I see its now turning into a bit of a project/hobby.
Give it a couple of months and you will have a 6 foot motorised dish in youre garden, and be frequenting http://forums.digitalspy.co.uk/forumdisplay.php?f=11;-)
Maybe, I do tend to go at it full steam ahead once I get an idea into my head ;-)
But first I actually need to get hold of the necessary hardware, namely a tuner card. As budget is an issue I would be willing to make do with a dual tuner card for now and then, if I feel it is insufficient, for my needs perhaps add another card at a later date (or even just a USB Freeview dongle).
The trouble is even on eBay (where I can normally hunt out a bargain) they seem to be pricey. Is there anywhere that has them on sale at the moment? In the interests of getting one for a reasonable price I'd be flexible in that I'd take used/oem/unboxed etc and I'd even consider a dual Freeview HD card instead of Freesat HD if it was significantly cheaper than the satellite equivalent and then add the satellite card at a later date if I found the Freeview line up to be too lacking.
Finally, just to check, you can put a PCIE X1 Card into a X16 slot right?
yep - my cards are in x16 slots
BTW I have 2 TV cards + a usb dongle (SD only) you can have for free if you want to have a dabble. I'll try and send a mail via the DS system. Never used the DS mail before, so fingers crossed LOL.
Maybe, I do tend to go at it full steam ahead once I get an idea into my head ;-)
But first I actually need to get hold of the necessary hardware, namely a tuner card. As budget is an issue I would be willing to make do with a dual tuner card for now and then, if I feel it is insufficient, for my needs perhaps add another card at a later date (or even just a USB Freeview dongle).
The trouble is even on eBay (where I can normally hunt out a bargain) they seem to be pricey. Is there anywhere that has them on sale at the moment? In the interests of getting one for a reasonable price I'd be flexible in that I'd take used/oem/unboxed etc and I'd even consider a dual Freeview HD card instead of Freesat HD if it was significantly cheaper than the satellite equivalent and then add the satellite card at a later date if I found the Freeview line up to be too lacking.
The DVB-T2 tuners are likely to be even more expensive that the DVB-S2 ones, as the UK is one of the few places that uses T2.
Don't even think about the cheap USB tuners. They have always been hopeless in my experience.
The DVB-T2 tuners are likely to be even more expensive that the DVB-S2 ones, as the UK is one of the few places that uses T2.
Good point, never thought about that. Still it's strange how cheap HD T2 based PVRs such as Youview have become (they can be under £100 used), guess BT and TalkTalk doing them has flooded the market and reduced the price. Whilst TV tuner cards are comparatively niche and hence not made in massive numbers...
Anyway, have decided I can definitely live without a quad tuner card so that narrows it down to a dual tuner DVB-S2 card, preferably one that doesn't cost the earth either ;-)
I'm currently using the following on a HP Microserver running Debian Wheezy.
3 x DVB-T tuners + 1 DVB-T2 tuner (All usb)
3 x DVB-S2 tuners (one PCI-E the other two are usb)
These are being controlled and managed via the awesome Tvheadend daemon which provides EPG, series link, auto recorder, timeshift* and more!
This setup is currently streaming all available channels around the house to a number of devices using xbmc as frontend!
Yes it can be a pain to setup (getting your tuners working etc) but once you get the hang of it, it works great!
And best of all I didn't purchase any additional software!
-- This is not an advert (and yes I know it sounds like one)
* Timeshift does work but it's still rather rudimentary at the moment.
I think I've mentioned this app before in another thread but anyway, if you want to try something different to Windows Media Centre, you can try sichbopvr (.com)
I'm currently using the following on a HP Microserver running Debian Wheezy.
3 x DVB-T tuners + 1 DVB-T2 tuner (All usb)
3 x DVB-S2 tuners (one PCI-E the other two are usb)
These are being controlled and managed via the awesome Tvheadend daemon which provides EPG, series link, auto recorder, timeshift* and more!
This setup is currently streaming all available channels around the house to a number of devices using xbmc as frontend!
Yes it can be a pain to setup (getting your tuners working etc) but once you get the hang of it, it works great!
And best of all I didn't purchase any additional software!
-- This is not an advert (and yes I know it sounds like one)
* Timeshift does work but it's still rather rudimentary at the moment.
I think I've mentioned this app before in another thread but anyway, if you want to try something different to Windows Media Centre, you can try sichbopvr (.com)
That's very much for the enthusiast though.
I love Linux, but I've never been able to get any Linux program to work with any of the TV cards I've had, either USB or PCI.
I've been able to get them all to work with Windows. Perhaps not all with Windows Media Center, but with third party progs.
But Linux - not a hope.
And I've tried 4 different cards, one of which I bought specially because it was supposed to work with Linux (Nebula digiTV). And I tried them with MythTV, Me TV, TVheadend and XBMC.
Not saying it can't be done. Obviously you prove that it can.
But you have to choose your hardware and software very carefully, and be prepared to fiddle about a lot to get it to work, and to get it configured.
I wasn't prepared to put in the leg work, I guess?
I love Linux, but I've never been able to get any Linux program to work with any of the TV cards I've had, either USB or PCI.
I've been able to get them all to work with Windows. Perhaps not all with Windows Media Center, but with third party progs.
But Linux - not a hope.
And I've tried 4 different cards, one of which I bought specially because it was supposed to work with Linux (Nebula digiTV). And I tried them with MythTV, Me TV, TVheadend and XBMC.
Not saying it can't be done. Obviously you prove that it can.
But you have to choose your hardware and software very carefully, and be prepared to fiddle about a lot to get it to work, and to get it configured.
I wasn't prepared to put in the leg work, I guess?
Linux support can be variable but most dvb devices nowdays do work out of the box on Linux provided you use an up to date kernel.
As I said in my previous post I have quite a few tuners.
The DVB-S2 card, A Tevii S471 PCIE was hell on some kernels because of driver changes but now it's working fine on 3.13.
The DVB-T usb tuners are all Hauppauge and all work fine under Linux, my DVB-T2 (PCTV Systems DVB-T2 290e) does work extremely well but there is the odd occasion it'll give up because it doesn't like sharing the usb bus with other tuners. (there's an easy fix for that though )
The best tuner that I've ever owned and has never caused me any grief has to be the Technisat Skystar USB HD because it's quite an old tuner (it's been out a while) it is very well supported on Linux, plug in the cable, load the firmware.. Job done.
I did try the Skystar on Windows and I could not for the life of me get it to work no matter how hard I tried, the software is absolute cack!
The worst tuner I have has to be the TBS 5922 (it replaced a QBOX that borked) under Windows it works wonderful but under Linux it's a nightmare to get running, Like most TBS it uses closed source drivers on Linux so you have to install TBS's customised media tree which is horribly put together and is very out of date, it's that bad there's a few people that have written their own drivers for some TBS devices!
This is currently attached to a spare machine that isn't used much not because the device is rubbish but because the drivers suck and screw up other devices.
Can I ask what tuners were these that you tried? I'm going to assume it was a while ago because of how old that Nebula digiTV card is.
Well I've never thrown any money at it, so the cards have been cheap or second hand, and apart from the Nebula one, they've been bought for Windows, so trying to get them to work in Linux has been very much secondary.
When I first started with Ubuntu in 2007 I tried to get Myth TV to work with the TV card I had at the time, a PCI DVB-T one that was branded Jetway (I think it was a rebadged Kworld), but although it knew there was a TV card installed, it wouldn't scan any channels.
Then in 2009 I bought the Nebula card second hand, and again no luck in Linux, but it worked fine in XP. Similar to above, it knew there was a card there, but wouldn't scan anything.
Then last year I had another go when I installed Linux on a PC that had two cards in it. A TBS DVB-S2 PCI card, and a cheap DVB-T USB one (MobiDTV Pro), but Linux didn't even know there were any cards installed, so it was a non-starter.
I think the most interesting you said in your post, was casually "load the firmware".
Something that would be easy in Windows, either via CD or downloading from the web, but much more problematic in Linux, if the drivers aren't inbuilt?
Well I've never thrown any money at it, so the cards have been cheap or second hand, and apart from the Nebula one, they've been bought for Windows, so trying to get them to work in Linux has been very much secondary.
When I first started with Ubuntu in 2007 I tried to get Myth TV to work with the TV card I had at the time, a PCI DVB-T one that was branded Jetway (I think it was a rebadged Kworld), but although it knew there was a TV card installed, it wouldn't scan any channels.
Then in 2009 I bought the Nebula card second hand, and again no luck in Linux, but it worked fine in XP. Similar to above, it knew there was a card there, but wouldn't scan anything.
Then last year I had another go when I installed Linux on a PC that had two cards in it. A TBS DVB-S2 PCI card, and a cheap DVB-T USB one (MobiDTV Pro), but Linux didn't even know there were any cards installed, so it was a non-starter.
I think the most interesting you said in your post, was casually "load the firmware".
Something that would be easy in Windows, either via CD or downloading from the web, but much more problematic in Linux, if the drivers aren't inbuilt?
^_^
Loading the firmware is all I ever have to do with that tuner on many kernels.
I'm not surprised you had trouble with a TBS card which is sadly let down by the poor drivers that you have to install yourself on top of your current kernel modules because they are closed source! You can thank TBS for that.
I'm not saying closed source is bad, it's just those TBS drivers are hacked together using an out of date linux media tree as the base!
There are many drivers built-in on most kernels, but it can be pot luck as to what is supported depending on kernel version.
Loading the firmware is all I ever have to do with that tuner on many kernels.
I'm not surprised you had trouble with a TBS card which is sadly let down by the poor drivers that you have to install yourself on top of your current kernel modules because they are closed source! You can thank TBS for that.
I'm not saying closed source is bad, it's just those TBS drivers are hacked together using an out of date linux media tree as the base!
There are many drivers built-in on most kernels, but it can be pot luck as to what is supported depending on kernel version.
Well perhaps I'm showing how little I really know about Linux here, but what do you mean by "loading the firmware"?
Are you searching the web for .deb files that you can double-click?
Are you finding drivers in 'Hardware Drivers' in settings?
Are you finding things in Synaptic Package Manager?
Are you building packages from source code, in the terminal? :eek:
As I said, "for the enthusiast".
(sorry for coming over as negative, but it's been frustrations like this that has stopped me going over fully to Linux, even though I generally (and genuinely) like messing around with it)
Well perhaps I'm showing how little I really know about Linux here, but what do you mean by "loading the firmware"?
Are you searching the web for .deb files that you can double-click?
Are you finding drivers in 'Hardware Drivers' in settings?
Are you finding things in Synaptic Package Manager?
Are you building packages from source code, in the terminal? :eek:
As I said, "for the enthusiast".
(sorry for coming over as negative, but it's been frustrations like this that has stopped me going over fully to Linux, even though I generally (and genuinely) like messing around with it)
Some devices along with the drivers require firmware files that are required to get the device running, they are usually plonked in /lib/firmware.
By loading the firmware I mean either installing linux-firmware-nonfree:
sudo apt-get install linux-firmware-nonfree
On a debian (or Ubuntu) system with non-free repo available or using:
Taking the discussion back to Media Center, I don't mind the Linux chat but it's not going to be relevant to me any time soon as I want to start with Windows Media Center to keep it simple (hopefully).
I know four tuners is quite a lot but I was thinking it would be nice to go to say six for the ultimate PVR set up, like the new Tivos in the US have....
Is it true that it can only have four tuners or have I misread that page somehow?
Taking the discussion back to Media Center, I don't mind the Linux chat but it's not going to be relevant to me any time soon as I want to start with Windows Media Center to keep it simple (hopefully).
I know four tuners is quite a lot but I was thinking it would be nice to go to say six for the ultimate PVR set up, like the new Tivos in the US have....
Is it true that it can only have four tuners or have I misread that page somehow?
You can have as many tuners as you like provided your system can handle them all of course, it's just you can only use four at a time in Windows Media Centre, you can use another app to control the others though.
Taking the discussion back to Media Center, I don't mind the Linux chat but it's not going to be relevant to me any time soon as I want to start with Windows Media Center to keep it simple (hopefully).
I know four tuners is quite a lot but I was thinking it would be nice to go to say six for the ultimate PVR set up, like the new Tivos in the US have....
Is it true that it can only have four tuners or have I misread that page somehow?
See here and Here
Not tried either but then I haven't one tuner yet
Satellite- 4
TBS DVB-S2 dual
Two single Hauppauge WinTV DVB-S2
1 DVB T Freeview tuner
Software: DVBViewer - Worth every penny and not exactly expensive anyway. Far better than media centre. Any number of tuners of any type and it will use them all seamlessly.
I have been running it for about 3 years now and when I read about what dedicated platforms can't do on here, I would never use anything else.
I can get full 7 day EPG from Freesat and/or Sky's EPG with a little bit of other software.
I can also put any channel wherever I want it, so all this yak about HD swapping on here and the moaning about it is quite funny. If I can tune it in, I can label it any name I want and put it any position I want to.
Yes, it's not for someone who finds tuning a PC on a massive task and tinkering is always fun, but it's not rocket science and there is usually a solution to your problem out of the internet.
Also with any combination of tuners you can have as many of a few as you wish and also have any channels Freesat is missing and any that Freeview is missing. Have them all!
Also no need for plus one channels as if you are getting recording clashes, just get more tuners! With 5 tuners, I have (sadly due to British TV) never had 4 things to record whilst simultaneously watching a 5th. (Or recording 5 things) - It can do that of course, but the programmes are just not there to need to!
AND like all things PC - You can start small and with free software to try things out and grow when you have the money. And if something changes down the line, then so can you. Can't do any of that with a dedicated box.
My HTPC is also of course my main PC and with two monitors (The Main LG 47" TV and an LG 22" monitor (both 1080p) I can chat on exciting forums such as this as well! And of course do all other things PCs do, - It makes me laugh when some don't like watching things on their PCs and want to watch on their main TV: With me, it's all one and the same thing. I can drag this page over to the main TV and drag the TV picture of DVBViewer over to this 22" montor. It's all one system.)
The DVB-T2 tuners are likely to be even more expensive that the DVB-S2 ones, as the UK is one of the few places that uses T2.
Don't even think about the cheap USB tuners. They have always been hopeless in my experience.
Yes T2 tuners are more expensive, but if you run Satellite tuners for the HD stuff, then the extra channels Freeview have that Freesat doesn't are all SD channels anyway. So only a SD Freeview card is needed.
Yes T2 tuners are more expensive, but if you run Satellite tuners for the HD stuff, then the extra channels Freeview have that Freesat doesn't are all SD channels anyway. So only a SD Freeview card is needed.
This is the exact reason, I took the plunge last week and got myself a Blackgold 3595 card which has dual DVB-S2 and dual DVB-T, the perfect combination giving me Freeview and Freesat HD all in one.... or so I thought.
I also bought Media Center for Windows (I have 8.1 so it isn't free ). I know there are lots of free alternatives but I wanted a known easy to use piece of software to get started with. However since then it's been straight downhill.
Media Center sees the card and all tuners just great. It asks me my location and postcode to make sure I get the right channels, then I tune the Freeview tuners, tunes them just fine, all channels no problem. However, then I set up the satellite tuners and it all goes pear shaped. It asks me which satellite I want to tune into and presents me with a long list of satellites, so I'm getting all these on a old bog standard Sky dish? I didn't think that was even possible
The default it picks is Hotbird 13.something, which seems to hover from two bars signal to a full signal. However I thought in the UK we used Astra 28.2? so I selected that option and continued. It asked me if I wanted to receive from multiple satellites, I selected no. Then it asked me what kind of lnb I had and I selected universal (the others were horizontal and vertical). I then set it to tune in the satellite channels it asked me if I wanted to tune in one transponder or multiple. I selected multiple and then left it to tune in. It must have taken 10-15 minutes and it came up with a list of well over 500 channels. Wow I thought, I don't even get that many with cable!
Of course, I can't actually watch many of them as most of them have no signal, and I'm not just talking the obscure foreign ones, no many of them ones actually work, I mean it's getting no signal on BBC1 FFS! but then BBC2 HD has perfect reception for example. Many of the same channels are listed many times over but at different numbers and the channel numbers go way over 1200! I'm getting mainstream channels like ITV HD in the 800s for example but the ITV on 103 doesn't work argh! >:( I should have known not to trust Microsoft with my TV! There are also some channels that don't even have names, they are just like a string of numbers. Also the TV guide just reports no information for many of the channels.
Please help! Is there anyway I can get media center to display the channels in some kind of sensible order and to display the signal strength of the channels? or even get it to only tune channels that have a good signal as it is driving me crazy having to shift through loads of channels it can't even receive, like why does it bother tuning them when there is no signal who watches channels that don't even work
I wish I had a separate STB to test my dish on but it was working when I last used it and the channels that are tuning in are free from glitches as far as I can tell so the dish must be good right?
Yes, assuming you are using a dish which was setup for Sky, you are using the Astra 2 28.2 satellite, and it may also say Eurobird. Ignore the signal strength; you are either pointing at the right satellite or you aren't.
And yes, you will see lots of redundant channels with odd numbers. This is a downside of using satellite vs terrestrial. If you did a scan specifying the wrong satellite, you might want to start the setup process again.
Regarding the 'odd' channels, the only fix is to manually go through and disable channels you don't want, and renumber the channels sensibly.
Yes, assuming you are using a dish which was setup for Sky, you are using the Astra 2 28.2 satellite, and it may also say Eurobird. Ignore the signal strength; you are either pointing at the right satellite or you aren't.
Yes, the dish was set up for Sky back in 2006 or 7 I think, then I had Sky+ on it for a few years (and Quad LNB fitted at same time) worked fine but then I went over to cable so it hasn't been used for a while though I did have a old Pace Sky digibox on it about a year and a half ago and it was getting everything then at least.
And yes, you will see lots of redundant channels with odd numbers. This is a downside of using satellite vs terrestrial. If you did a scan specifying the wrong satellite, you might want to start the setup process again.
Regarding the 'odd' channels, the only fix is to manually go through and disable channels you don't want, and renumber the channels sensibly.
Thanks for the list. Isn't there anyway I can set media centre up to use the same order as Freesat? as I really like the Freesat line up as they group all the channels and their associated +1s together, all the ITVs in one place, all the BBCs etc makes a lot of sense, probably about the most logical channel line up I have seen of any platform.
I thought media center was supposed to be easy to use, it's appalling >:( like comparing it to a STB, what STB asks you which satellite and LNB you are using?, like how is any beginner supposed to know that and then tunes in all the channels in some kind of stupid order where you have mainstream channels in the 800s 900s and 1000s and don't even have a working 101-105 Is there no way I can make my PC just behave like a nice simple PVR where the channels are in some kind of vaguely usable order and it doesn't need advanced knowledge of satellites and LNB and frequencies and stuff? This is all why I have a love/hate (mostly hate lately) relationship with PCs. Needless complication.
Yes, the dish was set up for Sky back in 2006 or 7 I think, then I had Sky+ on it for a few years (and Quad LNB fitted at same time) worked fine but then I went over to cable so it hasn't been used for a while though I did have a old Pace Sky digibox on it about a year and a half ago and it was getting everything then at least.
Thanks for the list. Isn't there anyway I can set media centre up to use the same order as Freesat? as I really like the Freesat line up as they group all the channels and their associated +1s together, all the ITVs in one place, all the BBCs etc makes a lot of sense, probably about the most logical channel line up I have seen of any platform.
I thought media center was supposed to be easy to use, it's appalling >:( like comparing it to a STB, what STB asks you which satellite and LNB you are using?, like how is any beginner supposed to know that and then tunes in all the channels in some kind of stupid order where you have mainstream channels in the 800s 900s and 1000s and don't even have a working 101-105 Is there no way I can make my PC just behave like a nice simple PVR where the channels are in some kind of vaguely usable order and it doesn't need advanced knowledge of satellites and LNB and frequencies and stuff? This is all why I have a love/hate (mostly hate lately) relationship with PCs. Needless complication.
As you will have seen, the terrestrial channels all come in with the standard numbers. Satellite channels don't. If you think about it, Sky and freesat have different channel numbers anyway, so there is no standard.
I know it seems frustrating, but think of it this way: People with freesat boxes often ask if they can renumber and reorder channels. Most of the time their box doesn't allow it. With Media Center you have complete flexibility. Once it's set up, you can have exactly what you want. No, it's not quick or easy, but in my opinion it's worth the effort.
I know it seems frustrating, but think of it this way: People with freesat boxes often ask if they can renumber and reorder channels. Most of the time their box doesn't allow it. With Media Center you have complete flexibility. Once it's set up, you can have exactly what you want. No, it's not quick or easy, but in my opinion it's worth the effort.
I guess but my point is why not have kind of a simple and advanced mode e.g. simple just sets the satellite tuning for the UK (hence using the 28.2 and setting the LNB to whatever the Sky/Freesat standard is) and sets regional variations of channels according to postcode and numbers the channels like Freesat. That would be a really nice simple starting point for novices, then if you want to tinker fine.
I just wanted a really simple starting set up so I can verify: A the dish/lnb is working and aligned ok and B the tuner card is working properly. However, because the channels are not in a standard form just doing those seemingly simple things isn't that straightforward.
I did try resetting media center and trying the initial set up again. I noticed when I selected Astra 28.2 Media Centre reported perfect signal quality (all five bars lit) does that mean the dish IS correctly aligned?
Also when selecting lnb type I selected the top one (universal) is that definitely the one I have or could it be a single or dual oscillator? Though I'd imagine if that was wrong it wouldn't receive anything at all?
It's been a while since I set up my W7 Media Center, but I seem to remember that it was fairly straightforward. Mind you, I aligned the dish using an old Sky box first, and I knew I was supposed to be scanning on Astra 2.
It sounds like you are getting there now. You just need to go through renumbering channels the way you want, and disable all the regional variations you don't want.
DVB-T only would have been much easier, as there are less 'filler' channels.
Comments
Maybe, I do tend to go at it full steam ahead once I get an idea into my head ;-)
But first I actually need to get hold of the necessary hardware, namely a tuner card. As budget is an issue I would be willing to make do with a dual tuner card for now and then, if I feel it is insufficient, for my needs perhaps add another card at a later date (or even just a USB Freeview dongle).
The trouble is even on eBay (where I can normally hunt out a bargain) they seem to be pricey. Is there anywhere that has them on sale at the moment? In the interests of getting one for a reasonable price I'd be flexible in that I'd take used/oem/unboxed etc and I'd even consider a dual Freeview HD card instead of Freesat HD if it was significantly cheaper than the satellite equivalent and then add the satellite card at a later date if I found the Freeview line up to be too lacking.
yep - my cards are in x16 slots
BTW I have 2 TV cards + a usb dongle (SD only) you can have for free if you want to have a dabble. I'll try and send a mail via the DS system. Never used the DS mail before, so fingers crossed LOL.
Don't even think about the cheap USB tuners. They have always been hopeless in my experience.
Good point, never thought about that. Still it's strange how cheap HD T2 based PVRs such as Youview have become (they can be under £100 used), guess BT and TalkTalk doing them has flooded the market and reduced the price. Whilst TV tuner cards are comparatively niche and hence not made in massive numbers...
Anyway, have decided I can definitely live without a quad tuner card so that narrows it down to a dual tuner DVB-S2 card, preferably one that doesn't cost the earth either ;-)
http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/offer-listing/B0038LU03K/ref=dp_olp_all_mbc?ie=UTF8&condition=all
If it's any consolation, I paid more than that for a single tuner Hauppauge card some years ago!
I'm currently using the following on a HP Microserver running Debian Wheezy.
3 x DVB-T tuners + 1 DVB-T2 tuner (All usb)
3 x DVB-S2 tuners (one PCI-E the other two are usb)
These are being controlled and managed via the awesome Tvheadend daemon which provides EPG, series link, auto recorder, timeshift* and more!
This setup is currently streaming all available channels around the house to a number of devices using xbmc as frontend!
Yes it can be a pain to setup (getting your tuners working etc) but once you get the hang of it, it works great!
And best of all I didn't purchase any additional software!
-- This is not an advert (and yes I know it sounds like one)
* Timeshift does work but it's still rather rudimentary at the moment.
I think I've mentioned this app before in another thread but anyway, if you want to try something different to Windows Media Centre, you can try sichbopvr (.com)
That's very much for the enthusiast though.
I love Linux, but I've never been able to get any Linux program to work with any of the TV cards I've had, either USB or PCI.
I've been able to get them all to work with Windows. Perhaps not all with Windows Media Center, but with third party progs.
But Linux - not a hope.
And I've tried 4 different cards, one of which I bought specially because it was supposed to work with Linux (Nebula digiTV). And I tried them with MythTV, Me TV, TVheadend and XBMC.
Not saying it can't be done. Obviously you prove that it can.
But you have to choose your hardware and software very carefully, and be prepared to fiddle about a lot to get it to work, and to get it configured.
I wasn't prepared to put in the leg work, I guess?
Linux support can be variable but most dvb devices nowdays do work out of the box on Linux provided you use an up to date kernel.
As I said in my previous post I have quite a few tuners.
The DVB-S2 card, A Tevii S471 PCIE was hell on some kernels because of driver changes but now it's working fine on 3.13.
The DVB-T usb tuners are all Hauppauge and all work fine under Linux, my DVB-T2 (PCTV Systems DVB-T2 290e) does work extremely well but there is the odd occasion it'll give up because it doesn't like sharing the usb bus with other tuners.
The best tuner that I've ever owned and has never caused me any grief has to be the Technisat Skystar USB HD because it's quite an old tuner (it's been out a while) it is very well supported on Linux, plug in the cable, load the firmware.. Job done.
I did try the Skystar on Windows and I could not for the life of me get it to work no matter how hard I tried, the software is absolute cack!
The worst tuner I have has to be the TBS 5922 (it replaced a QBOX that borked) under Windows it works wonderful but under Linux it's a nightmare to get running, Like most TBS it uses closed source drivers on Linux so you have to install TBS's customised media tree which is horribly put together and is very out of date, it's that bad there's a few people that have written their own drivers for some TBS devices!
This is currently attached to a spare machine that isn't used much not because the device is rubbish but because the drivers suck and screw up other devices.
Can I ask what tuners were these that you tried? I'm going to assume it was a while ago because of how old that Nebula digiTV card is.
When I first started with Ubuntu in 2007 I tried to get Myth TV to work with the TV card I had at the time, a PCI DVB-T one that was branded Jetway (I think it was a rebadged Kworld), but although it knew there was a TV card installed, it wouldn't scan any channels.
Then in 2009 I bought the Nebula card second hand, and again no luck in Linux, but it worked fine in XP. Similar to above, it knew there was a card there, but wouldn't scan anything.
Then last year I had another go when I installed Linux on a PC that had two cards in it. A TBS DVB-S2 PCI card, and a cheap DVB-T USB one (MobiDTV Pro), but Linux didn't even know there were any cards installed, so it was a non-starter.
I think the most interesting you said in your post, was casually "load the firmware".
Something that would be easy in Windows, either via CD or downloading from the web, but much more problematic in Linux, if the drivers aren't inbuilt?
^_^
Loading the firmware is all I ever have to do with that tuner on many kernels.
I'm not surprised you had trouble with a TBS card which is sadly let down by the poor drivers that you have to install yourself on top of your current kernel modules because they are closed source! You can thank TBS for that.
I'm not saying closed source is bad, it's just those TBS drivers are hacked together using an out of date linux media tree as the base!
There are many drivers built-in on most kernels, but it can be pot luck as to what is supported depending on kernel version.
Well perhaps I'm showing how little I really know about Linux here, but what do you mean by "loading the firmware"?
Are you searching the web for .deb files that you can double-click?
Are you finding drivers in 'Hardware Drivers' in settings?
Are you finding things in Synaptic Package Manager?
Are you building packages from source code, in the terminal? :eek:
As I said, "for the enthusiast".
(sorry for coming over as negative, but it's been frustrations like this that has stopped me going over fully to Linux, even though I generally (and genuinely) like messing around with it)
Some devices along with the drivers require firmware files that are required to get the device running, they are usually plonked in /lib/firmware.
By loading the firmware I mean either installing linux-firmware-nonfree:
On a debian (or Ubuntu) system with non-free repo available or using:
This of course means you'll need to look online for the firmware.
More info here http://linuxtv.org/wiki/index.php/Firmware
Ah thanks.
It's always good to learn new things about Linux. I'd never heard of that non-free firmware before.
Anyway, I read here: http://windows.microsoft.com/en-gb/windows/adding-tv-tuners-media-center#1TC=windows-7 that media center can only be used with a maximum of four tuners. Does that mean if you fit a quad tuner card, you can't install anything else?
I know four tuners is quite a lot but I was thinking it would be nice to go to say six for the ultimate PVR set up, like the new Tivos in the US have....
Is it true that it can only have four tuners or have I misread that page somehow?
You can have as many tuners as you like provided your system can handle them all of course, it's just you can only use four at a time in Windows Media Centre, you can use another app to control the others though.
See here and Here
Not tried either but then I haven't one tuner yet
Tuners:
Satellite- 4
TBS DVB-S2 dual
Two single Hauppauge WinTV DVB-S2
1 DVB T Freeview tuner
Software: DVBViewer - Worth every penny and not exactly expensive anyway. Far better than media centre. Any number of tuners of any type and it will use them all seamlessly.
I have been running it for about 3 years now and when I read about what dedicated platforms can't do on here, I would never use anything else.
I can get full 7 day EPG from Freesat and/or Sky's EPG with a little bit of other software.
I can also put any channel wherever I want it, so all this yak about HD swapping on here and the moaning about it is quite funny. If I can tune it in, I can label it any name I want and put it any position I want to.
Yes, it's not for someone who finds tuning a PC on a massive task and tinkering is always fun, but it's not rocket science and there is usually a solution to your problem out of the internet.
Also with any combination of tuners you can have as many of a few as you wish and also have any channels Freesat is missing and any that Freeview is missing. Have them all!
Also no need for plus one channels as if you are getting recording clashes, just get more tuners! With 5 tuners, I have (sadly due to British TV) never had 4 things to record whilst simultaneously watching a 5th. (Or recording 5 things) - It can do that of course, but the programmes are just not there to need to!
AND like all things PC - You can start small and with free software to try things out and grow when you have the money. And if something changes down the line, then so can you. Can't do any of that with a dedicated box.
My HTPC is also of course my main PC and with two monitors (The Main LG 47" TV and an LG 22" monitor (both 1080p) I can chat on exciting forums such as this as well! And of course do all other things PCs do, - It makes me laugh when some don't like watching things on their PCs and want to watch on their main TV: With me, it's all one and the same thing. I can drag this page over to the main TV and drag the TV picture of DVBViewer over to this 22" montor. It's all one system.)
Yes T2 tuners are more expensive, but if you run Satellite tuners for the HD stuff, then the extra channels Freeview have that Freesat doesn't are all SD channels anyway. So only a SD Freeview card is needed.
This is the exact reason, I took the plunge last week and got myself a Blackgold 3595 card which has dual DVB-S2 and dual DVB-T, the perfect combination giving me Freeview and Freesat HD all in one.... or so I thought.
I also bought Media Center for Windows (I have 8.1 so it isn't free
Media Center sees the card and all tuners just great. It asks me my location and postcode to make sure I get the right channels, then I tune the Freeview tuners, tunes them just fine, all channels no problem. However, then I set up the satellite tuners and it all goes pear shaped. It asks me which satellite I want to tune into and presents me with a long list of satellites, so I'm getting all these on a old bog standard Sky dish? I didn't think that was even possible
The default it picks is Hotbird 13.something, which seems to hover from two bars signal to a full signal. However I thought in the UK we used Astra 28.2? so I selected that option and continued. It asked me if I wanted to receive from multiple satellites, I selected no. Then it asked me what kind of lnb I had and I selected universal (the others were horizontal and vertical). I then set it to tune in the satellite channels it asked me if I wanted to tune in one transponder or multiple. I selected multiple and then left it to tune in. It must have taken 10-15 minutes and it came up with a list of well over 500 channels. Wow I thought, I don't even get that many with cable!
Of course, I can't actually watch many of them as most of them have no signal, and I'm not just talking the obscure foreign ones, no many of them ones actually work, I mean it's getting no signal on BBC1 FFS!
Please help! Is there anyway I can get media center to display the channels in some kind of sensible order and to display the signal strength of the channels? or even get it to only tune channels that have a good signal as it is driving me crazy having to shift through loads of channels it can't even receive, like why does it bother tuning them when there is no signal
I wish I had a separate STB to test my dish on but it was working when I last used it and the channels that are tuning in are free from glitches as far as I can tell so the dish must be good right?
And yes, you will see lots of redundant channels with odd numbers. This is a downside of using satellite vs terrestrial. If you did a scan specifying the wrong satellite, you might want to start the setup process again.
Regarding the 'odd' channels, the only fix is to manually go through and disable channels you don't want, and renumber the channels sensibly.
You might find the list below helpful. You can do a manual scan to identify channels.
http://en.kingofsat.net/pos-28.2E.php
Yes, the dish was set up for Sky back in 2006 or 7 I think, then I had Sky+ on it for a few years (and Quad LNB fitted at same time) worked fine but then I went over to cable so it hasn't been used for a while though I did have a old Pace Sky digibox on it about a year and a half ago and it was getting everything then at least.
Thanks for the list. Isn't there anyway I can set media centre up to use the same order as Freesat? as I really like the Freesat line up as they group all the channels and their associated +1s together, all the ITVs in one place, all the BBCs etc makes a lot of sense, probably about the most logical channel line up I have seen of any platform.
I thought media center was supposed to be easy to use, it's appalling >:( like comparing it to a STB, what STB asks you which satellite and LNB you are using?, like how is any beginner supposed to know that
I know it seems frustrating, but think of it this way: People with freesat boxes often ask if they can renumber and reorder channels. Most of the time their box doesn't allow it. With Media Center you have complete flexibility. Once it's set up, you can have exactly what you want. No, it's not quick or easy, but in my opinion it's worth the effort.
I guess but my point is why not have kind of a simple and advanced mode e.g. simple just sets the satellite tuning for the UK (hence using the 28.2 and setting the LNB to whatever the Sky/Freesat standard is) and sets regional variations of channels according to postcode and numbers the channels like Freesat. That would be a really nice simple starting point for novices, then if you want to tinker fine.
I just wanted a really simple starting set up so I can verify: A the dish/lnb is working and aligned ok and B the tuner card is working properly. However, because the channels are not in a standard form just doing those seemingly simple things isn't that straightforward.
I did try resetting media center and trying the initial set up again. I noticed when I selected Astra 28.2 Media Centre reported perfect signal quality (all five bars lit) does that mean the dish IS correctly aligned?
Also when selecting lnb type I selected the top one (universal) is that definitely the one I have or could it be a single or dual oscillator? Though I'd imagine if that was wrong it wouldn't receive anything at all?
It sounds like you are getting there now. You just need to go through renumbering channels the way you want, and disable all the regional variations you don't want.
DVB-T only would have been much easier, as there are less 'filler' channels.