After tonight's ep, I think I may have underestimated how messed up Dean is. I actually get the feeling now, esp from how he was stood at the end with Shirley that he does realize what he has done now but is attempting to convince himself it isn't true and is manipulating Shirley in the process.
I actually wonder if they are going to revisit stint in prison, in particular the implication that HE was raped.... just something he said to Shirley about being 'lost' and a few weeks ago Shirley told about 'things happening' to Ben inside. If they do, I wouldn't mind, just not as a way to absolve his guilt over raping Linda.
I actually wonder if they are going to revisit stint in prison, in particular the implication that HE was raped.... just something he said to Shirley about being 'lost' and a few weeks ago Shirley told about 'things happening' to Ben inside. If they do, I wouldn't mind, just not as a way to absolve his guilt over raping Linda.
I agree - it is not an excuse, but it could be a reason why he is so messed up and feels the way he does. His potential as a character dramatically changed in his last episode in 2008 and I'm still waiting for his potential to be realised.
I will say again - it's not an excuse and nothing could ever take away the pain he has caused, but looking at Dean as a character overall, his time in prison needs to be explored.
I actually wonder if they are going to revisit stint in prison, in particular the implication that HE was raped.... just something he said to Shirley about being 'lost' and a few weeks ago Shirley told about 'things happening' to Ben inside. If they do, I wouldn't mind, just not as a way to absolve his guilt over raping Linda.
I think that this could work well as it could be used as a way of making Dean realise and understand without any doubt what he has done. Far from absolving him it would make him face up to it and his own demons and perhaps go some way to rehabilitating him. However, he would have to admit his guilt and be punished for this to have any chance of succeeding in a soap. However, I can't imagine EE ever having him back after this which I personally am sad about but agree that he can't really ever come back and be happy or have any normal story lines.
I think that this could work well as it could be used as a way of making Dean realise and understand without any doubt what he has done. Far from absolving him it would make him face up to it and his own demons and perhaps go some way to rehabilitating him. However, he would have to admit his guilt and be punished for this to have any chance of succeeding in a soap. However, I can't imagine EE ever having him back after this which I personally am sad about but agree that he can't really ever come back and be happy or have any normal story lines.
Matt found out about this storyline after he had signed a contract and therefore he didn't just sign up for this storyline. I'm not sure that he is actually going to leave, unless he only wanted to stay for a year?
I think with any character, if the writers/producers etc. want them to stay, they can. It has to be extremely good writing with Dean though.
I agree - it is not an excuse, but it could be a reason why he is so messed up and feels the way he does. His potential as a character dramatically changed in his last episode in 2008 and I'm still waiting for his potential to be realised.
I will say again - it's not an excuse and nothing could ever take away the pain he has caused, but looking at Dean as a character overall, his time in prison needs to be explored.
It would certain add an interesting dimension to the storyline. I do also believe Dean has a lot more mileage as a character, but unfortunately not long-term now. I kind of see him in the same vein as Michael - a character with is basically an anti-hero, but with an interesting backstory which needs to reach its climax before he leaves.
I think that this could work well as it could be used as a way of making Dean realise and understand without any doubt what he has done. Far from absolving him it would make him face up to it and his own demons and perhaps go some way to rehabilitating him. However, he would have to admit his guilt and be punished for this to have any chance of succeeding in a soap. However, I can't imagine EE ever having him back after this which I personally am sad about but agree that he can't really ever come back and be happy or have any normal story lines.
I know, it is a real shame, because he could've been such a good part of the Carters, much more interesting than Lee, Nancy, Tina or Johnny. I too would like to see him come to realise what he's done, perhaps apologising to Linda (not that she necessarily has to forgive him) and then leaving.
Matt found out about this storyline after he had signed a contract and therefore he didn't just sign up for this storyline. I'm not sure that he is actually going to leave, unless he only wanted to stay for a year?
I think with any character, if the writers/producers etc. want them to stay, they can. It has to be extremely good writing with Dean though.
Well personally I'd be interested in seeing him stay on somehow but it just seems like a very difficult path to tread.
I know, it is a real shame, because he could've been such a good part of the Carters, much more interesting than Lee, Nancy, Tina or Johnny. I too would like to see him come to realise what he's done, perhaps apologising to Linda (not that she necessarily has to forgive him) and then leaving.
If he's in denial then why for the episodes prior to Christmas Day was he acting paranoid and defensive when the issue of him and Linda was raised?
He was questioning "What did she tell you?" in a very defensive manner which implied that he does know.
He often had guilty looks whenever he saw Linda from afar, as though he was nervous about what she may have told somebody.
Not forgetting the scene in the cafe with Stacey when she explicitly stated that he was acting defensive.
If he's in denial then why for the episodes prior to Christmas Day was he acting paranoid and defensive when the issue of him and Linda was raised?
He was questioning "What did she tell you?" in a very defensive manner which implied that he does know.
He often had guilty looks whenever he saw Linda from afar, as though he was nervous about what she may have told somebody.
Not forgetting the scene in the cafe with Stacey when she explicitly stated that he was acting defensive.
He realised Linda was trying to split him and Stacey up. He didn't want to tell Stacey about sleeping with Linda as this fitted in with the womaniser role he had been given. He loved Stacey and wanted the relationship intact.
I think, since Shirley took his side, he's convinced it was consensual.
He might have wavered on his vision of the truth slightly, but I can see him having moments where he looks at himself in the mirror whilst cutting someone's hair and convincing himself that he hasn't got it in him to rape somebody.
Having said that, I think if Shirley starts to doubt him, which to be honest I think she deep down is already doing, then he'll realise and just completely implode. Dean is fascinating really.
I don't think Shirley doubts him. She may do in future but right now she's convinced Linda is lying.
I hope they show Dean confessing to Shirley at some point in the future. It will be her chance to really own the difficult role of a real mother - how do you deal with a monster child? It'll be like the book/film "We need to talk about Kevin".
I don't think Shirley doubts him. She may do in future but right now she's convinced Linda is lying.
I hope they show Dean confessing to Shirley at some point in the future. It will be her chance to really own the difficult role of a real mother - how do you deal with a monster child? It'll be like the book/film "We need to talk about Kevin".
Actually, if they do go down the breakdown route with Dean, I wonder if the next time Shirley inevitably lets him down/treats him like dirt if he might admit it to her to ~punish her. 'Look what you made me, and now you have nothing apart from me' type thing.
I think if he thought it was a one night stand he would've tried it on again. He knows it was rape and his behaviour towards Linda since has proved that. He's trying to convince himself of his own lie and tried to convince Linda of it to.
He's delusional. Deep down he knows full well that he raped Linda but his conscience is trying to cover it up for him, twist it into something more palatable.
He's delusional. Deep down he knows full well that he raped Linda but his conscience is trying to cover it up for him, twist it into something more palatable.
Yep delusion, he knows what he has done he is playing mind games.
Dean was about to leave and actually didn't want to talk to Linda but she insisted. Then when he suggested it was because Mick wanted her to she denied it. She then claimed she really cared about him being fully aware of how he felt about her and proceeded to sit next to him on the sofa rather than keeping her distance.
She then brushed it under the carpet after it happened rather than putting him straight. You decide for yourselves what that is.
Dean was about to leave and actually didn't want to talk to Linda but she insisted. Then when he suggested it was because Mick wanted her to she denied it. She then claimed she really cared about him being fully aware of how he felt about her and proceeded to sit next to him on the sofa rather than keeping her distance.
She then brushed it under the carpet after it happened rather than putting him straight. You decide for yourselves what that is.
So because she was nice to him that means she wanted to have sex with him?
Do some men really think like this? Any expression of compassion from a woman means that she wants you sexually? If so, then I think the fault lies more with Dean reading something more into maternal affection than it was any fault of Linda's, who was just trying to be kind to him and openly told him she thought of him as a son. How one can read sexual attraction into that is astounding.
Dean was about to leave and actually didn't want to talk to Linda but she insisted. Then when he suggested it was because Mick wanted her to she denied it. She then claimed she really cared about him being fully aware of how he felt about her and proceeded to sit next to him on the sofa rather than keeping her distance.
She then brushed it under the carpet after it happened rather than putting him straight. You decide for yourselves what that is.
It was rape. Her being nice to her crybaby nephew/brother-in-law didn't give him the right to push her down and force himself inside her whilst ignoring her saying no and trying to escape from him. He's a disgusting, misogynistic rapist that thinks he can have any woman who shows him any kindness.
I think Dean's stint prison has given him a very twisted concept of sex, love and power. I mean, think about it, he was only about 18-20 when he went down, he wouldn't have been very experienced in such matters. I just have a feeling this is the road they are going to go down.
I think Dean's stint prison has given him a very twisted concept of sex, love and power. I mean, think about it, he was only about 18-20 when he went down, he wouldn't have been very experienced in such matters. I just have a feeling this is the road they are going to go down.
Comments
I agree - it is not an excuse, but it could be a reason why he is so messed up and feels the way he does. His potential as a character dramatically changed in his last episode in 2008 and I'm still waiting for his potential to be realised.
I will say again - it's not an excuse and nothing could ever take away the pain he has caused, but looking at Dean as a character overall, his time in prison needs to be explored.
I think that this could work well as it could be used as a way of making Dean realise and understand without any doubt what he has done. Far from absolving him it would make him face up to it and his own demons and perhaps go some way to rehabilitating him. However, he would have to admit his guilt and be punished for this to have any chance of succeeding in a soap. However, I can't imagine EE ever having him back after this which I personally am sad about but agree that he can't really ever come back and be happy or have any normal story lines.
Matt found out about this storyline after he had signed a contract and therefore he didn't just sign up for this storyline. I'm not sure that he is actually going to leave, unless he only wanted to stay for a year?
I think with any character, if the writers/producers etc. want them to stay, they can. It has to be extremely good writing with Dean though.
It would certain add an interesting dimension to the storyline. I do also believe Dean has a lot more mileage as a character, but unfortunately not long-term now. I kind of see him in the same vein as Michael - a character with is basically an anti-hero, but with an interesting backstory which needs to reach its climax before he leaves.
I know, it is a real shame, because he could've been such a good part of the Carters, much more interesting than Lee, Nancy, Tina or Johnny. I too would like to see him come to realise what he's done, perhaps apologising to Linda (not that she necessarily has to forgive him) and then leaving.
Well personally I'd be interested in seeing him stay on somehow but it just seems like a very difficult path to tread.
I agree :cool:
It would be extremely difficult, but not impossible.
He was questioning "What did she tell you?" in a very defensive manner which implied that he does know.
He often had guilty looks whenever he saw Linda from afar, as though he was nervous about what she may have told somebody.
Not forgetting the scene in the cafe with Stacey when she explicitly stated that he was acting defensive.
He might have wavered on his vision of the truth slightly, but I can see him having moments where he looks at himself in the mirror whilst cutting someone's hair and convincing himself that he hasn't got it in him to rape somebody.
Having said that, I think if Shirley starts to doubt him, which to be honest I think she deep down is already doing, then he'll realise and just completely implode. Dean is fascinating really.
I hope they show Dean confessing to Shirley at some point in the future. It will be her chance to really own the difficult role of a real mother - how do you deal with a monster child? It'll be like the book/film "We need to talk about Kevin".
Actually, if they do go down the breakdown route with Dean, I wonder if the next time Shirley inevitably lets him down/treats him like dirt if he might admit it to her to ~punish her. 'Look what you made me, and now you have nothing apart from me' type thing.
Yep delusion, he knows what he has done he is playing mind games.
She then brushed it under the carpet after it happened rather than putting him straight. You decide for yourselves what that is.
So because she was nice to him that means she wanted to have sex with him?
Do some men really think like this? Any expression of compassion from a woman means that she wants you sexually? If so, then I think the fault lies more with Dean reading something more into maternal affection than it was any fault of Linda's, who was just trying to be kind to him and openly told him she thought of him as a son. How one can read sexual attraction into that is astounding.
It was rape. Her being nice to her crybaby nephew/brother-in-law didn't give him the right to push her down and force himself inside her whilst ignoring her saying no and trying to escape from him. He's a disgusting, misogynistic rapist that thinks he can have any woman who shows him any kindness.
That's an interesting idea.