Theory on how the timelords could return

[Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 618
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The timelords original attempt to escape the time war was by using the Master as a pathway to the universe outside. They could do this because he existed both inside and outside of the time lock.

There are two other entities that like the Master also exist both inside and outside of the time lock, the Doctor and the Tardis.

We know from 'The Doctors Wife', that when the original (Hartnell) Doctor was trying to escape from Galifrey that he found the Tardis with its doors open and ready to leave. What if it was the timelords themselves that put the Tardis there, knowing that the Doctor would use it to escape? This would mean that the timelords had been playing the Doctor since the very begining. The timelords would have known that they couldn't escape until after their failed first attempt that was foiled by the Doctor and the Master, but now that those events are past the Tardis could start to put into action the timelords escape plan.

The first part of that plan was to put into place the events that would lead to the creation of Melody Pond and the death of the Doctor. Now that hasn't gone exactly to plan, with the Doctor being aware of his pending death by Lake Silencio. He is sure to find a way around that.

The second part of the plan would be for Melody and / or the Tardis to create a physical gateway between the time lock and the rest of the universe. I suspect this could be why the original Tardis exploded and caused the end of the old universe, because it was programmed to do so by the timelords. This could have released the timelords into their ascended pure conciousness forms, but they most likely didn't expect the Doctor to reboot the universe.

If the timelords have escaped in this manner, then it may also be possible that Master has too. Only he wouldn't have been allowed to ascend, so would most likely still be in his physical and presumably still dying body. This would however allow him to find the Doctor and warn him of the timelords plans.

The next bit may contain spoilers, so read at your peril:
We know that the Doctor is set to be betrayed on a huge scale, well what could be bigger than not just his own people but his lifelong most loyal companion, the Tardis, having been manipulating him from the very start.

It has also been mentioned that Gallifreyan Regeneration Cubes would play a part in the upcoming episodes, could this be a way to save both the Doctor and the Master?

Now the end result of all of this would be to leave the timelords restored to ultimate power, possibly as ascended beings, and would almost certainly see the Doctor being on the run again from his own people. Could this also give us the dream ticket companion for the next season, the Master?


So what do you guys think, would this be possible?
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Comments

  • ZariusZarius Posts: 176
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    Let the Time Lords go already, they dilute the mystique and uniqueness of The Doctor,.. there's a reason RTD made them made it clear they should never be brought back, there's also a reason Moffat dislikes them...too omnipotent. It's bad enough the sonic screwdriver takes away the drama of problem-solving, Time Lords would take the drama away completly, especially in the state they are now where they can wave away anything with a magic glove.
  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 672
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    Zarius wrote: »
    Let the Time Lords go already, they dilute the mystique and uniqueness of The Doctor,.. there's a reason RTD made them made it clear they should never be brought back, there's also a reason Moffat dislikes them...too omnipotent. It's bad enough the sonic screwdriver takes away the drama of problem-solving, Time Lords would take the drama away completly, especially in the state they are now where they can wave away anything with a magic glove.

    Yep I agree, the Classic Time Lords were too omnipotent...

    But if there was a good plot involving their return, but not a return to their former status in the universe, it could perhaps be quite interesting.
  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 73
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    Yep I agree, the Classic Time Lords were too omnipotent...

    But if there was a good plot involving their return, but not a return to their former status in the universe, it could perhaps be quite interesting.

    I know it's been a while since these postings but I just got this thread from a random google search so..

    Getting rid of the Timelords on grounds of their omnipotence is pure BBC bull**** and the best thing that can be said of this manouvre is that it qualifies as a low grade dramatic device

    Yes they were omnipotent. Did they exercise that omnipotence? No.

    They sent one Timelord to tell Tom Baker to go stop the Daleks before they became dangerous.

    They didn't blow skaro away with the hand of omega or bury it in a time loop or drop a passing planetoid on it they sent one man to ask another man to look into the situation with a specific goal

    The magic of the Time Lords was in their possessing god like powers, and possibly wisdom, but not using them. They didn't interfere. It's the kind of moral high ground we see in Star Trek where you don't strut in front of lesser species you simply consider and help them if possible.

    Either RTD missed the point or the Beeb had some other agenda.They turned good into bad to make an excuse to get rid of them.
  • ThrombinThrombin Posts: 9,416
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    I agree. As long as they didn't interfere, their omnipotence was never an issue. Plus, I'm not sure that they were that omnipotent anyway. Big Finish's Gallifrey series had plenty of trauma for the Time Lords.

    I like the idea that Time Travel and manipulation needs to be policed in order to prevent the kind of Time-related catastrophes that have been causing such problems in recent series. It makes sense that you would need someone to monitor and correct problems with the time lines in order to preserve the integrity of the Universe and the Time Lords were those people.

    I think the original idea of writing the Time Lords out was just that they came with a lot of back story which would just confuse new viewers but now that the Time Lords are back in the continuity of the series I don't see any reason not to bring them back.

    At least bring back Romana :D
  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 455
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    Great, Romana and River in the TARDIS together. Can't imagine how that would turn out:eek:
  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 73
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    Thrombin wrote: »
    At least bring back Romana :D

    Mary Tamm was the best there was, the best there is, and the best there ever will be.

    The new 'emmerdales' companion might measure up, assuming she hasn't been cast as Jenny at regeneration 2, or River's sister ( spoilers say Rory got sent into the past by a Weeping Angel and Amy got one of them to send her back to be with him ) but I won't hold my breath.
  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 455
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    Depends. If River's sister is called Susan things could get really interesting. Besides, if Jenna-Louise is Jenny the 2nd, it would be great provided the Doctor doesn't find out (especially if River does!):D
  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 73
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    Joanne1938 wrote: »
    Great, Romana and River in the TARDIS together. Can't imagine how that would turn out:eek:

    It would be Asolutely Fantastic. Imagine what it must be like for a chap in a tweed jacket and bow tie to have to tell himself he cannot possibly fall in love with two leading ladies simultaneously.

    Please pardon my use of outdated colloquialisms. I've been in the eastern hemisphere for some time.
  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 455
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    Or maybe it would be Absolutely Fabulous and the Doctor might end up on Prozac:confused: Then again, what if the two girls didn't get on?
  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 455
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    Brilliant idea!!!! Saffy:D as the new Doctor!!
  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 73
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    Joanne1938 wrote: »
    Depends. If River's sister is called Susan things could get really interesting. Besides, if Jenna-Louise is Jenny the 2nd, it would be great provided the Doctor doesn't find out (especially if River does!):D

    He would find out. Timelordkind have a way of recognising each other. And River most likely already knows. I quote the Moff 'You think you know all about River but ..'

    And the Susan anomaly will never be explained regardless of how much it deserves to be.
  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 73
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    Joanne1938 wrote: »
    Or maybe it would be Absolutely Fabulous and the Doctor might end up on Prozac:confused: Then again, what if the two girls didn't get on?

    I wouldn't know. Out here in the Eastern Hemisphere a chap's wifes get along famously.
  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 73
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    Joanne1938 wrote: »
    Brilliant idea!!!! Saffy:D as the new Doctor!!

    I googled it but didn't..and I cringe lowering my head below the desktop before asking because google in this hemisphere cannot enlighten me..who is Saffy?
  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 455
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    In the TV series Absolutely Fabulous (hilarious, you must look it up), there are two lead women, Edina and Patsy. Edina's put-upon daughter is Saffron (Saffy). It is seriously funny, see if you can get it on you tube or BBC America:D
  • nebogipfelnebogipfel Posts: 8,375
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    farstanley wrote: »
    I wouldn't know. Out here in the Eastern Hemisphere our wives get along famously.

    Cho-Je! You escaped the time lock, then?
  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 73
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    Joanne1938 wrote: »
    In the TV series Absolutely Fabulous (hilarious, you must look it up), there are two lead women, Edina and Patsy. Edina's put-upon daughter is Saffron (Saffy). It is seriously funny, see if you can get it on you tube or BBC America:D

    I remember. Thank you!
  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 73
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    nebogipfel wrote: »
    Cho-Je! You escaped the time lock, then?

    Ah So !
  • sovietusernamesovietusername Posts: 1,169
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    I always thought Matrix would be a good way to bring the time lords back, after all thats where the minds of dead timelords are stored. What if that virtual reality somehow escaped the time war, and the time lord are somehow uploaded to the real universe again...
  • TEDRTEDR Posts: 3,413
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    Joanne1938 wrote: »
    In the TV series Absolutely Fabulous (hilarious, you must look it up), there are two lead women, Edina and Patsy. Edina's put-upon daughter is Saffron (Saffy). It is seriously funny, see if you can get it on you tube or BBC America:D

    Of course, she's also Lynda from Moffatt's Press Gang, and I think was considered to become the new companion after Ace had the programme made it into 1990. Or so the rumour goes.
  • jenziejenzie Posts: 20,821
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    "There are two other entities that like the Master also exist both inside and outside of the time lock, the Doctor and the Tardis"

    uuh, where are you getting THAT idea from???
  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 618
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    jenzie wrote: »
    "There are two other entities that like the Master also exist both inside and outside of the time lock, the Doctor and the Tardis"

    uuh, where are you getting THAT idea from???

    It has been established in the show that the Doctor actively took part in the Time War. As he put it, he 'fought on the front lines'. We can also safely assume that he had his Tardis with him. That clearly shows that the Doctor existed at a point in time that is now considered to be contained within the time lock.

    Also as the Doctor and Tardis are now continuing to have adventures after the end of the time war, they both obviously exist outside the time lock.

    This is exactly the same situation that affected the Master, and allowed the Time Lords within the time lock to utilize the future version of the Master that existed outside the time lock as a means of escape.
  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 2,818
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    I would like it if the doctor goes somewhere and ran into a timelord, who travelled there before the time war and the doctor tries to save him or her
  • Sophie ~Oohie~Sophie ~Oohie~ Posts: 10,395
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    I always thought Matrix would be a good way to bring the time lords back, after all thats where the minds of dead timelords are stored. What if that virtual reality somehow escaped the time war, and the time lord are somehow uploaded to the real universe again...
    Sorry I'm not too sure what this means because I've hardly watched anything before 2005, is it like when River gets saved into the library? :confused:

    So okay, what if the Matrix was uploaded into the Earth Internet somehow, or into an advanced data centre or similar, and all those evil Time Lords can cause havoc without even being seen. I presume there would be evil ones because they died in the Time War after they became power-crazy. Would this be interesting or ridiculous? :o

    By the way, anyone else having network problems? The speed's been up and down all morning and now websites are giving me a weird symbol language that Google Translate can't identify. Oh and my sister kept me up half the night saying there were funny voices on her phone. She doesn't have any received calls on it, so she must be having me on, right?
    ;):D
  • Sophie ~Oohie~Sophie ~Oohie~ Posts: 10,395
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    I would like it if the doctor goes somewhere and ran into a timelord, who travelled there before the time war and the doctor tries to save him or her
    I would like this, is s/he also being tortured and/or having a failed regeneration? ;)
  • sovietusernamesovietusername Posts: 1,169
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    Sorry I'm not too sure what this means because I've hardly watched anything before 2005, is it like when River gets saved into the library? :confused:

    So okay, what if the Matrix was uploaded into the Earth Internet somehow, or into an advanced data centre or similar, and all those evil Time Lords can cause havoc without even being seen. I presume there would be evil ones because they died in the Time War after they became power-crazy. Would this be interesting or ridiculous? :o

    By the way, anyone else having network problems? The speed's been up and down all morning and now websites are giving me a weird symbol language that Google Translate can't identify. Oh and my sister kept me up half the night saying there were funny voices on her phone. She doesn't have any received calls on it, so she must be having me on, right?
    ;):D



    I dont actually know that much about as not seen any episodes set on Gallifrey but apparently the Time Lords had a virtual reality called the matrix where all their knowledge survived. I imagine a single machine surviving the war in which the minds of the time lords continue to exist in a virtual reality. Then something could happen which would allow their continued existence in the real universe, a new Gallifrey! Thats waht I'd want, I dont think I'd want them confined to cyberspace although....

    http://tardis.wikia.com/wiki/The_Matrix

    Also, I'd imagine them as all being bad, the time war devestating all time. The Time Lords could be TH enext big baddie.

    Maybe your network problems are down to them?:D
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