They had a bond long before that when they were both pregnant. Yes it was damaged by the baby swap but they are both trying to move on. Bitterness will destroy you and Kat realises that. It doesn't mean she has forgotten.
Because kat is the type to let go. No matter how you square it, her actions don't ring true; if she was a forgiving character then maybe; but she's not. Again lazy sloppy writing, enhanced by the ridiculously unrealistic and contrived fact of Ronnie being their in the first place.
And people wonder why EE looses viewers. It because they no longer give a damn about characterisation.
I do think Janine is very sympathetic. She's never recovered from her father abandoning her and her mother dying young. Although the writing's been patchy for her at times,Charlie Brooks does make the character vulnerable, despite what she's done. Just in recent memory, her death bed scene with Pat, when her grandmother Lydia died and when Scarlett was born, all made me feel for her.
What I like about Janine,is she's unapologetic for being a bitch a lot of the time.She 's had real ups and lows during her time on the Square,but her key motivation has always been fear of abandonment and wanting security in her life. A lot of the time, she's been a golddigger to try and achieve this, but actually she wants the security of the family life,which she's never had.
Crikey are there any more pointless, irrelevant characters than Sharon and Tamwar?
I think the writers have ruined their characters - and also Alfie's over the Ronnie thing.
i have never liked tamwar, found his role with the masoods during the syed outing s/l very cheesy.And his characterisation during his marriage to sofia (or whatever her name was) was horrible.But since tptb paired him with happy characters like fatboy or alice his monotone/tamboreness works. His social awkwardness is actually quite funny sometimes like the time he did hand puppets when alice was hungover
I really enjoyed tonight's episode, Michael was great as always. Even scenes with Poppy and Tamwar come alive when he is in them. I can't believe it's his last week
Kat and alfie scenes were good tonight as well, Kat being the voice of reason lately is a nice change. They have really saved her from her return.
Because kat is the type to let go. No matter how you square it, her actions don't ring true; if she was a forgiving character then maybe; but she's not. Again lazy sloppy writing, enhanced by the ridiculously unrealistic and contrived fact of Ronnie being their in the first place.
And people wonder why EE looses viewers. It because they no longer give a damn about characterisation.
There is so much more to it than that. Kat understands that ,like her, Ronnie was damaged by abuse at an early age and had to give up her first born. And no mother knows just what they'd do if faced with a cot death. Ronnie's reaction was extreme, to put it mildly, but it happened, and they all have to live with it. IRL she would not be back in the square, but I won't lose sleep over it. They wanted to bring Ronnie back so they did.
I do think Janine is very sympathetic. She's never recovered from her father abandoning her and her mother dying young. Although the writing's been patchy for her at times,Charlie Brooks does make the character vulnerable, despite what she's done. Just in recent memory, her death bed scene with Pat, when her grandmother Lydia died and when Scarlett was born, all made me feel for her..
lol these comments reminds me of how lacey/stacey fans had a slumber party when it was revealed stacey suffered from bi polar.Because from that point on every despicable thing the selfish bint did was rationalized due to her affliction.
.
What I like about Janine,is she's unapologeticfor being a bitch a lot of the time.She 's had real ups and lows during her time on the Square,but her key motivation has always been fear of abandonment and wanting security in her life. A lot of the time, she's been a golddigger to try and achieve this, but actually she wants the security of the family life,which she's never had.
I am sorry but when she was stealing from barry and willing him to die (a man who licked the floor she walked) she didnt seem too worried about abandonment then.
How was she going to achieve a family with the 80 year old? she just wanted his cash. She had pat and the jacksons and when she wasn't putting them down she was running to them when she needed something like a user. Much like stacey fans i am sure u like the actress and so naturally you will like the character but janine isnt sympathetic at all.
I think that Kat knows that Ronnie is no serious threat to children and was deeply broken when she did the baby swap. Kat had to pretend to be her daughter's sister for 16 years and her son is not even Alfie's. Maybe she doesn't think she should be one to judge Ronnie.
I loved Whitney telling Sharon, that the police believed her and that Denny was a spoiled, little, brat. Whitney looked really happy with Carol and David too.
Michael's put down of Joey was brilliant too and poor Janine, not even Billy showed up for her party..
Micheal and Joey was hilarious, it's like he's toying with a chimp at the zoo
Also good on David for telling Sharon to do one in the cafe :mad:
Whitney is so much better when she's not playing the 'dirty girl' card with whichever boy is being nice to her.
yeah it seems that episode with kat was tptb burying that aspect of her character.And shes better for it, we dont need anymore bootleg kat slater's.Stacey was enough
I think that Kat knows that Ronnie is no serious threat to children and was deeply broken when she did the baby swap. Kat had to pretend to be her daughter's sister for 16 years and her son is not even Alfie's. Maybe she doesn't think she should be one to judge Ronnie.
I loved Whitney telling Sharon, that the police believed her and that Denny was a spoiled, little, brat. Whitney looked really happy with Carol and David too.
I know Janine is pretty rotten to most people but I'm surprised people like Whitney, Liam, Tiffany, Morgan, Billy and Kim haven't turned up as she's generally got on well with them.
So I caught some of this when I gazed up from my laptop a few times tonight (yes, I do leave the computer now and again. To go to the fridge).
Ladies and gentlemen, it seems every time I watch, something incredible happens in Eastenders. Last time it was seeing Ava actually at work. This time, it's me actually liking Joey. Why? Because his performance (or indeed, his reason for being on screen) was not just so tween girls could fawn over him. His relationship with his sister was always a highlight of Joey, yet was never really explored, though they did try, to be fair to them. He worked better tonight than he ever has running after "Lawn" or sleeping with random bints on the square. His concern for Alice was good and nice to see! An interesting side of the character, wasted for shallow crap.
Michael continues to be his little psychotic self. I shudder to think what the show will be like without him. It is, literally, the only interesting thing going on at the moment.
I just can't work up any excitement for the obvious Kat and Alfie reunion, as redeemed as Kat is. Flash back 10 years. Kat was about to marry Andy, a gangster who was very bad news. She was marrying him for convenience, yet she really loved Alfie. Alfie for his part loved Kat, but didn't know she loved him back until his Nana told him. So off he went to the Church to win the woman of his dreams. See how this couple really were golden last time?
And for the love of all things holy... making Alfie the bad guy in this Ronnie fiasco is not only insulting, appalling and lazy... it just sucks. SHE KIDNAPPED HIS SON!!!! The fact that both he and Kat are willing to forgive her for this is just... ridiculous. Does the show need Ronnie that much? The Santar heydays of her ruling the show have passed. I see Ronnie as a reminder of how good things were a few short years ago (the same can be said for David Wicks, only extending that period), yet all she does now is mope about looking for purpose.
Yes, Alfie should not be marrying her sister if he hates her that much, but that still doesn't excuse the fact that Ronnie's unforgivable crime has been brushed under the carpet. Way to go, EE. Maybe in future you won't saddle characters you are obsessed with with such a ridiculous storyline. Baby snatching creates a shelf life for said character, as does rape and murder. The audience want them caught eventually, but until that date you can make them as entertaining and evil as you want. Hell, they've done it with Archie. Emmerdale's done it with Cameron recently. But there has to be an end. Kaput. And that's the issue here. Kirkwood gave this car crash of a story to the show's damn LEADING LADY! This explains her return, but does not justify it.
As for Whitney and Sharon... who cares? Sharon has been decimated, and Whitney is just a little skank.
I suppose the saving grace tonight was the non-appearance of Lauren. Every episode improves when that happens.
Look. I used to love Eastenders. It was a brilliant show we could discuss, debate, complain about even... but ultimately it captured us all. The past 3 years have been a case of me dipping in, being appalled, and dipping out. Every time I sit down to watch an episode, I am most of the time appalled by the crap, and even if the episode is good, the ones following it will be terrible. I really, really don't want to hate the show! I'm sure many of you feel the same way!
It's just shallow. It's written for shallow people, contains shallow characters, and played by actors hired for shallow reasons. Janine's off, the cast is continuing to be flooded with kids (seriously, enough already!) that will just add nothing to it. Tbh I'm expecting nothing from DTC. I'll no doubt dip in and out, but something is rotten over at EE now, and a few sensationalist stories will not help.
michael should know when janine's birthday is..instead he over hears it lol
Exactly. It would be imprinted on his brain from the times he wanted to get his mitts on her fortune so he was buttering her up. I doubt very much he'd forget yet another occasion that he could use to his advantage.
LOL!!! I don't know about anyone else but I didn't systematically carry my nearly 5 year olds around all the time? My back wouldn't have taken the strain! Talk about babying her child.
I notice that KAT didn't argue when he said 'our son'.
As to not being his kid, Alfie might not be biologically but he is in every other single way that counts. He's bonded with that child and, perhaps more importantly, the child has bonded with him. Alfie has been there since day one. They love each other. Kat has no problem referring to Alfie as the child's father and that really should be good enough for everyone else IMO.
I absolutely refuse to believe that both of Janine's sisters and her brother would forget her birthday. The Jackson/Brannings, absolutely, up their own @rses and only concentrating on their own problems. Billy, well, he's Billy isn't he? Hardly surprising! But EE always have to go one step too far and make absolutely everyone forget :rolleyes:
Quite frankly if I was Janine I'd be putting Bianca/Carol's rent up after THAT. She is doing them a massive favour and they repay her by forgetting her 30th birthday? Why should I be surprised though? FFS, Carol forgot her own father's 80th birthday!!! Notice hers wasn't ignored though, about time it was IMO.
Why do characters in soap always do that? Whenever nobody turns up to a meal or a party, they throw the meal or the cake away.
What a waste of food.
I don't know one single person who's done that. Not one. I've known people have strops and take their Xmas decorations down on Boxing Day morning because they've fallen out with their other halves (upsetting their kids twice!) but I've never seen anyone chuck food or big cakes in the bin!
A really good episode in underlying Janine's vulnerability and desperate need for a family.She is one of EE's most sympathetic characters.Usually I find Monday's episodes dull,but thought this was a good opener for the week,
I felt for Janine. God knows I know she's anything but perfect but she's always had a guard up protecting herself and it seems she's done such a good job now she's pushed everyone away. She must miss Pat dreadfully.
He checks out every female character's arse, in every single scene, it's gotten quite annoying to be honest. I think it's the right time to go, he's a good character but can't go any further imo.
What fool of a woman would marry a man who wont allow her see her own sister .Yes I know he changed his mind but Roxy was going along with it .No man should wield that power .
Because kat is the type to let go. No matter how you square it, her actions don't ring true; if she was a forgiving character then maybe; but she's not. Again lazy sloppy writing, enhanced by the ridiculously unrealistic and contrived fact of Ronnie being their in the first place.
And people wonder why EE looses viewers. It because they no longer give a damn about characterisation.
I can't help thinking you have a point.
With Kat being rehabilitated it had to be Alfie who's not happy with Ronnie's presence. Now, to me, Alfie's is a perfectly rational reaction and one I would have myself. I wouldn't wish Ronnie any harm but I wouldn't want her anywhere I could clap eyes on her. To me, Kat should be having Alfie's reaction but as she's being rehabilitated that was never going to happen so Alfie has been thrown to the dogs which leaves the character open to taunts like 'what's the matter with him, he's not even his kid' etc. Kat should have been the anti-Ronnie parent (and would have provided a few good locking horns scenes with Ronnie before eventually coming round perhaps?) with Alfie trying to be a bit more conciliatory because that's what he's always been like in the past. This way round just doesn't make sense to me but it's just my opinion.
I do think Janine is very sympathetic. She's never recovered from her father abandoning her and her mother dying young. Although the writing's been patchy for her at times,Charlie Brooks does make the character vulnerable, despite what she's done. Just in recent memory, her death bed scene with Pat, when her grandmother Lydia died and when Scarlett was born, all made me feel for her.
What I like about Janine,is she's unapologetic for being a bitch a lot of the time.She 's had real ups and lows during her time on the Square,but her key motivation has always been fear of abandonment and wanting security in her life. A lot of the time, she's been a golddigger to try and achieve this, but actually she wants the security of the family life,which she's never had.
Wonderfully summed up.
I've always maintained that Charlie Brooks is excellent at getting Janine's vulnerability through so many times you can feel sorry for her when in reality you really shouldn't. I'm going to miss both Charlie and Janine.
There is so much more to it than that. Kat understands that ,like her, Ronnie was damaged by abuse at an early age and had to give up her first born. And no mother knows just what they'd do if faced with a cot death. Ronnie's reaction was extreme, to put it mildly, but it happened, and they all have to live with it. IRL she would not be back in the square, but I won't lose sleep over it. They wanted to bring Ronnie back so they did.
Ultimately yes. They wanted Ronnie back and were going to bend over backwards to make it happen no matter how much they ended up bending the truth of the situation to do it. It might not have been so bad if they hadn't had that scene where Kat categorically stated that she didn't want Ronnie anywhere near the square when she was released, it jarred after that but what can you do but go with the flow if you want to continue watching? Ultimately it's a soap not a documentary but sometimes these things really bug me!
So I caught some of this when I gazed up from my laptop a few times tonight (yes, I do leave the computer now and again. To go to the fridge).
Ladies and gentlemen, it seems every time I watch, something incredible happens in Eastenders. Last time it was seeing Ava actually at work. This time, it's me actually liking Joey. Why? Because his performance (or indeed, his reason for being on screen) was not just so tween girls could fawn over him. His relationship with his sister was always a highlight of Joey, yet was never really explored, though they did try, to be fair to them. He worked better tonight than he ever has running after "Lawn" or sleeping with random bints on the square. His concern for Alice was good and nice to see! An interesting side of the character, wasted for shallow crap.
Michael continues to be his little psychotic self. I shudder to think what the show will be like without him. It is, literally, the only interesting thing going on at the moment.
I just can't work up any excitement for the obvious Kat and Alfie reunion, as redeemed as Kat is. Flash back 10 years. Kat was about to marry Andy, a gangster who was very bad news. She was marrying him for convenience, yet she really loved Alfie. Alfie for his part loved Kat, but didn't know she loved him back until his Nana told him. So off he went to the Church to win the woman of his dreams. See how this couple really were golden last time?
And for the love of all things holy... making Alfie the bad guy in this Ronnie fiasco is not only insulting, appalling and lazy... it just sucks. SHE KIDNAPPED HIS SON!!!! The fact that both he and Kat are willing to forgive her for this is just... ridiculous. Does the show need Ronnie that much? The Santar heydays of her ruling the show have passed. I see Ronnie as a reminder of how good things were a few short years ago (the same can be said for David Wicks, only extending that period), yet all she does now is mope about looking for purpose.
Yes, Alfie should not be marrying her sister if he hates her that much, but that still doesn't excuse the fact that Ronnie's unforgivable crime has been brushed under the carpet. Way to go, EE. Maybe in future you won't saddle characters you are obsessed with with such a ridiculous storyline. Baby snatching creates a shelf life for said character, as does rape and murder. The audience want them caught eventually, but until that date you can make them as entertaining and evil as you want. Hell, they've done it with Archie. Emmerdale's done it with Cameron recently. But there has to be an end. Kaput. And that's the issue here. Kirkwood gave this car crash of a story to the show's damn LEADING LADY! This explains her return, but does not justify it.
As for Whitney and Sharon... who cares? Sharon has been decimated, and Whitney is just a little skank.
I suppose the saving grace tonight was the non-appearance of Lauren. Every episode improves when that happens.
Look. I used to love Eastenders. It was a brilliant show we could discuss, debate, complain about even... but ultimately it captured us all. The past 3 years have been a case of me dipping in, being appalled, and dipping out. Every time I sit down to watch an episode, I am most of the time appalled by the crap, and even if the episode is good, the ones following it will be terrible. I really, really don't want to hate the show! I'm sure many of you feel the same way!
It's just shallow. It's written for shallow people, contains shallow characters, and played by actors hired for shallow reasons. Janine's off, the cast is continuing to be flooded with kids (seriously, enough already!) that will just add nothing to it. Tbh I'm expecting nothing from DTC. I'll no doubt dip in and out, but something is rotten over at EE now, and a few sensationalist stories will not help.
I love what I've bolded.
To me (again going against the grain) Ronnie's return should have been short and sharp like David Wick's return for Pat's funeral. Come back, shake things up for a couple of weeks then leave having created a bit of havoc.
Right. Re Whitney. Should she have been sacked for Denny's lie? Of course not but I would have liked to have seen her being told off for not seeing to Denny's wound properly at least and for her general attitude towards him. I take it Ava didn't grass her up for her verbal attack on Sharon? Shame. She made clear in front of a 7 year old child that she's supposed to be in charge of that she couldn't stand him. She made clear to Sharon tonight in the pub that she couldn't stand him. If I was Sharon I'd have been straight round to that school to tell the rather ineffectual head exactly what Whitney had just gloatingly said, that I'd be taking i to the governors and the LEA (or whatever it's called nowadays). No way would I put up with that sh!t outside of school. Whitney needs to be taught how to deal with parents in a proper manner because with her background of Bianca and Carol she hasn't got a bloody clue.
Going against the grain again, what can I say, I'm a rebel!
Right. Re Whitney. Should she have been sacked for Denny's lie? Of course not but I would have liked to have seen her being told off for not seeing to Denny's wound properly at least and for her general attitude towards him. I take it Ava didn't grass her up for her verbal attack on Sharon? Shame. She made clear in front of a 7 year old child that she's supposed to be in charge of that she couldn't stand him. She made clear to Sharon tonight in the pub that she couldn't stand him. If I was Sharon I'd have been straight round to that school to tell the rather ineffectual head exactly what Whitney had just gloatingly said, that I'd be taking i to the governors and the LEA (or whatever it's called nowadays). No way would I put up with that sh!t outside of school. Whitney needs to be taught how to deal with parents in a proper manner because with her background of Bianca and Carol she hasn't got a bloody clue.
Agree with all of that.
Janine should now write off her so called family and also her 'staff' They were all very mean spirited.
Great scene with Poppy, he was checking her out as she walked off :eek:
Dipped into Easties again yesterday and have to agree with the BIB, it really was a great scene!!!
Weird how, even though Poppy is normally portrayed as being so very very ditzy, she sometimes comes out with the most perceptive things!!!!
Everyone’s looking for Alice. Miss Joey Marple’s on the case though, so rest assured she should be found…never. No one wants to speak to her more than Michael though, who’s clearly concerned that she’s going to come back and spill the beans to Janine that he’s trying to drug and kill her with sleeping tablets. He’s unfazed by this though and ploughing on with the plan. If he doesn’t manage to get the drugs into a shiny red apple somehow, I shall be extremely disappointed.
I did feel a bit sorry for Janine, even though she’s made a rod for her own back with how she treats people, she can’t expect them to be at her beck and call only when she needs them. That being said, no one should be alone on their birthday. That doesn’t excuse throwing that amazing cake out though. That’s probably the most inexcusable thing the character’s ever done. They should send Mary Berry round her house to rescue it.
Michael is slowly being inning to unravel, his behaviour escalating to extreme proportions. Will he actually be able to kill the mother of his child? As much as Janine within this episode seemed lonely, warm and docile, we know that this is not the case at all times. Her past behaviour has proved that she too is capable of destroying lives without flinching. The wild card in all this is Alice if she returns. Is she capable of extreme acts too when pushed to the limit?
“I’ll give you everything you need…But I don’t think I need you.”
Ronnie, Roxy, Alfie and Kat, our love…rectangle…kind of. The Michael and Janine story seems to be coming to a conclusion, and soon after it appears that The Baby Swap fallout will finally reach a new chapter. Will Roxy and Alfie be able to stay true to each other, even though the people they love the most are distance within their lives? Or will the draw of Ronnie for Roxy and Kat for Alfie be to much for their relationship to take. No one knows. Well, they do if they’ve read spoilers, but lets pretend we live in a magical spoiler free world. Would Alfie and Roxy stand a chance if Ronnie and Kat were out of the picture? Maybe, they would. The problem is that as much as they try and get away from them and pretend they aren’t there, they can’t ignore them.
Alfie is the one holding them all up from being happy though.Kat says that he told her “Not let the past decide on the future”, but that’s absolutely what he’s doing to all three women. He can’t forgive Ronnie for her actions, which is understandable, but he’s hurting himself most of all. He’s made a baby step by inviting her to the wedding, but I don’t feel that he’s gonna be wild about having her round for Christmas lunch or anything. He’s never going to be happy with Roxy unless he loves her for who she truly is. He’s denying her seeing her family and is trying to pretend that she’s the safe option and will never let him down. He thinks he can control her, which he probably can for a while, but within a marriage that will soon unravel. Clearly he loves Kat and wants to be with her, but he knows he can’t trust her. Maybe he’s right and she will hurt him again, but choosing Roxy over Kat just because he thinks he might not get hurt isn’t fair to anyone.
Poor Kat I felt really sorry for her when they announced the wedding date. She did bring it all on herself, but you still feel sympathy for her, the same with Janine and her birthday. She knows her mistakes, she knows her faults. She’s managed show forgiveness to Ronnie, an act which could not be easy considering what happened and should be commended for that. I like the uneasy friendship between the two ladies, it seems natural, and both are really strong actresses that manage to convey the complexity of their relationship. They aren't fully comfortable with each other, it's like walking on eggshells for both of them.
“But now I’ve seen it though, And now I know the truth.”
Whitney’s been cleared, and rightly so, although hopefully she has learned some lessons for the future. Dennis certainly won’t be the last difficult child she comes across if she continues her career in this field, and won’t be the only difficult parent either who are blinkered to their child‘s issues, so she needs to learn control and the school needs to give her better training and support. Yes Dennis is being obnoxious, because he wants attention. The important thing is that he’s a child and they need to all work together to nip this behaviour in the bud before he turns into a teenager who bullies because he wants attention, and a adult who insults and attacks because they are insecure and want attention. He’s just a child and he needs to have some structure and support at both home and school to combat his behaviour.
I’m still loving how natural it feels to have David within that family. He just binds it together, and his scenes with anyone in that household really do feel genuine. His scenes with anyone are brilliant, but especially within the family. I can’t wait for Bianca to come back next week. I really love David and Bianca scenes, and her return will make that family even stronger within the show, something I’m really looking forward to.
“We held our breath, To see our names are written”
So we‘re still on the football team storyline then, eh? I don’t hate it, I don’t really feel anything about it I guess. They’re obviously making it a light hearted storyline, which actually works ok this week than it has in past weeks, because we actually have a darker storyline to contrast it. I do think they could make it even more humorous though. I’m guessing it was a way to get Danny integrated into the Square. I think Gary Lucy is actually a good soap actor, but I’m still unsure about this character for him. He seems a bit more appropriate now that they are ‘softening’ Danny a bit more. To have him as this mean, heartless city executive really didn’t wash with me. I’ll give them a few more months anyway, especially with the new boss and team, and see if he settles in a bit more.
OTHER
- “I don’t think that particular blandishment will mollify her somehow. “ Joey’s face was hilarious after Michael said that to him. He looked like a dog trying to understand a human conversation.
- I love Michael’s Chair of Evil. I wish it swivelled.
- Poor Jack, it took Carol three days to notice he’s gone, and Roxy didn’t even notice at all.
- Why did Alfie and Roxy go to the café before going to their home? Take your luggage in first for crying out loud!
- “A generic girls’s name like Emma or Besty or Gemma.” I love Michael. I love him, I love him, I love him…
- “You’re being quite hostile to me Tam..war.” …I love him.
A promising start to the week, it finally feels like we’re moving on to things happening in various storylines. Michael vesus Janine, is always good and that’s really picked up speed. We know something bad is going to happen, we just don’t know how, and it’s refreshing within a soap to have that mystery. We’ve got a date for the Roxy and Alfie wedding, and it’s soon, less than a month, which is also promising. We haven’t had a lot of ‘big’ events on the show recently, and this one looks all set to be an angst filled wedding, so I can’t wait. The Jackson/Wicks/Butchers continue to be extremely watchable part of the show. The football story didn’t set my world alight though. I'd quite like it to exit stage left immediately. I give this episode a C+.
Comments
Because kat is the type to let go. No matter how you square it, her actions don't ring true; if she was a forgiving character then maybe; but she's not. Again lazy sloppy writing, enhanced by the ridiculously unrealistic and contrived fact of Ronnie being their in the first place.
And people wonder why EE looses viewers. It because they no longer give a damn about characterisation.
What I like about Janine,is she's unapologetic for being a bitch a lot of the time.She 's had real ups and lows during her time on the Square,but her key motivation has always been fear of abandonment and wanting security in her life. A lot of the time, she's been a golddigger to try and achieve this, but actually she wants the security of the family life,which she's never had.
Michael was unintentionally hilarious as usual.
Glad Whitney got her job back.
Kat and Alfie still have chemistry.
We need to see more David I reckon
All he does i eat..see him eat that cream doughnut:D
Kat and alfie scenes were good tonight as well, Kat being the voice of reason lately is a nice change. They have really saved her from her return.
There is so much more to it than that. Kat understands that ,like her, Ronnie was damaged by abuse at an early age and had to give up her first born. And no mother knows just what they'd do if faced with a cot death. Ronnie's reaction was extreme, to put it mildly, but it happened, and they all have to live with it. IRL she would not be back in the square, but I won't lose sleep over it. They wanted to bring Ronnie back so they did.
. I am sorry but when she was stealing from barry and willing him to die (a man who licked the floor she walked) she didnt seem too worried about abandonment then.
How was she going to achieve a family with the 80 year old? she just wanted his cash. She had pat and the jacksons and when she wasn't putting them down she was running to them when she needed something like a user. Much like stacey fans i am sure u like the actress and so naturally you will like the character but janine isnt sympathetic at all.
I loved Whitney telling Sharon, that the police believed her and that Denny was a spoiled, little, brat. Whitney looked really happy with Carol and David too.
Michael's put down of Joey was brilliant too and poor Janine, not even Billy showed up for her party..
Also good on David for telling Sharon to do one in the cafe :mad:
Whitney is so much better when she's not playing the 'dirty girl' card with whichever boy is being nice to her.
Agree with this.
He doesn't actually know her.
and large fries please.
He needed a few weeks off so they could talk. :rolleyes:
Not for long
He may be a great grandfather but there is not a single grey hair in that full head of hair.
It was so predictable
They weren't allowed to turn up
Thanks for noticing.
Ladies and gentlemen, it seems every time I watch, something incredible happens in Eastenders. Last time it was seeing Ava actually at work. This time, it's me actually liking Joey. Why? Because his performance (or indeed, his reason for being on screen) was not just so tween girls could fawn over him. His relationship with his sister was always a highlight of Joey, yet was never really explored, though they did try, to be fair to them. He worked better tonight than he ever has running after "Lawn" or sleeping with random bints on the square. His concern for Alice was good and nice to see! An interesting side of the character, wasted for shallow crap.
Michael continues to be his little psychotic self. I shudder to think what the show will be like without him. It is, literally, the only interesting thing going on at the moment.
I just can't work up any excitement for the obvious Kat and Alfie reunion, as redeemed as Kat is. Flash back 10 years. Kat was about to marry Andy, a gangster who was very bad news. She was marrying him for convenience, yet she really loved Alfie. Alfie for his part loved Kat, but didn't know she loved him back until his Nana told him. So off he went to the Church to win the woman of his dreams. See how this couple really were golden last time?
And for the love of all things holy... making Alfie the bad guy in this Ronnie fiasco is not only insulting, appalling and lazy... it just sucks. SHE KIDNAPPED HIS SON!!!! The fact that both he and Kat are willing to forgive her for this is just... ridiculous. Does the show need Ronnie that much? The Santar heydays of her ruling the show have passed. I see Ronnie as a reminder of how good things were a few short years ago (the same can be said for David Wicks, only extending that period), yet all she does now is mope about looking for purpose.
Yes, Alfie should not be marrying her sister if he hates her that much, but that still doesn't excuse the fact that Ronnie's unforgivable crime has been brushed under the carpet. Way to go, EE. Maybe in future you won't saddle characters you are obsessed with with such a ridiculous storyline. Baby snatching creates a shelf life for said character, as does rape and murder. The audience want them caught eventually, but until that date you can make them as entertaining and evil as you want. Hell, they've done it with Archie. Emmerdale's done it with Cameron recently. But there has to be an end. Kaput. And that's the issue here. Kirkwood gave this car crash of a story to the show's damn LEADING LADY! This explains her return, but does not justify it.
As for Whitney and Sharon... who cares? Sharon has been decimated, and Whitney is just a little skank.
I suppose the saving grace tonight was the non-appearance of Lauren. Every episode improves when that happens.
Look. I used to love Eastenders. It was a brilliant show we could discuss, debate, complain about even... but ultimately it captured us all. The past 3 years have been a case of me dipping in, being appalled, and dipping out. Every time I sit down to watch an episode, I am most of the time appalled by the crap, and even if the episode is good, the ones following it will be terrible. I really, really don't want to hate the show! I'm sure many of you feel the same way!
It's just shallow. It's written for shallow people, contains shallow characters, and played by actors hired for shallow reasons. Janine's off, the cast is continuing to be flooded with kids (seriously, enough already!) that will just add nothing to it. Tbh I'm expecting nothing from DTC. I'll no doubt dip in and out, but something is rotten over at EE now, and a few sensationalist stories will not help.
@ Dullag - I didn't know DS Enders had returned (I've been on holiday) Hooray! I'm going to have to scan the forum now for the previous episodes
Exactly. It would be imprinted on his brain from the times he wanted to get his mitts on her fortune so he was buttering her up. I doubt very much he'd forget yet another occasion that he could use to his advantage.
LOL!!! I don't know about anyone else but I didn't systematically carry my nearly 5 year olds around all the time? My back wouldn't have taken the strain! Talk about babying her child.
I wonder what Ian (the owner) would have to say at his estranged half brother ordering one of his oldest friends out of his cafe?
I notice that KAT didn't argue when he said 'our son'.
As to not being his kid, Alfie might not be biologically but he is in every other single way that counts. He's bonded with that child and, perhaps more importantly, the child has bonded with him. Alfie has been there since day one. They love each other. Kat has no problem referring to Alfie as the child's father and that really should be good enough for everyone else IMO.
Ronnie will forgive her like a shot. Who else does SHE have really especially now Jack's gone.
I agree. I am so going to miss his acerbic tongue!
LOL, nice one SULLA!
I laughed last week when he referred to Alice as his 'acolyte'
God knows I'd hate to know a Michael in real life (might not get out alive, *eeeeeeeek!*) but he is so entertaining to watch.
Reminds me of Christopher Lee playing Dracula. Just waiting for his latest prey to walk through the door!
Or CCTV? I believe that is getting more common in schools.
I absolutely refuse to believe that both of Janine's sisters and her brother would forget her birthday. The Jackson/Brannings, absolutely, up their own @rses and only concentrating on their own problems. Billy, well, he's Billy isn't he? Hardly surprising! But EE always have to go one step too far and make absolutely everyone forget :rolleyes:
Quite frankly if I was Janine I'd be putting Bianca/Carol's rent up after THAT. She is doing them a massive favour and they repay her by forgetting her 30th birthday? Why should I be surprised though? FFS, Carol forgot her own father's 80th birthday!!! Notice hers wasn't ignored though, about time it was IMO.
I don't know one single person who's done that. Not one. I've known people have strops and take their Xmas decorations down on Boxing Day morning because they've fallen out with their other halves (upsetting their kids twice!) but I've never seen anyone chuck food or big cakes in the bin!
Does anyone else know anyone who's done that?
I felt for Janine. God knows I know she's anything but perfect but she's always had a guard up protecting herself and it seems she's done such a good job now she's pushed everyone away. She must miss Pat dreadfully.
OMG, he does doesn't he? He must be an @rse man!
No woman should go along with it.
Exactly.
I can't help thinking you have a point.
With Kat being rehabilitated it had to be Alfie who's not happy with Ronnie's presence. Now, to me, Alfie's is a perfectly rational reaction and one I would have myself. I wouldn't wish Ronnie any harm but I wouldn't want her anywhere I could clap eyes on her. To me, Kat should be having Alfie's reaction but as she's being rehabilitated that was never going to happen so Alfie has been thrown to the dogs which leaves the character open to taunts like 'what's the matter with him, he's not even his kid' etc. Kat should have been the anti-Ronnie parent (and would have provided a few good locking horns scenes with Ronnie before eventually coming round perhaps?) with Alfie trying to be a bit more conciliatory because that's what he's always been like in the past. This way round just doesn't make sense to me but it's just my opinion.
Wonderfully summed up.
I've always maintained that Charlie Brooks is excellent at getting Janine's vulnerability through so many times you can feel sorry for her when in reality you really shouldn't. I'm going to miss both Charlie and Janine.
Ultimately yes. They wanted Ronnie back and were going to bend over backwards to make it happen no matter how much they ended up bending the truth of the situation to do it. It might not have been so bad if they hadn't had that scene where Kat categorically stated that she didn't want Ronnie anywhere near the square when she was released, it jarred after that but what can you do but go with the flow if you want to continue watching? Ultimately it's a soap not a documentary but sometimes these things really bug me!
I love what I've bolded.
To me (again going against the grain) Ronnie's return should have been short and sharp like David Wick's return for Pat's funeral. Come back, shake things up for a couple of weeks then leave having created a bit of havoc.
Right. Re Whitney. Should she have been sacked for Denny's lie? Of course not but I would have liked to have seen her being told off for not seeing to Denny's wound properly at least and for her general attitude towards him. I take it Ava didn't grass her up for her verbal attack on Sharon? Shame. She made clear in front of a 7 year old child that she's supposed to be in charge of that she couldn't stand him. She made clear to Sharon tonight in the pub that she couldn't stand him. If I was Sharon I'd have been straight round to that school to tell the rather ineffectual head exactly what Whitney had just gloatingly said, that I'd be taking i to the governors and the LEA (or whatever it's called nowadays). No way would I put up with that sh!t outside of school. Whitney needs to be taught how to deal with parents in a proper manner because with her background of Bianca and Carol she hasn't got a bloody clue.
Going against the grain again, what can I say, I'm a rebel!
Agree with all of that.
Janine should now write off her so called family and also her 'staff' They were all very mean spirited.
Dipped into Easties again yesterday and have to agree with the BIB, it really was a great scene!!!
Weird how, even though Poppy is normally portrayed as being so very very ditzy, she sometimes comes out with the most perceptive things!!!!
Roxy and Alfie will NOT marry. I don't think so. And Roxy was never thinking about Jack. What a wonder...
Haha Sharon. Whitney wins the fight for now.
Everyone’s looking for Alice. Miss Joey Marple’s on the case though, so rest assured she should be found…never. No one wants to speak to her more than Michael though, who’s clearly concerned that she’s going to come back and spill the beans to Janine that he’s trying to drug and kill her with sleeping tablets. He’s unfazed by this though and ploughing on with the plan. If he doesn’t manage to get the drugs into a shiny red apple somehow, I shall be extremely disappointed.
I did feel a bit sorry for Janine, even though she’s made a rod for her own back with how she treats people, she can’t expect them to be at her beck and call only when she needs them. That being said, no one should be alone on their birthday. That doesn’t excuse throwing that amazing cake out though. That’s probably the most inexcusable thing the character’s ever done. They should send Mary Berry round her house to rescue it.
Michael is slowly being inning to unravel, his behaviour escalating to extreme proportions. Will he actually be able to kill the mother of his child? As much as Janine within this episode seemed lonely, warm and docile, we know that this is not the case at all times. Her past behaviour has proved that she too is capable of destroying lives without flinching. The wild card in all this is Alice if she returns. Is she capable of extreme acts too when pushed to the limit?
“I’ll give you everything you need…But I don’t think I need you.”
Ronnie, Roxy, Alfie and Kat, our love…rectangle…kind of. The Michael and Janine story seems to be coming to a conclusion, and soon after it appears that The Baby Swap fallout will finally reach a new chapter. Will Roxy and Alfie be able to stay true to each other, even though the people they love the most are distance within their lives? Or will the draw of Ronnie for Roxy and Kat for Alfie be to much for their relationship to take. No one knows. Well, they do if they’ve read spoilers, but lets pretend we live in a magical spoiler free world. Would Alfie and Roxy stand a chance if Ronnie and Kat were out of the picture? Maybe, they would. The problem is that as much as they try and get away from them and pretend they aren’t there, they can’t ignore them.
Alfie is the one holding them all up from being happy though.Kat says that he told her “Not let the past decide on the future”, but that’s absolutely what he’s doing to all three women. He can’t forgive Ronnie for her actions, which is understandable, but he’s hurting himself most of all. He’s made a baby step by inviting her to the wedding, but I don’t feel that he’s gonna be wild about having her round for Christmas lunch or anything. He’s never going to be happy with Roxy unless he loves her for who she truly is. He’s denying her seeing her family and is trying to pretend that she’s the safe option and will never let him down. He thinks he can control her, which he probably can for a while, but within a marriage that will soon unravel. Clearly he loves Kat and wants to be with her, but he knows he can’t trust her. Maybe he’s right and she will hurt him again, but choosing Roxy over Kat just because he thinks he might not get hurt isn’t fair to anyone.
Poor Kat
“But now I’ve seen it though, And now I know the truth.”
Whitney’s been cleared, and rightly so, although hopefully she has learned some lessons for the future. Dennis certainly won’t be the last difficult child she comes across if she continues her career in this field, and won’t be the only difficult parent either who are blinkered to their child‘s issues, so she needs to learn control and the school needs to give her better training and support. Yes Dennis is being obnoxious, because he wants attention. The important thing is that he’s a child and they need to all work together to nip this behaviour in the bud before he turns into a teenager who bullies because he wants attention, and a adult who insults and attacks because they are insecure and want attention. He’s just a child and he needs to have some structure and support at both home and school to combat his behaviour.
I’m still loving how natural it feels to have David within that family. He just binds it together, and his scenes with anyone in that household really do feel genuine. His scenes with anyone are brilliant, but especially within the family. I can’t wait for Bianca to come back next week. I really love David and Bianca scenes, and her return will make that family even stronger within the show, something I’m really looking forward to.
“We held our breath, To see our names are written”
So we‘re still on the football team storyline then, eh? I don’t hate it, I don’t really feel anything about it I guess. They’re obviously making it a light hearted storyline, which actually works ok this week than it has in past weeks, because we actually have a darker storyline to contrast it. I do think they could make it even more humorous though. I’m guessing it was a way to get Danny integrated into the Square. I think Gary Lucy is actually a good soap actor, but I’m still unsure about this character for him. He seems a bit more appropriate now that they are ‘softening’ Danny a bit more. To have him as this mean, heartless city executive really didn’t wash with me. I’ll give them a few more months anyway, especially with the new boss and team, and see if he settles in a bit more.
OTHER
- “I don’t think that particular blandishment will mollify her somehow. “ Joey’s face was hilarious after Michael said that to him. He looked like a dog trying to understand a human conversation.
- I love Michael’s Chair of Evil. I wish it swivelled.
- Poor Jack, it took Carol three days to notice he’s gone, and Roxy didn’t even notice at all.
- Why did Alfie and Roxy go to the café before going to their home? Take your luggage in first for crying out loud!
- “A generic girls’s name like Emma or Besty or Gemma.” I love Michael. I love him, I love him, I love him…
- “You’re being quite hostile to me Tam..war.” …I love him.
A promising start to the week, it finally feels like we’re moving on to things happening in various storylines. Michael vesus Janine, is always good and that’s really picked up speed. We know something bad is going to happen, we just don’t know how, and it’s refreshing within a soap to have that mystery. We’ve got a date for the Roxy and Alfie wedding, and it’s soon, less than a month, which is also promising. We haven’t had a lot of ‘big’ events on the show recently, and this one looks all set to be an angst filled wedding, so I can’t wait. The Jackson/Wicks/Butchers continue to be extremely watchable part of the show. The football story didn’t set my world alight though. I'd quite like it to exit stage left immediately. I give this episode a C+.