DAB in Tunnels

jimbojimbo Posts: 16,234
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I have been reliably informed that DAB is now available in

Rotherhythe Tunnel
Blackwall Tunnel

(in one of these only the southbound carrigeway - but can't remember which).

Also a third one has it with the word "link" in the name.

Sadly I was unable to note them down when I was told - however they only carry 5 muxes

BBC National DAB
Digital 1
London 1
London 2
London 3

If anyone can fill in the missing info please can you let us know.

As far as I am aware these are the only cases so fr of DAB in tunnels- hence a new thread!

Thanks for your help.

Comments

  • Colin_LondonColin_London Posts: 12,656
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    jimbo wrote: »
    I have been reliably informed that DAB is now available in

    Rotherhythe Tunnel
    Blackwall Tunnel

    (in one of these only the southbound carrigeway - but can't remember which).

    Also a third one has it with the word "link" in the name.

    Sadly I was unable to note them down when I was told - however they only carry 5 muxes

    BBC National DAB
    Digital 1
    London 1
    London 2
    London 3

    If anyone can fill in the missing info please can you let us know.

    As far as I am aware these are the only cases so fr of DAB in tunnels- hence a new thread!

    Thanks for your help.

    Rotherhithe Tunnel is only single bore with two way traffic (not nice to drive at all) so your informant must have been referring to Blackwall.

    Dartford and Limehouse Link tunnels also have FM and Dartford in particular should be a priority for conversion.

    But I think Blackwall and Rotherhithe were upgraded by Tyco relatively recently so I guess they were contracted to upgrade their systems together.

    As to why SDL is missing, I guess the spec was written and contracted before it launched.
  • Bill ClintonBill Clinton Posts: 9,389
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    Wonder if it'll ever be added to the Mersey tunnel, it has several stations on FM, Radio City, Rock FM, Capital, Heart, Radio City 2, Radio Merseyside, Radio 1, Radio 2, Radio 3 & Radio 4.
  • jimbojimbo Posts: 16,234
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    Rotherhithe Tunnel is only single bore with two way traffic (not nice to drive at all) so your informant must have been referring to Blackwall.

    Dartford and Limehouse Link tunnels also have FM and Dartford in particular should be a priority for conversion.

    But I think Blackwall and Rotherhithe were upgraded by Tyco relatively recently so I guess they were contracted to upgrade their systems together.

    As to why SDL is missing, I guess the spec was written and contracted before it launched.

    Thanks for clarification

    It was

    Blackwall Southbound
    Rotherhythe
    Limehouse Link

    And it is the same 5 muxes in all 3 cases.

    No info for Mersey Tunnels yet but will keep my ears peeled!
  • Colin_LondonColin_London Posts: 12,656
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    jimbo wrote: »
    Thanks for clarification

    It was

    Blackwall Southbound
    Rotherhythe
    Limehouse Link

    And it is the same 5 muxes in all 3 cases.

    No info for Mersey Tunnels yet but will keep my ears peeled!

    They are all TFL tunnels (and they have money). You would expect them to only equip national + London muxes, but SDL obviously missed the party.

    Dartford is Highways England so we'll probably be waiting some time for an upgrade....
  • Gerry1Gerry1 Posts: 4,206
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    The Rotherhithe and BWT S/B specifications date back to pre-Millennium days when BBC, D1 and London 1 were the only muxes in the area.

    Given that tunnels are refurbished only at 20 - 30 year intervals, the radio specification was intended to be as future proof as possible. Rotherhithe is one of the oldest road tunnels anywhere, and it was the first in the world to have Radio Public Address via DAB.

    Unfortunately the BWT S/B refurbishment project was put on hold to avoid disrupting the Millennium Dome, and the other London muxes and SDL were not added to the specification as variation orders.

    Later on when BWT N/B was refurbished there was even more severe pressure on funding so by then a cheap and cheerful FM solution was all that was affordable: DAB was omitted because in-vehicle take up was still very low. Similarly, MW and LW were also omitted.

    It must be remembered that coverage is provided to facilitate Radio Public Address during incidents and evacuations and that programme coverage is essentially a fringe benefit.
  • Colin_LondonColin_London Posts: 12,656
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    Gerry1 wrote: »
    The Rotherhithe and BWT S/B specifications date back to pre-Millennium days when BBC, D1 and London 1 were the only muxes in the area.

    Given that tunnels are refurbished only at 20 - 30 year intervals, the radio specification was intended to be as future proof as possible. Rotherhithe is one of the oldest road tunnels anywhere, and it was the first in the world to have Radio Public Address via DAB.

    Unfortunately the BWT S/B refurbishment project was put on hold to avoid disrupting the Millennium Dome, and the other London muxes and SDL were not added to the specification as variation orders.

    Later on when BWT N/B was refurbished there was even more severe pressure on funding so by then a cheap and cheerful FM solution was all that was affordable: DAB was omitted because in-vehicle take up was still very low. Similarly, MW and LW were also omitted.

    It must be remembered that coverage is provided to facilitate Radio Public Address during incidents and evacuations and that programme coverage is essentially a fringe benefit.

    I have been through Limehouse a couple of times when the PA feature was (mal)functioning - FM RDS on all channels states 'ALERT' IIRC and the audio was silent on all channels.

    Interesting how this will be replicated on DAB.

    Up until now if you were listening to a DAB station with FM coverage your car radio would AF-follow to FM when you entered the tunnel. DAB-only stations just cut out.
  • vinnielovinnielo Posts: 8,346
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    jimbo wrote: »
    I have been reliably informed that DAB is now available in

    Rotherhythe Tunnel
    Blackwall Tunnel

    As far as I am aware these are the only cases so fr of DAB in tunnels- hence a new thread!
    Interesting. Had your reliable informant been cryogenically frozen for the last 10 years?
    The equipment had been installed yonks ago, albeit operating on and off.
  • IcaraaIcaraa Posts: 6,043
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    Wonder if it'll ever be added to the Mersey tunnel, it has several stations on FM, Radio City, Rock FM, Capital, Heart, Radio City 2, Radio Merseyside, Radio 1, Radio 2, Radio 3 & Radio 4.

    It does indeed, two versions of Capital doesn't it?

    However Global haven't linked Capital L'pool to the DAB version so the car doesn't switch to the FM version. I have no idea who to contact at Global about it, they might not even realise.
  • Gerry1Gerry1 Posts: 4,206
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    I have been through Limehouse a couple of times when the PA feature was (mal)functioning - FM RDS on all channels states 'ALERT' IIRC and the audio was silent on all channels.

    Interesting how this will be replicated on DAB.
    The RDS display was probably ALARM, which is the car radio's interpretation of RDS Flag 31.

    Sounds like the control room forgot to restore normal programming after using the Radio Public Address facility.
  • hanssolohanssolo Posts: 22,561
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    They are all TFL tunnels (and they have money). You would expect them to only equip national + London muxes, but SDL obviously missed the party.

    Dartford is Highways England so we'll probably be waiting some time for an upgrade....
    http://www.landmobile.co.uk/news/londons-road-tunnels-radio-systems-what-lies-beneath
    Looks like Simoco a former division of Pye/Philips has taken over the TFL contract from Tyco. They may possibly add DÀB to the Blackwell north tunnel?

    Highways Agency had its budget cut in 2010 and also closed Traffic radio
    https://www.theguardian.com/media/2010/dec/08/traffic-radio-service-cut
    There was a remote chance Traffic radio might return to DAB, and Inrix are running it's own online station http://www.travelradio.org.uk but the present Government see it seem to have restored the HA funding but has made Highways England a public corporation.
    In France the funding for traffic radio and presumably tunnel repeaters come from tolls but the UK Government so far is not adding more toll roads.
  • Gerry1Gerry1 Posts: 4,206
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    hanssolo wrote: »
    Looks like Simoco a former division of Pye/Philips has taken over the TFL contract from Tyco. They may possibly add DÀB to the Blackwell north tunnel?
    It would have to be a decision made by TfL, not unilaterally by the current maintainer.
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