that for a patient like that, a psych consult would have done more harm than good, as being routinely assessed to determine his capabilities to make his own decision is exactly what he didn't want. He wanted to be taken seriously, treated as an individual and not due to a label that has been given.
I think this is something that a lot of people diagnosed with ASD go through; I don't think that we as a society are aware enough of the complexity of these people's emotions, and how in many cases the only thing that is different about them is one professional's opinion, probably when they were quite a young child. I think it is great that Holby City has shown this a couple of times; they did it a while back with a patient that Jac treated, and I loved Jac's attitude towards that boy, because she treated him exactly the same as she treats everyone else, which I think was what he needed actually. The suggestion is that most people are 'normal' and then there are people with these conditions who might not be capable adults. I believe that there is no such thing as a normal person; just because someone struggles with social skills and has been given one of these diagnoses does not mean that they are incapable of making decisions, and I think that suggesting that they might be and requiring a Psych consult is pretty insulting actually.
So with regards to Zosia... it's difficult to condemn as she was actually following procedure, but I think that sometimes common sense has to come first, and in this situation I do not think a Psych consult would have been emotionally beneficial to him in any way whatsoever. As for Jac... I utterly agreed with her.
I thought it was a good and interesting episode tonight.
I quite liked all the characters roles, I even enjoyed Harry, Gemma and Marie Claire's scenes.:)
I agree with kitkat, the build up of Edward/Marie Claire's relationship was abit confusing as I thought he was just building up to starting a fling with her but it wasn't clear that they had already started the affair from my pov. Edward has definitely turned out to be a right nasty sleaze ball. I initially thought he was at Holby to get back together with Serena, but he has ulterior motives now. I felt so sorry for Marie Claire as its the 3rd time she is being blamed on mistakes created by Edward.
I wasn't sure about Harry's role in the whole theatre fiasco, I need to see that scene again. I think, he genuinely didn't know who knew what or who gave what to who but I do believe he realised that something was not right between Marie Claire and Edward when he saw their antagonistic body language. I thought Ric was harsh with Marie Claire,and he really should have been abit more impartial in this situation. I know Marie Claire can be abit complacent at times but she is a good nurse when she is focused.
I found Colette more tolerable this week and she was abit more down to earth ad more likable, she clearly looks out for her nursing staff but I hope she is a fair person and treats each case in an impartial manner and doesn't become stand offish with 'nurses V doctors' battles. Also, I hope she doesn't become romantically involved with Guy as it would be nice to see a platonic professional relationship for a change.
With regards to Elliot, he seemed mesmerised by Guy Self who is a very flamboyant character who adds abit of spin, and would do anything to get more money, publicity and self interest rather than for the sake of the patient's welfare first. Elliot should have heeded Jac's advice, she maybe abrasive but she was clearly looking out for Elliot as his sincere friend, although Elliot hasn't been supportive of Jac in a few other past events, she is usually right in these matters. Jac is more astute in seeing through Guy's agenda.
I really like the dynamic with Digby and Sacha, I think they make a good team. I do kind of get it why Digby shouted out his negative feelings for Chantelle. He was clearly hurt and superdooper gave a good analogy of why he was feeling the way he was at that moment in time. With regards to Zosia, I am not convinced he will be romantically involved with Zosia this time round, as superdooper said, kind of annoying siblings scenario in the for seeable future but I think Zosia will be protective for Digby if anyone tries to harm him. She does like Digby but she is abit too bossy. It will be interesting if/when Digby will stand up to her in his own place.
All in all a decent episode and much improvement from the last few months, but Holby still could do much better.
I think Imelda was capable of bending rules for personal reasons. She told Jonny the confidential info that Jac had been part of ousting Hansenn after Jac had gone against her as revenge and what about bringing her cat to work - something that is surely against the rules. Also fixing rotas so Nurses got xmas off and Doctors had to cover. Minor things compared to getting an operation done maybe but they do show she only followed rules when they suited her.
I think we must assume that Edward hasn't always been like this and built up a reputation on genuine, clinical skill and now relies on that rep (25 years experience as Ric stated) to get by now he is slipping.
I wouldn't want anybody's emotional needs ignored or discounted because they have been 'labelled' but Psych assessments are there for the Patient's own long term good. Frankly I think that anybody would need to be handled carefully if they have been on a transplant list for 3 years, told they were getting a heart, then that they weren't and there was this new mechanical one but they'd have to come off the transplant list if they accepted it. Big, hard decision to take quickly for anyone and he didn't have any other support with him like friends or family. It is, as I understand it, a crucial part of the consent process that Patients have every possible outcome, positive and negative explained to them and that they understand it all and if there is any doubt whatsoever then a Psych counsul is necessary - pre existing mental health issue diagnosed or not.
Presumably the form Edward destroyed recently would have been in triplicate and signed off by him, hence the reason why he destroyed two carbon copies in the first place, so the original top copy should still exist in the relevant other department.
back from yet another temporary ban courtesy of one of the EE clique brigade.
A good episode I thought. Glad MC is now getting a full role and hope to see her sink that slimeball Edward. I think that this Collete will see right through Edward Scissorhands.
But why is he making all these HUGE mistakes ? Has he some undiagnosed medical problem ? Or are the hospital going to find out some 'buried history' that he has so far managed to blag his way out of - or used threats to keep it buried ?
It may get worse for MC but these things have a tendency to get put right in the end on Holby - so it could get embarrassing for Selena, will she be the next to cover for him ?
Love Dr Honeys hair - shes a little funny looking but I'm not complaining ;-)
What is the connection between Guy [who I don't like btw - was he in Doctors at some point ?] and the sssshhhhhhoooooosssshhhh ad girl ?
I think the answers to many of your questions will be revealed by Christmas - certainly the Edward and Zosia ones. I would tell you but can't use spoiler tags on my phone so it'll have to wait. There is an explanation for Edward though, one that does make sense.
Presumably the form Edward destroyed recently would have been in triplicate and signed off by him, hence the reason why he destroyed two carbon copies in the first place, so the original top copy should still exist in the relevant other department.
BIB: Oh yes. In the lab. For example where I work this situation would not rise for two reasons. 1) There is only one "copy" of the request form and that goes to the lab with the sample. The sample is not processed without the form being there in the first place. 2) Adding a crossmatch request to a previous group and save request is just a matter of filling another request form with relevant details and sending it to the lab.
Ooh, that Edward turned nasty, didn't he? He was all suave and charming to begin with. I did like it that Colette stepped in to support Mary-Claire, though. In fact I'm looking forward to a bigger focus on the nurses - I missed that since Donna left. I thought the interactions between Honey and M-C reminded me of the Maria/Donna relationship.
...and if anyone's interested, I've written a Holby Christmas story in which Jac visits Joseph in Cumbria. I couldn't bear not knowing how Joseph was getting on, so I decided to write it myself!
Comments
I do agree that she seemed to have a good sense of humour.
Looks interesting! Plus a couple of glimpses of Connie Beauchamp - she looks amazing!!
Mary-Claire's stuff with Edward was actually really interesting. I'm intrigued as to where its going to go. Harry was a massive arse with his non-commital "I don't know" stance, but the fact that Colette's taken over means that MC could actually annihilate Edward. I'm really hoping she does too because that'd be so satisfying to see him booted by Holby and Serena.
Digby and Secret Escapes? Just no. The fact that they screwed was ridiculous enough, but now she's forcibly moved herself in? Where are they going with this? I seriously hope it's not trying to turn into some sort of bizarre romance because they made a total mess of the pefect fit that could've been Chantelle/Digby so this (if that's the plan) shouldn't even get off the ground! Just a weird pairing on any level.
As for the rooftop screaming; Parasite? He called Chantelle a parasite?
Elliot *sigh* pushed into the Herzig stuff and it all went to hell * roll eyes* Should've listened to Jac. Incidentally, I loved their interaction tonight.
It was a decent ep, even Dr Joker and Posh were bearable. There's a chance that I'm not totally giving up on Holby just yet...
Quite agree. It's really time that Digby stood up for himself.
Holby lost its way this evening (for me).
I thought this was a good episode. The interaction between Edward and Mary-Claire was interesting, and I like that Edward's incompetence/lying ways are being revealed gradually so that you can understand why Ric etc. are reluctant to believe that he's done anything wrong. It's quite nice to have a "bad" character who's not one-dimensional - you can totally see how Serena ends up charmed by him but that he also has a darker side.
The patient storyline on AAU was quite sweet and I liked seeing Gemma and Harry just being doctors. I even liked Gemma and Mary-Claire together. I just thought it was nice to have an army character who was shown to be really caring - usually they have that sort of character and they tend to be abrasive or stand-offish and then soften towards the end.
Digby and Sacha I liked together. I was a bit
The interplay between Jac and Elliot was good, I like that Jac was looking out for him and supporting him at the same time.
Basically, a better episode than some recently and a welcome distraction from the sodden carpets in our house caused by a burst water pipe
Colette seemed much better this week - not nearly so abrasive though I do hope that she is getting involved out of a genuine desire to find out what is what and make sure everyone has an advocate rather than just assuming the Nurse is right and the Doctor wrong ala Imelda Cousins.
Speaking of whom, think Guy is more of an Imelda or Vanessa than Hansenn. Eye on the bottom line and willing to pressure staff into doing things they shouldn;t without putting the Patient first. Zosia (and it was implied Jac) were right. No patient should agree to something as major as an experimental, robotic heart which means coming off the waiting list without fully understanding all the potential pitfalls and in the case of someone with a diagnosed MHD they should have a Psych counsul. Today was really unlike Elliot though I appreciate he thought funding was about to be pulled. Why is he so determined to steer Zosia away from Psych? The world needs good Shrinks. Surgeon God Complex coming through I guess.
Hate to say it but Jac seems much more relaxed, professional and her old self without Jonny and Bonnie around to distract, upset and annoy her.
That actually makes sense. I'm happy to go with that
Next week I think and they are..
BIB: I understand your comparison with Vanessa, but Imelda? She was a stickler for the rules. I don't think she would ever have let Elliot go ahead with that procedure without all of the protocols being followed.
With the patient, I agree that Jac was right, but I'm not sure about Zosia. I liked the characterisation of the patient called Stephen; he came across as pretty sure of himself to me. I can appreciate that protocol demanded a Psych consult, but I think that in some situations, these things can be quite demeaning to a person's self-esteem. These labels are things that we stick on children whose behaviour some find a little unusual, and once given, they are incredibly difficult to get rid of. I feel strongly that a lot of the time, they reduce a person's individuality and result in the world seeing them by their diagnosis only. Some people get quite frustrated about this. I felt that with this patient; when he was talking to Elliot about people telling him what to do and not letting him make his mind up, my heart went out to him. I feel that for a patient like that, a psych consult would have done more harm than good, as being routinely assessed to determine his capabilities to make his own decision is exactly what he didn't want. He wanted to be taken seriously, treated as an individual and not due to a label that has been given.
I think this is something that a lot of people diagnosed with ASD go through; I don't think that we as a society are aware enough of the complexity of these people's emotions, and how in many cases the only thing that is different about them is one professional's opinion, probably when they were quite a young child. I think it is great that Holby City has shown this a couple of times; they did it a while back with a patient that Jac treated, and I loved Jac's attitude towards that boy, because she treated him exactly the same as she treats everyone else, which I think was what he needed actually. The suggestion is that most people are 'normal' and then there are people with these conditions who might not be capable adults. I believe that there is no such thing as a normal person; just because someone struggles with social skills and has been given one of these diagnoses does not mean that they are incapable of making decisions, and I think that suggesting that they might be and requiring a Psych consult is pretty insulting actually.
So with regards to Zosia... it's difficult to condemn as she was actually following procedure, but I think that sometimes common sense has to come first, and in this situation I do not think a Psych consult would have been emotionally beneficial to him in any way whatsoever. As for Jac... I utterly agreed with her.
I thought it was a good and interesting episode tonight.
I quite liked all the characters roles, I even enjoyed Harry, Gemma and Marie Claire's scenes.:)
I agree with kitkat, the build up of Edward/Marie Claire's relationship was abit confusing as I thought he was just building up to starting a fling with her but it wasn't clear that they had already started the affair from my pov. Edward has definitely turned out to be a right nasty sleaze ball. I initially thought he was at Holby to get back together with Serena, but he has ulterior motives now. I felt so sorry for Marie Claire as its the 3rd time she is being blamed on mistakes created by Edward.
I wasn't sure about Harry's role in the whole theatre fiasco, I need to see that scene again. I think, he genuinely didn't know who knew what or who gave what to who but I do believe he realised that something was not right between Marie Claire and Edward when he saw their antagonistic body language. I thought Ric was harsh with Marie Claire,and he really should have been abit more impartial in this situation. I know Marie Claire can be abit complacent at times but she is a good nurse when she is focused.
I found Colette more tolerable this week and she was abit more down to earth ad more likable, she clearly looks out for her nursing staff but I hope she is a fair person and treats each case in an impartial manner and doesn't become stand offish with 'nurses V doctors' battles. Also, I hope she doesn't become romantically involved with Guy as it would be nice to see a platonic professional relationship for a change.
With regards to Elliot, he seemed mesmerised by Guy Self who is a very flamboyant character who adds abit of spin, and would do anything to get more money, publicity and self interest rather than for the sake of the patient's welfare first. Elliot should have heeded Jac's advice, she maybe abrasive but she was clearly looking out for Elliot as his sincere friend, although Elliot hasn't been supportive of Jac in a few other past events, she is usually right in these matters. Jac is more astute in seeing through Guy's agenda.
I really like the dynamic with Digby and Sacha, I think they make a good team. I do kind of get it why Digby shouted out his negative feelings for Chantelle. He was clearly hurt and superdooper gave a good analogy of why he was feeling the way he was at that moment in time. With regards to Zosia, I am not convinced he will be romantically involved with Zosia this time round, as superdooper said, kind of annoying siblings scenario in the for seeable future but I think Zosia will be protective for Digby if anyone tries to harm him. She does like Digby but she is abit too bossy. It will be interesting if/when Digby will stand up to her in his own place.
All in all a decent episode and much improvement from the last few months, but Holby still could do much better.
I think we must assume that Edward hasn't always been like this and built up a reputation on genuine, clinical skill and now relies on that rep (25 years experience as Ric stated) to get by now he is slipping.
I wouldn't want anybody's emotional needs ignored or discounted because they have been 'labelled' but Psych assessments are there for the Patient's own long term good. Frankly I think that anybody would need to be handled carefully if they have been on a transplant list for 3 years, told they were getting a heart, then that they weren't and there was this new mechanical one but they'd have to come off the transplant list if they accepted it. Big, hard decision to take quickly for anyone and he didn't have any other support with him like friends or family. It is, as I understand it, a crucial part of the consent process that Patients have every possible outcome, positive and negative explained to them and that they understand it all and if there is any doubt whatsoever then a Psych counsul is necessary - pre existing mental health issue diagnosed or not.
A good episode I thought. Glad MC is now getting a full role and hope to see her sink that slimeball Edward. I think that this Collete will see right through Edward Scissorhands.
But why is he making all these HUGE mistakes ? Has he some undiagnosed medical problem ? Or are the hospital going to find out some 'buried history' that he has so far managed to blag his way out of - or used threats to keep it buried ?
It may get worse for MC but these things have a tendency to get put right in the end on Holby - so it could get embarrassing for Selena, will she be the next to cover for him ?
Love Dr Honeys hair - shes a little funny looking but I'm not complaining ;-)
What is the connection between Guy [who I don't like btw - was he in Doctors at some point ?] and the sssshhhhhhoooooosssshhhh ad girl ?
My guess with scissorhands is that he has early onset dementia or parkinsons or something like that.
I'm very interested to see how the storyline with Edward plays out. He is one nasty piece of work.
I saw a massive change in Digby too, personality-wise, even with patients, and that's down to Malick.
If he possibly has Parkinsons, calling him 'scissorhands' is rather insensitive.
BIB: Oh yes. In the lab. For example where I work this situation would not rise for two reasons. 1) There is only one "copy" of the request form and that goes to the lab with the sample. The sample is not processed without the form being there in the first place. 2) Adding a crossmatch request to a previous group and save request is just a matter of filling another request form with relevant details and sending it to the lab.
The episode review is here
...and if anyone's interested, I've written a Holby Christmas story in which Jac visits Joseph in Cumbria. I couldn't bear not knowing how Joseph was getting on, so I decided to write it myself!
Oh, how I miss the world's most beautiful heart surgeon!!