I've sometimes wondered if a certain MP was also involved with the Belgium scandal. Having supposedly been posted to Brussels after being caught up to no good with a child here.
I totally agree. What does it matter which political party these people represented.
If these allegations turn out to be true, it is horrific news.
Exactly, hapdash. If they're still alive, irrespective of money, connections, background and party affiliation, I want to see these child abuse perpetrators prosecuted and imprisoned and if they're dead then I'd like to see them named as active case prime suspects so that their reputations are trashed.
Exactly, hapdash. If they're still alive, irrespective of money, connections, background and party affiliation, I want to see these child abuse perpetrators prosecuted and imprisoned and if they're dead then I'd like to see them named as active case prime suspects so that their reputations are trashed.
This is really not the thread for point scoring. Lets face it, if it was only one party involved the other parties would be screaming for blood.
Indeed. It was reported about allegations being made against Greville Janner and also reported that no action could be taken because he has dementia. I think if there was a Westminster paedophile ring then it involved politicians from all parties.
The moral outrage by some tory posters on here over the reporting of this in the press and how they shouldnt be running with this -the same posters whos sense of priority is that How Ed Milliband eats a bacon sandwich is a story of national importance and worthy of front/top headline prominence.
A lot of faith being expressed in the polices intergrity by tory posters on here.Plebgate soon forgotten I see.
The moral outrage by some tory posters on here over the reporting of this in the press and how they shouldnt be running with this -the same posters whos sense of priority is that How Ed Milliband eats a bacon sandwich is a story of national importance and worthy of front/top headline prominence.
A lot of faith being expressed in the polices intergrity by tory posters on here.Plebgate soon forgotten I see.
They're either paid up Tory staff (unlikely tbh, they don't seem sophisticated enough) or brainwashed morons who treat Politics like football and will defend their team to the end. Pathetic existance really.
The moral outrage by some tory posters on here over the reporting of this in the press and how they shouldnt be running with this -the same posters whos sense of priority is that How Ed Milliband eats a bacon sandwich is a story of national importance and worthy of front/top headline prominence.
A lot of faith being expressed in the polices intergrity by tory posters on here.Plebgate soon forgotten I see.
Just like that TUC character above, you seem to be trying to turn this into a party political bunfight. The abuse and rape (and possible murder) of children is far more important than cheap and crude party political point scoring.
I don't care what somebody's party loyalty is; if they've abused children then they should be punished for it.
Well said. Any aggression should firmly be placed at the news outlets who are trying to bury this story.
Their arrogance and hypocrisy is astounding; the news outlets I mean. They preach 24/7 and hold up the West as a bastion of freedom, meanwhile we have this crap going down. And I don't doubt that it's happening in the establishment today as well!! Call me a conspiracy theorist...I'll probably be proved right in 30 years.
I am more optimistic this time because the Savile revelations and the Clifford and Harris prosecutions have blown things wide open and now, in a more open and less deferential society, the police have to be seen to be investigating things properly rather than closing them down and covering them up.
Personally, I'd much prefer to see the emphasis placed on the criminal investigations and prosecutions of these establishment paedophiles rather than on yet more inconclusive public inquiries. That way, the rot really would be exposed, the perpetrators would be punished and it would send a strong message that child abuse will not be tolerated no matter how powerful anyone thinks they are.
Who is pushing for these public inquiries in place of direct criminal investigations? Something stinks.
the public enquiries are not into the criminal acts......they're into different things
Such as how various bodies and institutions processed and acted upon claims of child abuse..........that is the administrative procedures for dealing with claims and how the procedures can be made more responsive
I am more optimistic this time because the Savile revelations and the Clifford and Harris prosecutions have blown things wide open and now, in a more open and less deferential society, the police have to be seen to be investigating things properly rather than closing them down and covering them up.
Personally, I'd much prefer to see the emphasis placed on the criminal investigations and prosecutions of these establishment paedophiles rather than on yet more inconclusive public inquiries. That way, the rot really would be exposed, the perpetrators would be punished and it would send a strong message that child abuse will not be tolerated no matter how powerful anyone thinks they are.
I watched the Jimmy Saville special put out by Louis Theroux in it Jimmy Saville said if ever an enquiry was launched he would take people down with him,when child abuse allegations were put to him.
Clifford and Harris were different they clearly did not have the connections Saville did.
I am afraid in the UK its still all about connections then justice.:(
The editors of Scallywag magazine tried to expose all this back in the 90s, with regards to politicians. A shame that Angus James and Simon Regan aren't around now.
Scallywag is an interesting topic. I can remember Major successfully suing it for carrying an article about an affair he claimed he wasn't or hadn't had. Then it carried accusations about McAlpine who didn't sue it because it became bankrupt. For me I don't think the McAlpine case will be revisited by the police but I'm not so sure it's entirely out of the woods.
Scallywag is an interesting topic. I can remember Major successfully suing it for carrying an article about an affair he claimed he wasn't or hadn't had. Then it carried accusations about McAlpine who didn't sue it because it became bankrupt. For me I don't think the McAlpine case will be revisited by the police but I'm not so sure it's entirely out of the woods.
He's gone now so can't be libelled, but it was interesting that in the Scallywag article it said that he was pointed out by alleged victims by his photograph.
Was there not an allegation by someone in care that a girl taken to see Saville simply never came back to the place she was living?
The way these children were treated as nothing is a national disgrace. People should be taking to the streets in protest.
And how are child in care being treated now? How can we be sure that we won't be seeing horrific stories of abuse taking place during this period in 30 years?
Just like that TUC character above, you seem to be trying to turn this into a party political bunfight. The abuse and rape (and possible murder) of children is far more important than cheap and crude party political point scoring.
I don't care what somebody's party loyalty is; if they've abused children then they should be punished for it.
I agree but I reject your attempt at trying to take the moral high ground with me.
There were a number of posters treating this as a political issue that could damage their parties electoral chances and thus they were seeking in a very transparent way to downplaythe seriousness of the issue and allegations in a way that they wouldnt seek to do if it wasnt their party.Sorry but thats how I feel.Yet their reaction was unnneccesary as anyone who knows some of the background details to these allegations will know it involves a number of political parties including fringe parties and non politicians.Its an issue about the establishment not one political party.
And how are child in care being treated now? How can we be sure that we won't be seeing horrific stories of abuse taking place during this period in 30 years?
We will be seeing the same stories, and it will go on and on, if nothing is done.
We need real investigations into past and present allegations. We need new blood in places people who wont cover up..
Its not going to happen though. I can see it being brushed away like all the others.
We will be seeing the same stories, and it will go on and on, if nothing is done.
We need real investigations into past and present allegations. We need new blood in places people who wont cover up..
Its not going to happen though. I can see it being brushed away like all the others.
I suspect you're right. Clegg and the libdems got confronted during a photo op. Their response was to run away without comment. While the BBC attempted to downplay it. One hand washes the other. If we ever get an investigation it'll be set up and run by a friend of the establishment and find nothing amiss. Just look at how the Chilcot inquiry is going. Obstruction by the cabinet secretary who also happens to be one of the people who might have been at fault.
Papers will ignore it and carry on about Milliband being in danger from totally unnamed Labour MPs.
Indeed our wonderful unbiased media while perfectly happy to create an entire mountain range out of a 'bump' in the lawn when it comes to totally unfounded and unsubstantiated rumours of a Labour 'rebellion' which, incidentally and as I predicted last week, has evaporated back into the thin air it was manufactured from.
While here we have a named individual making allegations against an 'unknown' MP,
and I personally think that his political party should have nothing to do with it, nor should he be named until after it has been investigated,
and yet there is almost total silence from the same media who were prepared to make such a big deal about unfounded and unsubstantiated rumours against the Labour leader, many of them finding it difficult to hide their glee just a few days ago.
Comments
This is really not the thread for point scoring. Lets face it, if it was only one party involved the other parties would be screaming for blood.
I've sometimes wondered if a certain MP was also involved with the Belgium scandal. Having supposedly been posted to Brussels after being caught up to no good with a child here.
Exactly, hapdash. If they're still alive, irrespective of money, connections, background and party affiliation, I want to see these child abuse perpetrators prosecuted and imprisoned and if they're dead then I'd like to see them named as active case prime suspects so that their reputations are trashed.
Looks to me like Britain is about to experience another fit of Satanic Panic.
There lies the problem sadly.:(
Indeed. It was reported about allegations being made against Greville Janner and also reported that no action could be taken because he has dementia. I think if there was a Westminster paedophile ring then it involved politicians from all parties.
A lot of faith being expressed in the polices intergrity by tory posters on here.Plebgate soon forgotten I see.
They're either paid up Tory staff (unlikely tbh, they don't seem sophisticated enough) or brainwashed morons who treat Politics like football and will defend their team to the end. Pathetic existance really.
Just like that TUC character above, you seem to be trying to turn this into a party political bunfight. The abuse and rape (and possible murder) of children is far more important than cheap and crude party political point scoring.
I don't care what somebody's party loyalty is; if they've abused children then they should be punished for it.
Their arrogance and hypocrisy is astounding; the news outlets I mean. They preach 24/7 and hold up the West as a bastion of freedom, meanwhile we have this crap going down. And I don't doubt that it's happening in the establishment today as well!! Call me a conspiracy theorist...I'll probably be proved right in 30 years.
I am more optimistic this time because the Savile revelations and the Clifford and Harris prosecutions have blown things wide open and now, in a more open and less deferential society, the police have to be seen to be investigating things properly rather than closing them down and covering them up.
Personally, I'd much prefer to see the emphasis placed on the criminal investigations and prosecutions of these establishment paedophiles rather than on yet more inconclusive public inquiries. That way, the rot really would be exposed, the perpetrators would be punished and it would send a strong message that child abuse will not be tolerated no matter how powerful anyone thinks they are.
the public enquiries are not into the criminal acts......they're into different things
Such as how various bodies and institutions processed and acted upon claims of child abuse..........that is the administrative procedures for dealing with claims and how the procedures can be made more responsive
I watched the Jimmy Saville special put out by Louis Theroux in it Jimmy Saville said if ever an enquiry was launched he would take people down with him,when child abuse allegations were put to him.
Clifford and Harris were different they clearly did not have the connections Saville did.
I am afraid in the UK its still all about connections then justice.:(
Scallywag is an interesting topic. I can remember Major successfully suing it for carrying an article about an affair he claimed he wasn't or hadn't had. Then it carried accusations about McAlpine who didn't sue it because it became bankrupt. For me I don't think the McAlpine case will be revisited by the police but I'm not so sure it's entirely out of the woods.
That's exactly the point I was making
He's gone now so can't be libelled, but it was interesting that in the Scallywag article it said that he was pointed out by alleged victims by his photograph.
I am Sorry. I must have misread your post.
And how are child in care being treated now? How can we be sure that we won't be seeing horrific stories of abuse taking place during this period in 30 years?
I agree but I reject your attempt at trying to take the moral high ground with me.
There were a number of posters treating this as a political issue that could damage their parties electoral chances and thus they were seeking in a very transparent way to downplaythe seriousness of the issue and allegations in a way that they wouldnt seek to do if it wasnt their party.Sorry but thats how I feel.Yet their reaction was unnneccesary as anyone who knows some of the background details to these allegations will know it involves a number of political parties including fringe parties and non politicians.Its an issue about the establishment not one political party.
We will be seeing the same stories, and it will go on and on, if nothing is done.
We need real investigations into past and present allegations. We need new blood in places people who wont cover up..
Its not going to happen though. I can see it being brushed away like all the others.
If you think that child abuse is trivial and isn't a serious matter then all that does is reflect badly upon your character and judgement.
I suspect you're right. Clegg and the libdems got confronted during a photo op. Their response was to run away without comment. While the BBC attempted to downplay it. One hand washes the other. If we ever get an investigation it'll be set up and run by a friend of the establishment and find nothing amiss. Just look at how the Chilcot inquiry is going. Obstruction by the cabinet secretary who also happens to be one of the people who might have been at fault.
Libdems &bbc
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rJC-vvx7ItY
Indeed our wonderful unbiased media while perfectly happy to create an entire mountain range out of a 'bump' in the lawn when it comes to totally unfounded and unsubstantiated rumours of a Labour 'rebellion' which, incidentally and as I predicted last week, has evaporated back into the thin air it was manufactured from.
While here we have a named individual making allegations against an 'unknown' MP,
and I personally think that his political party should have nothing to do with it, nor should he be named until after it has been investigated,
and yet there is almost total silence from the same media who were prepared to make such a big deal about unfounded and unsubstantiated rumours against the Labour leader, many of them finding it difficult to hide their glee just a few days ago.