Yeah, just watched the finale. 10/10. I genuinely thought I was bored with the whole "dark, gritty, noir" post-Miller take on superheroes. Turns out it's just been a long time since I've seen anyone do it well. That was SUPERB.
Yeah, just watched the finale. 10/10. I genuinely thought I was bored with the whole "dark, gritty, noir" post-Miller take on superheroes. Turns out it's just been a long time since I've seen anyone do it well. That was SUPERB.
I agree.
When I heard the hype, I thought we were in for the preposterous sixth form nihilism of the overrated Nolan Batman franchise, which seems to set the standard for darkness and a pretty low standard at that.
It was neither more nor less implausible than The Flash but what it did have was real heart. You cared about the characters and the cleverness of the plotting and pacing was brilliant. In that regard the explanation of Fisk's choice of painting was a bit of genius.
Mind you, I do also think that Fisk/D'Onofrio was the least persuasive element. I don't know whether it was the writing or the performance but it was difficult to buy the psychopath with a heart schtick.
But I loved all the other characters. The actors playing Karen, Leland (master of sarcasm beyond compare) and Stick deserve particular praise but top marks have to go to Charlie Cox who really mastered a very difficult part. I loved the way they worked in the back story as well. The direction also seemed to be of a consistently high standard.
I guess the most praise needs to go to the producers who obviously put together an incredible team. One of the best bits of TV I have seen in years and supplants the Sam Raimi Spiderman films and the Richard Donner Superman as my favourite screen adaptation of a comic book character.
One final thing though. I am mystified as to how they are going to integrate Power Man and Iron Fist, who are just about the campest characters on the Marvel roster, into this rather solemn world. After seeing this though, I am quite prepared to believe the producers know how.
Re: Fisk and the psychopath with a hearth schtick ^^ - didn't he show his hand in the final fight with DD? He didn't really care about seeing the city reborn, rather he wanted to see it burn in an effigy of sorts to his father?
It's just Whedon trying to get his Buffy-vibe started up again, all that "Scooby Gang" shite. Totally wrong for a series when the best way to use Shield can be seen quite clearly in the comics.
You're right that it's up and down like a yo-yo but it ain't Whedon. He glanced at some early scripts in season 1 but he's got more than enough to do with Avengers. He doesn't consult on AOS anywhere near the level that he'd need to to achieve what you're accusing him of.
It's five shots spliced as if it's one continuous take. Still impressive, though, as the continuity through five shots is pretty spot on and the choreography is well done. Good enough to make the fight look natural.
It's one continuous take, according to the star, the director, the cinematographer and the show runner, in numerous articles asking them about that scene this week.
Re: Fisk and the psychopath with a hearth schtick ^^ - didn't he show his hand in the final fight with DD? He didn't really care about seeing the city reborn, rather he wanted to see it burn in an effigy of sorts to his father?
I'll have to go back and watch.
Well it is hard to say much without spoilers but in the final episode he basically says that he realises he is the bad guy but I doubt that sort of person really has much conception of ethical standards. However, I was really referring to his love for Vanessa which was conveyed as genuine and heartfelt. It is extremely unlikely that an egoist (and egoist is putting it mildly) of that type would be able to form attachments of this kind.
If I'm honest I was disappointed with the last three episodes of the season.
I don't know if it was because we took a couple of days off from powering through but after coming back to the series we hit an episode which seemed to be very focused about Karen.
If I'm honest, I haven't really warmed to her. Her interactions with Foggy when it was clear that he was attracted to her and also her trickery with Ben was pretty underhand given what he is going through with his wife didn't paint her in a great light.
She's pretty selfish and there was a feeling that her character was being amped up to fill the role of 'strong female lead' so that accusations of sexism couldn't be levelled at the show. I found Claire's character far more engaging.
Although I didn't like her and hence relieved that Foggy didn't try to pursue things with her, I felt Foggy's re-igniting of his relationship with Marci was more to get him out of the way rather than an organic re-blossoming between them. Given how much Marci actually helped provide the evidence to bring Fisk down, I thought it a bit unfair that their interactions didn't receive much airtime.
Whereas the story had been about Matt, and seeing his vulnerability when recovering from his beating by Nobu was good to see, it felt that the story meandered away from him and onto others.
This in turn just led to the end of the series feeling a little rushed and not having the same emotional weight or melancholic cues that the first half had. Now maybe it was being away from the show for a couple of days that pulled me out of the bubble but the re-immersion seemed harder and I think Matt, Foggy and Karen have lost something.
It also didn't help that when Netflix showed the pic for the final episode as the credits for episode 12 ran, that it was the three of them in some kind of cheesy smiling shot with the placard on the wall. Maybe it was inevitable that it would all end in smiles etc but it's a bit of clanger to show that at the beginning of the final episode.
Finally I wasn't that impressed with his red outfit. I'd been looking forward to seeing it but it didn't blow me away and if anything his black outfit looked far more real and intimidating.
I like Fisk and I like the character of Vanessa but somehow the show managed to definitely lose my interest in selfish Karen, lose my interest in Foggy because his life was suddenly decided to be played out off screen and dampen my enthusiasm for Matt.
Some shows end on a high that although don't offer a forced cliff hanger can still hook you with a desire to see the next series (Walking Dead, Spartacus etc). Some series can just end and you think 'well I saw it but it hasn't really got inside me' (Breaking Bad, Hannibal) but Daredevil I'm just not sure about it.
It really pulled me in at the beginning and I was singing it's praises to everyone but the last three episodes felt like they'd had a different hand in them, that the writers were easing down in the finishing straight and left everything so neatly tied up that my lasting image is of the cheesy sign off in front of the Nelson & Murdoch sign rather than some of the more powerful and heartfelt imagery from the beginning of the show.
The show was good entertainment and some of the set ups and characters were refreshing but I felt it tailed off a little towards the end, taking it from the stellar series that I thought it was going to be to something a little stratospheric.
I adored it. I only finished it yesterday and asa complete 13 movie, it was sheer brilliance.
One again Marvel, totally nails it.
Cox was superb. Dònofrio was just wonderful. and th esupporting cast, Wesley, Leland, Gao etc was superbly cast and delivered.
They captured , what I thought was the essense of 70s Hell Kitchen, with a gritty take and yet still in the same Marvel universe, just in the cheaper section.
Its a shame that Wesley and Urich were killed off as bith were simply incredible with what they delivered.
Did it matter that Urich was now a black man? Not a jot. It was Ben Urich. Period.
How will they do Jones, then Luke Cage and Power Man? After this, I expect superbly.
Drew Stoddard and DeKnight really knocked it out of the park. I for one would love to see more in a year or 2.
I wasn't disappointed with the last few at all and I didn't get the impression that Karen is selfish, either. It seemed to me that Foggy was just doing a bit of harmless flirting and, in any case, if she didn't have feelings for him, the way she downplayed it was perfectly correct so as not to lead him on. Given that he then got back together with his old girlfriend seems to justify that, more than anything.
Yes, she tricked Ben, but the stakes were high and she felt important enough to justify it. That's a judgement call. Fate of the city vs. minor subterfuge to tempt Ben back to writing. Of course, if she'd know it was as dangerous as it turned out she'd never have done it but, again, that's just bad judgement, not selfishness. If Ben's wife had no problem with it then I don't see why we should.
I liked the suit. Now he looks like Daredevil. Black outfit isn't Daredevil. This is about the comic character, after all!
Loved Daredevil, the movie wasn't great so I didn't know what to expect from the show. I found the characters very engaging especially matt murdoch, wilson fisk and Ben urich. I haven't warmed to Karen page, I found her very irritating and got angry with what happens to Ben which I feel was all her fault.
It was actually refreshing to see Daredevil as dark rather than light-hearted like Agents of Shield.
just seen eps 4 and the ending with fisk is brilliant! i finish an episode and get same feeling like i watched breaking bad or better call saul,. its just a well polished package in acting,directing,writing etc
shame that deknight has left for s2, hope he wasnt forced out.
shame that deknight has left for s2, hope he wasnt forced out.
As far as I know he was brought in as showrunner when Drew Goddard left to do something else, DeKnight also has another show that he is going to be running so he wasn't forced out.
Really really glad they decided to give it a season 2 as season 1 was stunning TV.
Been watching a couple of episodes at a time but ended up ploughing through the last 4 all in one go.
Never read any Daredevil comics and only saw the film the once so wasn't really sure what to expect but enjoyed it. I did start to doze off during the (only one I think) trial scene back in ep3 but apart from that it kept me enthralled the whole time.
I love Madame Gao, I think the actress really nailed the character & I also think that her home is the mystical K'un-L'un that will feature in the Iron Fist TV show.
All in all I would give it 10 out of 10, I didn't think it would work but after watching it they really nailed it.
I was wondering what her remark about her home being a lot further than China meant.
I have watched the series over 2 days and really good
Vincent as Fisk/Kingpin really good because at one point I believed him, making the city a better place. He played both sides really well, I would not be surprised if Wilson Fisk has severe mental health issues in particular split personality disorder
Charlie Cox: again another fantastic character. I had to look up the name though I have seen him in Stardust and the bisexual Duke in Downton Abbey
Karen and Foggy I do like and I like the dynamic of all 3 and pleased that was back on track in the end.
The ending of episode 7 where Stick speaks to some mysterious person opens a future story and the whole thing with Karen murdering Wesley and her finding out that Matt is Daredevil is another future story. Would not be surprised if Fisk, Gao and Vanessa come back
Just watched a few episodes of Daredevil, enjoyed it as I find the character played by Charlie Cox very sympathetic. Oddly, I really thought the movie with Ben Affleck really daft!!!
I've not read through this read as I don't want to be spoiled. I've just watched Episode 6, what a brilliant show it is! Still only half way through! So glad I decided to watch it!
I slogged through this over a period of a few days - it had a few highs but for me it was mainly a sequence of lows thanks to some pretty poor to average writing.
I only really liked two episodes (4 (or was it 5?) and the penultimate).
Sometimes other episodes had a few good points, but mostly the series appeared to be aiming to be dark and cerebral but failing dismally due to bad writing and poor pacing. A lot of the acting wasn't so good either.
During most of the episodes I started clock watching after the first 10 minutes or so.
A few people compare Daredevil to Agents of SHIELD - okay, they're both Marvel productions but they're very different shows. Have to say that I do prefer Agents of SHIELD as the pacing is better, the writing is more enjoyable and overall it knows what is is (light hearted and generally a lot of fun) while Daredevil was trying to be dark and deep yet failing due to bad writing and some poor acting.
I'll give season 2 a go, simply because there will be a change of producers - perhaps they will improve matters on the writing front at least.
Have to disagree Iggyman about the pacing comparison between DareDevil & AoS.
Frankly this season AoS is all over the place, and the pacing is awful, let alone the storylines themselves which frankly are terrible. DareDevil was far better paced, with a much punchier storyline, with well written characters all round, a thing that AoS cant say....
Have to disagree Iggyman about the pacing comparison between DareDevil & AoS.
Frankly this season AoS is all over the place, and the pacing is awful, let alone the storylines themselves which frankly are terrible. DareDevil was far better paced, with a much punchier storyline, with well written characters all round, a thing that AoS cant say....
It's funny how opinions can be so different, I disagree with all that about AoS, there's nothing wrong with the pacing or the storylines. But I also don't think there's anything wrong with Daredevil, all of it was perfect TV.
Comments
I agree.
When I heard the hype, I thought we were in for the preposterous sixth form nihilism of the overrated Nolan Batman franchise, which seems to set the standard for darkness and a pretty low standard at that.
It was neither more nor less implausible than The Flash but what it did have was real heart. You cared about the characters and the cleverness of the plotting and pacing was brilliant. In that regard the explanation of Fisk's choice of painting was a bit of genius.
Mind you, I do also think that Fisk/D'Onofrio was the least persuasive element. I don't know whether it was the writing or the performance but it was difficult to buy the psychopath with a heart schtick.
But I loved all the other characters. The actors playing Karen, Leland (master of sarcasm beyond compare) and Stick deserve particular praise but top marks have to go to Charlie Cox who really mastered a very difficult part. I loved the way they worked in the back story as well. The direction also seemed to be of a consistently high standard.
I guess the most praise needs to go to the producers who obviously put together an incredible team. One of the best bits of TV I have seen in years and supplants the Sam Raimi Spiderman films and the Richard Donner Superman as my favourite screen adaptation of a comic book character.
One final thing though. I am mystified as to how they are going to integrate Power Man and Iron Fist, who are just about the campest characters on the Marvel roster, into this rather solemn world. After seeing this though, I am quite prepared to believe the producers know how.
I'll have to go back and watch.
What a ****ing idiot.
You're right that it's up and down like a yo-yo but it ain't Whedon. He glanced at some early scripts in season 1 but he's got more than enough to do with Avengers. He doesn't consult on AOS anywhere near the level that he'd need to to achieve what you're accusing him of.
Easy target though. I get it.
It's one continuous take, according to the star, the director, the cinematographer and the show runner, in numerous articles asking them about that scene this week.
Well it is hard to say much without spoilers but in the final episode he basically says that he realises he is the bad guy but I doubt that sort of person really has much conception of ethical standards. However, I was really referring to his love for Vanessa which was conveyed as genuine and heartfelt. It is extremely unlikely that an egoist (and egoist is putting it mildly) of that type would be able to form attachments of this kind.
I don't know if it was because we took a couple of days off from powering through but after coming back to the series we hit an episode which seemed to be very focused about Karen.
If I'm honest, I haven't really warmed to her. Her interactions with Foggy when it was clear that he was attracted to her and also her trickery with Ben was pretty underhand given what he is going through with his wife didn't paint her in a great light.
She's pretty selfish and there was a feeling that her character was being amped up to fill the role of 'strong female lead' so that accusations of sexism couldn't be levelled at the show. I found Claire's character far more engaging.
Although I didn't like her and hence relieved that Foggy didn't try to pursue things with her, I felt Foggy's re-igniting of his relationship with Marci was more to get him out of the way rather than an organic re-blossoming between them. Given how much Marci actually helped provide the evidence to bring Fisk down, I thought it a bit unfair that their interactions didn't receive much airtime.
Whereas the story had been about Matt, and seeing his vulnerability when recovering from his beating by Nobu was good to see, it felt that the story meandered away from him and onto others.
This in turn just led to the end of the series feeling a little rushed and not having the same emotional weight or melancholic cues that the first half had. Now maybe it was being away from the show for a couple of days that pulled me out of the bubble but the re-immersion seemed harder and I think Matt, Foggy and Karen have lost something.
It also didn't help that when Netflix showed the pic for the final episode as the credits for episode 12 ran, that it was the three of them in some kind of cheesy smiling shot with the placard on the wall. Maybe it was inevitable that it would all end in smiles etc but it's a bit of clanger to show that at the beginning of the final episode.
Finally I wasn't that impressed with his red outfit. I'd been looking forward to seeing it but it didn't blow me away and if anything his black outfit looked far more real and intimidating.
I like Fisk and I like the character of Vanessa but somehow the show managed to definitely lose my interest in selfish Karen, lose my interest in Foggy because his life was suddenly decided to be played out off screen and dampen my enthusiasm for Matt.
Some shows end on a high that although don't offer a forced cliff hanger can still hook you with a desire to see the next series (Walking Dead, Spartacus etc). Some series can just end and you think 'well I saw it but it hasn't really got inside me' (Breaking Bad, Hannibal) but Daredevil I'm just not sure about it.
It really pulled me in at the beginning and I was singing it's praises to everyone but the last three episodes felt like they'd had a different hand in them, that the writers were easing down in the finishing straight and left everything so neatly tied up that my lasting image is of the cheesy sign off in front of the Nelson & Murdoch sign rather than some of the more powerful and heartfelt imagery from the beginning of the show.
The show was good entertainment and some of the set ups and characters were refreshing but I felt it tailed off a little towards the end, taking it from the stellar series that I thought it was going to be to something a little stratospheric.
One again Marvel, totally nails it.
Cox was superb. Dònofrio was just wonderful. and th esupporting cast, Wesley, Leland, Gao etc was superbly cast and delivered.
They captured , what I thought was the essense of 70s Hell Kitchen, with a gritty take and yet still in the same Marvel universe, just in the cheaper section.
Its a shame that Wesley and Urich were killed off as bith were simply incredible with what they delivered.
Did it matter that Urich was now a black man? Not a jot. It was Ben Urich. Period.
How will they do Jones, then Luke Cage and Power Man? After this, I expect superbly.
Drew Stoddard and DeKnight really knocked it out of the park. I for one would love to see more in a year or 2.
Yes, she tricked Ben, but the stakes were high and she felt important enough to justify it. That's a judgement call. Fate of the city vs. minor subterfuge to tempt Ben back to writing. Of course, if she'd know it was as dangerous as it turned out she'd never have done it but, again, that's just bad judgement, not selfishness. If Ben's wife had no problem with it then I don't see why we should.
I liked the suit. Now he looks like Daredevil. Black outfit isn't Daredevil. This is about the comic character, after all!
It was actually refreshing to see Daredevil as dark rather than light-hearted like Agents of Shield.
http://tvline.com/2015/04/21/daredevil-renewed-season-2-netflix/
shame that deknight has left for s2, hope he wasnt forced out.
As far as I know he was brought in as showrunner when Drew Goddard left to do something else, DeKnight also has another show that he is going to be running so he wasn't forced out.
Really really glad they decided to give it a season 2 as season 1 was stunning TV.
Never read any Daredevil comics and only saw the film the once so wasn't really sure what to expect but enjoyed it. I did start to doze off during the (only one I think) trial scene back in ep3 but apart from that it kept me enthralled the whole time.
I was wondering what her remark about her home being a lot further than China meant.
Wasn't sure if this (plus the other upcoming shows) were meant to be one offs with them leading into The Defenders and that being a multiseason show.
I guess not.
Vincent as Fisk/Kingpin really good because at one point I believed him, making the city a better place. He played both sides really well, I would not be surprised if Wilson Fisk has severe mental health issues in particular split personality disorder
Charlie Cox: again another fantastic character. I had to look up the name though I have seen him in Stardust and the bisexual Duke in Downton Abbey
Karen and Foggy I do like and I like the dynamic of all 3 and pleased that was back on track in the end.
The ending of episode 7 where Stick speaks to some mysterious person opens a future story and the whole thing with Karen murdering Wesley and her finding out that Matt is Daredevil is another future story. Would not be surprised if Fisk, Gao and Vanessa come back
That's not an odd reaction. Many consider the Daredevil film to be complete crap.
I only really liked two episodes (4 (or was it 5?) and the penultimate).
Sometimes other episodes had a few good points, but mostly the series appeared to be aiming to be dark and cerebral but failing dismally due to bad writing and poor pacing. A lot of the acting wasn't so good either.
During most of the episodes I started clock watching after the first 10 minutes or so.
A few people compare Daredevil to Agents of SHIELD - okay, they're both Marvel productions but they're very different shows. Have to say that I do prefer Agents of SHIELD as the pacing is better, the writing is more enjoyable and overall it knows what is is (light hearted and generally a lot of fun) while Daredevil was trying to be dark and deep yet failing due to bad writing and some poor acting.
I'll give season 2 a go, simply because there will be a change of producers - perhaps they will improve matters on the writing front at least.
Frankly this season AoS is all over the place, and the pacing is awful, let alone the storylines themselves which frankly are terrible. DareDevil was far better paced, with a much punchier storyline, with well written characters all round, a thing that AoS cant say....