The recession hits the middle classes

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  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 1,043
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    My two pence :)

    While some of what the woman was saying was a bit silly, the reasoning behind it is clear. It is the middle classes who are the hardest hit in times like these. And it IS infuriating when you see those on benefits who don't know the meaning of the word 'work' being able to afford to give their kids everything.

    But because the ones in society (not just middle classes either) that work and pay all their taxes, rent/mortgage, council tax, water rates, childcare etc and don't get handouts for everything going (I know people that got given crisis loans/grants for Xmas presents etc), it means they are struggling to keep on top of everything. And there is a pressure to make sure your children don't go without. It doesn't necessarily mean they are spoiled but it is heartbreaking to know that little Johnny whose parents don't work (and really I mean Won't, rather than don't) got more for Xmas than your own child simply because you work.

    I know people think this woman is being a whinger etc (to some extent she may be) but I think I know what she is trying to say, my family has a nice home, albeit not a huge or expensive one, but every month it is a struggle to pay childcare and all our other bills and we do worry about losing our jobs in the cuts, especially as I am in the public sector (youth worker) - I can bet you bottom dollar that if that happened we would get no where near the handouts that others seem to.

    Saying that - I've never spent £50 on ribbon!! :eek:
  • SentenzaSentenza Posts: 12,114
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    It truly is poverty when you can't afford fiddy quid for some ribbons for your presents.I think she should launch a appeal on t.v.
  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 5,432
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    Yup - barely able to read it for my eyes welling up :D
  • RussellIanRussellIan Posts: 12,034
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    One thing about the DM, they do treat scroungers and the middle classes with the same taciturn contempt when it comes to 'oh woe is me I can't afford to buy the kids presents' type stories of folk who are dim with money.
  • BizBiz Posts: 14,756
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    horns wrote: »
    That's a little bit OTT. I know loads of TV producers, and they don't live in some rarefied social circle that only the wealthy may enter - they're just normal people. She's not going to become some sort of social outcast all of a sudden.

    I suspect if she isn't doing the same work she could lose contact with the TV colleagues.

    She is married. and there would be other family income. She did say that was five years ago. She says she has some friends in the same position as she is. If they socialize with her husband's business acquaintances, they probably can't afford the lifestyle now.

    It will be difficult for her children, their circle of friends from school is likely to disappear.
  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 17,470
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    Biz wrote: »
    I suspect if she isn't doing the same work she could lose contact with the TV colleagues.

    I very much doubt it. In my experience these people spend pretty much all day on Facebook when they're in my edit suite.
  • BizBiz Posts: 14,756
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    horns wrote: »
    I very much doubt it. In my experience these people spend pretty much all day on Facebook when they're in my edit suite.

    All is not lost then.:D
  • Squealer_MahonySquealer_Mahony Posts: 6,483
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    NatalieP wrote: »
    And there is a pressure to make sure your children don't go without. It doesn't necessarily mean they are spoiled but it is heartbreaking to know that little Johnny whose parents don't work (and really I mean Won't, rather than don't) got more for Xmas than your own child simply because you work.



    If you focus on what other people get and don't get you'll drive yourself mad I think.
  • Blondie XBlondie X Posts: 28,662
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    Biz wrote: »
    I suspect if she isn't doing the same work she could lose contact with the TV colleagues.

    She is married. and there would be other family income. She did say that was five years ago. She says she has some friends in the same position as she is. If they socialize with her husband's business acquaintances, they probably can't afford the lifestyle now.

    It will be difficult for her children, their circle of friends from school is likely to disappear.

    But she never could afford the lifestyle even back then. she lived on the never never and it's caught up with her. Why should we feel sympathy for people on middle income salaries who spent like they were millionaires?

    I was in the same income bracket as her and I know that I couldn't realistically afford that lifestyle so didn't try and pretend to be something i wasn't.

    She has no one to blame but herself for trying to keep up with the Jones'. maybe if she'd have lived within her means in the first place, it wouldn't be such an issue now
  • Squealer_MahonySquealer_Mahony Posts: 6,483
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    Blondie X wrote: »

    She has no one to blame but herself for trying to keep up with the Jones'. maybe if she'd have lived within her means in the first place, it wouldn't be such an issue now

    Totally agree with this.

    I mean I don't think people should live in fear of whats around the corner but it's important to be prepared for a rainy day, educate your children to be compassionate and to know you can't always have what you want all the time.
  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 18,071
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    That woman isn't middle class.. Buying pretentious, overpriced junk is soo aspiring .. :D

    Most of my rich relatives, wouldn't miss a chance to play poor and pretend they are old tough nuts.

    I even have an aunt with x houses that eats out of date stuff cause she is so mean.

    My father lives in some desert hut on Fuerteventura, pretending to love the pauper locals, while counting his millions of pees in German banks.

    At least my granddad knew how to live in style. :D Big fat house and Mercedes and flats etc. :cool:

    Sadly this wealth hasn't trickled down besides a minimal share in a business. :(
  • Squealer_MahonySquealer_Mahony Posts: 6,483
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    I have relatives like that,

    (in fairness they are self made "rich")

    Their house is lovely but they never turn the heating on, have the same tiny old television they've had for years,
    Drive their cars til the wheels fall off and when their kids were little they had to clean three rooms of the house every weekend for their 50p pocket money.
  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 1,043
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    If you focus on what other people get and don't get you'll drive yourself mad I think.

    See what you're saying, I wouldn't focus on it but it does come up in every day life which can then be disheartening.

    We have a lovely little girl who is not spoiled at all, she does know the value of money and understands why her daddy and I have to work instead of spending all day at home with her (although she does get upset about it at times), she understands and does not moan when we tell her she can't have loads for Xmas and her birthday but the injustice of how the benefits system works and those who are living it up on it is sometimes quite anger inducing!

    I count my blessings and know I am am far better off than some people, but it doesn't mean I am not struggling.
  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 18,071
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    I have relatives like that,

    (in fairness they are self made "rich")

    Their house is lovely but they never turn the heating on, have the same tiny old television they've had for years,
    Drive their cars til the wheels fall off and when their kids were little they had to clean three rooms of the house every weekend for their 50p pocket money.

    Yeah ... school of hard knocks. :mad: Tell me about it. And all bottles are brought back and every time you lift money you need to do a cost benefit balance sheet.

    My father doesn't celebrate anything involving gifts and his now wife is so great as she always orders the cheapest thing on the menu. :confused: Since he certainly likes to stuff his face, not in the slightest hypocritical. :sleep:

    Unlike my mother who dared to spend money that wasn't yet in the bank .. A crime against humanity ... :eek:
  • Squealer_MahonySquealer_Mahony Posts: 6,483
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    NatalieP wrote: »
    See what you're saying, I wouldn't focus on it but it does come up in every day life which can then be disheartening.

    We have a lovely little girl who is not spoiled at all, she does know the value of money and understands why her daddy and I have to work instead of spending all day at home with her (although she does get upset about it at times), she understands and does not moan when we tell her she can't have loads for Xmas and her birthday but the injustice of how the benefits system works and those who are living it up on it is sometimes quite anger inducing!

    I count my blessings and know I am am far better off than some people, but it doesn't mean I am not struggling.
    I understand,
    my little one is 2 and thankfully is blissfully unaware of what other people get and don't.

    What saddens me most is there are children who will get nothing this year.

    My husband tells a horrible story from when he was little he got a toy helicopter for Christmas and when he took it out of the box it was broken.
    They had to wait a week for the shop to open to bring it back and he never saw it again :cry:

    I hate Christmas sometimes
  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 9,168
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    Biz wrote: »
    Not so long ago, the received wisdom was that property was a safe investment because it was expected to continue to grow in value. Don't forget that she took the risk in order to provide homes for people who couldn't afford to buy, and that income would pay off the debt. I can think of worse things. Not so long ago it seemed to be expected that businesses ran on an overdraft.

    Think of the hordes who have run up comparatively immense debts buying clothes, cars, etc. They were positively encouraged to do that, and didn't have the wit, or education to understand that everything was costing far more than they could afford.

    It was because of people like her that people couldn't afford to buy, and now she's been bailed out with low interest rates. Savers are being punished for people like her. Credit card debts are just a drop in the ocean compared.
  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 1,043
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    I understand,
    my little one is 2 and thankfully is blissfully unaware of what other people get and don't.

    What saddens me most is there are children who will get nothing this year.

    My husband tells a horrible story from when he was little he got a toy helicopter for Christmas and when he took it out of the box it was broken.
    They had to wait a week for the shop to open to bring it back and he never saw it again :cry:

    I hate Christmas sometimes

    Oh that's horrible. I definitely agree with you that there are people worse off, and I never forget that. And to be fair my daughter doesn't compare what she gets to what others get, it's more what I know is going on that annoys me rather than it coming from her!

    But as you said, I shouldn't focus on that :)
  • Squealer_MahonySquealer_Mahony Posts: 6,483
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    NatalieP wrote: »
    Oh that's horrible. I definitely agree with you that there are people worse off, and I never forget that. And to be fair my daughter doesn't compare what she gets to what others get, it's more what I know is going on that annoys me rather than it coming from her!

    But as you said, I shouldn't focus on that :)

    Your daughter sounds like a lovely little girl :)
  • Bom Diddly WoBom Diddly Wo Posts: 14,094
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    lesleyanne wrote: »
    This is all over Twitter, but I couldn't see any mention here. This really does show how we're all in it together, my heart aches for this poor woman! :rolleyes:

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/article-1335550/Merry-Christmas-Along-millions-middle-class-families-I-afford-says-CHARLOTTE-METCALF.html

    I had to stop reading when she said she was lucky to earn £500 in a week now. I assume as well that her partner works and earns.

    What a greedy old gas bag she is.
  • indianwellsindianwells Posts: 12,702
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    Biz wrote: »
    Not so long ago, the received wisdom was that property was a safe investment because it was expected to continue to grow in value. Don't forget that she took the risk in order to provide homes for people who couldn't afford to buy, and that income would pay off the debt. I can think of worse things. Not so long ago it seemed to be expected that businesses ran on an overdraft.

    Think of the hordes who have run up comparatively immense debts buying clothes, cars, etc. They were positively encouraged to do that, and didn't have the wit, or education to understand that everything was costing far more than they could afford.

    Please tell me you don't really believe that?
  • BizBiz Posts: 14,756
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    _drak wrote: »
    It was because of people like her that people couldn't afford to buy, and now she's been bailed out with low interest rates. Savers are being punished for people like her. Credit card debts are just a drop in the ocean compared.

    Are you sure of your facts?
    Please tell me you don't really believe that?

    No! My memory was playing tricks on me. Sorry. I've looked back at the article. However in general, people who buy to rent are investing to provide themselves with an income, either now or in the future - perhaps as a pension when the mortgages are paid off, They are responsible for upkeep of the properties and are taking a huge risk, not only with their money, but with the tenants who might turn out to be bad payers or destructive. What's more they could have difficulties in getting them out.
    .
    The people who rent get a home to live in and don't have any responsibilities, what's more they can up sticks and move without the problem of selling. They do take the risk that the landlord will go bust.
  • Achtung!Achtung! Posts: 3,398
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    I had to stop reading when she said she was lucky to earn £500 in a week now. I assume as well that her partner works and earns.

    What a greedy old gas bag she is.

    You're greedy now if you want to earn more than £500 a week?
  • Pisces CloudPisces Cloud Posts: 30,239
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    NatalieP wrote: »
    See what you're saying, I wouldn't focus on it but it does come up in every day life which can then be disheartening.

    We have a lovely little girl who is not spoiled at all, she does know the value of money and understands why her daddy and I have to work instead of spending all day at home with her (although she does get upset about it at times), she understands and does not moan when we tell her she can't have loads for Xmas and her birthday but the injustice of how the benefits system works and those who are living it up on it is sometimes quite anger inducing!

    I count my blessings and know I am am far better off than some people, but it doesn't mean I am not struggling.

    I really wouldn't believe all that you read in the papers though. I very much doubt that most benefit claimants can afford to live the same lifestyle as middle class people. Yes, there's a minority out there who have lots of children, but they are the minority and the new benefit caps should take care of that.
  • scorpio manscorpio man Posts: 4,960
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    She needs to start a new career to bring in extra money.

    Selling the 'Big Issue' outside of Harrods would be a start.
    :D
  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 1,043
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    I really wouldn't believe all that you read in the papers though. I very much doubt that most benefit claimants can afford to live the same lifestyle as middle class people. Yes, there's a minority out there who have lots of children, but they are the minority and the new benefit caps should take care of that.

    Oh no, I don't believe it because of what is in the papers, I believe it through personal experience and people around me. My sister-in law's mother is a former drug addict and an alcoholic yet she gets hundreds of pounds a month for 'incapacity' and 'disability' because she has/had addictions - therefore she walks to the shops every day to spend said money on booze! I'm all for helping people with these horrible addictions but giving them endless cash to feed it with?! This is just one example out of many I have.

    I am hoping the new benefits cap will take care of it....and as for the middle class lifestyle, as I said - we don't have one! We pay all our bills and taxes, we never go out because we can't afford to and new clothes we only buy if absolutely necessary. We had our first holiday (nothing extravagant) in 5 years and that was very difficult to pay for. We make sure our daughter never goes without, but we sure do. And then you see these people with the latest clothes, gadgets etc....it is annoying!!
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