Well, I'd say it does. It doesn't make your race of British origin, but nationality is something that can be acquired, as Gerard Depardieu has just undertaken.
No he hasn't, he has citizenship not nationality, he is still french.
Right on your passport where it says british citizen, like i say there is a difference between what it says on your passport and what you actually are.
A jamaicans passport would say british nationality/british citizen.
That doesn't mean their nationality is welsh.
Once again I can only marvel at your superb grasp of the stunningly obvious.
Again, I'd have to ask how this relates to the idea that a person born in England, Scotland or Wales isn't actually "British"?
Once again I can only marvel at your superb grasp of the stunningly obvious.
Again, I'd have to ask how this relates to the idea that a person born in England, Scotland or Wales isn't actually "British"?
I never said they weren't british citizens i said british as a nationality was comparable to being european and has no meaning.
A british citizen is welsh, english, irish, scottish or a naturalised citizen... it has as much meaning as being european as a british citizen/national can be from anywhere and isn't a nationality.
I never said they weren't british citizens i said british as a nationality was comparable to being european and has no meaning.
Oh, come on. You're still flogging that particular dead horse?
A british citizen is welsh, english, irish, scottish or a naturalised citizen... it has as much meaning as being european as a british citizen can be from anywhere and isn't a nationality.
Setting aside the whole "European" thing again (which remains just as silly every time you mention it), I have no problem with people recognising their geographical heritage.
It just seems ridiculous to attempt to deny your ACTUAL nationality in favour of some notional heritage.
If a Jamaican points out the difference between their official nationality and their country of origin there's some point to it because they are different things.
When an English person does the same it's a bit silly because they are the same thing.
It's kinda like refusing to accept that you're British, in favour of claiming to be a Mancunian or Glaswegian.
This issue is often of concern to those on the right of the political spectrum, who regard any 'dilution' of the "British" or "English" race/nationality with horror, without realising we are a race of mongrels anyway,
was born here but dont consider myself to be english , my parents were born somewhere else and i consider myself to be more belonging to that place than england because of the obvious ethnic similarities.
personally though , i've integrated well in both but i don't feel belonging to either and im comfortable with that, i guess am one of those generations that are a bit confused.
Oh, come on. You're still flogging that particular dead horse?
Setting aside the whole "European" thing again (which remains just as silly every time you mention it), I have no problem with people recognising their geographical heritage.
It just seems ridiculous to attempt to deny your ACTUAL nationality in favour of some notional heritage.
If a Jamaican points out the difference between their official nationality and their country of origin there's some point to it because they are different things.
When an English person does the same it's a bit silly because they are the same thing.
It's kinda like refusing to accept that you're British, in favour of claiming to be a Mancunian or Glaswegian.
Maybe you need a venn diagram or something?
You're still neglecting the whole 4 different countries thing but knock yourself out, i'm bored now and it doesn't make you right.
He sounds confused, they will be both english and welsh.
By parentage they will - but when asked what nationality they are - what do you think they will say? I have never heard anyone describe themselves as "English and Welsh".
This goes back to the point I made earlier. I bet most of us have some mix of ancestry and so are all a bit English/Welsh, Welsh/Scottish etc. How far back does it have to go to be considered irrelevant to your current nationality so that you specify only one?
By parentage they will - but when asked what nationality they are - what do you think they will say. I have never heard anyone describe themselves as "English and Welsh".
Well from what i remember according to the UN part of identifying an indigenous people was self recognition, that doesn't change the fact that if one of those indigenous people had children with someone from somewhere else they would technically be both, it seems a bit strange though, for example someone who had welsh and english parents, if they were brought up in england to proclaim themselves strictly as welsh.
to me, your nationality is defined by your parents and your heritage before your country of birth.
...it seems a bit strange though for example someone who had welsh and english parents, if they were brought up in england to proclaim themselves strictly as welsh.
I didn't say they would be brought up in England. I said they would likely be born there - but they live (and the kid would be brought up) in Wales.
It isn't though it is defined by your country of birth and your parents.
So if you are Born to Scottish and English parents - in Wales........what nationality does that make you?
The reality is - people will tend to choose to identify with one nationality.
In my previous example - a kid born to English and Welsh parents - and brought up in Wales - is likely to identify as Welsh first (even though they may acknowledge their English ancestry).
I don't think it matters so much where you were born there is a Wrestler called Kane and his dad was in the army and worked abroad so he was born in Spain but I don't think that makes him Spanish even though his official birth certificate is a Spanish one
English = people born in England
British = non existant really, only a name given to people which in real life is meaningless to everyone. Scottish people are Scottish, Welsh people are Welsh and English people are English. British is as meaningless a term as European, again Scottish people are Scottish yes European but European is a meaningless word aswell.
It's more complicated than that, one of my uncles lives in Australia and his eldest son ( who didn't leave this country until he was about 5 years old ) now sounds like an Australian and barely remembers living in the UK.
I don't think it matters so much where you were born there is a Wrestler called Kane and his dad was in the army and worked abroad so he was born in Spain but I don't think that makes him Spanish even though his official birth certificate is a Spanish one
But if his famliy lived in spain they could have claimed spanish citizenship for him but his nationality would still have been that of his parents.
It isn't though it is defined by your country of birth and your parents and i believe your parents nationality takes priority.
What about those who were born to Indian-born British white parents in India? E.g. children in the British Raj.
Most I met said they saw themselves as British since birth because their parents and passports said so. Some of them didn't move to here until they were in their 40s and their late parents had never been to this country.
How would you define their nationality in that respect?
A british citizen with scottish and english nationality
Why doesn't the Welsh come into it - afterall, you said the country of Birth does have a bearing.
Technically you are correct - which kinda makes stating whether you are English, Welsh etc kinda pointless. What is the point of stating a single nationality (as most people do) - if there are so many potential options as to make it virtually meaningless.
What about those who were born to Indian-born British white parents in India? E.g. children in the British Raj.
Most I met said they saw themselves as British since birth because their parents and passports said so. Some of them didn't move to here until they were in their 40s and their late parents had never been to this country.
How would you define their nationality in that respect?
I think i've said it before but if move to africa and have children, their children wont be african, i'm not so they wont be, they might be african citizens.
Comments
No he hasn't, he has citizenship not nationality, he is still french.
Once again I can only marvel at your superb grasp of the stunningly obvious.
Again, I'd have to ask how this relates to the idea that a person born in England, Scotland or Wales isn't actually "British"?
I never said they weren't british citizens i said british as a nationality was comparable to being european and has no meaning.
A british citizen is welsh, english, irish, scottish or a naturalised citizen... it has as much meaning as being european as a british citizen/national can be from anywhere and isn't a nationality.
Oh, come on. You're still flogging that particular dead horse?
Setting aside the whole "European" thing again (which remains just as silly every time you mention it), I have no problem with people recognising their geographical heritage.
It just seems ridiculous to attempt to deny your ACTUAL nationality in favour of some notional heritage.
If a Jamaican points out the difference between their official nationality and their country of origin there's some point to it because they are different things.
When an English person does the same it's a bit silly because they are the same thing.
It's kinda like refusing to accept that you're British, in favour of claiming to be a Mancunian or Glaswegian.
Maybe you need a venn diagram or something?
personally though , i've integrated well in both but i don't feel belonging to either and im comfortable with that, i guess am one of those generations that are a bit confused.
You're still neglecting the whole 4 different countries thing but knock yourself out, i'm bored now and it doesn't make you right.
By parentage they will - but when asked what nationality they are - what do you think they will say? I have never heard anyone describe themselves as "English and Welsh".
This goes back to the point I made earlier. I bet most of us have some mix of ancestry and so are all a bit English/Welsh, Welsh/Scottish etc. How far back does it have to go to be considered irrelevant to your current nationality so that you specify only one?
Well from what i remember according to the UN part of identifying an indigenous people was self recognition, that doesn't change the fact that if one of those indigenous people had children with someone from somewhere else they would technically be both, it seems a bit strange though, for example someone who had welsh and english parents, if they were brought up in england to proclaim themselves strictly as welsh.
to me, your nationality is defined by your parents and your heritage before your country of birth.
I didn't say they would be brought up in England. I said they would likely be born there - but they live (and the kid would be brought up) in Wales.
Yep - and that's the difficulty - to others, nationality is defined by your country of birth first.......Both are simply opinions
At the end of the day - the persons nationality is probably determined by what they choose to identify with.
Bingo.
Doesn't that take us back to Jedi Knights and Jam Donuts from the Zog dimension?
I think I'll be a Zeta Reticulan today.
Perhaps it does.
How do you know a "real" English person - from somebody who is simply claiming to be English?
The reality is - you cant - and people can, in theory, choose to self identify with any nationality they like.
It isn't though it is defined by your country of birth and your parents and i believe your parents nationality takes priority.
So if you are Born to Scottish and English parents - in Wales........what nationality does that make you?
The reality is - people will tend to choose to identify with one nationality.
In my previous example - a kid born to English and Welsh parents - and brought up in Wales - is likely to identify as Welsh first (even though they may acknowledge their English ancestry).
A british citizen with scottish and english nationality
It's more complicated than that, one of my uncles lives in Australia and his eldest son ( who didn't leave this country until he was about 5 years old ) now sounds like an Australian and barely remembers living in the UK.
Nationality can change, your race can't.
But if his famliy lived in spain they could have claimed spanish citizenship for him but his nationality would still have been that of his parents.
What about those who were born to Indian-born British white parents in India? E.g. children in the British Raj.
Most I met said they saw themselves as British since birth because their parents and passports said so. Some of them didn't move to here until they were in their 40s and their late parents had never been to this country.
How would you define their nationality in that respect?
Why doesn't the Welsh come into it - afterall, you said the country of Birth does have a bearing.
Technically you are correct - which kinda makes stating whether you are English, Welsh etc kinda pointless. What is the point of stating a single nationality (as most people do) - if there are so many potential options as to make it virtually meaningless.
I think i've said it before but if move to africa and have children, their children wont be african, i'm not so they wont be, they might be african citizens.