As someone who has enjoyed the work of both showrunners but is aware of their individual weaknesses in executing their ideas and stories at times I don't favour one over the other (but think RTD benefitted from having SM as a writer he could rely on which SM has lacked) to any extent.
If I were a potential writer/show runner in waiting I would be very aware of succeeding these two in the role - it is not dissimilar to succeeding Ferguson or Morinho as a football manager where you are likely to suffer unfair comparisons against their ratings/awards etc.
Better someone who can do the job well (if not to your tastes) stays in post than someone comes in not ready/prepared/able to do the job!
I don't know why people keep suggesting Gaiman as a show runner - tv isn't his chosen medium nor his main focus for storytelling so will never happen.
How do you know how hard it must be? Do you have experience running multiple TV shows?
RTD's Writers Tale did seem to suggest it was hard enough to just write & EP Doctor Who let alone do the same for anything else.
Yet he did it. Reading the writers tale, you can almost hear the obsessing coming off the page. The man seemed to live and breath the doctor who universe for 5 years. He was absolutely committed to making every detail of every episode as good as it could be, whilst creating and working on both Torchwood and SJA at the same time, and I think his dedication, forward planning, and attention to detail shone through in the show.
Say what you will about whether you think RTD has a better era or if moffat does, but I think in terms of who is/was most dedicated, RTD wins hands down. It's sad but I doubt the show will ever see someone with that level of dedication again.
Gosh I know. It's almost like these people have minds of their own and are able to make their own career decisions. The very cheek of it!
How equally strange that people would dare to come on a forum that exists specifically to trade opinions on the show, to do just that.
Do you think we should all just come on here an comment that every single decision made by every showrunner and every actor is absolutely perfect?
The point I was trying to make in my previous post was just that Moffat and Eccleston spark much conversation because people tend to have strong opinions on their length of time on the show whereas as other prominent figures such as RTD, Tennant, smith are generally perceived to have left at about the right time so there isn't really much to say on the length of their tenure's.
Yet he did it. Reading the writers tale, you can almost hear the obsessing coming off the page. The man seemed to live and breath the doctor who universe for 5 years. He was absolutely committed to making every detail of every episode as good as it could be, whilst creating and working on both Torchwood and SJA at the same time, and I think his dedication, forward planning, and attention to detail shone through in the show.
Say what you will about whether you think RTD has a better era or if moffat does, but I think in terms of who is/was most dedicated, RTD wins hands down. It's sad but I doubt the show will ever see someone with that level of dedication again.
I'm not sure how you came to the conclusion that one person is more dedicated to their job than the other. Perhaps Moffat will write his own writers tale one day and we can all compare notes.
Personally I think Doctor Who has been very lucky to have two such high caliber, award winning writers as show runners. I'll certainly be very happy if the show strikes gold for a third time but I'm not convinced it will happen anytime soon.
I'm not sure how you came to the conclusion that one person is more dedicated to their job than the other. Perhaps Moffat will write his own writers tale one day and we can all compare notes.
Personally I think Doctor Who has been very lucky to have two such high caliber, award winning writers as show runners. I'll certainly be very happy if the show strikes gold for a third time but I'm not convinced it will happen anytime soon.
Personally I think Doctor Who has been extremely unlucky to have someone who had a few good stories in them being promoted above their ability to Showrunner. The BBC should have learnt from the debacle that was Jekyll but of course they didn't.
I'm not sure how you came to the conclusion that one person is more dedicated to their job than the other. Perhaps Moffat will write his own writers tale one day and we can all compare notes.
Personally I think Doctor Who has been very lucky to have two such high caliber, award winning writers as show runners. I'll certainly be very happy if the show strikes gold for a third time but I'm not convinced it will happen anytime soon.
Personally I think Doctor Who has been extremely unlucky to have someone who had a few good stories in them being promoted above their ability to Showrunner. The BBC should have learnt from the debacle that was Jekyll but of course they didn't.
Yeah the debacle of Jekyll and then what happened with that Sherlock thing he tried getting off the ground. What a disaster. Sank without a trace. Actors haven't worked since. And there are rumours the BBC buried all the millions of unsold DVDs in a secret landfill site somewhere in Norfolk. He's a bloody liability that Moffat. It's a wonder he ever gets any work at all.
In unrelated news I heard of a British writer who was being interviewed about his writing and craft to a select audience at a highly prestigious Bafta television event in New York city the other day. It was really well received. I forget his name but maybe the BBC should check that guy out. Sounds promising.
If he does stay for one more year could still see a lot of change. Clara could leave at the end of S9 or Christmas. PC will hopefully sign for a third series in 2016.
We would get a new companion next year. Be interesting to see how 12 would deal with Clara leaving and getting to know and bond with his new companion.
Everyone had their shelf life. Time for new fresh ideas imo. If it requires a gap year like between series 4 and 5 so be it.
Completely agree.
As an unrelated side note, why does everyone seem to really want Moffat and Capaldi to leave together? I'd much rather Capaldi have some time under the new showrunner, simply because that's unprecedented for New Who.
As an unrelated side note, why does everyone seem to really want Moffat and Capaldi to leave together? I'd much rather Capaldi have some time under the new showrunner, simply because that's unprecedented for New Who.
I agree. Would be good to see Capaldi's doctor in someone else's new fresh vision of the show. Series 5 felt like it was basically severing all ties (except river) from the previous 5 years of the show that went before it with new showrunner, new doctor, new TARDIS interior/slight change to exterior and new companion all at once, which was a bit strange.
Having Capaldi still on board at the time of leaving would be a much smoother transition, and if he and the companion of Moffat's last series both stayed on for the new showrunner's first series then the transition would be barely noticeable, at first at least.
I've grown really tired of the Moffat era since Matt left/S8. It's just become stale IMO and we've still got two more seasons with him as headwriter? Yikes.
Who the hell can actually replace him? The one thing missing from Steven Moffat's time on Doctor Who, is his own Steven Moffat contributing fantastic stories every year like he did for Russell.
There isn't anyone right now who's writing anything even close to the quality of his earlier work on the show. He'll stick around beyond S10, he has pretty much no choice..
There isn't anyone right now who's writing anything even close to the quality of his earlier work on the show. He'll stick around beyond S10, he has pretty much no choice..
I agree. Would be good to see Capaldi's doctor in someone else's new fresh vision of the show. Series 5 felt like it was basically severing all ties (except river) from the previous 5 years of the show that went before it with new showrunner, new doctor, new TARDIS interior/slight change to exterior and new companion all at once, which was a bit strange.
Having Capaldi still on board at the time of leaving would be a much smoother transition, and if he and the companion of Moffat's last series both stayed on for the new showrunner's first series then the transition would be barely noticeable, at first at least.
Disagree about the companion bit. I wouldn't mind a Doctor staying on between showrunners but I can't imagine it happening with a companion. Companions are the creation of that particular showrunner, who devises their entire character arc. Capaldi could stay on for the next showrunner because he's the Doctor, who is the same character in all incarnations, but the companions should ideally stay with their respective showrunners.
What if the companion was a creation of the writer that then became the new showrunner?
Isn't that what happened with River Song? She was presented in Silence in the Library, which was written by Stephen Moffat and then he became the showrunner. He then used her extensively.
The next showrunner could introduce a companion in one of his stories during the series before he takes over, that companion could be around for a good 10 or 12 episodes and then stay with The Doctor for at least one more series, if not more, so that the writer who invented the companion could then use him or her to the fullest extent possible since that writer would then be the showrunner.
What if the companion was a creation of the writer that then became the new showrunner? Isn't that what happened with River Song? She was presented in Silence in the Library, which was written by Stephen Moffat and then he became the showrunner. He then used her extensively.
For me, River Song is one of the few elements of Moffat's era that really worked and her appearance in the Library episodes with the 10th Doctor and Donna it just superb - especially as its where she dies. So some great planning there. I do wonder if Moffat knew at the time that RTD was leaving and that he would be taking over, or if he simply had an agreement with RTD that he could bring River back for future stories he wrote - regardless of whether RTD was still showrunner.
If Moffat also has a planned exit strategy then your scenario could easily be a part of that.
Comments
Hooray!
If I were a potential writer/show runner in waiting I would be very aware of succeeding these two in the role - it is not dissimilar to succeeding Ferguson or Morinho as a football manager where you are likely to suffer unfair comparisons against their ratings/awards etc.
Better someone who can do the job well (if not to your tastes) stays in post than someone comes in not ready/prepared/able to do the job!
I don't know why people keep suggesting Gaiman as a show runner - tv isn't his chosen medium nor his main focus for storytelling so will never happen.
And a special this year
How do you know how hard it must be? Do you have experience running multiple TV shows?
RTD's Writers Tale did seem to suggest it was hard enough to just write & EP Doctor Who let alone do the same for anything else.
Yet he did it. Reading the writers tale, you can almost hear the obsessing coming off the page. The man seemed to live and breath the doctor who universe for 5 years. He was absolutely committed to making every detail of every episode as good as it could be, whilst creating and working on both Torchwood and SJA at the same time, and I think his dedication, forward planning, and attention to detail shone through in the show.
Say what you will about whether you think RTD has a better era or if moffat does, but I think in terms of who is/was most dedicated, RTD wins hands down. It's sad but I doubt the show will ever see someone with that level of dedication again.
Gosh I know. It's almost like these people have minds of their own and are able to make their own career decisions. The very cheek of it!
Do you think we should all just come on here an comment that every single decision made by every showrunner and every actor is absolutely perfect?
The point I was trying to make in my previous post was just that Moffat and Eccleston spark much conversation because people tend to have strong opinions on their length of time on the show whereas as other prominent figures such as RTD, Tennant, smith are generally perceived to have left at about the right time so there isn't really much to say on the length of their tenure's.
I'm not sure how you came to the conclusion that one person is more dedicated to their job than the other. Perhaps Moffat will write his own writers tale one day and we can all compare notes.
Personally I think Doctor Who has been very lucky to have two such high caliber, award winning writers as show runners. I'll certainly be very happy if the show strikes gold for a third time but I'm not convinced it will happen anytime soon.
Personally I think Doctor Who has been extremely unlucky to have someone who had a few good stories in them being promoted above their ability to Showrunner. The BBC should have learnt from the debacle that was Jekyll but of course they didn't.
Great post! The one liners are sometimes the best.
JTD was actual gold; Moffat is Fool's Gold.
JTD? Never heard of him. Any good?
Yeah the debacle of Jekyll and then what happened with that Sherlock thing he tried getting off the ground. What a disaster. Sank without a trace. Actors haven't worked since. And there are rumours the BBC buried all the millions of unsold DVDs in a secret landfill site somewhere in Norfolk. He's a bloody liability that Moffat. It's a wonder he ever gets any work at all.
In unrelated news I heard of a British writer who was being interviewed about his writing and craft to a select audience at a highly prestigious Bafta television event in New York city the other day. It was really well received. I forget his name but maybe the BBC should check that guy out. Sounds promising.
We would get a new companion next year. Be interesting to see how 12 would deal with Clara leaving and getting to know and bond with his new companion.
LOL! Typo obviously. However, I am now lobbying for somebody with the initials of JTD to be the next showrunner. Then, I will look prescient.
Do we have anybody who might fit that bill?
As an unrelated side note, why does everyone seem to really want Moffat and Capaldi to leave together? I'd much rather Capaldi have some time under the new showrunner, simply because that's unprecedented for New Who.
Having Capaldi still on board at the time of leaving would be a much smoother transition, and if he and the companion of Moffat's last series both stayed on for the new showrunner's first series then the transition would be barely noticeable, at first at least.
Who the hell can actually replace him? The one thing missing from Steven Moffat's time on Doctor Who, is his own Steven Moffat contributing fantastic stories every year like he did for Russell.
There isn't anyone right now who's writing anything even close to the quality of his earlier work on the show. He'll stick around beyond S10, he has pretty much no choice..
Mark Gattis springs to mind.
Isn't that what happened with River Song? She was presented in Silence in the Library, which was written by Stephen Moffat and then he became the showrunner. He then used her extensively.
The next showrunner could introduce a companion in one of his stories during the series before he takes over, that companion could be around for a good 10 or 12 episodes and then stay with The Doctor for at least one more series, if not more, so that the writer who invented the companion could then use him or her to the fullest extent possible since that writer would then be the showrunner.
For me, River Song is one of the few elements of Moffat's era that really worked and her appearance in the Library episodes with the 10th Doctor and Donna it just superb - especially as its where she dies. So some great planning there. I do wonder if Moffat knew at the time that RTD was leaving and that he would be taking over, or if he simply had an agreement with RTD that he could bring River back for future stories he wrote - regardless of whether RTD was still showrunner.
If Moffat also has a planned exit strategy then your scenario could easily be a part of that.