I just wish He had not placed all those bloody fossils in the ground.
How many people are going to Hell for believing in evolution?
Then again they certainly deserve to burn in unendurable agony for all eternity for daring to question the Word of the Lord.
The filthy Heathen scum. >:(
He's testing our faith, this loving god.
He put us on earth, made it so we were designed to doubt him, put fake evidence there to mislead us, and the punishes us for all eternity for using the scepticism tool he gifted us with.
He put us on earth, made it so we were designed to doubt him, put fake evidence there to mislead us, and the punishes us for all eternity for using the scepticism tool he gifted us with.
He is not a very nice chap really when you come to think of it.
It's almost as though he was created by a very primitive patriarchal desert tribe.
Karma Police, arrest this man, he talks in math, he buzzes like a fridge.
I was referring to a previous convo me and Bolly had about shamanism, and different hypothesis about how shamanistic/ spiritual healing could be achieved. Then it became all quantum physics and I ended up learning a lot, some of which my brain still can't wrap itself around.
It was in response to "wasn't it that there is a sublevel of consciousness of which we are not aware? A collective? If so how would a person have "free will?"?"
He put us on earth, made it so we were designed to doubt him, put fake evidence there to mislead us, and the punishes us for all eternity for using the scepticism tool he gifted us with.
Nah. Not likely. True, it's job done - game over for those happily convinced already, but for those of us who truly appreciate this incredibly detailed diversiverse, and believe it to be just what it's intended to look like, and that we really are the result of the tenacity of the will to live honed through very many generations and changes through natural selection - and all the other stuff... Remarkable job. Unbelievable - especially in six days! See. That's another thing the faithful already accept - almost as though it's nothing, but I bet it took loads longer really. At least a fortnight.
It's quite a short piece and I'd missed it previously. About this bit:
“Time, space and causation are like the glass through which the Absolute is seen."
Couldn't the same be said about everything? Or am I misunderstanding and there exists a "glass through which the Absolute is seen" which time, space and causation are like?
"In the Absolute there is neither time, space nor causation.”
Doesn't sound like a good place for a man and his dog. Seems (like) one of those giant leaps again - to presume that something which can only(?) be seen through something else does not have that something else as a property of itself.
If by no causation is meant unchanging, and this Absolute occupies no space, and has no duration - there can be no "in".
To be honest I took it as a metaphor of normal consciousness, like looking through glass that distorted the vision - like say a glass bottle. The absolute is distorted when seen through the glass but the glass is an obstruction not a requirement. Also I guess the clarity of your average glass panel has improved somewhat since the India of the 19th century. It's not a question of seeing in the normal sense but of being in a completely different state of consciousness. Using the word "in" is a way of talking and doesn't mean that you are in anything but that the state of being has become absolute. Limitations of language used in the relative to refer to the absolute. .
A collective? If so how would a person have "free will?"?"
Yeah but we were previously talking about faith healing/shamanism/ the idea of a collective on the quantum level on a different thread a while back. I was just checking that was what we were chatting about.
That bolly was of the opinion we have free will, but work on a collective level under that, I thought it was impossible to have free will / self awareness in a collective. I was checking I had the right person, and the right recall of that conversation (not actually asking the questions themselves).
To be honest I took it as a metaphor of normal consciousness, like looking through glass that distorted the vision - like say a glass bottle. The absolute is distorted when seen through the glass but the glass is an obstruction not a requirement. Also I guess the clarity of your average glass panel has improved somewhat since the India of the 19th century. It's not a question of seeing in the normal sense but of being in a completely different state of consciousness. Using the word "in" is a way of talking and doesn't mean that you are in anything but that the state of being has become absolute. Limitations of language used in the relative to refer to the absolute. .
I see. "The Absolute" is a possible state of being? One which normal people can achieve? If it's timeless - wouldn't it be too instantaneous to observe in any state of linear consciousness? Dreams are non linear. Probably dreamed of something big and old and dubbed it The Absolute. No disrespect.
Even if He did exist I would not worship Him. The pitiful need for validation like that is more like a child or a psychopath than an entity who created the entire Cosmos.
Surely God wouldn't get his/her kicks from beings who were created with no option but to worship him/her. What would be the point?
Their choosing to do so would be the important part.
Even if He did exist I would not worship Him. The pitiful need for validation like that is more like a child or a psychopath than an entity who created the entire Cosmos.
lol... yet another bit of common sense that makes you wonder why people believe that religious guff.... it simply doesnt add up does it.
and neither did god. we have gone into great detail on this thread as to why god hasnt given you free will.
we are told he knows what decisions we will all make... that implies that our paths in life are already set out, are pre - destined. in which case theres no freewill.... if we had free will we would be able to chose a different path, make different choices, but we are destined to do what we are destined to do....
anyway, the whole free will excuse is nothing but one giant cop-out.... a joker card to explain the unexplainable, to try to add reason to an unreasonable proposition. if you were a loving parent, youd make sure your child wouldnt get into any harm. "oh its my babys free will to play with the matches and get burnt"...yeah right... "i told him not to play with the matches but i wanted him to obey me out of love, he chose by free will to ignore me so its his fault hes scared for life"....
I see. "The Absolute" is a possible state of being? One which normal people can achieve?
Anyone anytime. The obstacles are our own beliefs, obsessions, actions and repressions.
If it's timeless - wouldn't it be too instantaneous to observe in any state of linear consciousness? Dreams are non linear. Probably dreamed of something big and old and dubbed it The Absolute. No disrespect.
Yes, that's what I've been saying in previous posts. It would be like you just turned off but time had passed - like having had general aneastheic but quicker. It would be a state of transcendence. The difference would be , on return to everyday consciousness, that you would be affected by it but according to your own individuality, beliefs and boundaries. So for example you might feel a great sense of peace, love, silence, awe or you might have had visions or meaningful dramas - you may even have returned with something metaphorical but useful. Eventually there would be a state where the selfish ego-mind has lost it's fear and allowed itself union with the higher Self - this has been referred to as enlightenment. It would be like the parable of the return of the prodigal son. IMO..
Yeah but we were previously talking about faith healing/shamanism/ the idea of a collective on the quantum level on a different thread a while back. I was just checking that was what we were chatting about.
That bolly was of the opinion we have free will, but work on a collective level under that, I thought it was impossible to have free will / self awareness in a collective. I was checking I had the right person, and the right recall of that conversation (not actually asking the questions themselves).
Sorry...It's a great question though. Yeah breakfast time so I'm going with... percolation.
I agree. Doesn't matter a jot if we don't wake up either.
Though you might want to expedite matter if the legions of Rome are gathering on your borders and your collective "chosen" speciality is religion and spirituality, as in "Render to Caesar the things that are Caesar's, and to God the things that are God's". Had the advice been taken this might have avoided one hell of a blood sacrifice that continues to this day.
It was in response to "wasn't it that there is a sublevel of consciousness of which we are not aware? A collective? If so how would a person have "free will?"?"
How would another order of consciousness prevent us from having free will?
The amount of free will that humans have, even in Judaeo Christian concepts of free will, is rather small, anyway.
It mostly defines moral decision making and the ability to accept or reject God.
How would another order of consciousness prevent us from having free will?
The amount of free will that humans have, even in Judaeo Christian concepts of free will, is rather small.
That was my thinking. The largely absent free will is with the relativity of things and in our case the human-ness. It's missing because we hid it in separate places. That sort of makes sense to me. Hence I posted "Its a question of waking up and becoming all of ourself" and prior to that "Existence is free because it has no cause."
Comments
He must be a Christian after all then, as it's the only religion that doesn't mind a little flutter every now and then .
How many people are going to Hell for believing in evolution?
Then again they certainly deserve to burn in unendurable agony for all eternity for daring to question the Word of the Lord.
The filthy Heathen scum. >:(
He's testing our faith, this loving god.
He put us on earth, made it so we were designed to doubt him, put fake evidence there to mislead us, and the punishes us for all eternity for using the scepticism tool he gifted us with.
Not possible if you are in a job where you have to take orders.
He is not a very nice chap really when you come to think of it.
It's almost as though he was created by a very primitive patriarchal desert tribe.
Very true so why invent another control freak in our spare time?
... and subsequently rebranded based upon focus group results, several times over.
Exactly. I just wish Islam would be rebranded as well.
It was in response to "wasn't it that there is a sublevel of consciousness of which we are not aware? A collective? If so how would a person have "free will?"?"
Proper job God. I can't see you at all.
I only have a lack of belief in God(s), I don't take sides in religious matters, because we know where that leads.
True but I would prefer religion to at least try and move with the times.
Because when it does - like the Church of England - it becomes a much more acceptable institution.
Aside from any suffering.
To be honest I took it as a metaphor of normal consciousness, like looking through glass that distorted the vision - like say a glass bottle. The absolute is distorted when seen through the glass but the glass is an obstruction not a requirement. Also I guess the clarity of your average glass panel has improved somewhat since the India of the 19th century. It's not a question of seeing in the normal sense but of being in a completely different state of consciousness. Using the word "in" is a way of talking and doesn't mean that you are in anything but that the state of being has become absolute. Limitations of language used in the relative to refer to the absolute. .
Yeah but we were previously talking about faith healing/shamanism/ the idea of a collective on the quantum level on a different thread a while back. I was just checking that was what we were chatting about.
That bolly was of the opinion we have free will, but work on a collective level under that, I thought it was impossible to have free will / self awareness in a collective. I was checking I had the right person, and the right recall of that conversation (not actually asking the questions themselves).
One whole reality as I see it.
What is your hidden question?
Could I buy a vowel?
Control freaks do not give everyone free will.
Surely God wouldn't get his/her kicks from beings who were created with no option but to worship him/her. What would be the point?
Their choosing to do so would be the important part.
lol... yet another bit of common sense that makes you wonder why people believe that religious guff.... it simply doesnt add up does it.
....which is why im self employed, so i steer my own ship, master of my own destiny.
and neither did god. we have gone into great detail on this thread as to why god hasnt given you free will.
we are told he knows what decisions we will all make... that implies that our paths in life are already set out, are pre - destined. in which case theres no freewill.... if we had free will we would be able to chose a different path, make different choices, but we are destined to do what we are destined to do....
anyway, the whole free will excuse is nothing but one giant cop-out.... a joker card to explain the unexplainable, to try to add reason to an unreasonable proposition. if you were a loving parent, youd make sure your child wouldnt get into any harm. "oh its my babys free will to play with the matches and get burnt"...yeah right... "i told him not to play with the matches but i wanted him to obey me out of love, he chose by free will to ignore me so its his fault hes scared for life"....
BONKERS.
Yes, that's what I've been saying in previous posts. It would be like you just turned off but time had passed - like having had general aneastheic but quicker. It would be a state of transcendence. The difference would be , on return to everyday consciousness, that you would be affected by it but according to your own individuality, beliefs and boundaries. So for example you might feel a great sense of peace, love, silence, awe or you might have had visions or meaningful dramas - you may even have returned with something metaphorical but useful. Eventually there would be a state where the selfish ego-mind has lost it's fear and allowed itself union with the higher Self - this has been referred to as enlightenment. It would be like the parable of the return of the prodigal son. IMO..
Sorry...It's a great question though. Yeah breakfast time so I'm going with... percolation.
Though you might want to expedite matter if the legions of Rome are gathering on your borders and your collective "chosen" speciality is religion and spirituality, as in "Render to Caesar the things that are Caesar's, and to God the things that are God's". Had the advice been taken this might have avoided one hell of a blood sacrifice that continues to this day.
How would another order of consciousness prevent us from having free will?
The amount of free will that humans have, even in Judaeo Christian concepts of free will, is rather small, anyway.
It mostly defines moral decision making and the ability to accept or reject God.
That was my thinking. The largely absent free will is with the relativity of things and in our case the human-ness. It's missing because we hid it in separate places. That sort of makes sense to me. Hence I posted "Its a question of waking up and becoming all of ourself" and prior to that "Existence is free because it has no cause."
Someone thwack me with a big stick...:D