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Working 30 hours a week for next to nothing on job seekers
Bunk Moreland
Posts: 1,141 Forum Member
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Two of my friends are on job seekers (as am I unfortunately) and they have recently been told they have to work 30 hours a week for two different stores, one being Poundland. One of them told me he doesn't get paid for it, he simply gets an extra 10 or 15 quid a week on top of his benefit. The other told me he gets £2 an hour or something.
I think I am getting put on this soon myself, but my question is, how can this be legal? How can people be expected to work for a third (or less) of minimum wage? I'm thinking of refusing to do it when asked, because to work 30 hours in some retail store for next to nothing seems utterly pointless to me. It isn't a great job anyway and most people who work in these places would rather work elseware, I know I did when I worked in Sainsburys years ago, but people who work in these places at least get paid £6 an hour or whatever minimum wage is these days.
I know someone who done this years ago as well and he told me it was a joke. He was basically treated like a second class employee and at the end of the 8 weeks didn't get a job either in there or anywhere else off the back of his time there. It seems to me like the employer is simply getting 8 weeks cheap or free labour while the dole think you're getting valuable experience.
Has anyone any experience with this while claiming job seekers? Have you refused to do it? I think I read on here a while ago that it isn't legally required for people to work for their benefits. I'm at a loss really, I'm desperate to get off the dole and back into work, but I'm not going to work 30 hours a week for 8 week for naff all.
I think I am getting put on this soon myself, but my question is, how can this be legal? How can people be expected to work for a third (or less) of minimum wage? I'm thinking of refusing to do it when asked, because to work 30 hours in some retail store for next to nothing seems utterly pointless to me. It isn't a great job anyway and most people who work in these places would rather work elseware, I know I did when I worked in Sainsburys years ago, but people who work in these places at least get paid £6 an hour or whatever minimum wage is these days.
I know someone who done this years ago as well and he told me it was a joke. He was basically treated like a second class employee and at the end of the 8 weeks didn't get a job either in there or anywhere else off the back of his time there. It seems to me like the employer is simply getting 8 weeks cheap or free labour while the dole think you're getting valuable experience.
Has anyone any experience with this while claiming job seekers? Have you refused to do it? I think I read on here a while ago that it isn't legally required for people to work for their benefits. I'm at a loss really, I'm desperate to get off the dole and back into work, but I'm not going to work 30 hours a week for 8 week for naff all.
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And have zero money coming in?
Whether it's a good or bad idea depends on your mind set, some could see it as a springboard to a potential permanent job after the 8 weeks because it means they can improve their CV, others will see it as slave labour and how they are being exploited.
It's still a choice - perhaps not a choice you'd like, but a choice nontheless. Anyway as far as I understand it you have to be on Jobseeker's for some time before you get on one of these activities. Surely you're no worse off financially doing it, plus it keeps your skills sharpened? What's the harm of that?
If you've listened to David Cameron's speeches recently he's discussing the Wisconsin model, that makes this sort of thing a doddle in comparison.
I remember when it used to be a BENEFIT paid to you as you had no other income. The only requirement being that you were expected to look for work.
Has that now change to being a way of paying a wage that is lower than EVERYONE ELSE has to pay by law and take up all your time so that you will never find a proper PAYING job?
I mean it is called "Jobseeker's Allowance" so it's not an illegal wage and you are meant to be Jobseeking! Not wasting all your time working for an illegal wage.
Instead they are free slave labour for stores like Poundland who rip off the system. Sadly, unpaid shelf-stacker for Poundland is no more attractive to an employer than laid in bed 'til noon.
And, as said by other posters, if these stores actually employed people, instead of exploiting pathetically ill-conceived schemes - then more people would be in paid work.
A typical Tory lose-lose scenario.
I did two months unpaid in the summer holiday before my MA specifically to gain some experience and have something practical to add to my CV showing I had experience of the workplace. Plus I'd always rather be doing something constructive than sitting at home in front of daytime TV.
This is a chance to show what you can do and learn. It might not lead directly to a job - although it could - but it will give you some skills and experience. What would you be doing otherwise that would enhance your CV more than work experience?
A lot of graduates work for free just to gain some work experience in the career of their choice.
Or they could not pay tax which is what they paid so they could have dole money when they lost their jobs.
£26.25 a week to make the tea and fetch **** from the newsy for a lazy alcoholic. When I said I was here to learn IT and wanted some real work I was hastily sacked for being lazy and having a bad attitude.
If you're 16 and fresh out of school it might be helpful.
But if you're 30+ and have already been working for 20 so years, then shelf stacking in poundland isn't going to enhance anyone's CV
The bit in bold is exactly why they do that though.
When you've been on job seekers for so long and get a job the dole pays a percentage of your wages for a while at the start, I think about £2 an hour or so of your wage. Would it not make more sense to give people fully paid jobs with these places instead of just free work? The business benefits from having an employee on about £4 an hour and the dole benefits from ultimately getting you off benefits. I think with systems like this 30 hours for free, you get businesses simply exploiting it.
If these places have room to give job seekers 30 hours a week, then why haven't they got room to employ them on 30 hour contracts? The option to take people for free out of the dole queue means they don't need to make the job available.
They like to claim it is work experience, but it is just a scheme to make the figures look better, the only people it benefits are the companies that are getting vacancies filled for free, which they would otherwise have to pay minimum wage for. These people are obviously needed otherwise they would not utilise the jobless. They should make these into full paid jobs, surely that is better as it would be getting someone permanently employed.
If you have got nothing constructive to add, don't contribute the thread.
These threads are creating by people wanting advice, not to be patronised.
And I have never listened to any of the bullshit David Cameron speaks, because he is only looking after himself and his rich friends. He does not live in the real world, and has no idea to live on a working class, or even middle class income.
There is doing nothing, and there is being taken advantage of. The latter is the case with this slave-labour scheme.
If you employ 20 people, but can't afford to employ any more what do you do if the DWP ask you to take someone on for two months work experience? Do you say no because you won't be able to employ them after two months or do you let them work for you so they gain some experience of work?
You're suggesting Poundland can afford to employ all these extra people. I'd imagine, due to the fact they sell things for £1, that they will only have so much money to pay staff and still make a healthy profit.
On this scheme you are just getting sent to whatever company want free labour, regardless of whether you are interested in that type of business or what.
Coming up on 6 months, which is why I'm going on this thing. I already have experience in retail as well as call centres and self employment. I've got a degree and loads of other qualifications that I picked up on the side while at university and while being on the dole. I've done two courses that I've sorted myself in the last 6 months and got things like a World Host qualification and a qualification in management. I think things like that benefit job seekers. I only finished up on a 6 month, 8 hours a week course last week so hopefully I'll get work out of it soon, but it'll be on my CV nonetheless.
Imagine what you could do in a course for 8 weeks doing 30 hours a week? I'd rather do that than stack selves for free. You could pick up something that could genuinely get you work and something that will always be on your CV. Lets be serious, 8 weeks work in a place like Poundland is hardly CV worthy unless you've very little experience.
Fair comment about the money. I was thinking more about doing nothing all day and self-respect etc. I found that a killer (almost) when I spent 2 years unemployed. Ended up volunteering.
Well in your case it is a waste of time, it won't enhance your CV since you're over-qualified to stack shelves. Have you considered contacting employers yourself and asking if you can do work experience for them? That way at least you'd have a bit of choice in what work experience you do.
Sadly, probably true - playing X-box would improve hand-eye co-ordination skills and probably lead to some basic IT knowledge - both useful in any work-place . More useful than stacking shelves for nothing.
There is a huge difference between career based internships to build experience and networks for your future and being farmed out to work for companies that should be paying a standard wage and offer no job-experience.
There will always be a small number who exploit the system but they are a very small minority. The lack of jobs and the recession are down to banks and a poorly managed financial world.
Blaming the unemployed for the recession doesn't make sense to anyone with the basic intelligence to look at the facts.
Six months out of work and anyone starts getting rusty. Recent retail experience gives you a routine of getting up and into work each day, interacting with others, stock control, EPOS experience, dealing with deliveries, providing customer service, problem solving and loads more.
If someone has recently been out of work then yes it's a bit harsh saying off you go to work experience, but six months is quite a fair old time. I think after about 3-4 weeks of being unemployed I would be standing near a busy junction with a sandwich board listing my key skills and doing whatever I could to work. Depends how badly you want a job.