Changes to Radio 2: Alex Lester to weekends, 3-5am with repeats

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  • CRTHDCRTHD Posts: 7,602
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    TUC wrote: »
    When will the BBC learn?

    Most people do not care whether presenters are male or female, black or white.

    What they expect is that the BBC hire the very best people available, without any regard to whether the chattering classes approve.

    I totally agree but the BBC aren't interested in "most people". The beeb are worried about the faux metro-liberal outrage that would no doubt result from them removing a female presenter rather than a male, even though he may be a far better and more popular presenter.

    I don't believe that there is one female presenter currently on R2 that is there on merit. Ball / Cox / Whiley / Feltz, et-al are all there because they are women and have sufficient experience that the BBC bosses can justify appointing them.

    That's not to say I think there aren't any decent female presenters out there. Kirsty Young is an excellent natural broadcaster and I'd replace Vine with her in a shot. Also Michelle Hussain has been a breath of fresh air on the Today program.
  • Peter the GreatPeter the Great Posts: 14,225
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    CRTHD wrote: »
    I totally agree but the BBC aren't interested in "most people". The beeb are worried about the faux metro-liberal outrage that would no doubt result from them removing a female presenter rather than a male, even though he may be a far better and more popular presenter.

    I don't believe that there is one female presenter currently on R2 that is there on merit. Ball / Cox / Whiley / Feltz, et-al are all there because they are women and have sufficient experience that the BBC bosses can justify appointing them.

    That's not to say I think there aren't any decent female presenters out there. Kirsty Young is an excellent natural broadcaster and I'd replace Vine with her in a shot. Also Michelle Hussain has been a breath of fresh air on the Today program.
    Even though you never mentioned her I think you are being unfair to Janice Long by what you are saying about current female presenters On Radio 2. Certainly presenters like Janice and Annie Nightingale would have had to have worked harder to get in to radio in the era they started. Maybe Annie should have a permanent show on Radio 2?
  • CRTHDCRTHD Posts: 7,602
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    Even though you never mentioned her I think you are being unfair to Janice Long by what you are saying about current female presenters On Radio 2. Certainly presenters like Janice and Annie Nightingale would have had to have worked harder to get in to radio in the era they started. Maybe Annie should have a permanent show on Radio 2?

    Didn't she get the gig (originally) simply because she related to Cheggars? I would have included her had I remembered.

    I think Annie's ok but shes never really presented a show that I can take to music-wise.
  • GeordieyodelGeordieyodel Posts: 899
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    CRTHD wrote: »
    I totally agree but the BBC aren't interested in "most people". The beeb are worried about the faux metro-liberal outrage that would no doubt result from them removing a female presenter rather than a male, even though he may be a far better and more popular presenter.

    I don't believe that there is one female presenter currently on R2 that is there on merit. Ball / Cox / Whiley / Feltz, et-al are all there because they are women and have sufficient experience that the BBC bosses can justify appointing them.

    That's not to say I think there aren't any decent female presenters out there. Kirsty Young is an excellent natural broadcaster and I'd replace Vine with her in a shot. Also Michelle Hussain has been a breath of fresh air on the Today program.

    I disagree about Ball/Whiley/Cox being appointed solely due to their sex. Anneka Rice perhaps, Nicki Chapman and Maria McErlane being used for cover also possibly true. At the end of the day, it's all personal taste, attempting to appeal to as many people as possible.

    Besides, current changes are all about money saving, not adding more female presenters. Within the Beeb constraints I think these changes make sense.

    I agree about Mishal Hussein or Kirsty Young, though, they'd be great on weekday lunchtimes.
  • GeordieyodelGeordieyodel Posts: 899
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    I think that one of the key aspects to consider is what Radio 2 should be protecting, which is its specialist output, the ratings by day, reputation by night argument, to justify its status within the BBC. If the budget is being squeezed, then perhaps sacrificing some overnight nattering is entirely appropriate.

    In addition, looking at some of the presumably very expensive weekend hosts (Dermot, Paul O'Grady, Elaine Paige, even Terry Wogan) should also be on the agenda to aim for some money saving.
  • PassengersPassengers Posts: 764
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    Good thinking there. You can imagine Wogan being on at least £100k a year just for weekends. O'Leary on at least a grand a show, O'Grady the same (they may be conservative estimates). I wonder how much it would cost for a personal appearance from those presenters? That would be a similar fee to their show fees I reckon.
  • Peter the GreatPeter the Great Posts: 14,225
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    CRTHD wrote: »
    Didn't she get the gig (originally) simply because she related to Cheggars? I would have included her had I remembered.

    I think Annie's ok but shes never really presented a show that I can take to music-wise.
    It's always been about who you know. Janice is a talented presenter who was obviously not just employed because she is a woman.
  • Peter the GreatPeter the Great Posts: 14,225
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    I think that one of the key aspects to consider is what Radio 2 should be protecting, which is its specialist output, the ratings by day, reputation by night argument, to justify its status within the BBC. If the budget is being squeezed, then perhaps sacrificing some overnight nattering is entirely appropriate.

    In addition, looking at some of the presumably very expensive weekend hosts (Dermot, Paul O'Grady, Elaine Paige, even Terry Wogan) should also be on the agenda to aim for some money saving.
    That is not what is happening though. Bob Harris and Huey Morgan have been shunted to an even later slot. Then there is Saturday nights which used to be specialist but is now Sounds of the 80's.
  • GeordieyodelGeordieyodel Posts: 899
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    True, although I presume as discussed that Huey and Bob will be pre-records, thus saving on overnight staffing etc.
  • TUCTUC Posts: 5,105
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    GeorgeS wrote: »
    Since radio 2 axed all the pre Beatles era music there is little or nothing left of bbc2 that couldn't be provided by a private operator if bbc2 didn't exist.

    You're really out of touch with music aren't you?
  • TUCTUC Posts: 5,105
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    Station ID wrote: »
    It worked for 6 music but then again that was an entire radio station. I'm not sure how many people will really miss a porr mans Ken Bruce from 3am in the morning.

    No but I didn't mean that. Its more the issue of moving Bob Harris to 3 a.m. and the image of doing overnight repeats that has the chance of getting more momentum (and I agree its pretty unlikely. My question was more whether that was perhaps the strategy).
  • TUCTUC Posts: 5,105
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    Radiogram wrote: »
    Repositioning themselves? In what way?

    As I said earlier, stick a BBC local jock in that slot overnight, £100 a show. Sorted.

    They're cheap for a reason.
  • GeordieyodelGeordieyodel Posts: 899
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    Passengers wrote: »
    Good thinking there. You can imagine Wogan being on at least £100k a year just for weekends. O'Leary on at least a grand a show, O'Grady the same (they may be conservative estimates). I wonder how much it would cost for a personal appearance from those presenters? That would be a similar fee to their show fees I reckon.

    Give, for example, Lauren Laverne Dermot's show (continuing on 6 Music), extend Johnnie Walker and Michael Ball's show by an hour to replace Paul O'Grady, replace Elaine Paige with Sounds of the 60s, and create a proper Saturday breakfast show with, for example, Liza Tarbuck, and axe Anneka Rice. Put Bob Harris on Saturday evenings 7-10 (or Paul Gambaccini if he ever returns), leave Huey on 6 Music, and do an Archive show or repeats Sat-sun 3-6am. axe Sunday Love Songs and Wogan and give Tony Blackburn or perhaps Ken Bruce Sunday mornings 10-1 (in preparation for semi-retirement) and there's £1/2 million saved, easily!
  • occyoccy Posts: 64,627
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    Give, for example, Lauren Laverne Dermot's show (continuing on 6 Music), extend Johnnie Walker and Michael Ball's show by an hour to replace Paul O'Grady, replace Elaine Paige with Sounds of the 60s, and create a proper Saturday breakfast show with, for example, Liza Tarbuck, and axe Anneka Rice. Put Bob Harris on Saturday evenings 7-10 (or Paul Gambaccini if he ever returns), leave Huey on 6 Music, and do an Archive show or repeats Sat-sun 3-6am. axe Sunday Love Songs and Wogan and give Tony Blackburn or perhaps Ken Bruce Sunday mornings 10-1 (in preparation for semi-retirement) and there's £1/2 million saved, easily!

    Really Paul O Grady is popular. The station needs music shows too.
  • RadiogramRadiogram Posts: 3,515
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    TUC wrote: »
    They're cheap for a reason.

    So there's no-one on the entire BBC local radio network or the Nations that is capable of an overnight gig on Radio 2?
  • GeordieyodelGeordieyodel Posts: 899
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    occy wrote: »
    Really Paul O Grady is popular. The station needs music shows too.

    Very true, although Alex Lester's really popular, and his time has been reduced. I agree it should be all about the music, but if cost is an issue, 2 3 hour shows are cheaper than 3 2 hour shows.
  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 4,952
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    Passengers wrote: »
    You can imagine Wogan being on at least £100k a year just for weekends. O'Leary on at least a grand a show, O'Grady the same...
    Yes, you can imagine - but in fact you have absolutely no idea how much those presenters are paid and are just plucking figures from thin air.
  • ste2010ste2010 Posts: 1,127
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    One thing I have just thought of - are the audiences for all the Sounds of ... Shows the same? Will they enjoy the 3 separate shows. I don't see why they could not simulcast 6 music if we really do have to lose the excellent Alex Lester.
  • pjexpjex Posts: 9,315
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    I disagree about Ball/Whiley/Cox being appointed solely due to their sex. Anneka Rice perhaps, Nicki Chapman and Maria McErlane being used for cover also possibly true. At the end of the day, it's all personal taste, attempting to appeal to as many people as possible.

    Besides, current changes are all about money saving, not adding more female presenters. Within the Beeb constraints I think these changes make sense.

    I agree about Mishal Hussein or Kirsty Young, though, they'd be great on weekday lunchtimes.

    Agree about Ball/Whiley/Cox not TV celebs but many years in high profile Radio 1 daytime shows ( 2 of them did Breakfast don't forget!) so perfectly qualified for Radio 2. In fact these 3 are better qualified in Radio than Alex, Ken and Jeremy when they started their Radio 2 careers.

    An awful lot of sexism on here denouncing all female Radio 2 DJs as only being their because their women, agree some are there due to celeb status but that is true of many men at the station ; Norton, O'Leary, O'Grady, Ball (Michael).

    Don't forget 50% of the population are women so to have no females presenting the 5 daytime shows is a bit wrong, whilst 50 % isn't necessary, 20% presented by females (1 show) should be a minimum, so replace 1 of Vine (Feltz), Bruce, Wright (Ball/Cox/Whiley) and make the station more representative.
  • ahoymeisterahoymeister Posts: 1,134
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    ste2010 wrote: »
    One thing I have just thought of - are the audiences for all the Sounds of ... Shows the same? Will they enjoy the 3 separate shows. I don't see why they could not simulcast 6 music if we really do have to lose the excellent Alex Lester.

    The OP described these as repeats of specialist shows: do Radio 2 count the Sounds... Shows as part of their specialist music obligation? If so, is this also a backdoor attempt at maintaining the number of hours of specialist shows so they can cut back at other times?
  • confuddledconfuddled Posts: 3,758
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    R2 used to be on in my house all day everyday, I moved the dial when Evans came along and have rarely put it back. I will occasionally put ken Bruce and Jeremy vine on and have occasionally tried other shows but for me they lost my interest when they lost Kennedy, Wogan, walker at drive and Stuart and mark in the evening!
  • nikobatallonesnikobatallones Posts: 3,991
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    The OP described these as repeats of specialist shows: do Radio 2 count the Sounds... Shows as part of their specialist music obligation? If so, is this also a backdoor attempt at maintaining the number of hours of specialist shows so they can cut back at other times?
    I just called them specialist shows, for lack of a better term -- I shouldn't have, in hindsight.

    But don't the BBC have repeat quotas too, or does that just apply to TV?
  • FM LoverFM Lover Posts: 50,668
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    Give, for example, Lauren Laverne Dermot's show (continuing on 6 Music), extend Johnnie Walker and Michael Ball's show by an hour to replace Paul O'Grady, replace Elaine Paige with Sounds of the 60s, and create a proper Saturday breakfast show with, for example, Liza Tarbuck, and axe Anneka Rice. Put Bob Harris on Saturday evenings 7-10 (or Paul Gambaccini if he ever returns), leave Huey on 6 Music, and do an Archive show or repeats Sat-sun 3-6am. axe Sunday Love Songs and Wogan and give Tony Blackburn or perhaps Ken Bruce Sunday mornings 10-1 (in preparation for semi-retirement) and there's £1/2 million saved, easily!

    Why on earth would they axe some of the most popular weekend shows? Because they're not to your taste? Love Songs is so popular, as is Paul O'Grady.
    Elaine Paige's show is part of Radio 2's remit so they have to provide such a show.
    Sounds of the 60's consistently performs well at 8am on Saturdays so why would they move it to Sunday lunchtimes.

    Yes, the BBC have to save money and I guess that by re-jigging overnights it's been done as it will cause least disruption as it's the time of day when the least amount of people listen.

    I'm not in favour of repeats on the UK's best and most popular station but I can understand why it's been done.
  • bh21bh21 Posts: 161
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    Some stations call the 4-6am slot early breakfast so surely the 3-6 slot is promotion for Bob and Huey . kidding . never actually realised radio 2 don't have a proper weekend breakfast show . but that's a good shout . Scott mills Sat and Sunday morning would be an excellent idea
  • radio tunerradio tuner Posts: 3,030
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    Radiogram wrote: »
    So there's no-one on the entire BBC local radio network or the Nations that is capable of an overnight gig on Radio 2?

    mark forrest is more than capable
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