iPad mini from £269 worth it?

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  • grumpyoldbatgrumpyoldbat Posts: 3,663
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    paulbrock wrote: »
    a tiny slither. 700k vs 650k from what I remember, with the smaller one growing faster.

    When you're talking about tablet optimised apps the numbers aren't this big.

    Apple claim 275,000 apps are specific to iPad. By that I suspect they mean they include at least the iPad specific resolution of 768x1024.

    The thing is, when you develop an app for a small phone screen versus a large tablet screen, it's not just as simple as scaling up and making everything bigger. There are design changes to consider, whether UI elements should be made bigger. What better use of the larger screen can be made to increase the usability of an app.

    This applies across both Android and iOS - just making something bigger, doesn't necessarily make it better and tablet optimised, there's a lot more to it. I wish more developers would spend the time and effort really optimising their apps rather than just expecting us to use the phone versions either in a little box on screen or just scaled up so they look a bit cack!
  • shepster34shepster34 Posts: 1,092
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    Really surprised at the price. I thought the idea was to stop google and amazon getting a larger foothold in this 7inch market. Price plays a large part in this market i think and the percieved going rate for a 7 inch tablet is quite low, certainly not £269. If they had priced it at £199 or even £229 it would have been better value and wiped the floor with the others. I was really expecting apple to be quite ruthless but the company seems more about profits each passing year. Its not even retina display....i'll stick to my £120 64gb playbook. It does what i need perfectly.

    I also agree with the fact you are buying an apple brand, so i see alot of potential ipod touch customers buying this.
  • Miles_TMiles_T Posts: 2,519
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    does this still require you to have itunes to use it at all? I can't stand having to use itunes to update everything, horrible piece of software.
  • alan1302alan1302 Posts: 6,336
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    Zack06 wrote: »
    But can it emulate all the PS1 games smoothly with OpenGL like Android can? Didn't think so. The Google Play Book Store has more titles than the Amazon one apparently, and I just think the UI is rubbish. Blackberry has not invested in QNX and when you compare it to Android's Holo UI, it's just lacking in comparison.

    But if someone spent a bit of time with the Playbook would it be possible? And to be fair playing emulated PS1 games is hardly the height of gaming these days.

    Does the Google Play Book Store have more good stuff though - quantity is no good if it's rubbish.

    I like your justification...you don't like the UI as it's 'rubbish' but failed to actually give an instance (even one) which makes it rubbish...have you really ever sat down and used one?
  • alan1302alan1302 Posts: 6,336
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    Zack06 wrote: »
    A good interface shouldn't need statements like this to try and justify it as good. Android also implements natural gestures across its entire interface. To call it clunky suggests that you haven't used the 4.x interface at all...

    The designer of the Holo UI is Matias Duarte who was entirely responsible for the WebOS interface which BB ripped off in QNX. The Android UI gives you a lot more freedom.

    In what way does it give you more freedom?
  • alan1302alan1302 Posts: 6,336
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    Zack06 wrote: »
    Exactly because practically all Android tablets are already undeniably better. Galaxy Tab 2, Transformer Prime, Nexus 7. The iPad has been slayed. People only buy it for the brand not the actual device and even then, Apple's brand image is starting to deteriorate. :)

    You do spout some rubbish - Android tablets are not undeinably better - different people like different things - people do buy non-Android tablets for the device as well you know.
  • Zack06Zack06 Posts: 28,304
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    alan1302 wrote: »
    You do spout some rubbish - Android tablets are not undeinably better - different people like different things - people do buy non-Android tablets for the device as well you know.

    I think they are. I'm not saying nobody should be buying 'other' tablets, but I think it's a little misinformed to pretend like they are somehow cutting edge technology.
  • Zack06Zack06 Posts: 28,304
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    alan1302 wrote: »
    In what way does it give you more freedom?

    The Playbook can't even properly send emails without a Blackberry phone nearby, the App Store is so lacking that they've actually tried to put Android apps in their own ecosystem. So desperate. The only reason people are buying that device is because it's cheap. It's not a powerful tablet like a Nexus 7 or Transformer Prime....I'd say it's just as bad as the iPad. Except cheaper. :)
  • Rob500Rob500 Posts: 3,944
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    Zack06 wrote: »
    The Playbook can't even properly send emails without a Blackberry phone nearby, the App Store is so lacking that they've actually tried to put Android apps in their own ecosystem. So desperate. The only reason people are buying that device is because it's cheap. It's not a powerful tablet like a Nexus 7 or Transformer Prime....I'd say it's just as bad as the iPad. Except cheaper. :)

    I don't know anyone who bought one, the people I know who have one were given it for free at a developer conference - and they still think it's crap.
  • Zack06Zack06 Posts: 28,304
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    Rob500 wrote: »
    I don't know anyone who bought one, the people I know who have one were given it for free at a developer conference - and they still think it's crap.

    You're probably right. I can't see any other reason why the price has been slashed so much that it's most likely under cost price now....nobody is buying it save for a few in a niche market.
  • ACUACU Posts: 9,104
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    For me its not worth it. If the rumours are to be believed about the 32GB Nexus 7 being sold at £200, its even less of a no brainer.

    The Nexus has a superior screen, a very good ecosystem, GPS, NFC and a micro USB port. Apart from a very good ecosystem, and a bigger inferior screen*, the ipad mini has nothing else to bring to the table. The money you save on the tablet, you could buy a hell of a lot of apps. Thus the "I have bought into the apple ecosystem", doesnt need to be true anymore.

    * - A lot of the iphone crowd used to say, "its a smaller screen but its a lot clearer/better" argument, when comparing it to android phones with a larger screen. Wonder what they will say now. :D
  • shepster34shepster34 Posts: 1,092
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    ACU wrote: »
    For me its not worth it. If the rumours are to be believed about the 32GB Nexus 7 being sold at £200, its even less of a no brainer.

    The Nexus has a superior screen, a very good ecosystem, GPS, NFC and a micro USB port. Apart from a very good ecosystem, and a bigger inferior screen*, the ipad mini has nothing else to bring to the table. The money you save on the tablet, you could buy a hell of a lot of apps. Thus the "I have bought into the apple ecosystem", doesnt need to be true anymore.

    * - A lot of the iphone crowd used to say, "its a smaller screen but its a lot clearer/better" argument, when comparing it to android phones with a larger screen. Wonder what they will say now. :D

    The nexus has a superior screen resolution, but not necesarily a better screen. Screen quality plays a factor too. My playbook screen has a lower resolution screen than the nexus but i think the pb screen is better. As for the ipad mini, we havent seen the screen yet, its same resolution as ipad 2 but on a 3/4 size screen.
  • grumpyoldbatgrumpyoldbat Posts: 3,663
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    Zack06 wrote: »
    I think they are. I'm not saying nobody should be buying 'other' tablets, but I think it's a little misinformed to pretend like they are somehow cutting edge technology.

    I think the point with these tablets is that they don't need to be cutting edge technology. The percentage of people who want super-specced devices is minute. The iPad is selling so well in this market because it's selling to the mainstream. It's selling to people who aren't tech savvy. Pretty much anyone can work out how to launch an app from a grid of icons.

    I don't think Apple's advertising presents them as cutting edge either. The advertising has always struck me as being about "the experience" - the touchy feeliness of these devices. Something which Samsung and HTC have done in their most recent adverts too. Amazon do the same in their Kindle ads - show people using the devices, enjoying them in lots of different situations. They don't reel off a list of specs. They only talk about that aluminium unibody, manufacturing guff in their keynotes because tech journalists might be interested.
  • shepster34shepster34 Posts: 1,092
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    Zack06 wrote: »
    The Playbook can't even properly send emails without a Blackberry phone nearby, the App Store is so lacking that they've actually tried to put Android apps in their own ecosystem. So desperate. The only reason people are buying that device is because it's cheap. It's not a powerful tablet like a Nexus 7 or Transformer Prime....I'd say it's just as bad as the iPad. Except cheaper. :)

    Well i must be seeing things then because my emails are fine and i dont own a blackberry. The apps are lacking in amount yes, but other than one or two really popular ones like skype and netflix, the pb has most of the main apps. Dont forget you dont necessarily need an app, the full website may work just as well, eg tunein radio website works perfectly. And to be honest, theres alot of faff apps out there in the app store and google play.....im not bothered about 50000 apps about farting or how quick i can make a bog roll spin!!!! Btw i own a hannspree android tablet and iphone 4 so have used all os and still use my pb because the experience of using the os with swipe commands and true multitasking is an absolute joy.
  • VoynichVoynich Posts: 14,481
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    ACU wrote: »
    For me its not worth it. If the rumours are to be believed about the 32GB Nexus 7 being sold at £200, its even less of a no brainer.

    The Nexus has a superior screen, a very good ecosystem, GPS, NFC and a micro USB port. Apart from a very good ecosystem, and a bigger inferior screen*, the ipad mini has nothing else to bring to the table. The money you save on the tablet, you could buy a hell of a lot of apps. Thus the "I have bought into the apple ecosystem", doesnt need to be true anymore.

    * - A lot of the iphone crowd used to say, "its a smaller screen but its a lot clearer/better" argument, when comparing it to android phones with a larger screen. Wonder what they will say now. :D

    I for one am pleased I won't have to hear from the media and fanboys that the only way to go is the 'retina display' way. At least until the next mini is released anyway! Retina display is nice, but it's a bit of a gimmick. As long as the screen is crisp clear and readable, that's what should count.
  • ACUACU Posts: 9,104
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    shepster34 wrote: »
    The nexus has a superior screen resolution, but not necesarily a better screen. Screen quality plays a factor too. My playbook screen has a lower resolution screen than the nexus but i think the pb screen is better. As for the ipad mini, we havent seen the screen yet, its same resolution as ipad 2 but on a 3/4 size screen.

    The nexus has a 7" 1280*800 HD back-lit IPS display with 216PPI. The mini has a 7.9" 1024*768 back-lit LED display with IPS technology and 163 PPI. I think in this case it is fairly safe to say its a better screen.

    Comparing the ipad2 with the nexus 7, the nexus 7 display is sharper and better. Of course this is only my opinion.
  • clonmultclonmult Posts: 3,366
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    Zack06 wrote: »
    The Playbook can't even properly send emails without a Blackberry phone nearby, the App Store is so lacking that they've actually tried to put Android apps in their own ecosystem. So desperate. The only reason people are buying that device is because it's cheap. It's not a powerful tablet like a Nexus 7 or Transformer Prime....I'd say it's just as bad as the iPad. Except cheaper. :)

    There you go, showing a total lack of knowledge/understanding/etc.

    The Playbook has always been able to send emails without having to be bridged - its just a standard wifi tablet, and can tether to a BB via bluetooth for extremely tight integration of services if you so desire.

    What have you got against the Playbook? You don't like it, fine, no need to make it into an idiotic/childish crusade.

    There is nothing that has the capacity, functionality or build quality of the Playbook for a similar price. But its not for everyone, no one device is "perfect" (regardless of what Apple say).

    As long as *you* like the tablet that you've bought, why get so irate?
  • Zack06Zack06 Posts: 28,304
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    clonmult wrote: »
    childish crusade.

    There is nothing that has the capacity, functionality or build quality of the Playbook for a similar price. But its not for everyone, no one device is "perfect" (regardless of what Apple say).

    As long as *you* like the tablet that you've bought, why get so irate?

    I'm not irate at all. Far from it. More bemused at the fact that people think it's a contender in the tablet war. Blackberry is leaking money and selling off assets, and the Playbook has done nothing to remedy that. It's just a more recent equivalent to the HP Touchpad. It's fine if you can't be bothered to buy a real tablet, but I would never get one, there are too many features missing and I would be too worried about the future of the device/updates with the state its manufacturer is in. Personally I don't think QNX will last that long at all, imo it will end up just like WebOS.
  • clonmultclonmult Posts: 3,366
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    Zack06 wrote: »
    I'm not irate at all. Far from it. More bemused at the fact that people think it's a contender in the tablet war. Blackberry is leaking money and selling off assets, and the Playbook has done nothing to remedy that. It's just a more recent equivalent to the HP Touchpad. It's fine if you can't be bothered to buy a real tablet, but I would never get one, there are too many features missing and I would be too worried about the future of the device/updates with the state its manufacturer is in. Personally I don't think QNX will last that long at all, imo it will end up just like WebOS.

    QNX itself is doing fine, it has plenty of takeup in embedded systems, its a quality RTOS.

    If you have a recent Audi, BMW, Chrysler, Daewoo, GM, Hyundai or Porsche the odds are that you've got an in-car control system running QNX. So that is very far from dead, it'll keep going on quite well.

    Aside from the app store, there isn't anything missing features wise with the Playbook. If you'd happily highlight what is majorly missing .... ? (aside from a book mark manager, it lacks a bookmark manager)

    When I'm at home if I want gaming I'll use the 360 or PS3. If I want to browse from the sofa then the playbook is as good as anything else out there (it does have a good browser).
  • kidspudkidspud Posts: 18,341
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    Zack06 wrote: »
    I think they are. I'm not saying nobody should be buying 'other' tablets, but I think it's a little misinformed to pretend like they are somehow cutting edge technology.

    I think it would be wrong to claim any tablet is cutting edge technology.

    However, what people seem to mistake is that the majority of buyers are interested in processors, screen resolutions, etc, etc.

    If you put a ipad mini and a nexus 7 side by side they will look at the form (how it looks and feels) and function. Although people go on and on about Android and how configurable it is, I've been using it now for over a month (on a phone) and see nothing special about it. If you are keen on changing every aspect of how your device looks then Android is for you, but most people couldn't care less.

    As far as performance is concerned, almost everyone couldn't tell you which would have the 'better' screen and in terms of speed they are all so close to each other that it makes no difference.

    I know people don't like it, but buyers see Apple as a premium brand and the look/feel helps re-enforce that. That is why people are willing to pay more and do pay more.
  • flagpoleflagpole Posts: 44,641
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    kidspud wrote: »
    I think it would be wrong to claim any tablet is cutting edge technology.

    However, what people seem to mistake is that the majority of buyers are interested in processors, screen resolutions, etc, etc.

    If you put a ipad mini and a nexus 7 side by side they will look at the form (how it looks and feels) and function. Although people go on and on about Android and how configurable it is, I've been using it now for over a month (on a phone) and see nothing special about it. If you are keen on changing every aspect of how your device looks then Android is for you, but most people couldn't care less.

    As far as performance is concerned, almost everyone couldn't tell you which would have the 'better' screen and in terms of speed they are all so close to each other that it makes no difference.

    I know people don't like it, but buyers see Apple as a premium brand and the look/feel helps re-enforce that. That is why people are willing to pay more and do pay more.

    we may as well all give up and go home then.
  • kidspudkidspud Posts: 18,341
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    flagpole wrote: »
    we may as well all give up and go home then.

    Why, although they share the same market they will attract different buyers. I thought choice was a good thing:)
  • IvanIVIvanIV Posts: 30,301
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    kidspud wrote: »
    Although people go on and on about Android and how configurable it is, I've been using it now for over a month (on a phone) and see nothing special about it. If you are keen on changing every aspect of how your device looks then Android is for you, but most people couldn't care less.

    Things like this are very important as an USP. They present it to people, it looks great and people are hooked. If it's something they will use is a different story. The bells and whistles I had to programme :rolleyes: Everybody wants to customise everything.
  • kidspudkidspud Posts: 18,341
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    IvanIV wrote: »
    Things like this are very important as an USP. They present it to people, it looks great and people are hooked. If it's something they will use is a different story. The bells and whistles I had to programme :rolleyes: Everybody wants to customise everything.

    The weird thing is, I don't think the manufacturers are very good at selling android. If you look at a Samsung or nexus device in the shop that tend to have boring widgets (clock and weather) and then a couple of blank widgets on other pages, and it doesn't look polished (although nexus do a better job than Samsung). I think they could be set up better.
  • Zack06Zack06 Posts: 28,304
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    kidspud wrote: »
    I think it would be wrong to claim any tablet is cutting edge technology.

    However, what people seem to mistake is that the majority of buyers are interested in processors, screen resolutions, etc, etc.

    If you put a ipad mini and a nexus 7 side by side they will look at the form (how it looks and feels) and function. Although people go on and on about Android and how configurable it is, I've been using it now for over a month (on a phone) and see nothing special about it. If you are keen on changing every aspect of how your device looks then Android is for you, but most people couldn't care less.

    As far as performance is concerned, almost everyone couldn't tell you which would have the 'better' screen and in terms of speed they are all so close to each other that it makes no difference.

    I know people don't like it, but buyers see Apple as a premium brand and the look/feel helps re-enforce that. That is why people are willing to pay more and do pay more.

    The mistake you are making is that you seem to think you can predict what 'most' buyers would want, which is wrong. If you compare the iPad Mini to the Nexus 7, the Nexus does come across as cutting edge as it features the latest processor wrapped up in a usable environment. The iPad features last-gen hardware dressed up in a pretty package. There is a difference between marketing and actual content here, which is why I made the distinction between cutting edge devices.

    People see Apple as a 'cool' brand, purely down to marketing. But rising sales of phones like the Galaxy S3 prove that consumers are very much interested in performance and specs, so your comments have no bearing in reality.

    As for Android, it's strange to think that one should use every single customisation feature just because they are there. But at least you have the option to place widgets and pictures and emails on your homescreen should you wish rather than being dictated what you can and cannot do because the manufacturer says so.
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