Haha I dont know what happened there! Teach me to read my posts back.
Camera angle makes it difficult to see ,but there is no reason to approach table with a twig so therefore it is important,and why the large box? Stands out like a sore thumb. I assume the box was used as a cover to switch bolts. I hate assuming stooges so that's my theory.
I'm not sure P&T would be associated with a show that used "TV editing" to make the trick work. They have spoken out against magicians who do this.
I am pretty sure they (along with the vast majority) of magicians also frown upon "stooges". Unless its this type of trick https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zmtFGSHFcbs
(Warning, this trick was (more or less) banned from many American stages for decades due to people fainting in the audience (or maybe moral ethical reason) , it had an associated unofficial ban on TV )
I'm not sure P&T would be associated with a show that used "TV editing" to make the trick work. They have spoken out against magicians who do this.
I am pretty sure they (along with the vast majority) of magicians also frown upon "stooges". Unless its this type of trick https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zmtFGSHFcbs
(Warning, this trick was (more or less) banned from many American stages for decades due to people fainting in the audience (or maybe moral ethical reason) , it had an associated unofficial ban on TV )
Surprisingly poor.
Why would anyone faint at that trick? It cant be done "live" as its camera editing.
I don't think your knowledge of magic is very extensive, based on calling it forced choice.
Unless "forced choice" is a euphemism for "she was part of the act."
If she wasn't a stooge then someone at the judge's table had to be in on it.
Just because you dont know how something is done doesnt make anyone a stooge. Youre talking about different person to me it seems.,The woman who choose the bolt wasnt "in on it" -she was "guided" into choosing the bolt-nor was woman with dollar bill I dont think, all it needs is a switch of the bolts at the judges table and job done.
Due to bad camera angles I couldnt see what happened.
Just because you dont know how something is done doesnt make anyone a stooge. Youre talking about different person to me it seems.,The woman who choose the bolt wasnt "in on it" -she was "guided" into choosing the bolt-nor was woman with dollar bill I dont think, all it needs is a switch of the bolts at the judges table and job done.
Due to bad camera angles I couldnt see what happened.
No I don't believe " guided." Either she is in or it or not. No shades of gray. The act has to go right. The explanations are usually disappointingly simple.
No I don't believe " guided." Either she is in or it or not. No shades of gray. The act has to go right. The explanations are usually disappointingly simple.
The show is based around acts being given items and then they have to create tricks with them hence the patter is a bit rough,
You may not believe she was guided but she was to an extent and there was also something else being used. They were 'lucky' to an extent that she choose the bolt at that point as it looked 'better' than her choosing it a bit later.
The act would have gone right no matter whether she had picked a screwdriver at that point.
The note in bolt will have been a switch at some point. Not shown on TV as they would have done it at an 'off-beat' at some point but done such that no-one knew it had happened.
As someone else has said you are so happy to believe in somethings with no basis but seem so unwillingly to believe that a trick is not done via a plant etc.
It was a really nice set of tricks. A shame we can't see the show over here as I really want to.
I don't think your knowledge of magic is very extensive, based on calling it forced choice.
.
It is actually you who does not have an extensive knowledge of magic. It is indeed a 'forced choice'; there a more specific phrase for what was going on but 'forced choice' is good enough...in this type of forced choice the magician sometimes get lucky at an early point...that is what happened here.
It is actually you who does not have an extensive knowledge of magic. It is indeed a 'forced choice'; there a more specific phrase for what was going on but 'forced choice' is good enough...in this type of forced choice the magician sometimes get lucky at an early point...that is what happened here.
Magicians don't depend on "getting lucky." That's pure amateurism. The act was set up. Why would someone take a risk when it is so easy to make an act foolproof?
Making something appear in a different place is a variation on an old trick.
Magicians don't depend on "getting lucky." That's pure amateurism. The act was set up. Why would someone take a risk when it is so easy to make an act foolproof?
Making something appear in a different place is a variation on an old trick.
If I hadn't had to speak to you on other threads I would be calling you a simple troll.
We really can not put it any clearer: THEY WERE NOT DEPENDING ON GETTING LUCKY - THEY WERE IN FULL CONTROL OF THE SITUATION.
You just don't know how they were in control of the situation and as it appeared that they weren't means they were doing it properly.
Then why did you say the magician got lucky early on?
Of course they were in full control.
That's what I said.
It was a simple illusion.
No forced choice.
Unless again by forced choice you mean, they told the woman what tool to pick.
That's not forced choice. That's setting up the trick in advance.
They either used her on someone at the judge's table.
It never appeared to me that they weren't in control.
It was obvious 100% that the tool she chose would turn up in the thermos.
I can only chip in to agree with what the other two have said.
It was a forced choice. The magicians simultaneously didn't depend on luck, yet they also got lucky - whilst never losing control of the desired outcome. That's all we can really say without giving it away. The fact that you can't see it means that they did it well. Please don't be so dogmatic about something about which you are uninformed.
Then why did you say the magician got lucky early on?
Of course they were in full control.
They were lucky in that she picked bolt when she did,otherwise the trick would have gone a different way albeit with same outcome.
That's what I said.
It was a simple illusion.
No forced choice.
It WAS a forced choice. The magicians needed bolt to be picked so had to make sure she picked it via a "forced choice "
Unless again by forced choice you mean, they told the woman what tool to pick.
That's not forced choice. That's setting up the trick in advance.
They didnt tell her,they guided her choice it wasnt set up in advance ,how many more times do you need telling?
They either used her or someone at the judge's table.
Two different people were involved in the trick IIRC neither were stooges,PEnn and Teller wouldnt allow collusion with any judge.All that's required is to switch bolts,not very difficult for a magician.
It never appeared to me that they weren't in control.
I can only chip in to agree with what the other two have said.
It was a forced choice. The magicians simultaneously didn't depend on luck, yet they also got lucky - whilst never losing control of the desired outcome. That's all we can really say without giving it away. The fact that you can't see it means that they did it well. Please don't be so dogmatic about something about which you are uninformed.
They only had to set it up well and divert attention.
You are making it sound more complicated than it was.
They were lucky in that she picked bolt when she did,otherwise the trick would have gone a different way albeit with same outcome.
It WAS a forced choice. The magicians needed bolt to be picked so had to make sure she picked it via a "forced choice "
They didnt tell her,they guided her choice it wasnt set up in advance ,how many more times do you need telling?
Two different people were involved in the trick IIRC neither were stooges,PEnn and Teller wouldnt allow collusion with any judge.All that's required is to switch bolts,not very difficult for a magician.
Who said they weren't?
You are trying again to make it more complicated. They didn't have to guide her choice at all.
They only had to set it up well and divert attention.
You are making it sound more complicated than it was.
From the mouth of someone who knows nothing about magic: 'only', 'more complicated than it is'.
Do you know how much effort magicians put in to making things look 'simple'? Years of practice and experience.
A book trick I did a few years ago took 3 months to get the patter right and that was nailed in the car to where I was doing it to some friends - and the guy in the car who knew what I was doing was amazed at how much thought I was putting into the wording and realised then how important it is.
And I'll not even go into a card trick patter that took me a year to sort out for a bit of a trick that took about 30seconds at the out-set.
From the mouth of someone who knows nothing about magic: 'only', 'more complicated than it is'.
Do you know how much effort magicians put in to making things look 'simple'? Years of practice and experience.
A book trick I did a few years ago took 3 months to get the patter right and that was nailed in the car to where I was doing it to some friends - and the guy in the car who knew what I was doing was amazed at how much thought I was putting into the wording and realised then how important it is.
And I'll not even go into a card trick patter that took me a year to sort out for a bit of a trick that took about 30seconds at the out-set.
It's not necessary to do that though. Most famous magicians have tricks that are so easy when you know how they're done.
They only had to set it up well and divert attention.
You are making it sound more complicated than it was.
Vis-à-vis the choice of "tool", there was no diversion of attention.
"...more complicated than it was" - again with the dogmatism. It's not that complicated, and it's a standard magicians' "thing". You try to sound so sure that you know how it was done, yet demonstrate that you have paltry knowledge of things legerdemain. A child who'd got beginners' magic books out of the library would likely have seen through that part of the routine.
Comments
Just joshing, I knew what you meant!
I am pretty sure they (along with the vast majority) of magicians also frown upon "stooges". Unless its this type of trick
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zmtFGSHFcbs
(Warning, this trick was (more or less) banned from many American stages for decades due to people fainting in the audience (or maybe moral ethical reason) , it had an associated unofficial ban on TV )
Surprisingly poor.
Why would anyone faint at that trick? It cant be done "live" as its camera editing.
I have,sort of. Im not giving away full methods to tricks ,but picking the bolt wasn't a free choice. No stooge needed.
Nah I don't accept not a free choice.
Either she was a plant or not.
No one has explained it.
She wasnt a plant,no; what you accept and what is true are two different things as previous discussions have proven
It was set up ahead.
If you don't know how the trick was done, that's okay.
I don't think your knowledge of magic is very extensive, based on calling it forced choice.
Unless "forced choice" is a euphemism for "she was part of the act."
If she wasn't a stooge then someone at the judge's table had to be in on it.
Just because you dont know how something is done doesnt make anyone a stooge. Youre talking about different person to me it seems.,The woman who choose the bolt wasnt "in on it" -she was "guided" into choosing the bolt-nor was woman with dollar bill I dont think, all it needs is a switch of the bolts at the judges table and job done.
Due to bad camera angles I couldnt see what happened.
No I don't believe " guided." Either she is in or it or not. No shades of gray. The act has to go right. The explanations are usually disappointingly simple.
The show is based around acts being given items and then they have to create tricks with them hence the patter is a bit rough,
You may not believe she was guided but she was to an extent and there was also something else being used. They were 'lucky' to an extent that she choose the bolt at that point as it looked 'better' than her choosing it a bit later.
The act would have gone right no matter whether she had picked a screwdriver at that point.
The note in bolt will have been a switch at some point. Not shown on TV as they would have done it at an 'off-beat' at some point but done such that no-one knew it had happened.
As someone else has said you are so happy to believe in somethings with no basis but seem so unwillingly to believe that a trick is not done via a plant etc.
It was a really nice set of tricks. A shame we can't see the show over here as I really want to.
It is actually you who does not have an extensive knowledge of magic. It is indeed a 'forced choice'; there a more specific phrase for what was going on but 'forced choice' is good enough...in this type of forced choice the magician sometimes get lucky at an early point...that is what happened here.
Magicians don't depend on "getting lucky." That's pure amateurism. The act was set up. Why would someone take a risk when it is so easy to make an act foolproof?
Making something appear in a different place is a variation on an old trick.
If I hadn't had to speak to you on other threads I would be calling you a simple troll.
We really can not put it any clearer: THEY WERE NOT DEPENDING ON GETTING LUCKY - THEY WERE IN FULL CONTROL OF THE SITUATION.
You just don't know how they were in control of the situation and as it appeared that they weren't means they were doing it properly.
Then why did you say the magician got lucky early on?
Of course they were in full control.
That's what I said.
It was a simple illusion.
No forced choice.
Unless again by forced choice you mean, they told the woman what tool to pick.
That's not forced choice. That's setting up the trick in advance.
They either used her or someone at the judge's table.
It never appeared to me that they weren't in control.
It was obvious 100% that the tool she chose would turn up in the thermos.
You might think someone was amazed by the trick when it's pretty standard.
I can only chip in to agree with what the other two have said.
It was a forced choice. The magicians simultaneously didn't depend on luck, yet they also got lucky - whilst never losing control of the desired outcome. That's all we can really say without giving it away. The fact that you can't see it means that they did it well. Please don't be so dogmatic about something about which you are uninformed.
They didnt tell her,they guided her choice it wasnt set up in advance ,how many more times do you need telling?
Two different people were involved in the trick IIRC neither were stooges,PEnn and Teller wouldnt allow collusion with any judge.All that's required is to switch bolts,not very difficult for a magician. Who said they weren't?
They only had to set it up well and divert attention.
You are making it sound more complicated than it was.
You are trying again to make it more complicated. They didn't have to guide her choice at all.
Its bollywood doing what she does best. Having no idea.
YES THEY DID. You cant see it because youre not supposed to. 3 members in total have told you yet you still insist otherwise. You never change.
From the mouth of someone who knows nothing about magic: 'only', 'more complicated than it is'.
Do you know how much effort magicians put in to making things look 'simple'? Years of practice and experience.
A book trick I did a few years ago took 3 months to get the patter right and that was nailed in the car to where I was doing it to some friends - and the guy in the car who knew what I was doing was amazed at how much thought I was putting into the wording and realised then how important it is.
And I'll not even go into a card trick patter that took me a year to sort out for a bit of a trick that took about 30seconds at the out-set.
It's not necessary to do that though. Most famous magicians have tricks that are so easy when you know how they're done.
Vis-à-vis the choice of "tool", there was no diversion of attention.
"...more complicated than it was" - again with the dogmatism. It's not that complicated, and it's a standard magicians' "thing". You try to sound so sure that you know how it was done, yet demonstrate that you have paltry knowledge of things legerdemain. A child who'd got beginners' magic books out of the library would likely have seen through that part of the routine.
And I've told you there are much easier ways to do that trick.