Current Sony satellite TV's

I finally managed to get the opportunity to try one of the new Sony sets on satellite, the previous ones I'd tried wouldn't find anything from 28.2E on auto search, making them fairly useless in the UK (which is probably why it wasn't even mentioned in the instructions or advertising).

However, the new one (actually a 4K KDL-55X8505B) finds 28.2E fine, and finds 465 channels (I only scanned for non-encrypted), and gives you 'some sort' of EPG, although many of the channels just report 'no event information'.

So it's certainly usable, although well short of a proper Freesat set.
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Comments

  • NorthDown2NorthDown2 Posts: 307
    Forum Member
    I'm interested to see that you were able to scan for unencrypted services on the satellite part of a 2014 Sony. Can you tel me what you clicked in the menus to do this - have a s but have every channel it could find including encrypted at the moment!
  • beamobhoybeamobhoy Posts: 42
    Forum Member
    Settings
    Digital Set Up
    Satellite Auto Tuning
    Service Type - select Free Services
  • marceljackmarceljack Posts: 633
    Forum Member
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    ... the previous ones I'd tried wouldn't find anything from 28.2E on auto search, making them fairly useless in the UK (which is probably why it wasn't even mentioned in the instructions or advertising)...
    Hi Nigel,
    It's really surprising! Did you check if the transponder list was up to date and LNB settings OK ?
    I really do not see why this set would not be able to find and store the FTA channels on any satellite position if the LNB settings and the transponder list are OK.
    There is nothing special on 28.2E which could prevent any receiver to find the FTA channels.
    If the receiver has a "blind search" option, it can find all transmissions even without any transponder list stored.
  • Nigel GoodwinNigel Goodwin Posts: 58,328
    Forum Member
    marceljack wrote: »
    Hi Nigel,
    It's really surprising! Did you check if the transponder list was up to date and LNB settings OK ?

    No, straight out of a box - nothing to check or do :D

    Older ones didn't find anything, new ones do - but it takes a VERY, VERY long time :D

    I really do not see why this set would not be able to find and store the FTA channels on any satellite position if the LNB settings and the transponder list are OK.
    There is nothing special on 28.2E which could prevent any receiver to find the FTA channels.
    If the receiver has a "blind search" option, it can find all transmissions even without any transponder list stored.

    I'm presuming it has a list stored in the set of what to search?, and the older models didn't include 28.2?
  • marceljackmarceljack Posts: 633
    Forum Member
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    I'm presuming it has a list stored in the set of what to search?, and the older models didn't include 28.2?
    OK, but in this case the set has certainly the possibility to add a "new" satellite and define a list of transponders for this satellite (taken from kingofsat or lyngsat for example) carrying FTA channels.
    Otherwise if it has the "blind search" option it can find by itself the transponders and their parameters but this type of search takes very long.
  • Nigel GoodwinNigel Goodwin Posts: 58,328
    Forum Member
    marceljack wrote: »
    OK, but in this case the set has certainly the possibility to add a "new" satellite and define a list of transponders for this satellite (taken from kingofsat or lyngsat for example) carrying FTA channels.
    Otherwise if it has the "blind search" option it can find by itself the transponders and their parameters but this type of search takes very long.

    I didn't really pay much attention to it's actual capabilities, the sole purpose was to find out if it was easily useful for the general public - which at the time was NO :D

    There is a manual tuning option, but I considered that beyond the scope of the average user (and couldn't even be bothered to do it myself :D) - but the current ones do work via the initial auto-search.
  • pgnlpgnl Posts: 273
    Forum Member
    The satellite tuner is better utilised on the continent as there many TVs, as they are here now, have dvb-s/s2 tuners built in. What is probably not widely known in the UK, is that these are used together with the CI+ interface slot to provide easy set up encrypted local satellite tuning in the TV. Examples of this are HD+ with Astra1 in Germany, Tivusat on Hotbird in Italy and Fransat on Eutelsat 5W for France.

    I have a Samsung UE-40F6500 UK model TV and the French Fransat HD CI+ module and card. The installation is pretty clever, as it automatically program's the TV channels in the correct order. The TV also has DiSeqc built in and I have a multi LNB setup. On the TV itself you can select the relevant antenna setting ie Aerial for Freeview HD, Freesat for the UK Freesat channels, Satellite which are the sat channels in the order you choose and installing the Fransat CAM also adds Fransat which then lists the French channels.

    Anyway I digress, I reckon that as long as the TV has a satellite tuner with a Compatible CI+ slot and a dvb-s/s2 tuner you could probably do the same on pretty much any UK TV..

    I hope someone finds this interesting/useful


    Patrick
    N Worcs
  • MarkynottsMarkynotts Posts: 5,255
    Forum Member
    I picked up a Sony 700 series for the bedroom at the weekend. Nothing in John Lewis to say that it had a satellite tuner, so I was really surprised to find the port on the back of the tv for it.

    We set the tv on scan and left it for around 15 minutes. It picked up around 700 channels - obviously didn't see the option to just scan the free services - doh ! I then spent about an hour juggling the channels around but it had already sorted BBC One HD onto 1 BBC Two HD onto 2 etc.

    There is a full tv guide and really impressed with it. Good to see some of the music channels again that aren't on freesat but obviously still floating around out there.

    Im very impressed with the tv, so much so that Im contemplating replacing the tv in the living room with a 42 inch 700 series model that is available.
  • Nigel GoodwinNigel Goodwin Posts: 58,328
    Forum Member
    Markynotts wrote: »
    There is a full tv guide and really impressed with it. Good to see some of the music channels again that aren't on freesat but obviously still floating around out there.

    Are you sure you've checked the guide?, the set can't show either the Sky or Freesat EPG's, and just shows an EPG of 'now and next' - nothing like a 'full EPG'.

    Nothing in JL to mention it because it's not a UK supported feature, just a non-UK FTA satellite tuner.

    If you're not fussed about an EPG then it's a worthwhile free extra though :D
  • SteveMcKSteveMcK Posts: 5,457
    Forum Member
    Are you sure you've checked the guide?, the set can't show either the Sky or Freesat EPG's, and just shows an EPG of 'now and next' - nothing like a 'full EPG'.

    Nothing in JL to mention it because it's not a UK supported feature, just a non-UK FTA satellite tuner.

    If you're not fussed about an EPG then it's a worthwhile free extra though :D
    These sets have an internet-based app that downloads a 7-day EPG, I forget where from. It's pretty good.
  • Nigel GoodwinNigel Goodwin Posts: 58,328
    Forum Member
    SteveMcK wrote: »
    These sets have an internet-based app that downloads a 7-day EPG, I forget where from. It's pretty good.

    Now that's certainly interesting :D

    If I get one in the workshop again I'll have to try it, is there anything you need to do to use it?.
  • PatrickBateman1PatrickBateman1 Posts: 924
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    SteveMcK wrote: »
    These sets have an internet-based app that downloads a 7-day EPG, I forget where from. It's pretty good.

    On my Sony TV it says Powered by Gracenote on the online EPG
  • MarkynottsMarkynotts Posts: 5,255
    Forum Member
    Now that's certainly interesting :D

    If I get one in the workshop again I'll have to try it, is there anything you need to do to use it?.

    Probably just the internet connection which is a doodle with it's built in wifi.

    I gave in and ended up buying a replacement for the lounge TV yesterday - yes another Sony but the 42 inch version. I really shouldn't have time off work, it sometimes gets a little expensive.
  • SteveMcKSteveMcK Posts: 5,457
    Forum Member
    Now that's certainly interesting :D

    If I get one in the workshop again I'll have to try it, is there anything you need to do to use it?.
    I don't remember the details, sorry, it was a year ago that i set it up. I'm pretty sure I just connected the TV to the internet and followed the online instructions to set up the app (powered by Gracenote, as PatrickBateman1 says). I had to do a bit of tweaking to get the right regions aligned with my channel order, since I have BBC1 NI in HD on 101, BBC 2 HD on 102, UTV HD on 103, etc. Then the epg button on the remote brings it up.

    I don't use it much, the Sky box is the main source, but it's handy to have the FTA channels for those occasions when my wife is recording two Sky channels that I don't want to watch (I can only take so much NCIS in a week :) )
  • richie wildrichie wild Posts: 9,888
    Forum Member
    pgnl wrote: »
    The satellite tuner is better utilised on the continent as there many TVs, as they are here now, have dvb-s/s2 tuners built in. What is probably not widely known in the UK, is that these are used together with the CI+ interface slot to provide easy set up encrypted local satellite tuning in the TV. Examples of this are HD+ with Astra1 in Germany, Tivusat on Hotbird in Italy and Fransat on Eutelsat 5W for France.

    I have a Samsung UE-40F6500 UK model TV and the French Fransat HD CI+ module and card. The installation is pretty clever, as it automatically program's the TV channels in the correct order. The TV also has DiSeqc built in and I have a multi LNB setup. On the TV itself you can select the relevant antenna setting ie Aerial for Freeview HD, Freesat for the UK Freesat channels, Satellite which are the sat channels in the order you choose and installing the Fransat CAM also adds Fransat which then lists the French channels.

    Anyway I digress, I reckon that as long as the TV has a satellite tuner with a Compatible CI+ slot and a dvb-s/s2 tuner you could probably do the same on pretty much any UK TV..

    I hope someone finds this interesting/useful


    Patrick
    N Worcs

    Hi Patrick,

    This is very interesting! So, the CAM slots in tv's with satellite tuners work? I was told they just decrypted Top Up TV (or whatever it's called now). My LG cheapo Boxing Day Deal tv has a satellite tuner in it and I have German tv on it. Would be great to have the HD channels from the likes of Sat.1 in HD, but that needs a card and CAM. Likewise Tivusat if I plugged my Hot Bird dish in.

    I didn't want to buy one only to find it was incompatible.
  • Nigel GoodwinNigel Goodwin Posts: 58,328
    Forum Member
    This is very interesting! So, the CAM slots in tv's with satellite tuners work? I was told they just decrypted Top Up TV (or whatever it's called now). My LG cheapo Boxing Day Deal tv has a satellite tuner in it and I have German tv on it. Would be great to have the HD channels from the likes of Sat.1 in HD, but that needs a card and CAM. Likewise Tivusat if I plugged my Hot Bird dish in.

    I didn't want to buy one only to find it was incompatible.

    CAM slots are included on TV's by EU regulation, specifically for such purposes - so 'should' work fine :D

    Sony in particular would be good, as they produce pan-European sets, so the set you buy here is essentially identical to the one you would buy in Germany (you set the country of use and menu language when you initially set it up).

    Many sets are pan-European, a notable exception been Panasonic, who still sell country specific models.
  • pgnlpgnl Posts: 273
    Forum Member
    Hi Patrick,

    This is very interesting! So, the CAM slots in tv's with satellite tuners work? I was told they just decrypted Top Up TV (or whatever it's called now). My LG cheapo Boxing Day Deal tv has a satellite tuner in it and I have German tv on it. Would be great to have the HD channels from the likes of Sat.1 in HD, but that needs a card and CAM. Likewise Tivusat if I plugged my Hot Bird dish in.

    I didn't want to buy one only to find it was incompatible.

    The thing to check for is whether or not not the TV is compatible with CI+ (I think 1.3 onwards..), if it is, it should work like my Samsung TV. For Germany, you need a HD+ Cam and card (see here for more info and use Google translate), you can find them from either the UK or German verson of the 'bay for around £68. For tivusat you must get the card preactivated or it has to activated by an italian resident.

    I did pick my TV carefully as few have both Fransat and DiseQc switching built-in but it all works perfectly and I can get 8 French channels in HD.

    Patrick
    Worcs
  • pgnlpgnl Posts: 273
    Forum Member
    CAM slots are included on TV's by EU regulation, specifically for such purposes - so 'should' work fine :D

    Sony in particular would be good, as they produce pan-European sets, so the set you buy here is essentially identical to the one you would buy in Germany (you set the country of use and menu language when you initially set it up).

    Many sets are pan-European, a notable exception been Panasonic, who still sell country specific models.

    Hmm... you have to be carefully though, as each country in the EU doesn't need a DVB-T2 tuner like the UK, so to save money the manufacturer will often only install a DVB-T version instead. Also some countries use HBB text, the UK doesn't as we use MHEG. The models may look the same but there are often small hardware and programming differences. Samsung adds a few extra letters to the model number to denote the specific country,

    As you quite rightly say, Panasonic models are UK/Ireland only and the VHF tuner only kicks in when set to Ireland mode. You do need to carefully check the spec first.

    As for the Common interface, you're right, I think CI+ slots are pretty much standard on all modern TVs now..

    Patrick
    Worcs
  • Nigel GoodwinNigel Goodwin Posts: 58,328
    Forum Member
    pgnl wrote: »
    Hmm... you have to be carefully though, as each country in the EU doesn't need a DVB-T2 tuner like the UK, so to save money the manufacturer will often only install a DVB-T version instead. Also some countries use HBB text, the UK doesn't as we use MHEG. The models may look the same but there are often small hardware and programming differences.

    Sony are the same, the country specific changes are done when you set it up (not during manufacture) - so sets that have a T2 'tuner' in the UK, also have one in Germany etc. - it's the exact same set (apart from the plug :D).

    What does annoy me though is sets (like Sharp) that auto-tune the VHF channels, even after you've told it you're in the UK! >:(
  • Nigel GoodwinNigel Goodwin Posts: 58,328
    Forum Member
    Winston_1 wrote: »
    VHF is used on cable and distribution systems in the UK. Sharp etc are enlightened manufacturers unlike Panachronic who take the attitude that we know best when in fact they don't.

    It was in the VERY distant past - cable in the UK is almost exclusively digital and requires a rented box to use - so no use for any kind of tuner in the TV.

    Besides, nothing to stop you tuning VHF afterwards if you wanted, just don't do it as default from initial install when it's not required and just wastes a considerable amount of time.
  • richie wildrichie wild Posts: 9,888
    Forum Member
    I'm beating my head against a brick wall with LG! They won't confirm anything, they won't even tell me if the CI is compliant with the standard required.
  • Nigel GoodwinNigel Goodwin Posts: 58,328
    Forum Member
    I'm beating my head against a brick wall with LG! They won't confirm anything, they won't even tell me if the CI is compliant with the standard required.

    As we don't use the CI slot in the UK, it's probably something LG UK wouldn't know?, and of course they wouldn't know anything about non-UK channels.
  • richie wildrichie wild Posts: 9,888
    Forum Member
    All I asked was for the spec for the CI slot, but explained why. I get a lot of useless sh1t as an answer, but no reply on specification :(
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