The Xbox-One: What we know so far

1235»

Comments

  • jabbamk1jabbamk1 Posts: 8,942
    Forum Member
    No-one on this earth except from MS knows what is possible right now, developers are already making use of it in interesting ways (driving AI). I'm not admitting anything until the box is out and we can see for ourselves. You need to keep an open mind, this isn't all bullshit as you're trying to imply it's real technology that can be used to enhance gaming.

    Of course i know it's a real technology. Of course there are advantages. But the "cloud power" is nothing amazing at the moment. Take the example of Forza which you clearly missed in my last post. There is no cloud power in use there, it's cloud storage. You drive, upload your profile (AI file), someone else downloads it, they drive against your AI file.

    Simple. Any game can do that. And like i've said before it's something similar to what Quake 2 did back in 1997.

    Distributed computing is great but the latency and bandwidth issues make it a nightmare to offload anything other than AI.

    Regarding Titanfall, the game is an MMO. MMO's have been on PC for over a decade and on consoles for years. Titanfall is not using cloud power any differently than any other MMO. The only thing it's doing is offloading AI to the cloud. The AI is just going to be bots run on a dedicated server. Probably learn as time goes on. But again, it's an MMO. That's what it does. It's not some new cloud technology that only Microsoft has. (Do you not read my posts where i already covered this point?)

    It's BS when it's implemented in single player games like say the example i gave for Fifa, or in Forza where you're just downloading a profile locally.

    You don't know how it works so don't comment on it and hype up something that is just an excuse for always online DRM.

    And of course i keep an open mind. Have you seen the Forza 5 off screen demo? It looks flipping amazing for a racing game and i'd love to get my hands on it.
  • wildphantom!wildphantom! Posts: 561
    Forum Member
    ✭✭
    Eurogamer did a brilliant article on the cloud in gaming and is very in-depth about limitations and how it is actually used. Well worth a read.

    http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/digitalfoundry-in-theory-can-xbox-one-cloud-transform-gaming
  • 2dshmuplover2dshmuplover Posts: 8,271
    Forum Member
    jabbamk1 wrote: »
    Of course i know it's a real technology. Of course there are advantages. But the "cloud power" is nothing amazing at the moment. Take the example of Forza which you clearly missed in my last post. There is no cloud power in use there, it's cloud storage. You drive, upload your profile (AI file), someone else downloads it, they drive against your AI file.

    Simple. Any game can do that. And like i've said before it's something similar to what Quake 2 did back in 1997.

    Distributed computing is great but the latency and bandwidth issues make it a nightmare to offload anything other than AI.

    Regarding Titanfall, the game is an MMO. MMO's have been on PC for over a decade and on consoles for years. Titanfall is not using cloud power any differently than any other MMO. The only thing it's doing is offloading AI to the cloud. The AI is just going to be bots run on a dedicated server. Probably learn as time goes on. But again, it's an MMO. That's what it does. It's not some new cloud technology that only Microsoft has. (Do you not read my posts where i already covered this point?)

    It's BS when it's implemented in single player games like say the example i gave for Fifa, or in Forza where you're just downloading a profile locally.

    You don't know how it works so don't comment on it and hype up something that is just an excuse for always online DRM.

    And of course i keep an open mind. Have you seen the Forza 5 off screen demo? It looks flipping amazing for a racing game and i'd love to get my hands on it.

    You're telling me I don't know how it works while you are spouting off completely inaccurate information and quotes. There's more to Forza 5 computational AI than what you are suggesting, it is using cloud rendering (Azure) that much is known, its' NOT a simple upload/download service. I am not pretending to be an expert (unlike some here), I've already confessed I'm not. The fact of the matter is that the ball is in MS's court and no-one can call their bluff until the machine is out and we can see if what they are promising comes true. There IS true potential in cloud rendering and it's not all rubbish.

    I'm NOT even hyping it up! the only time I ever mention it is when you keep saying it's no different to what the "N64 had" or that it's simply "dedicated servers". I already said in a thread today that I believe that always online is strictly for the draconian DRM policies and not an excuse for the cloud so don't put words in my mouth.
  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 64
    Forum Member
    jabbamk1 wrote: »
    Sony have already said the PS4 will use cloud technology as well, but the thing is, that is no reason to require an always online connection. The reason Microsoft are shouting about it is because they want you to believe it's justification for always online when it's not.

    But it's not a justification for always online.



    I dont think you have read the facts. Xbox One DOES NOT require an always online connection. It needs to be online at least once every 24 hours for verification. This is very different to requiring an ALWAYS ONLINE connection. If you telling me thats the same thing the i think you need to do some research and then come back
  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 64
    Forum Member
    The main one thing i want to know is a full release date. What we know is it will be Novemeber but what date? I cant find anything. Nov 5th makes sense as same days as CoD:Ghosts
  • wildphantom!wildphantom! Posts: 561
    Forum Member
    ✭✭
    nstokes wrote: »
    I dont think you have read the facts. Xbox One DOES NOT require an always online connection. It needs to be online at least once every 24 hours for verification. This is very different to requiring an ALWAYS ONLINE connection. If you telling me thats the same thing the i think you need to do some research and then come back

    Not a 100% true. To use 'the power of the cloud' the games need to be online, so for dynamic AI in Forza/TitanFall (TF is an MMO) it requires a online connection. Microsoft are blurring the lines between always online and the cloud.

    So if your console is offline the game will be less 'enhanced' for lack of a better word.
  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 3,743
    Forum Member
    ✭✭✭
    There's more to Forza 5 computational AI than what you are suggesting, it is using cloud rendering (Azure) that much is known, its' NOT a simple upload/download service.
    Where have they said this, I've only seen them talk about the Drivatar thing.
    nstokes wrote: »
    I dont think you have read the facts. Xbox One DOES NOT require an always online connection. It needs to be online at least once every 24 hours for verification. This is very different to requiring an ALWAYS ONLINE connection. If you telling me thats the same thing the i think you need to do some research and then come back
    With all these games using the infinite power of cloud it is looking like the Xbox One will end up being an always online console by proxy, because if they utilise the cloud to the point where it is freeing up sufficient resource to improve the game in terms of using the resource freed up by cloud compute to enhance the look of the game then if your internet dies, the game won't work because it is missing all the cloud data.

    So many games at E3 seemed to be these single-multi-player hybrids where you play single player but actually it's multiplayer - I'm calling it mulgleplayer.

    It will be interesting to see how those kind of games pan out in terms of will they work offline etc, as that is something that affects both systems.
  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 64
    Forum Member
    Not a 100% true. To use 'the power of the cloud' the games need to be online, so for dynamic AI in Forza/TitanFall (TF is an MMO) it requires a online connection. Microsoft are blurring the lines between always online and the cloud.

    So if your console is offline the game will be less 'enhanced' for lack of a better word.

    Ill agree with that but the way that dude was making out it was trying to say that Xbox One needs to be online all time. Of course it needs to be online for the cloud stuff but thats not how he was trying to come across. Also if your drivatar on Forza is already in the cloud and my friend wants to beat my times and race against me but im at work then he can as its already in cloud for him even if my console is offline
  • jabbamk1jabbamk1 Posts: 8,942
    Forum Member
    You're telling me I don't know how it works while you are spouting off completely inaccurate information and quotes. There's more to Forza 5 computational AI than what you are suggesting, it is using cloud rendering (Azure) that much is known, its' NOT a simple upload/download service..

    Please explain how cloud rendering works ;)

    @nstokes- The Xbox One is an online console. You can't play any games unless you have an internet connection to register the game and play the game.

    And i don't think you understand how Forza works. It uploads your AI profile to the cloud after each race and then your friends xbox automatically downloads it whenever it has an internet connection.
  • whoever,heywhoever,hey Posts: 30,992
    Forum Member
    ✭✭✭
    jabbamk1 wrote: »
    And you know what. Forza's "cloud powered AI" isn't even that great. It works similar to dropbox. You drive, save your profile, upload your profile to the cloud, others download and race against you virtually using your AI file. That's cloud storage, not cloud powered AI. It's a gimmick being used as justification for the DRM.

    Is that all it is? :confused:

    We used to call them ghost cars back in the day.
  • whoever,heywhoever,hey Posts: 30,992
    Forum Member
    ✭✭✭
    You are wrong, firstly no-one is saying dedicated servers is cloud gaming, also Azure is a completely separate service to XBL which developers have access to for cloud rendering.



    Please read this article which outlines the technology and how in theory it could offer the above PROVIDING there was enough bandwidth available (hello dedicated servers) and latency could be reduced to within playable limits.

    An example of what it could achieve:



    In 5 years who knows if this will be a reality, MS obvious seem to think so. To call it all a lie and myth is completely wrong.

    And all that could be done on a spare core. Have you not been reading my posts or something? Hardly any modern games consume all cpu processing time especially with all the cores next gen consoles and PCs have. Please have some common sense and listen to what we are saying instead of just being spoon fed by marketing people. Like i said earlier, i am a game dev so have first hand experience of all this including network programming. More than you i bet.
  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 3,743
    Forum Member
    ✭✭✭
    Is that all it is? :confused:

    We used to call them ghost cars back in the day.
    Well no it is like a 'profile' of how you drive.

    So if you're someone who blazes into a corner and brakes late or someone you brakes first, then floors it and how you pass people etc.

    You can then race against your friends without them being online or playing the game, 'exactly' how they would normally be racing.

    I think I'd rather have computer opponents to be honest I don't want a line up full of people ramming in the first corner :D
  • whoever,heywhoever,hey Posts: 30,992
    Forum Member
    ✭✭✭
    chopoff wrote: »
    Well no it is like a 'profile' of how you drive.

    So if you're someone who blazes into a corner and brakes late or someone you brakes first, then floors it and how you pass people etc.

    You can then race against your friends without them being online or playing the game, 'exactly' how they would normally be racing.

    I think I'd rather have computer opponents to be honest I don't want a line up full of people ramming in the first corner :D

    Right, that sounds like EA's Real Racing on the mobile platforms. Timeshifted multiplayer they call it.
    http://www.pocketgamer.co.uk/r/iPhone/Real+Racing+3/news.asp?c=48276
  • jabbamk1jabbamk1 Posts: 8,942
    Forum Member
    chopoff wrote: »
    Well no it is like a 'profile' of how you drive.

    So if you're someone who blazes into a corner and brakes late or someone you brakes first, then floors it and how you pass people etc.

    You can then race against your friends without them being online or playing the game, 'exactly' how they would normally be racing.

    I think I'd rather have computer opponents to be honest I don't want a line up full of people ramming in the first corner :D

    Pretty much, although obviously it'll disregard any obvious errors on the users part. Basically it'll learn how you drive and take corners and what type of speed you usually take etc....

    Then it uploads your AI Profile to the cloud for others to download and race against virtually. All processing is still done locally via the console though.

    It's the exact same thing Quake 2 did back in 1997 with it's self learning AI. Obviously this is a bit more advanced.

    EDIT: Yeh, bit like real racing 3 but a bit more advanced because it actually uses your exact profile.
  • Octopus_PrimeOctopus_Prime Posts: 851
    Forum Member
    ✭✭
    haven't read all the thread, sorry, but just incase it wasn't known on Amazon US Games like Dead Rising 3, Ryse and Forza 5 are down for Day one release due to the Special editions.

    http://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_sb_noss?url=search-alias%3Dvideogames&field-keywords=day+one+edition&rh=n%3A468642%2Ck%3Aday+one+edition
  • He4rtHe4rt Posts: 5,379
    Forum Member
    Read today that 'Project Spark' will also be a free game with purchasable DLC.

    ....and something else i read about,which is kinda funny; If you have your Kinect turned on while playing DR3, zombies will detect and respond to sounds in your living room!:D
  • He4rtHe4rt Posts: 5,379
    Forum Member
    I'm going to ask for this to be locked due to recent news, as most of the info here is now wrong.
  • Octopus_PrimeOctopus_Prime Posts: 851
    Forum Member
    ✭✭
    He4rt wrote: »
    I'm going to ask for this to be locked due to recent news, as most of the info here is now wrong.

    lol :D
Sign In or Register to comment.