Interesting read. Around this time, the emergence of advanced life appeared in south America. As well as europe, china and middle east and many other places. What I find interesting is that all these cultures 1000s of miles apart believed in a higher life be it 'gods' or some kind of spirit world. I think there is something lost from our ancestors about the origins of our civilisation and history.
There's also the pyramid design, which has roughly similar counterparts in various parts of the world. More recently there have been almost simultaneous scientific discoveries by people separated by many miles. Not so surprising though. We're all humans of the same ancient ancestors evolving and devising as best we can. It's common sense.
We must remember that we know more about their history than they did. How they came by the knowledge they had, and were able to talk about it, must have seemed to them to make them so different to every other kind around - that they could easily presume they must have been given those abilities by some greater entity. Probably the same one that made the night turn to day and decided whether it would be a good or bad year for their new found agriculture.
I could be 7 hours, 8 hours or more, that's up to you. This is what you said:
With regard to the bit in red, do you still believe this to be correct?
BIB - If you don't know for sure what happened then why don't you just say that? Why do you feel the need to make something up to fill in the knowledge gaps?
I can't see how you can have a meaningful discussion about ideas when you provide no reasoning or evidence to support them. I may believe that this advancement at around 10,000bc you keep referring to was due to alien visitation, but would never suggest it due to there being zero evidence.
I said only 4% of the universe is understood. My next post I said about 96%. Anyone with half a brain cell would add it together and understand what I meant, fair enough you didnt. So I explained what I meant after. Is it that you still dont understand? or do you just enjoy being pedantic?
Yes the neolithic period interests me, as to what happened around this era.
Do you now finally agree the neolithic era is known as the birth of modern civilisation?
I couldnt care less if you believe in aliens, believe it. I am fascinated by the universe and the possibility of creation, I like reading about it. Its a belief that has always existed within humans and still resides today, that for me is evidence which makes me interested, unless you want to fund me billions of pounds to prove or disprove theories its a bit stupid asking me to do so on the internet. When I never stated anything as a fact in the first place.
There's also the pyramid design, which has roughly similar counterparts in various parts of the world. More recently there have been almost simultaneous scientific discoveries by people separated by many miles. Not so surprising though. We're all humans of the same ancient ancestors evolving and devising as best we can. It's common sense.
We must remember that we know more about their history than they did. How they came by the knowledge they had, and were able to talk about it, must have seemed to them to make them so different to every other kind around - that they could easily presume they must have been given those abilities by some greater entity. Probably the same one that made the night turn to day and decided whether it would be a good or bad year for their new found agriculture.
I'd love a time machine, go back and see how everything happened
No answer would be unanswered, imagine that!
I'd love a time machine, go back and see how everything happened
No answer would be unanswered, imagine that!
I don't see how that works. Can you give a definitive answer why you did everything you did? And if the answer someone you go back to talk to gives is that God told them to do it, I don't really see that it helps.
I don't believe time travel will ever be possible.
I don't see how that works. Can you give a definitive answer why you did everything you did? And if the answer someone you go back to talk to gives is that God told them to do it, I don't really see that it helps.
I don't believe time travel will ever be possible.
Not in that sense. But many mysteries could be answered as an observer at specific times.
Time travel is unlikely. I have read alot of stuff by Stephen Hawking about time travel, well more time manipulation, worm holes, black holes, traveling at the speed of light etc
Its a good read even though not possible.
Not in that sense. But many mysteries could be answered as an observer at specific times.
Time travel is unlikely. I have read alot of stuff by Stephen Hawking about time travel, well more time manipulation, worm holes, black holes, traveling at the speed of light etc
Its a good read even though not possible.
For sure. I posted a link in another thread to some recent news about the Large Hadron Collider, which is suffering delays because of a short circuit in one of the magnets. It shows the kind of magnetic power necessary to keep a small bit of plasma under control at very near light speed, and that's with an experiment which spans the border of two countries...
They're actually hoping to 'see' some of that dark matter in their upgraded detectors. Would be truly amazing if the same machine proved the Higgs boson and dark matter...
For sure. I posted a link in another thread to some recent news about the Large Hadron Collider, which is suffering delays because of a short circuit in one of the magnets. It shows the kind of magnetic power necessary to keep a small bit of plasma under control at very near light speed, and that's with an experiment which spans the border of two countries...
They're actually hoping to 'see' some of that dark matter in their upgraded detectors. Would be truly amazing if the same machine proved the Higgs boson and dark matter...
Its mind boggling. Reading various articles about this. Dark matter, Higgs boson, understanding dimension. I fear what man would do if he was able to create large amounts of antimatter. I dont think there could be a more powerful weapon than a antimatter weapon.
I said only 4% of the universe is understood. My next post I said about 96%. Anyone with half a brain cell would add it together and understand what I meant, fair enough you didnt. So I explained what I meant after. Is it that you still dont understand? or do you just enjoy being pedantic?
The second statement is logically flawed and has little relation to the first statement, I was not the only poster to pull you up on this.
Anyway, I believe this 4% statistic gives the wrong impression of scientific knowledge with regards to the universe. Science says that the universe consists of about 96% dark energy/matter of which they know very little about. If the universe consisted of 60% dark energy/matter, would science have up to 40% understanding of the universe? if it was 5% dark energy/matter, would science have up to 95% understanding of the universe? This stat is more of a reflection of the proportion of dark energy/matter the universe contains, rather than knowledge of its workings.
You can't really measure to what degree science knows about the workings of the universe until it has a full and complete understanding.
Yes the neolithic period interests me, as to what happened around this era.
Do you now finally agree the neolithic era is known as the birth of modern civilisation?
I don't know.
I couldnt care less if you believe in aliens, believe it.
I don't believe in aliens.
I am fascinated by the universe and the possibility of creation, I like reading about it. Its a belief that has always existed within humans and still resides today, that for me is evidence which makes me interested, unless you want to fund me billions of pounds to prove or disprove theories its a bit stupid asking me to do so on the internet. When I never stated anything as a fact in the first place.
I'm also fascinated by the universe.
Belief in creation has existed for a long time and still does, but it is believed by less and less people as time progresses and science provides alternative explanations based on irrefutable evidence. Even the Pope now believes in evolution.
Don't think any amount of money is going to prove or disprove the theories which you seem to be alluding to, but I may be wrong as I still have not heard what they are.
The second statement is logically flawed and has little relation to the first statement, I was not the only poster to pull you up on this.
Anyway, I believe this 4% statistic gives the wrong impression of scientific knowledge with regards to the universe. Science says that the universe consists of about 96% dark energy/matter of which they know very little about. If the universe consisted of 60% dark energy/matter, would science have up to 40% understanding of the universe? if it was 5% dark energy/matter, would science have up to 95% understanding of the universe? This stat is more of a reflection of the proportion of dark energy/matter the universe contains, rather than knowledge of its workings.
You can't really measure to what degree science knows about the workings of the universe until it has a full and complete understanding.
I don't know.
I don't believe in aliens.
I'm also fascinated by the universe.
Belief in creation has existed for a long time and still does, but it is believed by less and less people as time progresses and science provides alternative explanations based on irrefutable evidence. Even the Pope now believes in evolution.
Don't think any amount of money is going to prove or disprove the theories which you seem to be alluding to, but I may be wrong as I still have not heard what they are.
"All the stars, planets and galaxies that can be seen today make up just 4 percent of the universe. The other 96 percent is made of stuff astronomers can't see, detect or even comprehend. These mysterious substances are called dark energy and dark matter." http://www.space.com/11642-dark-matter-dark-energy-4-percent-universe-panek.html
Or if we want to talk about how much we have actually explored or observed then its much less.
Whichever way you look at it there is alot out there we dont know.
Which makes me think about other dimensions.
The pope can believe in what he likes, I dont believe in the pope. 86% of the worlds population believe in something spiritual.
I pondered the thought that outside influences played a role in the development / intelligence of mankind. If something exists its normally because it does or there is some kind of truth behind it. This is not just one mad thought, but strongly believed by billions upon billions of people for millennia. Its not even about religion or who is right or wrong.
"All the stars, planets and galaxies that can be seen today make up just 4 percent of the universe. The other 96 percent is made of stuff astronomers can't see, detect or even comprehend. These mysterious substances are called dark energy and dark matter." http://www.space.com/11642-dark-matter-dark-energy-4-percent-universe-panek.html
Or if we want to talk about how much we have actually explored or observed then its much less.
Whichever way you look at it there is alot out there we dont know.
Which makes me think about other dimensions.
The pope can believe in what he likes, I dont believe in the pope. 86% of the worlds population believe in something spiritual.
I pondered the thought that outside influences played a role in the development / intelligence of mankind. If something exists its normally because it does or there is some kind of truth behind it. This is not just one mad thought, but strongly believed by billions upon billions of people for millennia. Its not even about religion or who is right or wrong.
I accept that there's probably lots science has to learn about the universe, but have no idea how much this is.
Don't know where you got your stat that 86% of the worlds population believe in something spiritual (and I don't know exactly what spiritual belief means), but if this stat has any correlation with religious belief (which probably classes as a spiritual belief) then that percentage tends to be much lower in educated countries.
Things believed by "billions upon billions of people for millennia" means very little to me when you consider the main reason for this is that these beliefs originated pre-science. In terms of human existence, science is in its infancy, so it's no surprise to me that there are many people who still hold on to these ancient beliefs. What I find difficult to understand is when an educated person closes his mind to the irrefutable evidence which supports evolution.
I accept that there's probably lots science has to learn about the universe, but have no idea how much this is.
Don't know where you got your stat that 86% of the worlds population believe in something spiritual (and I don't know exactly what spiritual belief means), but if this stat has any correlation with religious belief (which probably classes as a spiritual belief) then that percentage tends to be much lower in educated countries.
Things believed by "billions upon billions of people for millennia" means very little to me when you consider the main reason for this is that these beliefs originated pre-science. In terms of human existence, science is in its infancy, so it's no surprise to me that there are many people who still hold on to these ancient beliefs. What I find difficult to understand is when an educated person closes his mind to the irrefutable evidence which supports evolution.
Even evolution doesn't point blank rule out creation. Evolution itself could be a design. If there are such things as different realms, paradoxes and dimensions, our vast universe could be nothing but a spec of something much larger. Whats truly out there cannot be comprehended by the human mind. The more research you do on the universe the more questions it actually leaves you with. Why do we have this constant connection to something higher which can defined as spiritual. Was we put for here for a purpose somehow. We may be nothing but an experiment.
Even evolution doesn't point blank rule out creation. Evolution itself could be a design. If there are such things as different realms, paradoxes and dimensions, our vast universe could be nothing but a spec of something much larger. Whats truly out there cannot be comprehended by the human mind. The more research you do on the universe the more questions it actually leaves you with. Why do we have this constant connection to something higher which can defined as spiritual. Was we put for here for a purpose somehow. We may be nothing but an experiment.
Not quite sure what you mean by "Evolution itself could be a design" unless you mean it's being guided by some form of intelligence. If it is then what makes you think this? as there is nothing I can see about evolution which indicates there is any intelligence involved.
I've heard about multi-verse theories and similar, but much of it goes over my head, so think it's best if those types of debates are kept between scientific experts. There are countless possibilities regarding life, the universe and everything, but I'm happy with not knowing stuff until science finds out.
Your stat may suggest that many people have a "connection to something higher which can defined as spiritual", but I'm not one of them. I'm content in the knowledge that we're here by chance, we each exist for one time only, we live on a tiny insignificant rock in a humongous universe and there is no purpose or reason for our existence apart from the ones we create for ourselves.
God is a Jewish God so how come Christian days of rest are different also there are 2 different stories of creation in Genesis , which is right
Its just an observation as a disbeliever
The Bible is a silly book written by stupid men, which has singularly been responsible for more deaths on this earth than all the wars history has to date recorded...(in fact caused many of said wars)
That's the Bible in a nutshell. Anything else is just superfluous nonsense.
Even evolution doesn't point blank rule out creation. Evolution itself could be a design. If there are such things as different realms, paradoxes and dimensions, our vast universe could be nothing but a spec of something much larger. Whats truly out there cannot be comprehended by the human mind. The more research you do on the universe the more questions it actually leaves you with. Why do we have this constant connection to something higher which can defined as spiritual. Was we put for here for a purpose somehow. We may be nothing but an experiment.
If you mean evolution by natural selection then no it cannot be a design. If it was it would be evolution by design.
What fascinates me is the persistent desire to ascribe our cultures and indeed our humanity to an external agancy. Concepts using terms like god or universal un/consciousness or spirituality are used. Sometimes it is just these prosaic aliens but the theme is always the same; we where made by something else; the great ape of evolution (us) could never have achieved all this without help.
Pretty much anything is possible but why is this kind of narrative so popular? It is like we are not good enough for ourselves.
e.g. watch that dreadful film 2001 for further evidence.
How does any evolved, cause and affected bio-chemical concoction get any more choice than a lump of rock bouncing around the asteroid belt? Like a change in trajectory any perceived achievements or beliefs must be purely incidental and under the action of given forces. So much for being good enough for ourselves.
How does any evolved, cause and affected bio-chemical concoction get any more choice than a lump of rock bouncing around the asteroid belt? Like a change in trajectory any perceived achievements or beliefs must be purely incidental and under the action of given forces. So much for being good enough for ourselves.
Interesting questions but the fact I cannot answer them does not justify you making any conclusions. I don't conflate things I cannot explain with things that cannot happen so there is no reason for you doing it either.
Interesting questions but the fact I cannot answer them does not justify you making any conclusions. I don't conflate things I cannot explain with things that cannot happen so there is no reason for you doing it either.
I just went where the logic of your post took me. There's always a reason for me to do it. How could it be any other way for any poor brain in a cause an effect Universe? It's a no brainer.
I just went where the logic of your post took me. There's always a reason for me to do it. How could it be any other way for any poor brain in a cause an effect Universe? It's a no brainer.
Ahh.... perhaps there's some ambiguity in your post and you were also associating the "persistent desire to ascribe our cultures and our humanity to an external agency" to your own, and those similar non theist realist beliefs, as well as those of other posters with various but alternative views. I was just suggesting that in a material cause and effect Universe the answer should be relatively simple. For those views and tendencies of belief with some mysterious element I couldn't say as you state.
Ahh.... perhaps there's some ambiguity in your post and you were also associating the "persistent desire to ascribe our cultures and our humanity to an external agency" to your own, and those similar non theist realist beliefs, as well as those of other posters with various but alternative views. I was just suggesting that in a material cause and effect Universe the answer should be relatively simple. For those views and tendencies of belief with some mysterious element I couldn't say as you state.
If there where I am sure you could have nailed it.
I take it there wasn't then ....so how do you think I conflate things that I cannot explain with things that cannot happen?
I think you need to read back I was not talking about things you could not explain I was talking about things I could not explain. I went on to point out that I did not not conflate things I could not explain with things that could not happen. I suggested there was no reason for you to conflate things I could not understand with things that could not happen either.
I think you somehow read that as a reference to things you don't understand.
How does any evolved, cause and affected bio-chemical concoction get any more choice than a lump of rock bouncing around the asteroid belt?
Why do you ask?
Like a change in trajectory any perceived achievements or beliefs must be purely incidental and under the action of given forces. So much for being good enough for ourselves.
Comments
We must remember that we know more about their history than they did. How they came by the knowledge they had, and were able to talk about it, must have seemed to them to make them so different to every other kind around - that they could easily presume they must have been given those abilities by some greater entity. Probably the same one that made the night turn to day and decided whether it would be a good or bad year for their new found agriculture.
I said only 4% of the universe is understood. My next post I said about 96%. Anyone with half a brain cell would add it together and understand what I meant, fair enough you didnt. So I explained what I meant after. Is it that you still dont understand? or do you just enjoy being pedantic?
Yes the neolithic period interests me, as to what happened around this era.
Do you now finally agree the neolithic era is known as the birth of modern civilisation?
I couldnt care less if you believe in aliens, believe it. I am fascinated by the universe and the possibility of creation, I like reading about it. Its a belief that has always existed within humans and still resides today, that for me is evidence which makes me interested, unless you want to fund me billions of pounds to prove or disprove theories its a bit stupid asking me to do so on the internet. When I never stated anything as a fact in the first place.
I'd love a time machine, go back and see how everything happened
No answer would be unanswered, imagine that!
I don't believe time travel will ever be possible.
Not in that sense. But many mysteries could be answered as an observer at specific times.
Time travel is unlikely. I have read alot of stuff by Stephen Hawking about time travel, well more time manipulation, worm holes, black holes, traveling at the speed of light etc
Its a good read even though not possible.
It's a good read
They're actually hoping to 'see' some of that dark matter in their upgraded detectors. Would be truly amazing if the same machine proved the Higgs boson and dark matter...
Its mind boggling. Reading various articles about this. Dark matter, Higgs boson, understanding dimension. I fear what man would do if he was able to create large amounts of antimatter. I dont think there could be a more powerful weapon than a antimatter weapon.
The second statement is logically flawed and has little relation to the first statement, I was not the only poster to pull you up on this.
Anyway, I believe this 4% statistic gives the wrong impression of scientific knowledge with regards to the universe. Science says that the universe consists of about 96% dark energy/matter of which they know very little about. If the universe consisted of 60% dark energy/matter, would science have up to 40% understanding of the universe? if it was 5% dark energy/matter, would science have up to 95% understanding of the universe? This stat is more of a reflection of the proportion of dark energy/matter the universe contains, rather than knowledge of its workings.
You can't really measure to what degree science knows about the workings of the universe until it has a full and complete understanding.
I don't know.
I don't believe in aliens.
I'm also fascinated by the universe.
Belief in creation has existed for a long time and still does, but it is believed by less and less people as time progresses and science provides alternative explanations based on irrefutable evidence. Even the Pope now believes in evolution.
Don't think any amount of money is going to prove or disprove the theories which you seem to be alluding to, but I may be wrong as I still have not heard what they are.
"All the stars, planets and galaxies that can be seen today make up just 4 percent of the universe. The other 96 percent is made of stuff astronomers can't see, detect or even comprehend. These mysterious substances are called dark energy and dark matter."
http://www.space.com/11642-dark-matter-dark-energy-4-percent-universe-panek.html
Or if we want to talk about how much we have actually explored or observed then its much less.
Whichever way you look at it there is alot out there we dont know.
Which makes me think about other dimensions.
The pope can believe in what he likes, I dont believe in the pope. 86% of the worlds population believe in something spiritual.
I pondered the thought that outside influences played a role in the development / intelligence of mankind. If something exists its normally because it does or there is some kind of truth behind it. This is not just one mad thought, but strongly believed by billions upon billions of people for millennia. Its not even about religion or who is right or wrong.
I accept that there's probably lots science has to learn about the universe, but have no idea how much this is.
Don't know where you got your stat that 86% of the worlds population believe in something spiritual (and I don't know exactly what spiritual belief means), but if this stat has any correlation with religious belief (which probably classes as a spiritual belief) then that percentage tends to be much lower in educated countries.
Things believed by "billions upon billions of people for millennia" means very little to me when you consider the main reason for this is that these beliefs originated pre-science. In terms of human existence, science is in its infancy, so it's no surprise to me that there are many people who still hold on to these ancient beliefs. What I find difficult to understand is when an educated person closes his mind to the irrefutable evidence which supports evolution.
Even evolution doesn't point blank rule out creation. Evolution itself could be a design. If there are such things as different realms, paradoxes and dimensions, our vast universe could be nothing but a spec of something much larger. Whats truly out there cannot be comprehended by the human mind. The more research you do on the universe the more questions it actually leaves you with. Why do we have this constant connection to something higher which can defined as spiritual. Was we put for here for a purpose somehow. We may be nothing but an experiment.
Not quite sure what you mean by "Evolution itself could be a design" unless you mean it's being guided by some form of intelligence. If it is then what makes you think this? as there is nothing I can see about evolution which indicates there is any intelligence involved.
I've heard about multi-verse theories and similar, but much of it goes over my head, so think it's best if those types of debates are kept between scientific experts. There are countless possibilities regarding life, the universe and everything, but I'm happy with not knowing stuff until science finds out.
Your stat may suggest that many people have a "connection to something higher which can defined as spiritual", but I'm not one of them. I'm content in the knowledge that we're here by chance, we each exist for one time only, we live on a tiny insignificant rock in a humongous universe and there is no purpose or reason for our existence apart from the ones we create for ourselves.
Neither
That's the Bible in a nutshell. Anything else is just superfluous nonsense.
If you mean evolution by natural selection then no it cannot be a design. If it was it would be evolution by design.
How does any evolved, cause and affected bio-chemical concoction get any more choice than a lump of rock bouncing around the asteroid belt? Like a change in trajectory any perceived achievements or beliefs must be purely incidental and under the action of given forces. So much for being good enough for ourselves.
Interesting questions but the fact I cannot answer them does not justify you making any conclusions. I don't conflate things I cannot explain with things that cannot happen so there is no reason for you doing it either.
I just went where the logic of your post took me. There's always a reason for me to do it. How could it be any other way for any poor brain in a cause an effect Universe? It's a no brainer.
Nothing wrong with a Humanist reality slap.
Me too.
Ahh.... perhaps there's some ambiguity in your post and you were also associating the "persistent desire to ascribe our cultures and our humanity to an external agency" to your own, and those similar non theist realist beliefs, as well as those of other posters with various but alternative views. I was just suggesting that in a material cause and effect Universe the answer should be relatively simple. For those views and tendencies of belief with some mysterious element I couldn't say as you state.
If there where I am sure you could have nailed it.
I take it there wasn't then ....so how do you think I conflate things that I cannot explain with things that cannot happen?
I think you need to read back I was not talking about things you could not explain I was talking about things I could not explain. I went on to point out that I did not not conflate things I could not explain with things that could not happen. I suggested there was no reason for you to conflate things I could not understand with things that could not happen either.
I think you somehow read that as a reference to things you don't understand.
"Must be purely incidental"? Who told you that?