Firstly, is there a reason the majority of your post compares Xiaomi with Apple in particular?
Surely most of those comparisons should be between Xiaomi and all the major smartphone manufacturers.
Or would you have us believe that Apple are the odd one out because they don't sell phones at cost, or don't provide updates on a daily basis?
It seems a a little unreasonable to expect Apple, and Apple in particular, to sell phones at cost. In fact, you missed out the part about how they see themselves using a model more like Amazon, i.e. taking a hit on the hardware costs with the aim of making up for it by selling content and services on top of it.
Or highlight Apple in particular for not providing daily updates. And who even wants or needs updates every day anyway?
Also, I think this mantra about Apple "not providing people what they want" is getting a bit tired. What that really means is this:
"Apple don't provide a minority of people with a small number of particular features that they consider important".
Given how many iPhones they do sell, I think its difficult to argue that they don't provide something that people want.
Such a fanboy.
I'm comparing Apple to Xiaomi because a lot of people call them the Apple of China. I was saying they were not and showing how they are more like Amazon as you say.
I'm comparing Apple to Xiaomi because a lot of people call them the Apple of China. I was saying they were not and showing how they are more like Amazon as you say.
So you ignored all my points, and call me a fanboy.
Who says constructive debate is dead?
I thought they had been compared to Apple because of their hardware design and style of product launches. But the things you compared were mostly things at that would apply to all the main smartphone manufacturers, not just Apple.
When you said:
"they are actually quite the opposite of Apple as they work on creating the best products and selling them at cost price to the benefit of the end user."
You make it sound as though they are purely altruistic. Surely you are not so naive that you believe Amazon sell their products at the prices they do for the benefit of the end user?
Also:
"Apple do not care what the users want, they imagine what the users want."
Whatever you or I might think of the iPhone is irrelevant. Given how popular it is, it is difficult to argue that they are not providing people with something they want.
These are perfectly valid points, so I don't know why you feel the need to shout them down as fanboyism.
Sometimes it seems literally impossible to discuss anything without the discussion immediately being reduced to that?
So you ignored all my points, and call me a fanboy.
Who says constructive debate is dead?
I thought they had been compared to Apple because of their hardware design and style of product launches. But the things you compared were mostly things at that would apply to all the main smartphone manufacturers, not just Apple.
When you said:
"they are actually quite the opposite of Apple as they work on creating the best products and selling them at cost price to the benefit of the end user."
You make it sound as though they are purely altruistic. Surely you are not so naive that you believe Amazon sell their products at the prices they do for the benefit of the end user?
Also:
"Apple do not care what the users want, they imagine what the users want."
Whatever you or I might think of the iPhone is irrelevant. Given how popular it is, it is difficult to argue that they are not providing people with something they want.
These are perfectly valid points, so I don't know why you feel the need to shout it them down as fanboyism.
I was comparing them to Apple because the common thought between people in the west is that Xiaomi is China's Apple. So i was saying that actually they are not.
And the second quote you pulled is saying that Xiaomi take user feedback very seriously and update MiUi every week with what the user wants. Apple take a different approach and do very little research on what the user wants, instead they imagine what users want. This is what Apple have always said and been like.
I really don't understand why you've turned this into an Apple thread. Then again you do this with every thread.
I was trying to explain the differences between Xiaomi and Apple. You need to stop taking everything so literally.
I think it was about Apple to some degree when you chose to make so many comparisons to Apple.
You say MiUi is updated every week "with what the user wants". That's going to work great if there is only one user. But how does it work when you have tens of millions of users all asking for different things?
I think it was about Apple to some degree when you chose to make so many comparisons to Apple.
You say MiUi is updated every week "with what the user wants". That's going to work great if there is only one user. But how does it work when you have tens of millions of users all asking for different things?
No, the thread is about Xiaomi.
The common misconception is that Xiaomi is China's version of Apple.
Xiaomi are not Apple. I was using Apple to make it easier for people to learn about the company and how it works.
OK, fair enough. You did seem to portray them as some sort of socialist company, providing users with things at cost for their benefit though. You also made it sound as though Apple force things on users that they don't want. There was no need to bite my head off though.
So with these weekly updates giving users what they want. How does it work when you have tens of millions of users all asking for different things?
OK, fair enough. You did seem to portray them as some sort of socialist company, providing users with things at cost for their benefit though. There was no need to bite my head off though.
So with these weekly updates giving users what they want. How does it work when you have tens of millions of users all asking for different things?
Well i'm a Mi Fan and have been following Xiaomi since Mi2, so of course this is a bias article about Xiaomi. It's only showing the good stuff. There is plenty of bad stuff as well such as stories of bad customer care.
All feedback is considered though. It's led to MiUi having a number of unique features over stock android, and iOS.
So all feedbaack is considered now? A moment ago they were giving their users what they want.
Doesn't sound that different to Apple then.
Stop taking stuff literally and then using it as a counter argument. You clearly know what i'm trying to say but your narrow mindedness and argumentative attitude is just making you look like an idiot.
No wonder everyone makes fun of you on other threads.
Like i said, Xiaomi take user feedback onboard. The feedback is used to design the UI add in new features.
Now. Lets stop talking about Apple and start talking about Xiaomi. If you want to talk about Apple then remove your fanboy hat and talk properly about how it compares to MiUi.
Stop taking stuff literally and then using it as a counter argument. You clearly know what i'm trying to say but your narrow mindedness and argumentative attitude is just making you look like an idiot.
No wonder everyone makes fun of you on other threads.
Like i said, Xiaomi take user feedback onboard. The feedback is used to design the UI add in new features.
I know what you're trying to say. I'm just not sure it amounts to as much as you think it does.
Simply because once you have tens of millions of users it becomes impossible to give people what they want. It will always involve compromise.
Apple invite feedback. They have beta software inviting bug reports and changes. There just becomes a point where it becomes impractical. If Xiaomi started to sell as many units as the likes of Apple and Samsung, do you honestly think it would be as practical for them to consider all requests and push out many changes on a regular weekly basis?
How about we spin this on its head - what are some if the features that Apple are withholding that large numbers of users want?
And no - everyone doesn't make fun of me. Unless "everyone" is a couple of posters who have an almost pathological dislike of Apple. Often completely twisting what I've said. Case in point the thread about the Maps app. I invite you to take a look and let me know anything I said that you disagree with.
...You also made it sound as though Apple force things on users that they don't want..
They wouldn't ever do that would they?
Even Google do that. Aople simply took it all to a whole new level. Microsoft is now seeing the financial advantage in copying Apple, for consumers that is. I think they have to be more pragmatic when it comes to businesses.
It's very nice in my opinion. Much more customisable than stock android. It's a shame they removed google apps but you can always install it yourself anyway.
I know it is only personal preference when discussing OS skins but you wrong. Miui is horrible. Why do you think Apple copied it for iOS 7? And how is it more customisable than stock? Having all your apps on the home screens severely restricts customisation.
You also made it sound as though Apple force things on users that they don't want.
Ask anyone who bought the iPad 3 if they really wanted the Lightning port.
Ask anyone who uses iOS if they really wanted Apple Maps.
You know full well that Apple do as they please regardless of their consumers. They know they will still make money, so this is a complete non-statement. Apple are notorious for their locked down/control freakish behaviour with their devices.
An Apple device never properly belongs to the consumer who bought it as the consumer can't dictate how they use the device. Apple does that for them, wanted or not.
Ask anyone who bought the iPad 3 if they really wanted the Lightning port.
Ask anyone who uses iOS if they really wanted Apple Maps.
You know full well that Apple do as they please regardless of their consumers. They know they will still make money, so this is a complete non-statement. Apple are notorious for their locked down/control freakish behaviour with their devices.
An Apple device never properly belongs to the consumer who bought it as the consumer can't dictate how they use the device. Apple does that for them, wanted or not.
Xiaomi have confirmed the Tegra 4 version will be shipping on October 15th. This is the TD-CDMA version so will ONLY work on China Mobile. China Unicom and international customers will have to wait a month or so for the Snapdragon 800 version.
It is certainly a phone i'm considering myself but i want to see what Mediatek will be shipping early next year first or see what my work can offer me next year as well. Rumour has it Mediatek will be looking at shipping 4G LTE chips soon. Plus they will have a new quad core and true 8 core processor coming soon.
Ask anyone who bought the iPad 3 if they really wanted the Lightning port.
Ask anyone who uses iOS if they really wanted Apple Maps.
You know full well that Apple do as they please regardless of their consumers. They know they will still make money, so this is a complete non-statement. Apple are notorious for their locked down/control freakish behaviour with their devices.
An Apple device never properly belongs to the consumer who bought it as the consumer can't dictate how they use the device. Apple does that for them, wanted or not.
Put it this way - how is what they do any different to Samsung, Sony, HTC, Nokia....
They all ship products with a set of features that the consumer has no real say over.
Replacing a ten year old connector is hardly an example of "freakish control behaviour".
Xiaomi have confirmed the Tegra 4 version will be shipping on October 15th. This is the TD-CDMA version so will ONLY work on China Mobile. China Unicom and international customers will have to wait a month or so for the Snapdragon 800 version.
It is certainly a phone i'm considering myself but i want to see what Mediatek will be shipping early next year first or see what my work can offer me next year as well. Rumour has it Mediatek will be looking at shipping 4G LTE chips soon. Plus they will have a new quad core and true 8 core processor coming soon.
OK, lets move on from the whole "giving users what they want" thing, and forget the point that that is completely impractical when you have tens of millions of users.
And no - I'm not being literal with it. It becomes impractical long before it needs to become literal.
Also loved the way you start a thread which by your own admission is based on bias. But then you call me a fanboy. Loving the irony!
OK, lets move on from the whole "giving users what they want" thing, and forget the point that that is completely impractical when you have tens of millions of users.
Democracy versus a Dictatorship.
You should have been the PR man for Colonel Gaddafi or even further back in time, telling the millions of Mao peasants to kill the birds.
Put it this way - how is what they do any different to Samsung, Sony, HTC, Nokia....
They all ship products with a set of features that the consumer has no real say over.
Replacing a ten year old connector is hardly an example of "freakish control behaviour".
Don't know who said that, but it wasn't me.
As for "they all ship products with a set of features that the consumer has no real say over". You're wrong.
By simply choosing Android as their platform, those OEMs are giving their customers a choice. Android is not locked down, consumers can change as much or as little as they want, even down to the actual hardware and design of the device in the case of the Moto X.
With Apple, you can't change the browser, the keyboard or set default apps. Apple has made all those decisions and there is nothing the consumer can do about them. The consumer cannot change or modify key features on their own device.
So that's not "they all ship products with a set of features" blah blah. Your attempt to lump other OEMs in with Apple and attempt to suggest that they all do the same thing is not the reality. Android users have the choice, that much is fact.
So that's not "they all ship products with a set of features" blah blah. Your attempt to lump other OEMs in with Apple and attempt to suggest that they all do the same thing is not the reality. Android users have the choice, that much is fact.
Samsung, HTC, Sony, Nokia, Huawei, ZTE, Google and Apple all do the same thing. They decide what you should have and then you buy what suits you.
The only difference is there is no way to change the default apps in iOS but that doesn't stop you from using other apps.
Comments
In total or per phone?
Which would you rather:
a. £10 x 10,000,000?
b. £20 x 1,000,000?
c. £40 x 100,000
Such a fanboy.
I'm comparing Apple to Xiaomi because a lot of people call them the Apple of China. I was saying they were not and showing how they are more like Amazon as you say.
So you ignored all my points, and call me a fanboy.
Who says constructive debate is dead?
I thought they had been compared to Apple because of their hardware design and style of product launches. But the things you compared were mostly things at that would apply to all the main smartphone manufacturers, not just Apple.
When you said:
"they are actually quite the opposite of Apple as they work on creating the best products and selling them at cost price to the benefit of the end user."
You make it sound as though they are purely altruistic. Surely you are not so naive that you believe Amazon sell their products at the prices they do for the benefit of the end user?
Also:
"Apple do not care what the users want, they imagine what the users want."
Whatever you or I might think of the iPhone is irrelevant. Given how popular it is, it is difficult to argue that they are not providing people with something they want.
These are perfectly valid points, so I don't know why you feel the need to shout them down as fanboyism.
Sometimes it seems literally impossible to discuss anything without the discussion immediately being reduced to that?
I was comparing them to Apple because the common thought between people in the west is that Xiaomi is China's Apple. So i was saying that actually they are not.
And the second quote you pulled is saying that Xiaomi take user feedback very seriously and update MiUi every week with what the user wants. Apple take a different approach and do very little research on what the user wants, instead they imagine what users want. This is what Apple have always said and been like.
Try this link
I was trying to explain the differences between Xiaomi and Apple. You need to stop taking everything so literally. Xiaomi and Apple are not the same.
I think it was about Apple to some degree when you chose to make so many comparisons to Apple.
You say MiUi is updated every week "with what the user wants". That's going to work great if there is only one user. But how does it work when you have tens of millions of users all asking for different things?
No, the thread is about Xiaomi.
The common misconception is that Xiaomi is China's version of Apple.
Xiaomi are not Apple. I was using Apple to make it easier for people to learn about the company and how it works.
MiUi is miles ahead of what Apple offer anyway.
So with these weekly updates giving users what they want. How does it work when you have tens of millions of users all asking for different things?
Well i'm a Mi Fan and have been following Xiaomi since Mi2, so of course this is a bias article about Xiaomi. It's only showing the good stuff. There is plenty of bad stuff as well such as stories of bad customer care.
All feedback is considered though. It's led to MiUi having a number of unique features over stock android, and iOS.
Doesn't sound that different to Apple then.
Like I said before, it's a nice idea in theory when there aren't many users.
But as soon as there are it just isn't possible. Agreed?
Stop taking stuff literally and then using it as a counter argument. You clearly know what i'm trying to say but your narrow mindedness and argumentative attitude is just making you look like an idiot.
No wonder everyone makes fun of you on other threads.
Like i said, Xiaomi take user feedback onboard. The feedback is used to design the UI add in new features.
Now. Lets stop talking about Apple and start talking about Xiaomi. If you want to talk about Apple then remove your fanboy hat and talk properly about how it compares to MiUi.
I know what you're trying to say. I'm just not sure it amounts to as much as you think it does.
Simply because once you have tens of millions of users it becomes impossible to give people what they want. It will always involve compromise.
Apple invite feedback. They have beta software inviting bug reports and changes. There just becomes a point where it becomes impractical. If Xiaomi started to sell as many units as the likes of Apple and Samsung, do you honestly think it would be as practical for them to consider all requests and push out many changes on a regular weekly basis?
How about we spin this on its head - what are some if the features that Apple are withholding that large numbers of users want?
And no - everyone doesn't make fun of me. Unless "everyone" is a couple of posters who have an almost pathological dislike of Apple. Often completely twisting what I've said. Case in point the thread about the Maps app. I invite you to take a look and let me know anything I said that you disagree with.
Even Google do that. Aople simply took it all to a whole new level. Microsoft is now seeing the financial advantage in copying Apple, for consumers that is. I think they have to be more pragmatic when it comes to businesses.
I know it is only personal preference when discussing OS skins but you wrong. Miui is horrible. Why do you think Apple copied it for iOS 7? And how is it more customisable than stock? Having all your apps on the home screens severely restricts customisation.
Wow :eek: If only other companies did that
Ask anyone who bought the iPad 3 if they really wanted the Lightning port.
Ask anyone who uses iOS if they really wanted Apple Maps.
You know full well that Apple do as they please regardless of their consumers. They know they will still make money, so this is a complete non-statement. Apple are notorious for their locked down/control freakish behaviour with their devices.
An Apple device never properly belongs to the consumer who bought it as the consumer can't dictate how they use the device. Apple does that for them, wanted or not.
So true, you can't even set default apps
Xiaomi have confirmed the Tegra 4 version will be shipping on October 15th. This is the TD-CDMA version so will ONLY work on China Mobile. China Unicom and international customers will have to wait a month or so for the Snapdragon 800 version.
It is certainly a phone i'm considering myself but i want to see what Mediatek will be shipping early next year first or see what my work can offer me next year as well. Rumour has it Mediatek will be looking at shipping 4G LTE chips soon. Plus they will have a new quad core and true 8 core processor coming soon.
Put it this way - how is what they do any different to Samsung, Sony, HTC, Nokia....
They all ship products with a set of features that the consumer has no real say over.
Replacing a ten year old connector is hardly an example of "freakish control behaviour".
OK, lets move on from the whole "giving users what they want" thing, and forget the point that that is completely impractical when you have tens of millions of users.
And no - I'm not being literal with it. It becomes impractical long before it needs to become literal.
Also loved the way you start a thread which by your own admission is based on bias. But then you call me a fanboy. Loving the irony!
You should have been the PR man for Colonel Gaddafi or even further back in time, telling the millions of Mao peasants to kill the birds.
You're comparing Apple to Gaddafi and Mao?
Jesus. H. Christ.
:rolleyes:
Tell me more about these democracies run by companies with tens of millions of users. How do they work exactly?
Don't know who said that, but it wasn't me.
As for "they all ship products with a set of features that the consumer has no real say over". You're wrong.
By simply choosing Android as their platform, those OEMs are giving their customers a choice. Android is not locked down, consumers can change as much or as little as they want, even down to the actual hardware and design of the device in the case of the Moto X.
With Apple, you can't change the browser, the keyboard or set default apps. Apple has made all those decisions and there is nothing the consumer can do about them. The consumer cannot change or modify key features on their own device.
So that's not "they all ship products with a set of features" blah blah. Your attempt to lump other OEMs in with Apple and attempt to suggest that they all do the same thing is not the reality. Android users have the choice, that much is fact.
Samsung, HTC, Sony, Nokia, Huawei, ZTE, Google and Apple all do the same thing. They decide what you should have and then you buy what suits you.
The only difference is there is no way to change the default apps in iOS but that doesn't stop you from using other apps.