Have I missed something, or has Rooney been distinctly average this season, and has been playing in midfield for most of it?
Liverpool and United have both been poor, for the majority. We've just been not quite as poor as them. The claim that United would have definitely finished below Liverpool with Sturridge fit is laughable.
With a fit Sturridge I think we'd have put up more of a fight, and maybe we would have finished in fourth instead of you, but of course it's not guaranteed. A fully fit and on form Sturridge would've turned some of those draws and defeats into wins, I'm confident of that. But obviously United would have reacted to that if they needed to. Turning two defeats into wins wouldn't mean we'd be level right now on points because you'd have to react to any pressure we'd put on you with those wins.
I wouldn't say we'd definitely finish above you with a fully fit Sturridge but I believe there'd be a good possibility of it happening. It'd have been a more interesting contest, at least.
But it's those "ifs" and "buts" that people like so much. Ultimately it doesn't mean much, if anything.
Have I missed something, or has Rooney been distinctly average this season, and has been playing in midfield for most of it?
Liverpool and United have both been poor, for the majority. We've just been not quite as poor as them. The claim that United would have definitely finished below Liverpool with Sturridge fit is laughable.
You're entitled to disagree but it's hardly laughable - see my post here.
As usual, a reasonable debate in here is futile without unnecessary posturing, so I'll leave it there. There really is no point. You guys take everything as some kind of slight or, dare I say, agenda and it's just kills any discussion. I was simply defending the point being made by a United fan. Have fun.
With a fit Sturridge I think we'd have put up more of a fight, and maybe we would have finished in fourth instead of you, but of course it's not guaranteed. A fully fit and on form Sturridge would've turned some of those draws and defeats into wins, I'm confident of that. But obviously United would have reacted to that if they needed to. Turning two defeats into wins wouldn't mean we'd be level right now on points because you'd have to react to any pressure we'd put on you with those wins.
I wouldn't say we'd definitely finish above you with a fully fit Sturridge but I believe there'd be a good possibility of it happening. It'd have been a more interesting contest, at least.
But it's those "ifs" and "buts" that people like so much. Ultimately it doesn't mean much, if anything.
And that's the point. 'If' our defenders hadn't all have been injured at some point, 'if' Di Maria had found some form, 'if' Falcao had been at his best, we'd have been well clear of you, by about February.
Sturridge is never going to be 'fully fit', in my opinion. And Rodgers should have compensated for that, by doing more than signing Rickie Lambert.
You're entitled to disagree but it's hardly laughable - see my post here.
As usual, a reasonable debate in here is futile without unnecessary posturing, so I'll leave it there. There really is no point. You guys take everything as some kind of slight or, dare I say, agenda and it's just kills any discussion. I was simply defending the point being made by a United fan. Have fun.
And you have the nerve to accuse us of taking things sensitively?
What did I say that was so upsetting for you? What did JMTD say that was so heinous? Seriously, you are totally correct, when you say that serious discussion is impossible.
And that's the point. 'If' our defenders hadn't all have been injured at some point, 'if' Di Maria had found some form, 'if' Falcao had been at his best, we'd have been well clear of you, by about February.
Sturridge is never going to be 'fully fit', in my opinion. And Rodgers should have compensated for that, by doing more than signing Rickie Lambert.
Yeah he'll be using losing Suárez and having Sturridge out for much of the season as an excuse for our poor season, but ultimately he should have prepared better. With Suárez gone and Sturridge already being known as injury-prone, he should've bought in an actual striker, and not whatever Balotelli is (who he didn't want anyway). Then in January having failed to get a striker he should've tried again then, but didn't. I don't believe a lack of money or FFP was really getting in the way, and if it was, then some of those millions spent in the summer could have gone on a striker. I reckon Higuain would've made a difference. He's realistic for us, especially since it was the summer after just finishing 2nd, and I don't think he'd be too expensive. £30m-£35m, I think.
I wouldn't be against us trying for him this summer, maybe as our main transfer target. Danny Ings is good, would be a good backup, or to play alongside Sturridge or Higuain, but he's not the answer to our problems. Higuain is a 1-in-2 striker. And with Sturridge out until at least October, and any future injuries he'll no doubt have, we'll need at least two strikers, not just one. Sell Sterling and Balotelli and we could afford it.
I wouldn't be against Benteke, either, but not for the rumoured £30m price tag.
Yeah he'll be using losing Suárez and having Sturridge out for much of the season as an excuse for our poor season, but ultimately he should have prepared better. With Suárez gone and Sturridge already being known as injury-prone, he should've bought in an actual striker, and not whatever Balotelli is (who he didn't want anyway). Then in January having failed to get a striker he should've tried again then, but didn't. I don't believe a lack of money or FFP was really getting in the way, and if it was, then some of those millions spent in the summer could have gone on a striker. I reckon Higuain would've made a difference. He's realistic for us, especially since it was the summer after just finishing 2nd, and I don't think he'd be too expensive. £30m-£35m, I think.
I wouldn't be against us trying for him this summer, maybe as our main transfer target. Danny Ings is good, would be a good backup, or to play alongside Sturridge or Higuain, but he's not the answer to our problems. Higuain is a 1-in-2 striker. And with Sturridge out until at least October, and any future injuries he'll no doubt have, we'll need at least two strikers, not just one. Sell Sterling and Balotelli and we could afford it.
I wouldn't be against Benteke, either, but not for the rumoured £30m price tag.
I kind of agree about Benteke. In my mind, he'd be a beast for you, but he could quite easily be anonymous, so it would be a bit of a punt.
If we're not going for him, you should go all-out for Lacazette. I can only see that working out well.
And you have the nerve to accuse us of taking things sensitively?
What did I say that was so upsetting for you? What did JMTD say that was so heinous? Seriously, you are totally correct, when you say that serious discussion is impossible.
I think it was the words laughable and nonsense.
Instead of conceding any ground, some posters just think they can shout the opposing view down with condescension - that's not debate in anybody's book.
And to try and turn the tables in an attempt to deflect any criticism is a well trodden path here too. You can try bullying others with such tactics but it just saddens me. Same old, same old.
Obviously the season is decided over 38 games, but there are pivotal clashes that have a huge bearing on how things turn out. The game at Anfield was massive. Liverpool went into that on a high, and yet we played some of our best football of the season (and perhaps our best football at Anfield in many years) and dominated the first half. Granted we had a bit of luck when Gerrard lost his rag, but I think his mistake, and Skrtel's later nastiness, were products of how frustrated Liverpool were. It was a fantastic win for us and I think it gave us the confidence to go and beat City as well. Shame we couldn't keep playing at that level for the rest of the season.
I kind of agree about Benteke. In my mind, he'd be a beast for you, but he could quite easily be anonymous, so it would be a bit of a punt.
If we're not going for him, you should go all-out for Lacazette. I can only see that working out well.
Yeah there's the anonymous part, but then Maxi went missing for large parts of the game and he worked out well for us!
There could be injury concerns with Benteke, and the fact that he went missing for most of the season but I think that was a combination of getting back to fitness and simply not liking the manager. It shows that he can a) come back from a long injury and still be dangerous (I don't know if Sturridge will) and he can also get through a rough patch and come out the other side.
£30m? No. I wouldn't be against £20m, though. Or, while I'd like to keep Lambert as a 4th choice striker, if he'd be willing to go we could offer him and, say, £15m. That'd be a great deal, I think. And it'd mean he stops scoring against us.
Regarding Lacazette, I'd love it if that were to happen. In fact it'd tie in with the two strikers thing. Imagine getting him and Higuain in one transfer window. Again, talking about using players as part of a deal, I want Lucas to stay, but if we are looking to get rid of him, he's been linked to Napoli, so we could use that to our advantage. Benitez used to play Lucas all the time and saw something in him that nobody else at the time did so he obviously values him.
Instead of conceding any ground, some posters just think they can shout the opposing view down with condescension - that's not debate in anybody's book.
And to try and turn the tables in an attempt to deflect any criticism is a well trodden path here too. You can try bullying others with such tactics but it just saddens me. Same old, same old.
What on Earth are you talking about?
You claim that Liverpool would 'definitely' have finished above United, if Sturridge had have stayed fit (which was never going to happen). That is total speculation, on your part. If others disagree, that is not people trying to quell the debate. It's a genuine, realistic look at the situation.
Still, you keep finding reasons to slag United fans for being idiots, with absolutely no basis in reality.
Yeah there's the anonymous part, but then Maxi went missing for large parts of the game and he worked out well for us!
There could be injury concerns with Benteke, and the fact that he went missing for most of the season but I think that was a combination of getting back to fitness and simply not liking the manager. It shows that he can a) come back from a long injury and still be dangerous (I don't know if Sturridge will) and he can also get through a rough patch and come out the other side.
£30m? No. I wouldn't be against £20m, though. Or, while I'd like to keep Lambert as a 4th choice striker, if he'd be willing to go we could offer him and, say, £15m. That'd be a great deal, I think. And it'd mean he stops scoring against us.
Regarding Lacazette, I'd love it if that were to happen. In fact it'd tie in with the two strikers thing. Imagine getting him and Higuain in one transfer window. Again, talking about using players as part of a deal, I want Lucas to stay, but if we are looking to get rid of him, he's been linked to Napoli, so we could use that to our advantage. Benitez used to play Lucas all the time and saw something in him that nobody else at the time did so he obviously values him.
No way are you getting Benteke for £20m, or £15m and Lambert. It'll be £25m minimum, I suspect.
Do you really want to shift Lucas, even if it means you getting Higuain?
I agree re Spurs but Liverpool were dealt a massive blow with Sturridge's long spells of absence, especially after Suarez left. Imagine if the same had happened to Rooney - like Balotelli, your new striking option misfired badly and if Rooney had been crocked for long periods, 4th may have been in peril - swap Sturridge's season for Rooney's and there's no doubt United would have finished below Liverpool.
Both teams need strikers, that's for sure.
Total nonsense,
Let me get the violins out, you complain about Sturridge being injured for long periods of the season, indeed so has most our defence been knackered for most of the season.
Yeah there's the anonymous part, but then Maxi went missing for large parts of the game and he worked out well for us!
There could be injury concerns with Benteke, and the fact that he went missing for most of the season but I think that was a combination of getting back to fitness and simply not liking the manager. It shows that he can a) come back from a long injury and still be dangerous (I don't know if Sturridge will) and he can also get through a rough patch and come out the other side.
£30m? No. I wouldn't be against £20m, though. Or, while I'd like to keep Lambert as a 4th choice striker, if he'd be willing to go we could offer him and, say, £15m. That'd be a great deal, I think. And it'd mean he stops scoring against us.
Regarding Lacazette, I'd love it if that were to happen. In fact it'd tie in with the two strikers thing. Imagine getting him and Higuain in one transfer window. Again, talking about using players as part of a deal, I want Lucas to stay, but if we are looking to get rid of him, he's been linked to Napoli, so we could use that to our advantage. Benitez used to play Lucas all the time and saw something in him that nobody else at the time did so he obviously values him.
There's plenty of decent strikers both home and abroad and it'll interesting to see which ones end up where. I'd be surprised if Falcao, RVP, Balotelli, Lambert and Borini are around next season for their respective clubs so it's not just a case of buying a single high cost striker.
Let me get the violins out, you complain about Sturridge being injured for long periods of the season, indeed so has most our defence been knackered for most of the season.
No way are you getting Benteke for £20m, or £15m and Lambert. It'll be £25m minimum, I suspect.
Do you really want to shift Lucas, even if it means you getting Higuain?
Well we've overpaid for players before, getting a bit of a reputation for it so I wouldn't be surprised if we did that. I don't know if I'd agree with it, but then it's not my money so I don't really care. And, actually, if I can forget about the money that isn't mine, I wouldn't be against it since he would be a good addition to the team.
I don't want Lucas to go, he's one of my favourites. But there were rumours of him going in January, then he didn't, and now-and-then there are rumours of him going, and he's always getting linked with Napoli, probably because of the Benitez connection. I don't want him to go but if we are selling him then be smart about it and use him in a deal to get Higuain. That way we save money, could stay under FFP and can use the money being saved on Lacazette.
Who knows? They might be stupid enough to want to take Balotelli on. Could use him in a deal.
You're entitled to disagree but it's hardly laughable - see my post here.
As usual, a reasonable debate in here is futile without unnecessary posturing, so I'll leave it there. There really is no point. You guys take everything as some kind of slight or, dare I say, agenda and it's just kills any discussion. I was simply defending the point being made by a United fan. Have fun.
You say that, but I find what you say happens in your thread, which is why I never ever post in there anymore.
I have learnt my lesson in there, some posters are very touchy.
Let me get the violins out, you complain about Sturridge being injured for long periods of the season, indeed so has most our defence been knackered for most of the season.
What tune do you want me to play?
You're playing the same tune as all the others it seems - why are you all so aggressive and confrontational in here? I get your point - you disagree. It's almost a pack mentality in here sometimes (even against your own).
Munch, Hernandez looks to be moving on when he comes back from his loan spell, do you guys want him, on second thoughts take Nani please with my blessing's on the way back to us after his loan spell.
You're playing the same tune as all the others it seems - why are you all so aggressive and confrontational in here? I get your point - you disagree. It's almost a pack mentality in here sometimes (even against your own).
Who has been 'aggressive and confrontational'?
Using words like 'nonsense', or 'laughable', is just giving an opinion. Why are you so defensive?
You still haven't been able to back up your claim that Liverpool would have 'definitely' finished above United with a fit Sturridge. Care to do so? Or do you accept that it is indeed a nonsensical claim?
Using words like 'nonsense', or 'laughable', is just giving an opinion. Why are you so defensive?
You still haven't been able to back up your claim that Liverpool would have 'definitely' finished above United with a fit Sturridge. Care to do so? Or do you accept that it is indeed a nonsensical claim?
I posted a link to my reasoning - you may not agree but it's hardly nonsensical. It's no different to suggesting de Gea has gained you valuable points this season which many United fans have said themselves. I happen to think Sturridge would have won us at least 8 more points, mostly in some very toothless displays at home. It's not exactly far fetched.
I posted a link to my reasoning - you may not agree but it's hardly nonsensical. It's no different to suggesting de Gea has gained you valuable points this season which many United fans have said themselves. I happen to think Sturridge would have won us at least 8 more points, mostly in some very toothless displays at home. It's not exactly far fetched.
But again, that ignores everything that has gone wrong for us.
What if Van Persie had been fit and firing? To claim that Sturridge being fit would have seen you 'definitely' finish above us is, I think, what people are taking exception to (well, me for sure).
Wouldn't it make more sense for you to be questioning why you were left with nothing, once Sturridge was inevitably injured? Rather than 'what if's', I'd be asking 'why didn't we...?.
Comments
With a fit Sturridge I think we'd have put up more of a fight, and maybe we would have finished in fourth instead of you, but of course it's not guaranteed. A fully fit and on form Sturridge would've turned some of those draws and defeats into wins, I'm confident of that. But obviously United would have reacted to that if they needed to. Turning two defeats into wins wouldn't mean we'd be level right now on points because you'd have to react to any pressure we'd put on you with those wins.
I wouldn't say we'd definitely finish above you with a fully fit Sturridge but I believe there'd be a good possibility of it happening. It'd have been a more interesting contest, at least.
But it's those "ifs" and "buts" that people like so much. Ultimately it doesn't mean much, if anything.
You're entitled to disagree but it's hardly laughable - see my post here.
As usual, a reasonable debate in here is futile without unnecessary posturing, so I'll leave it there. There really is no point. You guys take everything as some kind of slight or, dare I say, agenda and it's just kills any discussion. I was simply defending the point being made by a United fan. Have fun.
And that's the point. 'If' our defenders hadn't all have been injured at some point, 'if' Di Maria had found some form, 'if' Falcao had been at his best, we'd have been well clear of you, by about February.
Sturridge is never going to be 'fully fit', in my opinion. And Rodgers should have compensated for that, by doing more than signing Rickie Lambert.
And you have the nerve to accuse us of taking things sensitively?
What did I say that was so upsetting for you? What did JMTD say that was so heinous? Seriously, you are totally correct, when you say that serious discussion is impossible.
Yeah he'll be using losing Suárez and having Sturridge out for much of the season as an excuse for our poor season, but ultimately he should have prepared better. With Suárez gone and Sturridge already being known as injury-prone, he should've bought in an actual striker, and not whatever Balotelli is (who he didn't want anyway). Then in January having failed to get a striker he should've tried again then, but didn't. I don't believe a lack of money or FFP was really getting in the way, and if it was, then some of those millions spent in the summer could have gone on a striker. I reckon Higuain would've made a difference. He's realistic for us, especially since it was the summer after just finishing 2nd, and I don't think he'd be too expensive. £30m-£35m, I think.
I wouldn't be against us trying for him this summer, maybe as our main transfer target. Danny Ings is good, would be a good backup, or to play alongside Sturridge or Higuain, but he's not the answer to our problems. Higuain is a 1-in-2 striker. And with Sturridge out until at least October, and any future injuries he'll no doubt have, we'll need at least two strikers, not just one. Sell Sterling and Balotelli and we could afford it.
I wouldn't be against Benteke, either, but not for the rumoured £30m price tag.
I kind of agree about Benteke. In my mind, he'd be a beast for you, but he could quite easily be anonymous, so it would be a bit of a punt.
If we're not going for him, you should go all-out for Lacazette. I can only see that working out well.
I think it was the words laughable and nonsense.
Instead of conceding any ground, some posters just think they can shout the opposing view down with condescension - that's not debate in anybody's book.
And to try and turn the tables in an attempt to deflect any criticism is a well trodden path here too. You can try bullying others with such tactics but it just saddens me. Same old, same old.
Yeah there's the anonymous part, but then Maxi went missing for large parts of the game and he worked out well for us!
There could be injury concerns with Benteke, and the fact that he went missing for most of the season but I think that was a combination of getting back to fitness and simply not liking the manager. It shows that he can a) come back from a long injury and still be dangerous (I don't know if Sturridge will) and he can also get through a rough patch and come out the other side.
£30m? No. I wouldn't be against £20m, though. Or, while I'd like to keep Lambert as a 4th choice striker, if he'd be willing to go we could offer him and, say, £15m. That'd be a great deal, I think. And it'd mean he stops scoring against us.
Regarding Lacazette, I'd love it if that were to happen. In fact it'd tie in with the two strikers thing. Imagine getting him and Higuain in one transfer window. Again, talking about using players as part of a deal, I want Lucas to stay, but if we are looking to get rid of him, he's been linked to Napoli, so we could use that to our advantage. Benitez used to play Lucas all the time and saw something in him that nobody else at the time did so he obviously values him.
What on Earth are you talking about?
You claim that Liverpool would 'definitely' have finished above United, if Sturridge had have stayed fit (which was never going to happen). That is total speculation, on your part. If others disagree, that is not people trying to quell the debate. It's a genuine, realistic look at the situation.
Still, you keep finding reasons to slag United fans for being idiots, with absolutely no basis in reality.
No way are you getting Benteke for £20m, or £15m and Lambert. It'll be £25m minimum, I suspect.
Do you really want to shift Lucas, even if it means you getting Higuain?
Total nonsense,
Let me get the violins out, you complain about Sturridge being injured for long periods of the season, indeed so has most our defence been knackered for most of the season.
What tune do you want me to play?
There's plenty of decent strikers both home and abroad and it'll interesting to see which ones end up where. I'd be surprised if Falcao, RVP, Balotelli, Lambert and Borini are around next season for their respective clubs so it's not just a case of buying a single high cost striker.
Play him the Europa League theme?:D
Well we've overpaid for players before, getting a bit of a reputation for it so I wouldn't be surprised if we did that. I don't know if I'd agree with it, but then it's not my money so I don't really care. And, actually, if I can forget about the money that isn't mine, I wouldn't be against it since he would be a good addition to the team.
I don't want Lucas to go, he's one of my favourites. But there were rumours of him going in January, then he didn't, and now-and-then there are rumours of him going, and he's always getting linked with Napoli, probably because of the Benitez connection. I don't want him to go but if we are selling him then be smart about it and use him in a deal to get Higuain. That way we save money, could stay under FFP and can use the money being saved on Lacazette.
Who knows? They might be stupid enough to want to take Balotelli on. Could use him in a deal.
You say that, but I find what you say happens in your thread, which is why I never ever post in there anymore.
I have learnt my lesson in there, some posters are very touchy.
You're playing the same tune as all the others it seems - why are you all so aggressive and confrontational in here? I get your point - you disagree. It's almost a pack mentality in here sometimes (even against your own).
Please ;-)
Who has been 'aggressive and confrontational'?
Using words like 'nonsense', or 'laughable', is just giving an opinion. Why are you so defensive?
You still haven't been able to back up your claim that Liverpool would have 'definitely' finished above United with a fit Sturridge. Care to do so? Or do you accept that it is indeed a nonsensical claim?
I posted a link to my reasoning - you may not agree but it's hardly nonsensical. It's no different to suggesting de Gea has gained you valuable points this season which many United fans have said themselves. I happen to think Sturridge would have won us at least 8 more points, mostly in some very toothless displays at home. It's not exactly far fetched.
You keep your mitts of Hernandez Munch,
But again, that ignores everything that has gone wrong for us.
What if Van Persie had been fit and firing? To claim that Sturridge being fit would have seen you 'definitely' finish above us is, I think, what people are taking exception to (well, me for sure).
Wouldn't it make more sense for you to be questioning why you were left with nothing, once Sturridge was inevitably injured? Rather than 'what if's', I'd be asking 'why didn't we...?.
I'll only agree to that if it's the Chelsea bus, and it gets driven off a bridge before it gets back to London.
Fair play, that's a belter.
I await the "joining the pack mentality, impossible to debate properly" response.