Self Service will cost lives

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  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 7,134
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    Shadow27 wrote: »
    Is that the only concern OP? What about erosion of choice when a supermarket opens? The bribery used by supermarkets to open their stores (S106 money, money off vouchers that they send out to encourage shoppers to use the over local shops), the myth that they are cheaper than a local market or shop?, loss of community as local shops can't keep up trade?

    I agree with your statement that they are confusing but in my mum's experience of using them, she said they go wrong so often that it's the easier way to get a conversation since she needs help so often :)

    Hello:)

    I don't care what business does to business- it's war, after all.

    And one can't be an active component in a machine built for greed and then ask it to retain a humanitarian aspect.

    Capitalism is greed.

    But when business involves the common man/woman- ethics needs to be introduced.

    A sense of responsibility must be evoked.
  • LyricalisLyricalis Posts: 57,958
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    It isn't the governments job to prevent jobs from disappearing due to technological advancement. Otherwise we'd still be using typewriters and spinning jennys.

    No, but government surely has some responsibility for providing training and advice to people who may be in professions at threat from technological advancement or outsourcing? They are, after all, in a better position to see the wider picture of how the economy is developing than someone working in a call centre for a bank.

    Unfortunately, governments have failed miserably in this as they have in so many things.
  • malpascmalpasc Posts: 9,626
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    I left my debit card in a self-service machine the other week so that's a bad point to them. I am sure I am not the only one as they do not pop out like in a bank cash machine and obviously there is no-one there to remind you to take your card.

    Are you one of those people who has to be told everything they have to do?

    Surely you were aware enough to put the card in, so should have been aware enough to remove it.

    All Chip & Pin machines say "Remove Card" on the display when the transaction is complete.
  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 4,218
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    Hello:)

    We cannot understate the importance of human contact- however fleeting it may be.

    It rights an addled mind- keeps the pernicious effects of prolonged lonliness at bay.

    But now, I person can spend their entire life disconnected from everyone.

    They can feed delusions which would be countered by the reality of contact.

    Till girls have saved lives, repaired broken minds.

    Yes I can imagine "do you have a club card?" and "that will be 12.77" have brought many great comfort :rolleyes:

    Just realised that I have no access to a pound sign or an asterisk on this keyboard.
  • darkmothdarkmoth Posts: 12,265
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    You wanted self service education without human contact...make up your mind
  • JeffG1JeffG1 Posts: 15,243
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    eng123 wrote: »
    Just realised that I have no access to a pound sign or an asterisk on this keyboard.

    What do shift-3 and shift-8 do then? Or are you posting on a phone or similar? Being able to type £ signs and * are about the only things that keeps me sane these days. :p

    On topic, if there is a qeueue I will use a self-checkout. Otherwise I prefer a cheery hello from the cashier.
  • malpascmalpasc Posts: 9,626
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    If I am doing a big shop then no way would I use a self-service till in a supermarket but if I'm just in for a pint of milk and a loaf of bread and all the manned checkouts have queues at them then of course I'll use self-service.

    Our post office has self-service tills now for posting certain items and it is way more convenient than waiting in a queue of 20-odd people waiting for one of the two manned counters all wanting to make multiple transactions or post something really awkwardly shaped and heavy to somewhere really obscure.

    You can do most things with your bank self-service now thanks to ATMs, phone and internet banking but they still have staff. I don't think the entire high street is going to become a completely human-interaction-free zone anytime soon.
  • John259John259 Posts: 28,327
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    If you want human contact then you could order your groceries online and you'll be able to speak to the delivery driver for a few seconds.
  • Stewie_CStewie_C Posts: 1,739
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    I don't use the self service tills as it pretty well ALWAYS requires some authorisation from the assistant, or some button pressed and problems sorted by said assistant. As the assistant is trying to do the same for 8 other customers it takes longer than the regular tills so I don't use them. Good idea that somehow just doesn't work in practice for most of my transactions.
  • malpascmalpasc Posts: 9,626
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    Stewie_C wrote: »
    I don't use the self service tills as it pretty well ALWAYS requires some authorisation from the assistant, or some button pressed and problems sorted by said assistant. As the assistant is trying to do the same for 8 other customers it takes longer than the regular tills so I don't use them. Good idea that somehow just doesn't work in practice for most of my transactions.

    Not true - the only items that need authorisation are age restricted items such as blades or alcohol. I manage perfectly well to get through self-service tills without any intervention from staff.
  • Stewie_CStewie_C Posts: 1,739
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    malpasc wrote: »
    Not true - the only items that need authorisation are age restricted items such as blades or alcohol. I manage perfectly well to get through self-service tills without any intervention from staff.

    Is true - I was talking about stuff I personally buy. Knife blades, and various products in B&Q require authorisation but you will only know what products that applies to when you scan it. Therefore as most visits I make there have some item that requires authorisation, I find the normal tills work faster.

    If I'm in Tesco's the weekly shop is going through the main tills and the product I'm most likely to go into Tesco express for is the odd pack of beer. OK, bread and milk and chocolate scan without problem, but if I dare to purchase a four pack I have to wait for the person on the other till to come over and authorise the transaction. Might as well have gone there in the first place!

    I didn't say that they don't work for everybody - I said that they don't seem to work for me, therefore I won't use them most of the time.
  • ~Twinkle~~Twinkle~ Posts: 8,165
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    Hello:)

    That lonely man who has no natural proclivity to socialise, will have his last tenuous link with humanity cut by the emergence of the Self Service till.

    For some, the lady at the checkout is the only human contact they have.

    Their isolation compounded by technology's tendency to dump the human component for sake of automation.

    Now, I love technology and in certain areas, a human should be removed for sake of efficiency.

    But not in a supermarket, at the pay point.

    A few kind words exchanged can sustain an isolated person for days.

    But give them an option and they may take the lonely road and never exchange a pleasant word with anyone, ever.

    That has to be a breeding ground for mental dis-ease.

    The lonely man has a choice, he can go to a manned checkout if he so wishes but if he's wanting social interaction by doing so then he's going to be sadly disappointed. The cashier has enough to do with scanning the goods, taking payment and then moving on to the next customer.

    If Mr Lonely Man wants conversation he'd do better going to the corner shop where there's someone standing behind the counter, Arkwright style, and leaving the self service tills to the busy members of society because they can be a darned sight quicker than queuing behind someone doing a full week's shop just to put a few items through. Ipso facto the self service till will never cause the death of anyone except for the technophobe who's too scared to even try it or gives up before they learn how to use it properly.
  • malpascmalpasc Posts: 9,626
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    Stewie_C wrote: »
    Is true - I was talking about stuff I personally buy. Knife blades, and various products in B&Q require authorisation but you will only know what products that applies to when you scan it. Therefore as most visits I make there have some item that requires authorisation, I find the normal tills work faster.

    As I say, things with a blade are age restricted - I thought everyone knew that. I'd also imagine people would have the logic to realise a lot of items in DIY stores could be potentially dangerous weapons so are of course, age restricted,

    I'm sure if you just went in for a roll of wallpaper you'd have no problems with self-service.

    Personally, if I am buying age restricted items then I'll automatically use a manned checkout to save the bother of waiting for authorisation.
  • DinkyDooDinkyDoo Posts: 3,588
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    They are a breeding ground for mental health issues.

    I have seen many people having converstations with the self serve tills, and I've seen a fair few swearing at the machines, I even saw one man give one a hefty kick.
  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 7,134
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    ~Twinkle~ wrote: »
    The lonely man has a choice, he can go to a manned checkout if he so wishes but if he's wanting social interaction by doing so then he's going to be sadly disappointed. The cashier has enough to do with scanning the goods, taking payment and then moving on to the next customer.

    If Mr Lonely Man wants conversation he'd do better going to the corner shop where there's someone standing behind the counter, Arkwright style, and leaving the self service tills to the busy members of society because they can be a darned sight quicker than queuing behind someone doing a full week's shop just to put a few items through. Ipso facto the self service till will never cause the death of anyone except for the technophobe who's too scared to even try it or gives up before they learn how to use it properly.

    Hello:)

    A person with no natural compunction to engage in the lowly acts of social discord, will always take the option that further isolates them.

    To create situations in which they will need to breach the obstacle, is a matter of extreme importance.

    The articles in newspapers that contain the infamous phrase: 'He kept to himself'.

    Chilling and all too prevalent in this modern version of society.

    Just a nod and wink from some character at a till could separate a fragile personality from full blown insanity.

    At least keep them from launching into a world that is more shadow than light.

    Tiny insignificant gestures, at first look.
  • Stewie_CStewie_C Posts: 1,739
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    malpasc wrote: »
    As I say, things with a blade are age restricted - I thought everyone knew that. I'd also imagine people would have the logic to realise a lot of items in DIY stores could be potentially dangerous weapons so are of course, age restricted,

    I'm sure if you just went in for a roll of wallpaper you'd have no problems with self-service.

    Personally, if I am buying age restricted items then I'll automatically use a manned checkout to save the bother of waiting for authorisation.

    I know knife blades are restricted - and why. I also know that many DIY items are restricted and for good reason. It's also clear that if you have wallpaper that transaction will go smoothly unless the till has a wobbly. The trouble is that you never know if the wallpaper paste you also buy is age restriced or not. Therefore I don't bother with the self service till most of the time. I'm not saying they shouldn't be there - I'm sure they are a boon to many people. Just that I use the regular tills precisely because of the age restrictions, and my opinion that they don't seem to speed up the checkout experience.
  • ~Twinkle~~Twinkle~ Posts: 8,165
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    Hello:)

    A person with no natural compunction to engage in the lowly acts of social discord, will always take the option that further isolates them.

    To create situations in which they will need to breach the obstacle, is a matter of extreme importance.

    The articles in newspapers that contain the infamous phrase: 'He kept to himself'.

    Chilling and all too prevalent in this modern version of society.

    Just a nod and wink from some character at a till could separate a fragile personality from full blown insanity.

    At least keep them from launching into a world that is more shadow than light.

    Tiny insignificant gestures, at first look.

    *coughs*

    Well indeed! I agree with the sentiment entirely, but you seem to be forgetting that the self-service till speaks to its customers, it asks questions, it tells you if you've done something wrong and it thanks you for your custom which is more than some real-life human cashiers do.

    Yes, after more thought, the self-service till is more human than the regular cashier and it, therefore, has the ability to save more lives by being pleasant. :D
  • Manly BarrilowManly Barrilow Posts: 1,045
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    DinkyDoo wrote: »
    They are a breeding ground for mental health issues.

    I have seen many people having converstations with the self serve tills, and I've seen a fair few swearing at the machines, I even saw one man give one a hefty kick.

    I haven't got to the kicking stage but I'd done all the rest.

    Thanks for the tip, I'll try it in ASDA tomorrow.
  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 7,134
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    ~Twinkle~ wrote: »
    *coughs*

    Well indeed! I agree with the sentiment entirely, but you seem to be forgetting that the self-service till speaks to its customers, it asks questions, it tells you if you've done something wrong and it thanks you for your custom which is more than some real-life human cashiers do.

    Yes, after more thought, the self-service till is more human than the regular cashier and it, therefore, has the ability to save more lives by being pleasant. :D

    Hello:)

    The self service bank has four automated tills.

    The occupies the space of two tills.

    The represents two jobs, covered by anywhere between five and eight people.

    Soon you'll be taking hand-held devices around the supermarket that will upload purchase information as-you-go.

    Credit card posts at the door.

    No interaction, at all.

    Beyond that, blue tooth- wireless updates.

    No action needed, card automatically swiped as you exit the supermarket.

    No interaction.

    No jobs.

    But what will it cost- it real terms?

    Will the question of- 'is it good for the soul' become relevant?
  • Jane Doh!Jane Doh! Posts: 43,307
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    darkmoth wrote: »
    You wanted self service education without human contact...make up your mind

    Excellent point, but I fear the OP is ignoring it so far!
  • ChibiCandiChibiCandi Posts: 966
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    SlowRap wrote: »
    The self service machines is what makes supermarkets that bit more tolerable.

    PUT ITEM IN BAGGING AREA ....

    Just horrendous.
  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 7,174
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    I haven't got to the kicking stage but I'd done all the rest.

    Thanks for the tip, I'll try it in ASDA tomorrow.

    Yes, dirty looks and swearing (under my breath, obviously) don't really work on that stupid female voice, do they. God how I loathe the patronizing cow, telling me how to do things like I'm 4. Yes, I know the voice is needed for people with sight issues, but that doesn't make it any less annoying. There should be a way to turn it off.
  • Stewie_CStewie_C Posts: 1,739
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    Never sure about the "Brave new world" view of the future without human interaction. In the case of supermarkets, I see the advantage to them of having the self service tills, and I can see that it's also a positive for enough of the customers to make it worthwhile investing in them. However, will we do comepetely without checkout operators? I don't personally think so. Part of what a checkout operator and floor staff do is to try and minimise stock loss through pilfering. The automated scanning devices have to be foolproof at getting the items scanned correctly to make sure you are not overcharged, and that you haven't tried to sneak something in without the scanner noticing. Would a store that abolished checkouts then have to put the checkout staff onto cctv monitoring instead? Would that mean that every time you went the shop door you were in danger of a SWAT team swooping down on you as someone saw something funny on the CCTV? If someone did try to lose all tills as we know them, their competitors would then start competing on the personal service front, and bring back fully manned checkouts - and I know which shop I'd be spending my money in! We already see this happeing with some companies making a feature of only UK call centres, and if there was another company I could get cable from that didn't have an Indian call centre (Virginmedia I'm looking at YOU here) I'd pay extra to switch!

    I think that self service tills are never going to replace manned tills completely - there is going to be a balance. Retailers generally are pretty smart, and if they realised they would lose custom because of too many of them they will change tactics.
  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 7,134
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    Jane Doh! wrote: »
    Excellent point, but I fear the OP is ignoring it so far!

    Hello:)

    I answered in post 40.

    You should read it- it's a doozy
  • Jane Doh!Jane Doh! Posts: 43,307
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    Hello:)

    I answered in post 40.

    You should read it- it's a doozy
    The point, yes, that particular post, no. Trouble is, I've not read the whole thread.

    Doozy? Erm ... not the word I'd use myself but there you go, we're all different. Some people like to debate, some like to chat, some like to be sarcastic and some like to patronise.

    You gotta love people!
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