And if the game has a multiplayer and you can access the high end gear sooner by paying real cash it makes the grind even longer on those who don't buy the gear as they face better geared players. Unbalancing the game even more so.
I have never found that in the games I have played with short cut packages like BFBC2. What I have found is that the players who buy access to high end weapons aren't very good players or at the very least haven't put enough time into the game to learn the maps properly so can easily be beaten by players with weaker weapons. I used the F2000 in BFBC2 a lot because people kept saying it was the worst weapon and even against people with the best weapons I could still hold my own and be top of the server because I had put the time in to learn the game.
No amount of MTs can buy you gaming skills, they take time to learn which come through the grind to the high end weapons.
Madness!
I think we all knew it was coming though, remember the " horse armour " ?
The developers were putting the feelers out back then to see what they could get away with. They want a slice of that candy crush pie!
Sadly I don't think they will do that. But my point is they can put MTs into full priced games and still have a fair and balanced game.
I have never found that in the games I have played with short cut packages like BFBC2. What I have found is that the players who buy access to high end weapons aren't very good players or at the very least haven't put enough time into the game to learn the maps properly so can easily be beaten by players with weaker weapons. I used the F2000 in BFBC2 a lot because people kept saying it was the worst weapon and even against people with the best weapons I could still hold my own and be top of the server because I had put the time in to learn the game.
No amount of MTs can buy you gaming skills, they take time to learn which come through the grind to the high end weapons.
Well Forza's multiplayer is said to be suffering as people cant afford/have not got time to grind the high end cars.
I think it's a little different to the horse armour (wow, I forgot about that!)
This game has been cynically molded into either being a senseless, not fun grind or a cashcow to get the best cars. Mechanisms in place in the recent Forzas to empower the player with in-game currency have been removed
With a lot of DLC, its really just add-on stuff. In the FM5 scenario, the main lure of playing the game is to take the fastest cars in the world out onto iconic tracks (see that McLaren in the TV adverts).. FM5's underlying message is "yeah, you can do that after hours and hours and hours of grinding.. or you could give me £20....)
BFBC2s multiplayer wasn't compromised by short cut packages.
You're using one game to prove MTs are bad, I am saying they can be fine it just depends on how the game is developed.
So if you and I played BFBC2 and we were of similar skill but I bought all the short cut packages, you wouldn't be at any disadvantage whatsoever if we met?
So if you and I played BFBC2 and we were of similar skill but I bought all the short cut packages, you wouldn't be at any disadvantage whatsoever if we met?
Probably not TBH.
The question is if you have the time to put into the game to learn the maps to become as skilled as I am why are you buying the short cuts.
The question is if you have the time to put into the game to learn the maps to become as skilled as I am why are you buying the short cuts.
So the answer is yes you would be at a disadvantage.
Why would I do it? I wouldn't but some people could have more money than sense or they just like beating people or are lazy etc. Bottom line is you (and I) would suffer somewhat. Making it an unpleasant and less fun experience. I dont mind the grind as long as its fair and we are all in the same boat.
So we have had Ryse, Forza, Crimson Dragon and (Killer Instict kind of) all Microsoft exclusives and all with heavy Microtransactions. Its a good job they dont have any AAA blockbuster shooters coming....
Thats not an attack on Microsoft before any fanboys wade in, I fully expect Sony and any publishers to do the same.
So the answer is yes you would be at a disadvantage.
Why would I do it? I wouldn't but some people could have more money than sense or they just like beating people or are lazy etc. Bottom line is you (and I) would suffer somewhat. Making it an unpleasant and less fun experience. I dont mind the grind as long as its fair and we are all in the same boat.
I don't think I would be at a disadvantage. I was always able to hold my own using what were considered the worst weapons in the game versus people of equal level with what were considered the best weapons in the game. Tactics and strategy play as big a part as quality of weapons IMHO.
I don't mind people having the option to pay to avoid the grind as long as its fair. BFBC2 was, Forza sounds like it isn't. Grinding the game daily to open up the weapons is were people learn their skills and the maps which is were they gain that advantage back.
I would rather go up against a player who has just paid to unlock all the weapons with my starter kit than go up against a player who has played enough to open up all the weapons. Unless you start playing day one when the online mode is first opened you will always be at disadvantage to other players.
I don't think I would be at a disadvantage. I was always able to hold my own using what were considered the worst weapons in the game versus people of equal level with what were considered the best weapons in the game. Tactics and strategy play as big a part as quality of weapons IMHO.
I don't mind people having the option to pay to avoid the grind as long as its fair. BFBC2 was, Forza sounds like it isn't. Grinding the game daily to open up the weapons is were people learn their skills and the maps which is were they gain that advantage back.
I would rather go up against a player who has just paid to unlock all the weapons with my starter kit than go up against a player who has played enough to open up all the weapons. Unless you start playing day one when the online mode is first opened you will always be at disadvantage to other players.
I did it with BF3 because I found it was taken forever to unlock things. BFBC2 was quite an easy game to unlock things with and it remains as one of my favourite BF games to date.
Forza is just sounding too much of a console candy crush for my liking.
All you can do really is vote with your wallet. I for one will not be knowingly purchasing any titles that are more concerned with fleecing yet more money from me from the very outset than providing me with the best possible gaming experience.
It particularly grates to see this going on with launch titles. Perhaps they felt this was important as early adopters with few other titles to choose from at this moment in time are more likely to be susceptible to this sort of thing. But as if spending ~£450 on a new console, or double that for hardcore gamers who will buy both, plus another ~£90 or so on games/accessories/online wasn't a big enough hit to the wallet, you then have to factor in the potential cost of these microtransactions as well.
Frankly whilst gaming is an expensive enough hobby as it is, if developers are finding things tough at the moment then an increase in the RRP for games would surely be a better option. It was my understanding that this was the case anyway with the next-gen.
In the case of Forza 5, I can't help but feel it's more about greed. A high profile launch title like this is virtually guaranteed to be a big seller and make Microsoft a load of money even without these microtransactions. And it's not just the fact they are there which concerns me, but just how prominent they are, how difficult they've made it for you to get full enjoyment out of the title without exploring that option, and just how expensive these "optional" unlocks are.
Considering this is their most exciting launch title and its so badly letdown by a deeply flawed microtransaction policy that ultimately makes the game more unsatisfactory than fun for anyone without a frivolous approach to their finances, this looks to be another nail in the coffin for the Xbox One.
I think Micro transactions have their place in gaming
Take Fifa ultimate team for example, nobody complains about the fact you can spend an hour or two playing games to get a pack, or you could just buy one for a few pounds of real money
That's because at its core FUT is a trading card game you except to pay money
The problem is when you are, what i would call, locked out of content you already own, its like taking Capcoms Disk Locked Content to the next level
You already own Forza 5, the cars already belong to you the second you pay for the game
We aren't talking about the DLC or the Season Pass but the actual base game, you already own the cars, why is there a system in place that makes you pay twice
The problem is when you are, what i would call, locked out of content you already own, its like taking Capcoms Disk Locked Content to the next level
You already own Forza 5, the cars already belong to you the second you pay for the game
This is what pisses me off about DLC/Microtransactions. Everything you can buy is already there on the disk, you're just buying a chuffin unlock key to open it up :mad:
But we don't know that for sure. Weren't publishers trying their best to limit second hand games as a huge portion of their profits are lost to that market? But because they can't do that without annoying customers this is their next option.
Thats a false argument as they aren't losing profits. I buy second hand games to try them out. I wouldn't buy them at full price so they aren't losing any profits.
All companies (regardless of their product) are trying to squeeze more and more money out of people. This is just another example of that and the only way to stop it is to not pay it. Unfortunately there are too many people who are lazy and ignorant to it.
''If you are pressed for time, grab The Run Time Savers Pack to unlock all vehicles, Autolog Challenge Series and profile customization items that can be earned through the normal game progression.''
That's right pay £8 for content that you already have and just need to play the game to get, its hard to say who is worse here, EA for releasing a DLC like this or any ****ing idiot that has bought it
Not only is paying for unlocks a sheer greed it really takes away a sense of achievement for everyone imo. Having the best car,gun,armor or whatever shows you've played the game. These microtransactions allowing everyone to have the best unlocks without the grind really devalues that sense of accomplishment.
Most expensive car is £119.95
Hate to say I told... actually no I don't, I told you so.
Has anyone worked out how much the most expensive cars would be in GT5 and Forza 4 if you applied these microtransaction charges to those games. Also what is the time it takes to earn enough credits to buy the best cars in Forza 5 / GT6 versus the time it takes to earn the credits for the best cars in Forza 4 / GT5.
Video games will never be recognised as an art-form if this sort of thing escalates. In fact we are looking into something close to what the gambling game industry provide! Damm shame.
Even The Last of Us had a 'Season Pass'- which included an DLC that made the main single player game easier!
Has anyone worked out how much the most expensive cars would be in GT5 and Forza 4 if you applied these microtransaction charges to those games. Also what is the time it takes to earn enough credits to buy the best cars in Forza 5 / GT6 versus the time it takes to earn the credits for the best cars in Forza 4 / GT5.
Early reports suggest that the grind isn't out of the ordinary in comparison to older versions. But the fact is they are there and in my opinion its a slippery slope. They should be nowhere near a full price game. Its just abhorrent. I fear the urge to somehow even nudge people towards them will be too hard to resist. I personally wouldn't trust any publisher to keep the game "clean".
This is all messed up, games should be designed to be fun. Not this 'designed to be tedious and annoying so you will get fed up and pay money instead' business. I really hate this freemium/ microtransaction thing, on disc DLC can go take a running jump too.
Comments
Sadly I don't think they will do that. But my point is they can put MTs into full priced games and still have a fair and balanced game.
I have never found that in the games I have played with short cut packages like BFBC2. What I have found is that the players who buy access to high end weapons aren't very good players or at the very least haven't put enough time into the game to learn the maps properly so can easily be beaten by players with weaker weapons. I used the F2000 in BFBC2 a lot because people kept saying it was the worst weapon and even against people with the best weapons I could still hold my own and be top of the server because I had put the time in to learn the game.
No amount of MTs can buy you gaming skills, they take time to learn which come through the grind to the high end weapons.
I think we all knew it was coming though, remember the " horse armour " ?
The developers were putting the feelers out back then to see what they could get away with. They want a slice of that candy crush pie!
Well Forza's multiplayer is said to be suffering as people cant afford/have not got time to grind the high end cars.
This game has been cynically molded into either being a senseless, not fun grind or a cashcow to get the best cars. Mechanisms in place in the recent Forzas to empower the player with in-game currency have been removed
With a lot of DLC, its really just add-on stuff. In the FM5 scenario, the main lure of playing the game is to take the fastest cars in the world out onto iconic tracks (see that McLaren in the TV adverts).. FM5's underlying message is "yeah, you can do that after hours and hours and hours of grinding.. or you could give me £20....)
But Forza sounds like its just a cash grab.
BFBC2s multiplayer wasn't compromised by short cut packages.
You're using one game to prove MTs are bad, I am saying they can be fine it just depends on how the game is developed.
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?p=91353748#post91353748
So if you and I played BFBC2 and we were of similar skill but I bought all the short cut packages, you wouldn't be at any disadvantage whatsoever if we met?
Probably not TBH.
The question is if you have the time to put into the game to learn the maps to become as skilled as I am why are you buying the short cuts.
So the answer is yes you would be at a disadvantage.
Why would I do it? I wouldn't but some people could have more money than sense or they just like beating people or are lazy etc. Bottom line is you (and I) would suffer somewhat. Making it an unpleasant and less fun experience. I dont mind the grind as long as its fair and we are all in the same boat.
So we have had Ryse, Forza, Crimson Dragon and (Killer Instict kind of) all Microsoft exclusives and all with heavy Microtransactions. Its a good job they dont have any AAA blockbuster shooters coming....
Thats not an attack on Microsoft before any fanboys wade in, I fully expect Sony and any publishers to do the same.
I don't think I would be at a disadvantage. I was always able to hold my own using what were considered the worst weapons in the game versus people of equal level with what were considered the best weapons in the game. Tactics and strategy play as big a part as quality of weapons IMHO.
I don't mind people having the option to pay to avoid the grind as long as its fair. BFBC2 was, Forza sounds like it isn't. Grinding the game daily to open up the weapons is were people learn their skills and the maps which is were they gain that advantage back.
I would rather go up against a player who has just paid to unlock all the weapons with my starter kit than go up against a player who has played enough to open up all the weapons. Unless you start playing day one when the online mode is first opened you will always be at disadvantage to other players.
I did it with BF3 because I found it was taken forever to unlock things. BFBC2 was quite an easy game to unlock things with and it remains as one of my favourite BF games to date.
Forza is just sounding too much of a console candy crush for my liking.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O-ILszuIEIM
It particularly grates to see this going on with launch titles. Perhaps they felt this was important as early adopters with few other titles to choose from at this moment in time are more likely to be susceptible to this sort of thing. But as if spending ~£450 on a new console, or double that for hardcore gamers who will buy both, plus another ~£90 or so on games/accessories/online wasn't a big enough hit to the wallet, you then have to factor in the potential cost of these microtransactions as well.
Frankly whilst gaming is an expensive enough hobby as it is, if developers are finding things tough at the moment then an increase in the RRP for games would surely be a better option. It was my understanding that this was the case anyway with the next-gen.
In the case of Forza 5, I can't help but feel it's more about greed. A high profile launch title like this is virtually guaranteed to be a big seller and make Microsoft a load of money even without these microtransactions. And it's not just the fact they are there which concerns me, but just how prominent they are, how difficult they've made it for you to get full enjoyment out of the title without exploring that option, and just how expensive these "optional" unlocks are.
Considering this is their most exciting launch title and its so badly letdown by a deeply flawed microtransaction policy that ultimately makes the game more unsatisfactory than fun for anyone without a frivolous approach to their finances, this looks to be another nail in the coffin for the Xbox One.
Take Fifa ultimate team for example, nobody complains about the fact you can spend an hour or two playing games to get a pack, or you could just buy one for a few pounds of real money
That's because at its core FUT is a trading card game you except to pay money
The problem is when you are, what i would call, locked out of content you already own, its like taking Capcoms Disk Locked Content to the next level
You already own Forza 5, the cars already belong to you the second you pay for the game
We aren't talking about the DLC or the Season Pass but the actual base game, you already own the cars, why is there a system in place that makes you pay twice
This is what pisses me off about DLC/Microtransactions. Everything you can buy is already there on the disk, you're just buying a chuffin unlock key to open it up :mad:
Thats a false argument as they aren't losing profits. I buy second hand games to try them out. I wouldn't buy them at full price so they aren't losing any profits.
All companies (regardless of their product) are trying to squeeze more and more money out of people. This is just another example of that and the only way to stop it is to not pay it. Unfortunately there are too many people who are lazy and ignorant to it.
For 7.99 let's see what extra content we get
''If you are pressed for time, grab The Run Time Savers Pack to unlock all vehicles, Autolog Challenge Series and profile customization items that can be earned through the normal game progression.''
That's right pay £8 for content that you already have and just need to play the game to get, its hard to say who is worse here, EA for releasing a DLC like this or any ****ing idiot that has bought it
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mpx4R9SY98o
GT6 prices revealed.
Most expensive car is £119.95
Hate to say I told... actually no I don't, I told you so.
Has anyone worked out how much the most expensive cars would be in GT5 and Forza 4 if you applied these microtransaction charges to those games. Also what is the time it takes to earn enough credits to buy the best cars in Forza 5 / GT6 versus the time it takes to earn the credits for the best cars in Forza 4 / GT5.
Even The Last of Us had a 'Season Pass'- which included an DLC that made the main single player game easier!
Early reports suggest that the grind isn't out of the ordinary in comparison to older versions. But the fact is they are there and in my opinion its a slippery slope. They should be nowhere near a full price game. Its just abhorrent. I fear the urge to somehow even nudge people towards them will be too hard to resist. I personally wouldn't trust any publisher to keep the game "clean".