For example, if Sky have Sky Sports 1-4, News, F1 HD on 401-406 for HD subscribers and the SD versions on the same numbers for SD subscribers, they'd then lose EPG positions 407-409, 435, 436 & 439. Presumably Sky wouldn't want to lose such prominent positions as 407-409. The same example applies for other broadcasters in the same position.
This is all I'm going to say on this particular issue in this thread because I don't wan't to take the thread off topic.
Im sure Sky wouldnt want to loose any important LCNs (Local Channel Numbers), but if and its a big if right now, if they scrapped their SD channels and just had HD channels then they would put their HD channels where the SD channels were as a permanent thing.
The other thing is they do control their EPG so they can say where a channel goes when its launched, what I understand they cant do is take an LCN away from a channel unless that channel closes or breaks Sky's terms for being on the platform.
So with that in mind when a broadcaster sells an SD slot, they dont sell that LCN, as the channel they had is effectively closing, they sell the rights to a SD channel being on Sky, Sky then may give the new channel a new LCN.
I hope that helps. Oh and quite right its getting off topic, lets get back to the new BBC HD channels launching!
is 'Concerto at the BBC Proms' upscaled or Dr Who over on BBC three?
"Concerto at the BBC Proms" on Four is upscaled.
Doctor Who (complete with CBBC "new" DOG) might be upscaled, or it's very soft. Some shots definitely look native but others within the same scene look upscaled.
Edit: I think it's just very soft. Not sure if they're trying things or if that's how Doctor Who normally looks stylistically?
Doctor Who (complete with CBBC "new" DOG) might be upscaled, or it's very soft. Some shots definitely look native but others within the same scene look upscaled.
Edit: I think it's just very soft. Not sure if they're trying things or if that's how Doctor Who normally looks stylistically?
Seems there's no strikethrough bbcode either.
could they have stopped the HD testing from the HD playouts for the weekend and just be upscaling off the SD playout for now?
Cbeebies this afternoon had the BBC Four HD DOG too! I think they've switched back to SD playout routed to new HD service feeds. The DOG's must be inserted post playout switching and pre RedBee network output switching.
Anyone know why there are intermittent issues recording these streams with DVBViewer? I can watch all these new channels 24/7, but half the time if I try and record them I just get a zero-byte output file. For instance last night, I couldn't get a recording of BBC Three HD no matter how many times I tried, but this morning it's working fine. But now BBC Four HD is doing instead what BBC Three HD was doing last night and refusing to record.
But I'm not changing anything in DVB Viewer so it must be something about the streams that is changing? Either that or I'm just being thick...
Im sure Sky wouldnt want to loose any important LCNs (Local Channel Numbers), but if and its a big if right now, if they scrapped their SD channels and just had HD channels then they would put their HD channels where the SD channels were as a permanent thing.
The other thing is they do control their EPG so they can say where a channel goes when its launched, what I understand they cant do is take an LCN away from a channel unless that channel closes or breaks Sky's terms for being on the platform.
Again you show your lack of knowledge of the FRND (Fair, reasonable and non-discriminatory) regulations for EPGs. Sky must allocate a new channel the first available slot at the end of the genre and cannot "fill in" blanks in the listings unless the broadcaster already owns or purchases that slot. This applies to all broadcasters including themselves. Blank "unowned" slots in the listings are filled in with the regular shuffling up of all channels in the genre - where unless a broadcaster for some reason wishes to keep a particular number slot all channels below the gaps move up the listing without changing their order
in the listing (channels retaining their EPG number are "leap-frogged" by channels below them). This sometimes appears incomplete because some slots still have a "reserved" status stemming from early days when channels were allocated a slot and adjacent channels were reserved for the same broadcaster.
So with that in mind when a broadcaster sells an SD slot, they dont sell that LCN, as the channel they had is effectively closing, they sell the rights to a SD channel being on Sky, Sky then may give the new channel a new LCN.
I hope that helps. Oh and quite right its getting off topic, lets get back to the new BBC HD channels launching!
Wrong again they sell their position in the EPG listing which is why slots at the top of the genres have a lot higher financial value (and price) than those lower down.
has anyone observed anything new today or are they just showing the SD playout upscaled for the weekend?
BBC News HD is definitely HD at the moment but BBC Three HD and BBC Four HD seem to be upscaled.
Also re: my earlier question about problems recording with DVBViewer I've fixed the issue by switching back to DVBViewer GE instead of DVBViewer Pro. Whatever is changing on these streams seems to confuse the cut-down version of the software less, for some reason. Presumably it won't be an issue when everything is finalised next week.
BBC News HD is definitely HD at the moment but BBC Three HD and BBC Four HD seem to be upscaled.
Also re: my earlier question about problems recording with DVBViewer I've fixed the issue by switching back to DVBViewer GE instead of DVBViewer Pro. Whatever is changing on these streams seems to confuse the cut-down version of the software less, for some reason. Presumably it won't be an issue when everything is finalised next week.
Oh right well BBC News HD will definitely launch first then if thats going strong in HD. The other 2 streams/4 channels may be an issue with Sky I suppose if they think that they aren't fully tested!
Im glad you got your issue solved. I hope that BBC 3 HD/CBBC HD and BBC 4 HD/Cbeebies HD being from the SD playout upscaled is just a weekend thing where the testers have gone home, as I dont fancy waiting for these channels on Sky, just because Sky think they arent fully tested!
Is it me or is the studio footage on BBC News HD sharper now than it previously was. I've noticed a lot of BBC News's new HD output across the BBC Network (Marr, Sunday Politics, News etc) never looks as sharp as other HD output, suspect they softened the picture somewhat. Only Sportsday and general sports inserts from MediaCity looked sharp, obviously sourced not from W1, however BBC News studio footage looks much better now.
I notice CBeebies HD is still showing the BBC Four HD DOG, as per yesterday.
I notice CBeebies HD is still showing the BBC Four HD DOG, as per yesterday.
As above, I don't think they are doing anything over the weekend so have left the upscaled SD play out rolling with whatever graphic was on the screen at the time!
I wonder why some contributors cant post without marketing Sky?
This is the FreeSat forum isn't it?
Give us a break.
Well on Sky we cant manually tune the channels, so to discuss whats going on we have to somehow talk about them here, as freesat is where you can see whats going on if you manually tune, or a generic HD Dsat box.
I suppose this thread would still work in broadcasting though!
As above, I don't think they are doing anything over the weekend so have left the upscaled SD play out rolling with whatever graphic was on the screen at the time!
Yeah looks that way. Shame as I was hoping they'd "accidentally" show Borgen in HD. But there's no excuse for it not to be next weekend
As above, I don't think they are doing anything over the weekend so have left the upscaled SD play out rolling with whatever graphic was on the screen at the time!
Yep, guess your right. I suppose RedBee will still be running both new HD playout suites on soak-test, the BBC are probably not paying for the two services to be played out in HD until Tuesday morning so RedBee won't switch the HD versions 'to air' until contractually they are obliged to. I guess, as with any playout organisation, they won't do anything until they contractually need to.
I wonder if Alix Pryde will appear from behind her secrecy veil on Monday to announce the formal launch of all these new HD channels or will the BBC simply launch them quietly on to each platform. Apart from those in the industry and who have an interest in this line of business, jo-public will still be none the wiser that any of these channels are launching next week.
Whilst, to most, it makes no difference and they will simply appear in place of the current SD variants, surely for the BBC it holds a degree of prestige to announce the formal launch on the 10th and that almost all it's mainstream services will now be available in HD, taking the BBC's HD output to seven channels from the current two! I guess they don't want to pre-empt a backlash from those DTT viewers who won't have access to BBC Four, CBeebies or BBC News in HD and kicking off!
Yep, guess your right. I suppose RedBee will still be running both new HD playout suites on soak-test, the BBC are probably not paying for the two services to be played out in HD until Tuesday morning so RedBee won't switch the HD versions 'to air' until contractually they are obliged to. I guess, as with any playout organisation, they won't do anything until they contractually need to.
I wonder if Alix Pryde will appear from behind her secrecy veil on Monday to announce the formal launch of all these new HD channels or will the BBC simply launch them quietly on to each platform. Apart from those in the industry and who have an interest in this line of business, jo-public will still be none the wiser that any of these channels are launching next week.
Whilst, to most, it makes no difference and they will simply appear in place of the current SD variants, surely for the BBC it holds a degree of prestige to announce the formal launch on the 10th and that almost all it's mainstream services will now be available in HD, taking the BBC's HD output to seven channels from the current two! I guess they don't want to pre-empt a backlash from those DTT viewers who won't have access to BBC Four, CBeebies or BBC News in HD and kicking off!
BBC 2 HD was a soft or quiet launch though (although they did announce it on air in the BBC HD channel) and they made a formal announcement on the BBC blog.
I suppose there was no technical issues like with these new channels though, as it was just a change in name and the programming when BBC HD became BBC 2 HD.
BBC 2 HD was a soft or quiet launch though (although they did announce it on air in the BBC HD channel) and they made a formal announcement on the BBC blog.
I suppose there was no technical issues like with these new channels though, as it was just a change in name and the programming when BBC HD became BBC 2 HD.
Your right it was, it didn't also come with it's own criticisms too as there was a fair bit of BBC HD output from Three and Four no longer available in HD (until next week).
Your right it was, it didn't also come with it's own criticisms too as there was a fair bit of BBC HD output from Three and Four no longer available in HD (until next week).
Which we were supposed to get via iPlayer but never did
Comments
Im sure Sky wouldnt want to loose any important LCNs (Local Channel Numbers), but if and its a big if right now, if they scrapped their SD channels and just had HD channels then they would put their HD channels where the SD channels were as a permanent thing.
The other thing is they do control their EPG so they can say where a channel goes when its launched, what I understand they cant do is take an LCN away from a channel unless that channel closes or breaks Sky's terms for being on the platform.
So with that in mind when a broadcaster sells an SD slot, they dont sell that LCN, as the channel they had is effectively closing, they sell the rights to a SD channel being on Sky, Sky then may give the new channel a new LCN.
I hope that helps. Oh and quite right its getting off topic, lets get back to the new BBC HD channels launching!
Ah I see well that makes sense, I guess they were told to remove the launch date as the BBC haven't made any announcements!
is 'Concerto at the BBC Proms' upscaled or Dr Who over on BBC three?
"Concerto at the BBC Proms" on Four is upscaled.
Doctor Who (complete with CBBC "new" DOG) might be upscaled, or it's very soft. Some shots definitely look native but others within the same scene look upscaled.
Edit: I think it's just very soft. Not sure if they're trying things or if that's how Doctor Who normally looks stylistically?
Seems there's no strikethrough bbcode either.
could they have stopped the HD testing from the HD playouts for the weekend and just be upscaling off the SD playout for now?
I guess it's possible, I just had a flick over to Three and it looks upscaled on this Doctor Who.
Enjoying Bonnie Raitt now on Four, just a shame it's not HD!
Will they be showing Sherlock in HD?
But I'm not changing anything in DVB Viewer so it must be something about the streams that is changing? Either that or I'm just being thick...
Again you show your lack of knowledge of the FRND (Fair, reasonable and non-discriminatory) regulations for EPGs. Sky must allocate a new channel the first available slot at the end of the genre and cannot "fill in" blanks in the listings unless the broadcaster already owns or purchases that slot. This applies to all broadcasters including themselves. Blank "unowned" slots in the listings are filled in with the regular shuffling up of all channels in the genre - where unless a broadcaster for some reason wishes to keep a particular number slot all channels below the gaps move up the listing without changing their order
in the listing (channels retaining their EPG number are "leap-frogged" by channels below them). This sometimes appears incomplete because some slots still have a "reserved" status stemming from early days when channels were allocated a slot and adjacent channels were reserved for the same broadcaster.
Wrong again they sell their position in the EPG listing which is why slots at the top of the genres have a lot higher financial value (and price) than those lower down.
. Read the document http://corporate.sky.com/file.axd?pointerid=5c857aa08dae4ece9c83bf84f55f17ce Section three .
But you might find the provisions of section 4.3 interesting as we await 10 th December .
Hopefully this is before the time in section 6.2!!!!!
I cannot find the equivalent Freesat document ..... Despite JML direct ltd v Freesat ltd [2009]
But this is uk digital for DTT http://www.digitaluk.co.uk/__data/assets/pdf_file/0009/86814/Digital_UK_LCN_Policy_Version_5.2_07082013.pdf
Rol on Tuesday !
Also re: my earlier question about problems recording with DVBViewer I've fixed the issue by switching back to DVBViewer GE instead of DVBViewer Pro. Whatever is changing on these streams seems to confuse the cut-down version of the software less, for some reason. Presumably it won't be an issue when everything is finalised next week.
Oh right well BBC News HD will definitely launch first then if thats going strong in HD. The other 2 streams/4 channels may be an issue with Sky I suppose if they think that they aren't fully tested!
Im glad you got your issue solved. I hope that BBC 3 HD/CBBC HD and BBC 4 HD/Cbeebies HD being from the SD playout upscaled is just a weekend thing where the testers have gone home, as I dont fancy waiting for these channels on Sky, just because Sky think they arent fully tested!
I notice CBeebies HD is still showing the BBC Four HD DOG, as per yesterday.
As above, I don't think they are doing anything over the weekend so have left the upscaled SD play out rolling with whatever graphic was on the screen at the time!
This is the FreeSat forum isn't it?
Give us a break.
Well on Sky we cant manually tune the channels, so to discuss whats going on we have to somehow talk about them here, as freesat is where you can see whats going on if you manually tune, or a generic HD Dsat box.
I suppose this thread would still work in broadcasting though!
Yep, guess your right. I suppose RedBee will still be running both new HD playout suites on soak-test, the BBC are probably not paying for the two services to be played out in HD until Tuesday morning so RedBee won't switch the HD versions 'to air' until contractually they are obliged to. I guess, as with any playout organisation, they won't do anything until they contractually need to.
I wonder if Alix Pryde will appear from behind her secrecy veil on Monday to announce the formal launch of all these new HD channels or will the BBC simply launch them quietly on to each platform. Apart from those in the industry and who have an interest in this line of business, jo-public will still be none the wiser that any of these channels are launching next week.
Whilst, to most, it makes no difference and they will simply appear in place of the current SD variants, surely for the BBC it holds a degree of prestige to announce the formal launch on the 10th and that almost all it's mainstream services will now be available in HD, taking the BBC's HD output to seven channels from the current two! I guess they don't want to pre-empt a backlash from those DTT viewers who won't have access to BBC Four, CBeebies or BBC News in HD and kicking off!
BBC 2 HD was a soft or quiet launch though (although they did announce it on air in the BBC HD channel) and they made a formal announcement on the BBC blog.
I suppose there was no technical issues like with these new channels though, as it was just a change in name and the programming when BBC HD became BBC 2 HD.
Your right it was, it didn't also come with it's own criticisms too as there was a fair bit of BBC HD output from Three and Four no longer available in HD (until next week).
Which we were supposed to get via iPlayer but never did