He was up for physically shooting them though wasn't he as it turned out...
He also had two previous incidents of what we could call 'assault' one of the woman he slammed the door so hard on that it broke on her leg, and the other woman he pushed hard at a party (or was it a concert?)
What had got her so scared that she tried to lock the bedroom door in the first place? He was already furious, aggressive and violent by that point, otherwise why lock it? So I don't think it's safe to say her screaming made him angry as he was already apparently irate.
Sam Taylor said OP had been verbally abusive with her… from Whatsapp, OP was also verbally abusive with RS.
Not opening the toilet door to silence RS and shooting RS through a closed door is evidence that OP was a coward… he couldn't face direct physical confrontation.
OP chased her in the bedroom saying something like : No f*ckin way you're leaving me on Valentine's day ! RS locked the door as a precaution… that infuriated OP who proceeded to break it open… now it was physical in RS's mind and she did not know how far OP would go…. she started to scream in fear.
A man can punch a hole in the wall without ever even considering hitting the woman he is arguing with… it's an act of frustration… but the woman does not and cannot know that for sure… and her fear can be real.
I think AJ version of what happened that night ..ie OP went to sleep and reeva stayed up and the argument started in the kitchen, has legs only because of the stomach contents evidence ..sorry to bring this up again
If we believe the evidence that she ate 2/3 hours before she died, we have to believe OP has absolutely no knowledge of this all.
OP has admitted he has no idea or knowledge of it either, he has only said she was awake when he went to sleep.
IF he had been awake all night to 3.am with her and had seen her eat, he would have to had to include this possibility in his statement somehow
He had no idea she eat anything, probably did not cross his mind at all, because he was sleeping, that part of OP's story i do believe:o
Indeed.
Let us keep in mind :
- According to Pr. Saayman Reeva ate around 2 hours prior to TOD = 1:15AM
- According to Estelle van der Merwe, Reeva was arguing loudly starting at 2AM
- Oscar’s 1:48:48 GPRS connection is precisely between Reeva’s snack at around 1:15AM and Reeva’s loud arguing at around 2:00AM
According to Pr. Saayman Reeva ate around 2 hours prior to TOD = 1:15AM
That makes RS awake, hungry and in the kitchen eating
According to Estelle van der Merwe, Reeva was arguing loudly starting at 2AM
That places RS towards the front of OP's house, the only place EVDW can hear what is happening in OP's house… somewhere like the kitchen which is towards the front of the house
SO Rs is in the kitchen and the argument starts there…. it will eventually move to the bedroom, the bathroom and the toilet where it terminated tragically.
I wonder if he has abandonment issues from his mum's early death, and that somehow her leaving felt like some kind of death to him. But then she hadn't been in his life long enough really to take on that role. Maybe he was just angry selfish and violent. Who knows...
As you say, who knows?
I just think he could not believe anyone dumped him, he was the dumper. It was because she was strong and would not comply that caused the row to escalate to where it was.
Remember his evidence re Sam Taylor? He got her to pack her bags and moved her out. The way he talked about that it was clear to me she was disposable. And she just did what he wanted. He even put his car at her disposal. I'd have shoved it where the sun don't shine, and I suspect Reeva would not just rollover for him. She just was not a wee teen blonde lass in awe of him. He could not handle her.
Why did Johan Stander not inform the police that Dr Stipp had been at Oscar's house that morning. Dr stipp told Stander about the first shots then the screams then the second shots .Dr stipp left before the police arrived but exchanged numbers with Stander thinking that Stander would inform the police that he had been on the scene .Dr stipp said shortly after he arrived home at 4 17 Stander called him and said he had left his number with Oscars lawyers incase he is needed .Stander said in his tetimony he took Dr stipps number so he could tell the police that he had been at the scene .This shows that Stander had contact with Oscars lawyers and thats within an hour of the incident. .Dr stipp went to work as normal that day and didnt find out until 9 am that it was Oscar Pistorius house he was in that morning.The rest of the day he was expecting the police to contact him because Stander had his number but they did not so the next day Dr stipp contacted the police himself.
Dr stipp also said something in his testimony that i have never heard been talked about before .
He said when he was talking to Stander at the scene a woman arrived and Dr stipp thought it was Stander's wife .He said that he heard mrs Stander say i hope it dosen't get in the papers . from 45 00
Sam Taylor said OP had been verbally abusive with her… from Whatsapp, OP was also verbally abusive with RS.
Not opening the toilet door to silence RS and shooting RS through a closed door is evidence that OP was a coward… he couldn't face direct physical confrontation.
OP chased her in the bedroom saying something like : No f*ckin way you're leaving me on Valentine's day ! RS locked the door as a precaution… that infuriated OP who proceeded to break it open… now it was physical in RS's mind and she did not know how far OP would go…. she started to scream in fear.
A man can punch a hole in the wall without ever even considering hitting the woman he is arguing with… it's an act of frustration… but the woman does not and cannot know that for sure… and her fear can be real.
Don't buy it, sorry AJ. He couldn't open the door but he could get a gun?
Punching a hole in a wall, or throwing things that smash next to a woman, or chasing her with a bat: this isn't just frustration they are acts of violence and intimidation. It's not true to say that the man does not consider hitting the woman in such a scenario, he does but choses to hit the wall instead. It's a message: this could be your head. It's intimidating and intended to render the woman fearful and under control. This all counts as dv, and men who throw things and punch walls often escalate to punching women. Women who are in a relationship with a man who behaves like that are advised to get out asap.
As you say, who knows?
I just think he could not believe anyone dumped him, he was the dumper. It was because she was strong and would not comply that caused the row to escalate to where it was.
Remember his evidence re Sam Taylor? He got her to pack her bags and moved her out. The way he talked about that it was clear to me she was disposable. And she just did what he wanted. He even put his car at her disposal. I'd have shoved it where the sun don't shine, and I suspect Reeva would not just rollover for him. She just was not a wee teen blonde lass in awe of him. He could not handle her.
Reeva was a kind, patient, loving soul… she put up with a lot crap from OP… but that night was just too much, the straw that broke the camels back…. she had stayed over that night, cooked him dinner, only because OP had insisted on it so much.
Don't buy it, sorry AJ. He couldn't open the door but he could get a gun?
Punching a hole in a wall, or throwing things that smash next to a woman, or chasing her with an bat: this isn't just frustration they are acts of violence and intimidation. It's not true to say that the man does not consider hitting the woman in such a scenario, he does but choses to hit the wall instead. It's a message: this could be your head. It's intimidating and intended to render the woman fearful and under control. This all counts as dv, and men who throw things and punch walls often escalate to punching women. Women who are in a relationship with a man who behaves like that are advised to get out asap.
OP had his gun with him… in the holster which was clipped to his shorts
I get your meaning… but I have punched a hole in wall before… and I never raised my hand to any woman… never was even tempted to do so… never even crossed my mind to do so…. it was pure frustration and the wall (and pain I felt) was an outlet for said frustration.
As you say, who knows?
I just think he could not believe anyone dumped him, he was the dumper. It was because she was strong and would not comply that caused the row to escalate to where it was.
Remember his evidence re Sam Taylor? He got her to pack her bags and moved her out. The way he talked about that it was clear to me she was disposable. And she just did what he wanted. He even put his car at her disposal. I'd have shoved it where the sun don't shine, and I suspect Reeva would not just rollover for him. She just was not a wee teen blonde lass in awe of him. He could not handle her.
She stood up to him, which was the worst thing she could have done. She wasn't afraid of him and she should have been.
Sam Taylor, by contrast, just slipped away like a meek thing. It doesn't sound like he was that invested in that relationship... Which is what people do when they can't cope with being hurt.
Reeva was a kind, patient, loving soul… she put up with a lot crap from OP… but that night was just too much, the straw that broke the camels back…. she had stayed over that night, cooked him dinner, only because OP had insisted on it so much.
BiB… exactly !
And insult to injury he hadn't given her a thought regarding a card or gift for that day. A day in which Reeva had been very excited about.
OP had his gun with him… in the holster which was clipped to his shorts
I get your meaning… but I have punched a hole in wall before… and I never raised my hand to any woman… never was even tempted to do so… never even crossed my mind to do so…. it was pure frustration and the wall (and pain I felt) was an outlet for said frustration.
Sorry that was meant to say bat, but the same principle applies. He couldn't open the door but he could smash it with a bat or fire a gun?
I don't think a one off counts. You're not abusive so you're not representative of men who are.
OP didn't just punch a hole in a wall once, he smashed up a whole bathroom and more.
Why did Johan Stander not inform the police that Dr Stipp had been at Oscar's house that morning. Dr stipp told Stander about the first shots then the screams then the second shots .Dr stipp left before the police arrived but exchanged numbers with Stander thinking that Stander would inform the police that he had been on the scene .Dr stipp said shortly after he arrived home at 4 17 Stander called him and said he had left his number with Oscars lawyers incase he is needed .Stander said in his tetimony he took Dr stipps number so he could tell the police that he had been at the scene .This shows that Stander had contact with Oscars lawyers and thats within an hour of the incident. .Dr stipp went to work as normal that day and didnt find out until 9 am that it was Oscar Pistorius house he was in that morning.The rest of the day he was expecting the police to contact him because Stander had his number but they did not so the next day Dr stipp contacted the police himself.
Dr stipp also said something in his testimony that i have never heard been talked about before .
He said when he was talking to Stander at the scene a woman arrived and Dr stipp thought it was Stander's wife .He said that he heard mrs Stander say i hope it dosen't get in the papers . from 45 00
- According to Pr. Saayman Reeva ate around 2 hours prior to TOD = 1:15AM
- According to Estelle van der Merwe, Reeva was arguing loudly starting at 2AM
- Oscar’s 1:48:48 GPRS connection is precisely between Reeva’s snack at around 1:15AM and Reeva’s loud arguing at around 2:00AM
I am even open to the possibility that reeva did go to bed with OP, pandering to his needs as such and when he went to sleep, she was sat there worrying about her unfinished speech.
So she got up went downstairs, turning the alarm off on her way;-).and proceeded to work in the kitchen, little snack to keep her going.
OP wakes up finds her not there, may well have a been a bit worried, goes downstairs, (with his gun and phone) and finds her sitting there. Worry turns to annoyance and the argument starts..
Why did Johan Stander not inform the police that Dr Stipp had been at Oscar's house that morning. Dr stipp told Stander about the first shots then the screams then the second shots .Dr stipp left before the police arrived but exchanged numbers with Stander thinking that Stander would inform the police that he had been on the scene .Dr stipp said shortly after he arrived home at 4 17 Stander called him and said he had left his number with Oscars lawyers incase he is needed .Stander said in his tetimony he took Dr stipps number so he could tell the police that he had been at the scene .This shows that Stander had contact with Oscars lawyers and thats within an hour of the incident. .Dr stipp went to work as normal that day and didnt find out until 9 am that it was Oscar Pistorius house he was in that morning.The rest of the day he was expecting the police to contact him because Stander had his number but they did not so the next day Dr stipp contacted the police himself.
Dr stipp also said something in his testimony that i have never heard been talked about before .
He said when he was talking to Stander at the scene a woman arrived and Dr stipp thought it was Stander's wife .He said that he heard mrs Stander say i hope it dosen't get in the papers . from 45 00
Sorry that was meant to say bat, but the same principle applies. He couldn't open the door but he could smash it with a bat or fire a gun?
I don't think a one off counts. You're not abusive so you're not representative of men who are.
OP didn't just punch a hole in a wall once, he smashed up a whole bathroom and more.
Quite frankly I believe OP is a complete nut-job IMO
I believe my one-off punch in the wall was his bashing up a bathroom with a cricket bat
BiB… again... I do not believe that the toilet door being locked had anything to do with the bashing or the shooting… of course only my theory
But if opening the door was OP's goal :
- why charge it and kick it… useless because the door opens outwardly
- why shoot at it… that would certainly not open it
BTW… after I punched the wall, my girlfriend threw a plate at me… it missed but a shard hit my face… it was bleeding just a bit… she came over and apologized profusely.. as did I about the wall… we made up on the spot
I am even open to the possibility that reeva did go to bed with OP, pandering to his needs as such and when he went to sleep, she was sat there worrying about her unfinished speech.
So she got up went downstairs, turning the alarm off on her way;-).and proceeded to work in the kitchen, little snack to keep her going.
OP wakes up finds her not there, may well have a been a bit worried, goes downstairs, (with his gun and phone) and finds her sitting there. Worry turns to annoyance and the argument starts..
Also possible…. but it does not explain why RS did not shutdown her GPRS Hotspot before going to bed…. of course it could be that she forgot to do it
Why did Johan Stander not inform the police that Dr Stipp had been at Oscar's house that morning. Dr stipp told Stander about the first shots then the screams then the second shots .Dr stipp left before the police arrived but exchanged numbers with Stander thinking that Stander would inform the police that he had been on the scene .Dr stipp said shortly after he arrived home at 4 17 Stander called him and said he had left his number with Oscars lawyers incase he is needed .Stander said in his tetimony he took Dr stipps number so he could tell the police that he had been at the scene .This shows that Stander had contact with Oscars lawyers and thats within an hour of the incident. .Dr stipp went to work as normal that day and didnt find out until 9 am that it was Oscar Pistorius house he was in that morning.The rest of the day he was expecting the police to contact him because Stander had his number but they did not so the next day Dr stipp contacted the police himself.
Dr stipp also said something in his testimony that i have never heard been talked about before .
He said when he was talking to Stander at the scene a woman arrived and Dr stipp thought it was Stander's wife .He said that he heard mrs Stander say i hope it dosen't get in the papers . from 45 00
So before the ambulance and police arrived all the Standers were at the scene Johan Stander ,
Clarice and Mrs Stander .
I am shocked all over again at hearing that Johan Stander hadn't even called an ambulance. What are these people like??? He gave Dr Stipps number to OP's lawyers and not the police - because he knew instantly that OP had called on him and not the emergency services, to keep this in some way away from the attention of the authorities. That's why he blocked security from entering the house. OP was totally gutted that Dr Stipp had turned up, it mucked up his plans to control who was at the house.
Thanks for that clip - It reminded me what I thought I had heard - which was that OP went upstairs on his own twice. Carice only told the court that OP went up by himself once, when the paramedics asked for Reeva's ID. But Dr Stipp saw him going up and he left as soon as the paramedics arrived. Therefore OP went up twice to re-arrange things.
Quite frankly I believe OP is a complete nut-job IMO
I believe my one-off punch in the wall was his bashing up a bathroom with a cricket bat
BiB… again... I do not believe that the toilet door being locked had anything to do with the bashing or the shooting… of course only my theory
But if opening the door was OP's goal :
- why charge it and kick it… useless because the door opens outwardly
- why shoot at it… that would certainly not open it
BTW… after I punched the wall, my girlfriend threw a plate at me… it missed but a shard hit my face… it was bleeding just a bit… she came over and apologized profusely.. as did I about the wall… we made up on the spot
I don't believe your one off punch was anything like OP smashing up the bathroom. It turns out he was in a murderous rage. There's a big difference.
Your fight with your gf is what's called 'common or situational couple violence' and it's fairly common as the name implies. It's not based on one partner being the abuser, the dominator, the controller, that's called 'intimate terrorism', but it's more about an argument/s that get out of hand, in which a couple lashes out physically at each other. It's much less likely to end in serious violence. Which is not to minimise it, it's not healthy if it's a repeated pattern, but just to put it in context.
I am shocked all over again at hearing that Johan Stander hadn't even called an ambulance. What are these people like??? He gave Dr Stipps number to OP's lawyers and not the police - because he knew instantly that OP had called on him and not the emergency services, to keep this in some way away from the attention of the authorities. That's why he blocked security from entering the house. OP was totally gutted that Dr Stipp had turned up, it mucked up his plans to control who was at the house.
Thanks for that clip - It reminded me what I thought I had heard - which was that OP went upstairs on his own twice. Carice only told the court that OP went up by himself once, when the paramedics asked for Reeva's ID. But Dr Stipp saw him going up and he left as soon as the paramedics arrived. Therefore OP went up twice to re-arrange things.
BiB… Indeed… OP was constantly thinking and refining his story as the events unfolded that night… he saw obvious 'mistakes' that needed correcting !
I don't believe your one off punch was anything like OP smashing up the bathroom. It turns out he was in a murderous rage. There's a big difference.
Your fight with your gf is what's called 'common or situational couple violence' and it's fairly common as the name implies. It's not based on one partner being the abuser, the dominator, the controller, that's called 'intimate terrorism', but it's more about an argument/s that get out of hand, in which a couple lashes out physically at each other. It's much less likely to end in serious violence. Which is not to minimise it, it's not healthy if it's a repeated pattern, but just to put it in context.
BiB… OP was not in a murderous rage from the get go of the argument… it built up from an argument, to anger, to furious anger, to murderous rage.
Let us remember that about 1 hour and 15 minutes elapsed between the start of the argument to the shooting
Why did Johan Stander not inform the police that Dr Stipp had been at Oscar's house that morning. Dr stipp told Stander about the first shots then the screams then the second shots .Dr stipp left before the police arrived but exchanged numbers with Stander thinking that Stander would inform the police that he had been on the scene .Dr stipp said shortly after he arrived home at 4 17 Stander called him and said he had left his number with Oscars lawyers incase he is needed .Stander said in his tetimony he took Dr stipps number so he could tell the police that he had been at the scene .This shows that Stander had contact with Oscars lawyers and thats within an hour of the incident. .Dr stipp went to work as normal that day and didnt find out until 9 am that it was Oscar Pistorius house he was in that morning.The rest of the day he was expecting the police to contact him because Stander had his number but they did not so the next day Dr stipp contacted the police himself.
Dr stipp also said something in his testimony that i have never heard been talked about before .
He said when he was talking to Stander at the scene a woman arrived and Dr stipp thought it was Stander's wife .He said that he heard mrs Stander say i hope it dosen't get in the papers . from 45 00
So before the ambulance and police arrived all the Standers were at the scene Johan Stander ,
Clarice and Mrs Stander .
Yes indeed, why didn't Stander tell the police about Dr Stipp? His arrival had put a spanner in the works I think ... he was at that point the only disinterested person there.
We've talked about Mrs Stander's comments .... it's simply astounding ... given what she'd witnessed .. that she could say or think such a thing.
So OP called the Standers and Aimee and Carl. Oldwage too I think and his cousin and Justin Divaris. He didn't call the Steenkamps though ... and neither did Aimee .. though she was so concerned about the handbag bless her .. no.. let them hear it from someone else hours later >:(
Yes indeed, why didn't Stander tell the police about Dr Stipp? His arrival had put a spanner in the works I think ... he was at that point the only disinterested person there.
We've talked about Mrs Stander's comments .... it's simply astounding ... given what she'd witnessed .. that she could say or think such a thing.
So OP called the Standers and Aimee and Carl. Oldwage too I think and his cousin and Justin Divaris. He didn't call the Steenkamps though ... and neither did Aimee .. though she was so concerned about the handbag bless her .. no.. let them hear it from someone else hours later >:(
Not surprising that OP called Johan Stander first… he was not an authority figure and he would side with OP.
Carice was an unknown 'bonus' for OP… I suspect they had an affair at some point prior to that night
Yes indeed, why didn't Stander tell the police about Dr Stipp? His arrival had put a spanner in the works I think ... he was at that point the only disinterested person there.
We've talked about Mrs Stander's comments .... it's simply astounding ... given what she'd witnessed .. that she could say or think such a thing.
So OP called the Standers and Aimee and Carl. Oldwage too I think and his cousin and Justin Divaris. He didn't call the Steenkamps though ... and neither did Aimee .. though she was so concerned about the handbag bless her .. no.. let them hear it from someone else hours later >:(
They should all be charged with perverting the course of justice>:(
BiB… OP was not in a murderous rage from the get go of the argument… it built up from an argument, to anger, to furious anger, to murderous rage.
Let us remember that about 1 hour and 15 minutes elapsed between the start of the argument to the shooting
I agree the rage and violence built up, but unfortunately murder was where it was headed...
We don't know how long the argument went on, personally I think it likely that, if OP were awake, which we don't know, they had been bickering on an off all evening.
I just can't see an argument that extreme coming out of nowhere at 2 in the morning, I think it had probably been building like a thunderstorm.
Comments
Sam Taylor said OP had been verbally abusive with her… from Whatsapp, OP was also verbally abusive with RS.
Not opening the toilet door to silence RS and shooting RS through a closed door is evidence that OP was a coward… he couldn't face direct physical confrontation.
OP chased her in the bedroom saying something like : No f*ckin way you're leaving me on Valentine's day ! RS locked the door as a precaution… that infuriated OP who proceeded to break it open… now it was physical in RS's mind and she did not know how far OP would go…. she started to scream in fear.
A man can punch a hole in the wall without ever even considering hitting the woman he is arguing with… it's an act of frustration… but the woman does not and cannot know that for sure… and her fear can be real.
Indeed.
Let us keep in mind :
- According to Pr. Saayman Reeva ate around 2 hours prior to TOD = 1:15AM
- According to Estelle van der Merwe, Reeva was arguing loudly starting at 2AM
- Oscar’s 1:48:48 GPRS connection is precisely between Reeva’s snack at around 1:15AM and Reeva’s loud arguing at around 2:00AM
That makes RS awake, hungry and in the kitchen eating
According to Estelle van der Merwe, Reeva was arguing loudly starting at 2AM
That places RS towards the front of OP's house, the only place EVDW can hear what is happening in OP's house… somewhere like the kitchen which is towards the front of the house
SO Rs is in the kitchen and the argument starts there…. it will eventually move to the bedroom, the bathroom and the toilet where it terminated tragically.
As you say, who knows?
I just think he could not believe anyone dumped him, he was the dumper. It was because she was strong and would not comply that caused the row to escalate to where it was.
Remember his evidence re Sam Taylor? He got her to pack her bags and moved her out. The way he talked about that it was clear to me she was disposable. And she just did what he wanted. He even put his car at her disposal. I'd have shoved it where the sun don't shine, and I suspect Reeva would not just rollover for him. She just was not a wee teen blonde lass in awe of him. He could not handle her.
Dr stipp also said something in his testimony that i have never heard been talked about before .
He said when he was talking to Stander at the scene a woman arrived and Dr stipp thought it was Stander's wife .He said that he heard mrs Stander say i hope it dosen't get in the papers . from 45 00
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dFZA03eu9NM
So before the ambulance and police arrived all the Standers were at the scene Johan Stander ,
Clarice and Mrs Stander .
Punching a hole in a wall, or throwing things that smash next to a woman, or chasing her with a bat: this isn't just frustration they are acts of violence and intimidation. It's not true to say that the man does not consider hitting the woman in such a scenario, he does but choses to hit the wall instead. It's a message: this could be your head. It's intimidating and intended to render the woman fearful and under control. This all counts as dv, and men who throw things and punch walls often escalate to punching women. Women who are in a relationship with a man who behaves like that are advised to get out asap.
Reeva was a kind, patient, loving soul… she put up with a lot crap from OP… but that night was just too much, the straw that broke the camels back…. she had stayed over that night, cooked him dinner, only because OP had insisted on it so much.
BiB… exactly !
OP had his gun with him… in the holster which was clipped to his shorts
I get your meaning… but I have punched a hole in wall before… and I never raised my hand to any woman… never was even tempted to do so… never even crossed my mind to do so…. it was pure frustration and the wall (and pain I felt) was an outlet for said frustration.
She stood up to him, which was the worst thing she could have done. She wasn't afraid of him and she should have been.
Sam Taylor, by contrast, just slipped away like a meek thing. It doesn't sound like he was that invested in that relationship... Which is what people do when they can't cope with being hurt.
And insult to injury he hadn't given her a thought regarding a card or gift for that day. A day in which Reeva had been very excited about.
Sorry that was meant to say bat, but the same principle applies. He couldn't open the door but he could smash it with a bat or fire a gun?
I don't think a one off counts. You're not abusive so you're not representative of men who are.
OP didn't just punch a hole in a wall once, he smashed up a whole bathroom and more.
BiB… don't know… do you have a theory on the matter ?
So she got up went downstairs, turning the alarm off on her way;-).and proceeded to work in the kitchen, little snack to keep her going.
OP wakes up finds her not there, may well have a been a bit worried, goes downstairs, (with his gun and phone) and finds her sitting there. Worry turns to annoyance and the argument starts..
That is why I don't trust the Stander's >:(. Telling Stipp the lawyer would be in touch
Wonder if they told the police a Dr Stipp had been present?
Quite frankly I believe OP is a complete nut-job IMO
I believe my one-off punch in the wall was his bashing up a bathroom with a cricket bat
BiB… again... I do not believe that the toilet door being locked had anything to do with the bashing or the shooting… of course only my theory
But if opening the door was OP's goal :
- why charge it and kick it… useless because the door opens outwardly
- why shoot at it… that would certainly not open it
BTW… after I punched the wall, my girlfriend threw a plate at me… it missed but a shard hit my face… it was bleeding just a bit… she came over and apologized profusely.. as did I about the wall… we made up on the spot
Also possible…. but it does not explain why RS did not shutdown her GPRS Hotspot before going to bed…. of course it could be that she forgot to do it
That could certainly fuel an argument from RS perspective
I am shocked all over again at hearing that Johan Stander hadn't even called an ambulance. What are these people like??? He gave Dr Stipps number to OP's lawyers and not the police - because he knew instantly that OP had called on him and not the emergency services, to keep this in some way away from the attention of the authorities. That's why he blocked security from entering the house. OP was totally gutted that Dr Stipp had turned up, it mucked up his plans to control who was at the house.
Thanks for that clip - It reminded me what I thought I had heard - which was that OP went upstairs on his own twice. Carice only told the court that OP went up by himself once, when the paramedics asked for Reeva's ID. But Dr Stipp saw him going up and he left as soon as the paramedics arrived. Therefore OP went up twice to re-arrange things.
I don't believe your one off punch was anything like OP smashing up the bathroom. It turns out he was in a murderous rage. There's a big difference.
Your fight with your gf is what's called 'common or situational couple violence' and it's fairly common as the name implies. It's not based on one partner being the abuser, the dominator, the controller, that's called 'intimate terrorism', but it's more about an argument/s that get out of hand, in which a couple lashes out physically at each other. It's much less likely to end in serious violence. Which is not to minimise it, it's not healthy if it's a repeated pattern, but just to put it in context.
BiB… Indeed… OP was constantly thinking and refining his story as the events unfolded that night… he saw obvious 'mistakes' that needed correcting !
BiB… OP was not in a murderous rage from the get go of the argument… it built up from an argument, to anger, to furious anger, to murderous rage.
Let us remember that about 1 hour and 15 minutes elapsed between the start of the argument to the shooting
We've talked about Mrs Stander's comments .... it's simply astounding ... given what she'd witnessed .. that she could say or think such a thing.
So OP called the Standers and Aimee and Carl. Oldwage too I think and his cousin and Justin Divaris. He didn't call the Steenkamps though ... and neither did Aimee .. though she was so concerned about the handbag bless her .. no.. let them hear it from someone else hours later >:(
Not surprising that OP called Johan Stander first… he was not an authority figure and he would side with OP.
Carice was an unknown 'bonus' for OP… I suspect they had an affair at some point prior to that night
They should all be charged with perverting the course of justice>:(
We don't know how long the argument went on, personally I think it likely that, if OP were awake, which we don't know, they had been bickering on an off all evening.
I just can't see an argument that extreme coming out of nowhere at 2 in the morning, I think it had probably been building like a thunderstorm.