A first, 2.1, 2.2 or third for which you need 360 credits is an honours degree. Anything below 360 credits does not get a classification nor honours.
No students study for a degree without honours at the university I work at - non-honours degrees are awarded as an exit qualification for those students who have failed modules or have exceeded the maximum time in which to obtain 360 credits for an honours degree. Not all degees have dissertations so it doesn't relate to the fact that you chose not to do one.
No students study for a degree without honours at the university I work at - non-honours degrees are awarded as an exit qualification for those students who have failed modules or have exceeded the maximum time in which to obtain 360 credits for an honours degree.
It was certainly news to me that you can opt to do a degree course without Hons. I agree with the above.
A BA (ordinary degree without honours) is not lower than a third it may simply be that no dissertation has been done or that the candidate left the course before the final year but having achieved a high enough level/enough credit to obtain a BA.
I'll approach 300 points this time next year with the OU and am more than happy with an Open Degree without honours as I don't have time/money for another extra 60 points. P
Is there still a ceremony for those at the OU who have obtained a 300 point Open degree without honours?
A first, 2.1, 2.2 or third for which you need 360 credits is an honours degree. Anything below 360 credits does not get a classification nor honours.
No students study for a degree without honours at the university I work at - non-honours degrees are awarded as an exit qualification for those students who have failed modules or have exceeded the maximum time in which to obtain 360 credits for an honours degree. Not all degees have dissertations so it doesn't relate to the fact that you chose not to do one.
Or because 300 points is sufficient for a degree without honours (at the OU anyway)
If you want to teach (English or primary) a pass degree won't get you on to a pgce course. Some accept 2:2 most prefer 2:1 honours degrees. Even a 3rd won't get you on.
I have friends who dropped out of our degree at 3rd year, not doing the honours, and found they couldn't compete with the honours/masters graduates, but this is a science degree, so very competitive.
An ordinary degree is 20% less work than an honours degree, and employers know that. For better or worse, an ordinary degree has some stigma attached. Get an honours degree if you can.
An ordinary degree is 20% less work than an honours degree, and employers know that. For better or worse, an ordinary degree has some stigma attached. Get an honours degree if you can.
There is no such thing as an "ordinary degree", the classification for all University degree courses in England doesn't work like that. There is no doing 20% less work, you either do the same as others and fail to get the required overall mark for an honours and end up with a pass or you drop out and get a diploma. I am currently sat with our University progression rules and classifications information in front of me as it is exam time.
So many people in this thread are passing on misinformation. Someone mentioned a 3rd doesn't come with honours when it does, someone mentioned you need to do the dissertation to get the honours when you don't, others have mentioned you need a year in industry or something when you don't. I know at one point you needed to do the dissertation to get the honours but that changed many years ago and not in the 9 years I have been working at University and the 3 years I was a student have the students needed to do a dissertation to get an honours degree.
This is an old thread but anyway. The University I work at classes a final overall mark of 35-39 as a below honours degree, it is still a pass. Anything above 40 is classed as with honours, anything below 34% is a fail.
0-34% - Fail
35-39 - below honours standard
40-49 Third Class with honours
50-59 - 2.2 hons
60-69 - 2.1 hons
70+ - 1st hons.
It matters not whether you do a dissertation and every student has to do 120 credits every year. The first year doesn't count so it's a total of 240 credits, and the final mark is worked out adding the marks for all the modules together and then dividing it by 240 and that gives you the weighted average which is the final over all mark. The University I went to worked it out the same way, OU may be different though.
This is pretty much how it works in Ireland. Some degrees require dissertation and/or thesis - some don't. The 'honours' is completely determined by your percentage marks on each module as above. Anything under a 2.2 is completely frowned upon
For my course in Scotland we have an exit point at the end of 3rd year - meaning you leave with an ordinary degree or stay for 4th year and receive honours. They are doing away with the option of leaving though (in a few years)
We were always told that an honours degree was only for those who passed every module (ie gained 360 credits (and first year counted in those) but I failed one first year module and one second year one and my degree certificate still says "Honours".
Unless the year abroad credits were what pushed me way above 360.
We were always told that an honours degree was only for those who passed every module (ie gained 360 credits (and first year counted in those) but I failed one first year module and one second year one and my degree certificate still says "Honours".
Unless the year abroad credits were what pushed me way above 360.
I don't get that as I thought it wasn't possible to obtain Honours if a module was failed.
I don't get that as I thought it wasn't possible to obtain Honours if a module was failed.
Well I'm not sure although just looking at my transcript I had 450 credits (4 year degree). But my friend who did a 3 year degree and failed one of her first year modules got an honours degree as well with 340 credits.
Not having any University experience I have always assumed that (Hons) indicated the very top achievement. A First and then a dissertation. Something to distinguish the elite from everyone else.
If a person can get a Third with honours then what on earth is the point? I wonder how many employers (outside of Academia) actually understand what it all means? If they are knocking on a bit there is a good chance that they didn't go to University (in my day only 10% of students did) or they went when an honours degree involved a dissertation.
I shall now wander off and no longer be impressed with (Hons)!
Not having any University experience I have always assumed that (Hons) indicated the very top achievement. A First and then a dissertation. Something to distinguish the elite from everyone else.
If a person can get a Third with honours then what on earth is the point? I wonder how many employers (outside of Academia) actually understand what it all means? If they are knocking on a bit there is a good chance that they didn't go to University (in my day only 10% of students did) or they went when an honours degree involved a dissertation.
I shall now wander off and no longer be impressed with (Hons)!
The honours reflects the longer period and hence a lot more study at the higher level. Suppose if you've never studied for a degree you would have no concept.
I don't get that as I thought it wasn't possible to obtain Honours if a module was failed.
I failed a module and still got honours.
When i was at uni it was explained simply to us. First year counts for nothing, only second and third year does. You can fail one module and still pass, but if you fail two you have to resit at least one and if you still fail you cant complete the course.
We all had to do a dissertation and if you passed that you got honours. If you failed then you got an ordinary degree.
From that maybe our uni made us do an extra module to allow everyone the chance to fail one but still pass.
Not sure of the dissertation rumour because i thought it was worth double the credits than a normal module so if you failed it that would be the equivalent of failing two modules. Unless you passed everything having one module extra, failed or dropped out of dissertation meaning overall you were one module down so still able to pass?
The honours reflects the longer period and hence a lot more study at the higher level. Suppose if you've never studied for a degree you would have no concept.
My friends have 3 year degrees and all honours degrees.
Not all of them had dissertations either.
As I said my friend couldn't have gotten more than 350 credits and she still has an honours degree.
I think it varies from uni to uni though, same as with a masters. For example at Sunderland uni the pass mark for a masters is 40% whereas most other universities have it set at 50%. (Except Bristol which apparently has it at 60% because they just have pass then distinction).
My friends have 3 year degrees and all honours degrees.
Not all of them had dissertations either.
As I said my friend couldn't have gotten more than 350 credits and she still has an honours degree.
I think it varies from uni to uni though, same as with a masters. For example at Sunderland uni the pass mark for a masters is 40% whereas most other universities have it set at 50%. (Except Bristol which apparently has it at 60% because they just have pass then distinction).
I don't think the degree course having a dissertation included matters as long as the number of credits you can earn adds up to 360.
There is no such thing as an "ordinary degree", the classification for all University degree courses in England doesn't work like that. There is no doing 20% less work, you either do the same as others and fail to get the required overall mark for an honours and end up with a pass or you drop out and get a diploma. I am currently sat with our University progression rules and classifications information in front of me as it is exam time.
I think you'll find there is! I'm looking at our Regulations right now and between a DipHE and an Honours Degree is an Ordinary Degree - 300 credits compared to 360 for honours. And doing a quick google search for most universities guides and regulations quite clearly show ordinary degrees (normally awarded when students don't complete enough credit for their honours).
There is no such thing as an "ordinary degree", the classification for all University degree courses in England doesn't work like that. There is no doing 20% less work, you either do the same as others and fail to get the required overall mark for an honours and end up with a pass or you drop out and get a diploma. I am currently sat with our University progression rules and classifications information in front of me as it is exam time.
So many people in this thread are passing on misinformation. Someone mentioned a 3rd doesn't come with honours when it does, someone mentioned you need to do the dissertation to get the honours when you don't, others have mentioned you need a year in industry or something when you don't. I know at one point you needed to do the dissertation to get the honours but that changed many years ago and not in the 9 years I have been working at University and the 3 years I was a student have the students needed to do a dissertation to get an honours degree.
A pass degree does not necessarily have anything to do with failing modules.
For example, when I trained as a teacher we took a four year honours degree course. At the end of the third year students who chose for any reason to leave without completing the fourth year were awarded ordinary degrees in Education Studies. This also applied to students who completed the final year but who failed their teaching practice.
It was not a case of failing academically, at the end of third year as every module needed to have been passed in order to gain sufficient credits to get the ordinary degree. Many of those who left at that point had decided they didn't want to do a dissertation, or they didn't want to go on to the six week teaching practice and yet others were completely fed up with the whole course and decided to get out to the working world instead.
So in summary, a pass or ordinary degree does not always imply academic failure. It means that the person has either left a four year degree early or for some other reason have decided not to continue with the honours degree. The only thing that can be claimed in any certainty is that the person has passed at least 300 of the 360 credits required for an honours degree.
Comments
No students study for a degree without honours at the university I work at - non-honours degrees are awarded as an exit qualification for those students who have failed modules or have exceeded the maximum time in which to obtain 360 credits for an honours degree. Not all degees have dissertations so it doesn't relate to the fact that you chose not to do one.
It was certainly news to me that you can opt to do a degree course without Hons. I agree with the above.
In other words it's just a 'degree' ..but no more
Is there still a ceremony for those at the OU who have obtained a 300 point Open degree without honours?
Or because 300 points is sufficient for a degree without honours (at the OU anyway)
Oh hang on http://www.open.ac.uk/students/ceremonies/helpful-information
Cheers you sarcy little mug.
what's the point
There is no such thing as an "ordinary degree", the classification for all University degree courses in England doesn't work like that. There is no doing 20% less work, you either do the same as others and fail to get the required overall mark for an honours and end up with a pass or you drop out and get a diploma. I am currently sat with our University progression rules and classifications information in front of me as it is exam time.
So many people in this thread are passing on misinformation. Someone mentioned a 3rd doesn't come with honours when it does, someone mentioned you need to do the dissertation to get the honours when you don't, others have mentioned you need a year in industry or something when you don't. I know at one point you needed to do the dissertation to get the honours but that changed many years ago and not in the 9 years I have been working at University and the 3 years I was a student have the students needed to do a dissertation to get an honours degree.
This is pretty much how it works in Ireland. Some degrees require dissertation and/or thesis - some don't. The 'honours' is completely determined by your percentage marks on each module as above. Anything under a 2.2 is completely frowned upon
Unless the year abroad credits were what pushed me way above 360.
I don't get that as I thought it wasn't possible to obtain Honours if a module was failed.
Well I'm not sure although just looking at my transcript I had 450 credits (4 year degree). But my friend who did a 3 year degree and failed one of her first year modules got an honours degree as well with 340 credits.
If a person can get a Third with honours then what on earth is the point? I wonder how many employers (outside of Academia) actually understand what it all means? If they are knocking on a bit there is a good chance that they didn't go to University (in my day only 10% of students did) or they went when an honours degree involved a dissertation.
I shall now wander off and no longer be impressed with (Hons)!
The honours reflects the longer period and hence a lot more study at the higher level. Suppose if you've never studied for a degree you would have no concept.
I failed a module and still got honours.
When i was at uni it was explained simply to us. First year counts for nothing, only second and third year does. You can fail one module and still pass, but if you fail two you have to resit at least one and if you still fail you cant complete the course.
We all had to do a dissertation and if you passed that you got honours. If you failed then you got an ordinary degree.
From that maybe our uni made us do an extra module to allow everyone the chance to fail one but still pass.
Not sure of the dissertation rumour because i thought it was worth double the credits than a normal module so if you failed it that would be the equivalent of failing two modules. Unless you passed everything having one module extra, failed or dropped out of dissertation meaning overall you were one module down so still able to pass?
My friends have 3 year degrees and all honours degrees.
Not all of them had dissertations either.
As I said my friend couldn't have gotten more than 350 credits and she still has an honours degree.
I think it varies from uni to uni though, same as with a masters. For example at Sunderland uni the pass mark for a masters is 40% whereas most other universities have it set at 50%. (Except Bristol which apparently has it at 60% because they just have pass then distinction).
I don't think the degree course having a dissertation included matters as long as the number of credits you can earn adds up to 360.
I think you'll find there is! I'm looking at our Regulations right now and between a DipHE and an Honours Degree is an Ordinary Degree - 300 credits compared to 360 for honours. And doing a quick google search for most universities guides and regulations quite clearly show ordinary degrees (normally awarded when students don't complete enough credit for their honours).
Out of interest which university do you work at?
A pass degree does not necessarily have anything to do with failing modules.
For example, when I trained as a teacher we took a four year honours degree course. At the end of the third year students who chose for any reason to leave without completing the fourth year were awarded ordinary degrees in Education Studies. This also applied to students who completed the final year but who failed their teaching practice.
It was not a case of failing academically, at the end of third year as every module needed to have been passed in order to gain sufficient credits to get the ordinary degree. Many of those who left at that point had decided they didn't want to do a dissertation, or they didn't want to go on to the six week teaching practice and yet others were completely fed up with the whole course and decided to get out to the working world instead.
So in summary, a pass or ordinary degree does not always imply academic failure. It means that the person has either left a four year degree early or for some other reason have decided not to continue with the honours degree. The only thing that can be claimed in any certainty is that the person has passed at least 300 of the 360 credits required for an honours degree.