Hostages and Beheadiing threat within GB

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  • zx50zx50 Posts: 91,200
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    Flash525 wrote: »
    25 years? I'd rather them get tortured and then left in a cell, to rot.

    25 years in a very tough prison. I'm not bloodthirsty though. Whatever happened to him while he was in there, well...
  • dekafdekaf Posts: 8,398
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    jjwales wrote: »
    Quite. Why some keep harping on about false accusations of racism, when there are none, escapes me.

    Now who's being silly, stupid, ridiculous etc, etc.

    We both know that it happens here on a regular basis. Show any support for UKIP = racist. Against halal meat = racist. Againt the burka = racist. Want to control our borders = racist. The list is quite long, but I think you and others will get the gist. False accusations, I don't think so!
  • Rich_LRich_L Posts: 6,110
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    jjwales wrote: »
    This is complete and utter nonsense, and you must know it.

    Yeah, it might not be 77 virgins.
  • jjwalesjjwales Posts: 48,534
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    Rich_L wrote: »
    Yeah, it might not be 77 virgins.

    I was actually referring to your second paragraph ... as you probably knew!
  • jesayajesaya Posts: 35,597
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    dekaf wrote: »
    What was it that went terribly wrong? Are you speaking of the hunger strikes, the wearing of blankets, and the smearing of their cells with excrement?

    No, I am talking about the riots, the killings, the additional bombings and the delay in finding a solution.
  • MidnightFalconMidnightFalcon Posts: 15,016
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    jjwales wrote: »
    Quite. Why some keep harping on about false accusations of racism, when there are none, escapes me.

    Once people become used to a pattern of behaviour they tend to expect it even when it hasn't happened yet. There is a decades long pattern of people being accused of racism or islamophobia for raising concerns about islamic extremism and related abuses.

    In some cases it has even led to authorities being afraid to act to protect vulnerable children. People aren't going to forget that no matter how much "the left" try to rewrite history.

    (I say "the left" because usually the accusation goes hand in hand with accusations of being "right wing").
  • Rich_LRich_L Posts: 6,110
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    jjwales wrote: »
    I was actually referring to your second paragraph ... as you probably knew!

    Right to a fair trial is one thing. Right to abuse the system is another. You've seen it before people getting 'life' and doing 14 years then out etc. I dont agree with that and dont think it is fair however if you are going to start quoting law to me again and that its somebodys 'right' to kill someone in cold blood, be given life / 25 years, be able to appeal that and only serve 14 years because of good behaviour then the law needs changing.
  • jesayajesaya Posts: 35,597
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    I think with *some* people there is a tendency to make excuses for inappropriate actions taken by *some* Muslims, and call those who criticise it racist - the Trojan Horse story in Birmingham was one such case where I saw loads of well-meaning liberal people rushing in to make accusations of racism and witch-hunts, where some of the practises outlined in the schools must go against everything those people to believe in, and the fact that Birmingham City Council has admitted it did not act on concerns for fear of being called Islamophobic (http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2014/jul/18/birmingham-council-disastrous-failure-islamism-schools-trojan-horse-letter) may have contributed to the radicalisation problem in Birmingham which doesn't help anyone or make life easier for anyone but the terrorist recruiters

    I think this is what gives people the idea they can't say anything for fear of being called racist, but hopefully we can move past that now and acknowledge the issues and hopefully tackle them while not discriminating against the innocent

    Have you got an example where someone has called a person racist for saying that terrorists are a threat though? I appreciate the argument you are making, but there is a world of difference between your example and criticising terrorists.
  • dekafdekaf Posts: 8,398
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    jesaya wrote: »
    No, I am talking about the riots, the killings, the additional bombings and the delay in finding a solution.

    Maybe we can learn from any previous mistakes. It could actually be useful to weed out the extremists supporters, and eventually, as we keep getting told it's only a small amount of extremists here, we should soon be on top of it all.

    We need to be extreme with these savages. Why do people find that so difficult to accept?
  • MidnightFalconMidnightFalcon Posts: 15,016
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    dekaf wrote: »
    We need to be extreme with these savages. Why do people find that so difficult to accept?

    I'm (sadly) reaching the conclusion that placing our "principles" above the safety and protection of innocents is the height of arrogant selfishness.
  • jjwalesjjwales Posts: 48,534
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    Rich_L wrote: »
    Right to a fair trial is one thing. Right to abuse the system is another. You've seen it before people getting 'life' and doing 14 years then out etc. I dont agree with that and dont think it is fair however if you are going to start quoting law to me again and that its somebodys 'right' to kill someone in cold blood, be given life / 25 years, be able to appeal that and only serve 14 years because of good behaviour then the law needs changing.

    In a case like this, it is unlikely the prisoner would ever be released - quite rightly in my view. And he could well face extradition to the US of course.
  • jjwalesjjwales Posts: 48,534
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    I'm (sadly) reaching the conclusion that placing our "principles" above the safety and protection of innocents is the height of arrogance and selfishness.

    In what way are we doing that?
  • ElCantoDelLocoElCantoDelLoco Posts: 6,637
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    jesaya wrote: »
    Have you got an example where someone has called a person racist for saying that terrorists are a threat though? I appreciate the argument you are making, but there is a world of difference between your example and criticising terrorists.

    No, no example - I didn't see the original post, I was really just making the point that for many people, there is a feeling that they'd rather not say anything about something which seems wrong or makes them feel uneasy for fear of being seen as a bigot, which may have been what the person was referring to thinking they couldn't even criticise this - I can't seriously imagine anyone criticising the terrorists being called racist though and I'm not defending the post :)
  • Rich_LRich_L Posts: 6,110
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    jjwales wrote: »
    In a case like this, it is unlikely the prisoner would ever be released - quite rightly in my view. And he could well face extradition to the US of course.

    Sorry, a little off track here, but what about other cases of murders, rapes etc? Do you think good behaviour should be taken into consideration then?
  • MidnightFalconMidnightFalcon Posts: 15,016
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    jjwales wrote: »
    In what way are we doing that?

    By allowing a cabel of nihlistic extremists to flourish under our protection for decades and turning a blind eye while they corrupt a new generation to the point where we have a network of young Brittish citizens willing to commit the most appalling atrocities up to and including attempted genocide.
  • dekafdekaf Posts: 8,398
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    jjwales wrote: »
    In a case like this, it is unlikely the prisoner would ever be released - quite rightly in my view. And he could well face extradition to the US of course.


    And would you be happy with that? Knowing that the U.S. could impose the death sentence?
  • dekafdekaf Posts: 8,398
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    I'm (sadly) reaching the conclusion that placing our "principles" above the safety and protection of innocents is the height of arrogant selfishness.

    And sadly, I couldn't agree more.
  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 3,749
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    dekaf wrote: »
    [/B]

    And would you be happy with that? Knowing that the U.S. could impose the death sentence?

    I don't think we extradite people to countries where they can be executed.
  • jjwalesjjwales Posts: 48,534
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    By allowing a cabel of nihlistic extremists to flourish under our protection for decades and turning a blind eye while they corrupt a new generation to the point where we have a network of young Brittish citizens willing to commit the most appalling atrocities up to and including attempted genocide.

    It's not very clear how we could have stopped this.
  • cessnacessna Posts: 6,747
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    Quote:
    Originally Posted by MidnightFalcon
    I'm (sadly) reaching the conclusion that placing our "principles" above the safety and protection of innocents is the height of arrogance and selfishness.

    jjwales In what way are we doing that ?


    Posted by Cessna
    Fortunately these days we are now allowed to comment and discuss barbaric atrocities performed by those originating from overseas or alien cultures without the risk of being branded racist bigots, apart from one or two on here who appear to have leftist or liberal opinions that support the same fecklesh misguided views and policies of successive British Governments that we have to thank for lumbering us with the current series of Islamic medieval barbarism.
  • dekafdekaf Posts: 8,398
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    Chocdoc wrote: »
    I don't think we extradite people to countries where they can be executed.

    I have just googled, and yes, you are right.

    I personally hope James Foley's murderer is extradited to the U.S. though.
  • MidnightFalconMidnightFalcon Posts: 15,016
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    jjwales wrote: »
    It's not very clear how we could have stopped this.

    Not tolerating the stifling of disent under the banner of "multiculturalism" or the wholesale smearing and professional intimidation of those who would speak out against this brand of extremism would have been a good place to start.

    Unfortunately those chickens are now well and truly home to roost.
  • dorydaryldorydaryl Posts: 15,927
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    Going back to the original question, yes. It could happen here. It already has. It could happen to a civilian next time. Should we all walk around fearing it? Probably not. There are all kinds of threats in the day of a human, most of which never materialise into anything significant. If it were to happen, I hope retribution will be swift and harsh upon the perpetrators- even better if the threat was stopped in its tracks before the worst happens. On balance, I do think there will be further atrocities in Britain, at some point. All we can do is hope that the law and security services are vigilant.
  • Ethel_FredEthel_Fred Posts: 34,127
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    idlewilde wrote: »
    It was kind of gratifying when the original decapitation-meister Abu Musab Al Zarqawi got his arse handed to him in the form of a large US bomb on the top of his house, causing him to have to crawl out the rubble and die a short time later.

    Killing is too merciful - something that makes him live a long time but gives a very poor and public level of life would be better
  • NamiraNamira Posts: 3,099
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    Rich_L wrote: »
    Yeah, it might not be 77 virgins.

    I would love it if Muhammad got it wrong and it was actually one 77 year old virgin.
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