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How would you vote to approve or disapprove the following law on prostitution?

Regis MagnaeRegis Magnae Posts: 6,810
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Procuring sex for payment

(1)A person commits an offence under this section if he or she procures sexual
intercourse or any other sexual act, whether for himself or for another person, in return for payment.


(2)A “payment” includes—

(a)payment that is promised or is given or promised by another person; and

(b)provision of non-financial benefits, including, but not limited to, drugs or
alcohol.

The above amendment to the Modern Slavery Bill shall be voted on by MPs this Tuesday.

How would you vote to approve or disapprove the follwoing law on prostitution? 45 votes

Aye
17% 8 votes
No
80% 36 votes
Abstain
2% 1 vote
«1

Comments

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    U96U96 Posts: 13,937
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    I would vote no to this law.
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    HypnodiscHypnodisc Posts: 22,728
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    I've voted 'No'.

    This whole thing is preposterous and yet another step backward for the sex industry.

    It's 2014. I don't just see why it's not all legalised and regulated
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    CravenHavenCravenHaven Posts: 13,953
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    I want to see free-market loss-leading BOGOF sex. At the moment it's too often bog off for me.
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    skp20040skp20040 Posts: 66,874
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    So basically prostitution will now be criminalised in this country if they vote for it, at present it is legal as long as you work alone and not the streets etc etc . To me it should be fully legalised and brothels be legalised so that sex workers and clients are both safe , tax can be paid, health checks can be done, pimps got rid of and more time spent trying to stop the trafikking of prostitutes and underage prostitutes etc

    And it is a little ambiguous, I mean if you go out for the evening with someone and they buy you a bottle of wine and you have a one night stand are you guilty of prostitution ?
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    plateletplatelet Posts: 26,386
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    skp20040 wrote: »
    And it is a little ambiguous, I mean if you go out for the evening with someone and they buy you a bottle of wine and you have a one night stand are you guilty of prostitution ?

    Or marry them. "provision of non-financial benefits" could pretty much cover all of the marriage vows.

    Stupid law. They should be going after pimps not punters
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    Regis MagnaeRegis Magnae Posts: 6,810
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    http://www.publications.parliament.uk/pa/bills/cbill/2014-2015/0096/amend/modernslaveryaddednames.pdf

    From the above, the following MPs proposed and backed the amendment.
    Fiona Mactaggart P
    Fiona Bruce X
    Michael Connarty
    Mark Durkan
    Sir John Randall
    Mrs Madeleine Moon
    Mike Kane
    Keith Vaz P
    Mr Virendra Sharma P
    Sandra Osborne
    Mrs Mary Glindon
    Ann Coffey
    Mr David Burrowes X
    Lady Hermon
    Mr Philip Hollobone
    Jim Shannon X
    Barbara Keeley
    Dr William McCrea
    David Simpson
    Ian Paisley
    Mr Gregory Campbell
    Mr Nigel Dodds X
    Mrs Siân C. James
    Meg Hillier
    Liz McInnes
    Kelvin Hopkins
    Joan Walley
    Fiona O’Donnell
    Sarah Teather
    Hazel Blears
    Mr Jim Hood
    Mr Gary Streeter P

    Just out of curiosity I checked some of the names on this list as some of them sounded familiar. The bold ones are on the All-Party Parliamentary Pro-Life Group, and the ones with an X next to them proposed amendments to water down the gay marriage laws last year. The ones with a P next to them are on the All-Party Parliamentary Group on Prostitution and the Global Sex Trade.

    http://www.publications.parliament.uk/pa/cm/cmallparty/register/pro-life.htm

    Last meeting 16 July 2013, and receives "£250 per calendar month from Christian Action Research and Education (CARE)."

    http://www.publications.parliament.uk/pa/bills/cbill/2013-2014/0003/amend/pbc003170513m.pdf

    http://forums.digitalspy.co.uk/showpost.php?p=65973924&postcount=336

    http://www.publications.parliament.uk/pa/cm/cmallparty/register/prostitution-and-the-global-sex-trade.htm
    CARE (Christian Action Research and Education), a charity, acts as the group’s secretariat
    .
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    skp20040skp20040 Posts: 66,874
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    platelet wrote: »
    Or marry them. "provision of non-financial benefits" could pretty much cover all of the marriage vows.
    Stupid law. They should be going after pimps not punters

    Well that's it then, the minute you put the ring on you are a fully fledged tart:D
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    AneechikAneechik Posts: 20,208
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    I'd vote against it.
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    skp20040skp20040 Posts: 66,874
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    Aneechik wrote: »
    I'd vote against it.

    lets hope MP's will
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    FMKKFMKK Posts: 32,074
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    http://www.publications.parliament.uk/pa/bills/cbill/2014-2015/0096/amend/modernslaveryaddednames.pdf

    From the above, the following MPs proposed and backed the amendment.



    Just out of curiosity I checked some of the names on this list as some of them sounded familiar. The bold ones are on the All-Party Parliamentary Pro-Life Group, and the ones with an X next to them proposed amendments to water down the gay marriage laws last year. The ones with a P next to them are on the All-Party Parliamentary Group on Prostitution and the Global Sex Trade.

    http://www.publications.parliament.uk/pa/cm/cmallparty/register/pro-life.htm

    Last meeting 16 July 2013, and receives "£250 per calendar month from Christian Action Research and Education (CARE)."

    http://www.publications.parliament.uk/pa/bills/cbill/2013-2014/0003/amend/pbc003170513m.pdf

    http://forums.digitalspy.co.uk/showpost.php?p=65973924&postcount=336

    http://www.publications.parliament.uk/pa/cm/cmallparty/register/prostitution-and-the-global-sex-trade.htm .

    Thanks, that's interesting to see. Sad to see my MP up there but he's a reactionary DUP boor so it snot as if it's a surprise. Outrageously, Northern Ireland passed something very similar to this into our law just a couple of weeks ago. It's horrendous.
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    MidnightFalconMidnightFalcon Posts: 15,016
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    I voted no and I'd pretty much echo everything said here.
    skp20040 wrote: »
    So basically prostitution will now be criminalised in this country if they vote for it, at present it is legal as long as you work alone and not the streets etc etc . To me it should be fully legalised and brothels be legalised so that sex workers and clients are both safe , tax can be paid, health checks can be done, pimps got rid of and more time spent trying to stop the trafikking of prostitutes and underage prostitutes etc

    And it is a little ambiguous, I mean if you go out for the evening with someone and they buy you a bottle of wine and you have a one night stand are you guilty of prostitution ?
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    Regis MagnaeRegis Magnae Posts: 6,810
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    It has come to my attention that an amendment to remove the following from the Street Offences Act 1959 shall also be voted on:
    1 Loitering or soliciting for purposes of prostitution.

    (1)It shall be an offence for a common prostitute to loiter or solicit in a street or public place for the purpose of prostitution.

    [F1(2)A person guilty of an offence under this section shall be liable on summary conviction to a fine of an amount not exceeding level 2 on the standard scale, F2. . . or, for an offence committed after a previous conviction, to a fine of an amount not exceeding level 3 on that scale.]

    (3)A constable may arrest without warrant anyone he finds in a street or public place and suspects, with reasonable cause, to be committing an offence under this section.

    (4)For the purposes of this section “street” includes any bridge, road, lane, footway, subway, square, court, alley or passage, whether a thoroughfare or not, which is for the time being open to the public; and the doorways and entrances of premises abutting on a street (as hereinbefore defined), and any ground adjoining and open to a street, shall be treated as forming part of the street.

    This would in someways reflect the Nordic model. Note, however, the police could probably still arrest prostitutes with numerous other laws.
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    CrazySingerGalCrazySingerGal Posts: 363
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    It should all be totally legal and regulated. Something like this will never go away especially as it's the oldest industry! It's much better to be safe than sorry.
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    HypnodiscHypnodisc Posts: 22,728
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    http://www.publications.parliament.uk/pa/bills/cbill/2014-2015/0096/amend/modernslaveryaddednames.pdf

    From the above, the following MPs proposed and backed the amendment.



    Just out of curiosity I checked some of the names on this list as some of them sounded familiar. The bold ones are on the All-Party Parliamentary Pro-Life Group, and the ones with an X next to them proposed amendments to water down the gay marriage laws last year. The ones with a P next to them are on the All-Party Parliamentary Group on Prostitution and the Global Sex Trade.

    http://www.publications.parliament.uk/pa/cm/cmallparty/register/pro-life.htm

    Last meeting 16 July 2013, and receives "£250 per calendar month from Christian Action Research and Education (CARE)."

    http://www.publications.parliament.uk/pa/bills/cbill/2013-2014/0003/amend/pbc003170513m.pdf

    http://forums.digitalspy.co.uk/showpost.php?p=65973924&postcount=336

    http://www.publications.parliament.uk/pa/cm/cmallparty/register/prostitution-and-the-global-sex-trade.htm .

    ... and people think we're not in a religious country (or to be specific, a country whereby religion has a profound influence on politics).

    Makes me laugh. And despair.
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    IanPIanP Posts: 3,661
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    In addition to the clause in the original post there is also New Clause 23 proposed by Yvette Cooper, Diana Johnson, Mr David Hanson and Phil Wilson
    Consultation on prostitution, sexual exploitation and trafficking
    (1) The Secretary of State must initiate a statutory consultation on the introduction of
    legislation prohibiting the procurement of sex for payment.
    (2) The consultation in subsection (1) must seek to ascertain the degree to which the
    prohibition of sex for payment would—
    (a) reduce the number of people sexually exploited in England and Wales;
    (b) reduce demand for sexual services from sexually exploited persons in
    England and Wales;
    (c) reduce the number of people trafficked into England and Wales for the
    purposes of sexual exploitation.
    (3) In undertaking the consultation in subsection (1) the Secretary of State must—
    (a) seek the views of those who work with trafficked and exploited persons
    in England and Wales;
    (b) seek the views of the Director of Public Prosecutions and the Association
    of Chief Police Officers; and
    (c) allow submissions from members of the public.
    (4) The consultation must be completed and a summary of the results laid before
    Parliament within six months of the date of Royal Assent.”

    So even if the first amendment is defeated new legislation may still be brought forward to ban procurement of sex for payment following a consultation if this clause is added.
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    IanPIanP Posts: 3,661
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    New clause 6 would also presumably render all porn production in the UK illegal and possibly paying for porn including using adult live cams.
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    [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 32,379
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    The above amendment to the Modern Slavery Bill shall be voted on by MPs this Tuesday.

    How would you vote?
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    [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 32,379
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    It should all be totally legal and regulated. Something like this will never go away especially as it's the oldest industry! It's much better to be safe than sorry.

    Of course it should. It is in many European countries. Would be far safer for the women.
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    Bulletguy1Bulletguy1 Posts: 18,429
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    I think asking the question "Legalise Prostitution....Yes or No" would have been more straightforward!

    Why muddle it all up with 1 sub section a) para this 'n that quotes etc? :confused::confused:
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    [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 32,379
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    The above amendment to the Modern Slavery Bill shall be voted on by MPs this Tuesday.

    Absolutely not.
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    CravenHavenCravenHaven Posts: 13,953
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    If you feel that strongly about it you'll have to set up a movement on social media. Politicians live in their own bubble where they only care what the newspapers are saying about them. If the media are pushing an agenda as if it's "the right and proper thing to do" then that's what they'll vote with and to hell with civil liberties.
    You might have thought legalising prostitution might have been liberating but from the talking heads on the radio the feminists are talking about prostitution in itself is a men enslaving women deal. Once something is legalised and free to trade, the black market price of it goes away and so does the organised crime.
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    InkblotInkblot Posts: 26,889
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    I would understand the clauses cited in the first post as being an anti-pimping law rather than an anti-prostitution law, in that it specifically makes it illegal to procure sex for another person in return for payment, which may be payment in the form of drugs. My interpretation of that is that it would be illegal for someone to pimp out a prostitute and keep them under control by providing drugs, which is a form of slavery.

    If that's what the law is intended to do, I'm in favour of it, though I see no reason why paying for sex itself should be illegal.
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    Mark39LondonMark39London Posts: 3,977
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    No.

    It should be legal and heavily regulated in terms of money, health and security.
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    gemma-the-huskygemma-the-husky Posts: 18,116
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    all you naysayers should read this again. This measure is about pimping and worse, not about prostitution .

    That's why it's in the slavery bill.

    Although it might mean I can't buy you a good time on your birthday.

    Maybe it's not though, reading it again. I thought it was trying to protect against enforced prostitution, but it isn't very clear. Is the clause 100% accurate, or might it be out of context.
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    CravenHavenCravenHaven Posts: 13,953
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    It is obtuse to ignore that these amendments have been made for an ulterior religious reactionary agenda that is trying to massively penalise trade in sex itself by opportunistically associating the trade with slavery.
    These stories in the media always seem to involve immigrants. It's been shown there is a problem tracking immigrant criminals more generally.
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