Matt Smith uses his natural accent, and I don't think he was hired because of it.
I think you're slightly missing my point. It's not about whether or not an individual actor is asked to use his own natural accent or not (after all, these are actors - change of accent is part of the skillset for the job).
What I'm questioning goes a bit deeper than that....
Have you ever thought to wonder why the Matt Smith was not asked to play the Doctor with a different accent? Why the (vaguely) southern England accent is just accepted as being suitable for the Doctor as a sophisticated, educated character? Is it OK that DT was asked to play the Doctor with a southern English accent? Of course an accent has to be chosen, but why is it usually that accent for educated characters?
Ever wondered why the "bad characters" in the TV version of "Wind in the Willows" or "Tales of the Riverbank" all spoke with "working class" accents, and the nice characters had posh accents? (Both old examples, I know, but there's still quite a lot of it about)
I think you're slightly missing my point. It's not about whether or not an individual actor is asked to use his own natural accent or not (after all, these are actors - change of accent is part of the skillset for the job).
What I'm questioning goes a bit deeper than that....
No, I understand. But it goes both ways. CE has a Northern accent, and plays an intellectual. MS has a Southern accent, and plays the same intellectual. You can't give them plaudits for casting a Northerner as an intellectual, and then criticism for casting a Southerner, without appearing to buy into the stereotype.
You could equally make the point about people with shaved heads are rarely intellectuals, comparing CE with DT and MS's floppy hair.
The more likely possibility - and the one that has been reported as the real reason - is that the casting and choice of accent wasn't made as an attempt to confirm/contradict stereotypes, but because they wanted to contrast someone with a strong regional accent against someone without one.
I think you're slightly missing my point. It's not about whether or not an individual actor is asked to use his own natural accent or not (after all, these are actors - change of accent is part of the skillset for the job).
What I'm questioning goes a bit deeper than that....
Have you ever thought to wonder why the Matt Smith was not asked to play the Doctor with a different accent? Why the (vaguely) southern England accent is just accepted as being suitable for the Doctor as a sophisticated, educated character? Is it OK that DT was asked to play the Doctor with a southern English accent? Of course an accent has to be chosen, but why is it usually that accent for educated characters?
Ever wondered why the "bad characters" in the TV version of "Wind in the Willows" or "Tales of the Riverbank" all spoke with "working class" accents, and the nice characters had posh accents? (Both old examples, I know, but there's still quite a lot of it about)
Ahm jus sayin, is all....
True at one time, but inverted snobbery has become the norm in recent years with honest working class heroes and decadent posh villains.
In fact, the 11th Doctor is one of the few RP-speaking heroes on TV. Received Pronunciation almost always identifies a character as a villain.
No, I understand. But it goes both ways. CE has a Northern accent, and plays an intellectual. MS has a Southern accent, and plays the same intellectual. You can't give them plaudits for casting a Northerner as an intellectual, and then criticism for casting a Southerner, without appearing to buy into the stereotype.
I don't think you understand at all. What you just said makes no sense. One of those is the accepted stereotype. The other plays against it. Why would I give plaudits for reverting to the stereotype?
The more likely possibility - and the one that has been reported as the real reason - is that the casting and choice of accent wasn't made as an attempt to confirm/contradict stereotypes, but because they wanted to contrast someone with a strong regional accent against someone without one.
Qutie possibly. I'm not suggesting there's a conspiracy, just a tendency. They could have gone for a different "strong regional accent" - to use your words.
And, by the way, a southern accent is also a "strong regional accent". Now who's buying into the stereotypes?
It's almost impossible to discuss this subject without buying into one prejudice or another....
I don't think you understand at all. What you just said makes no sense. One of those is the accepted stereotype. The other plays against it. Why would I give plaudits for reverting to the stereotype?
For being blind to the stereotype. For saying that an intellectual can be a Northerner or a Southerner, equally - by following one with the other.
Subverting a stereotype is a difficult thing to do without drawing attention to it.
For being blind to the stereotype. For saying that an intellectual can be a Northerner or a Southerner, equally - by following one with the other.
If we'd had, say 5 new Doctors with 5 different regional (and I include "southern" as regional, BTW) accents, then I might agree with you. Since we've actually had 3 new Doctors, 2 of which had southern accents, then I think your case falls down (the ratio gets worse if you include classic Doctors).
That's hardly "subverting the stereotype". That's "going with the tendency". Hence, I make the distinction of praising them for CE and not praising for DT and MS. Further, I criticise them for asking DT to use a "received pronunciation" accent.
Subverting a stereotype is a difficult thing to do without drawing attention to it.
Indeed, but that's no argument for not trying to subvert the stereotype. And, in fact, drawing people's attention to an issue and making them think about it is the first step towards dealing with it.
If we'd had, say 5 new Doctors with 5 different regional (and I include "southern" as regional, BTW) accents, then I might agree with you. Since we've actually had 3 new Doctors, 2 of which had southern accents, then I think your case falls down (the ratio gets worse if you include classic Doctors).
That's hardly subverting the stereotype. That's "going with the tendency". Hence, I make the distinction of praising them for CE and not praising for DT and MS. Further, I criticise them for asking DT to use a "received pronunciation" accent.
Indeed, but that's no argument for not trying to subvert the stereotype.
But Tennant did not use Received Pronunciation. The 10th Doctor's accent can be described as Estuary English or "Mockney".
Matt Smith is the first Doctor since Colin Baker to speak in RP or "BBC English" as it was known in the days before its speakers were mainly portrayed as villains.
But Tennant did not use Received Pronunciation. The 10th Doctor's accent can be described as Estuary English or "Mockney".
Matt Smith is the first Doctor since Colin Baker to speak in RP or "BBC English" as it was known in the days before its speakers were mainly portrayed as villains.
OK, so it's still southern. It's actually going with the accent the largest group in the English population use. Since the south east is where the largest part of the population lives.
And it's usually US productions that have RP English accented villains.
Let's see what accent the next Doctor has then. :-)
OK, so it's still southern. It's actually going with the accent the largest group in the English population use. Since the south east is where the largest part of the population lives.
And it's usually US productions that have RP English accented villains.
Let's see what accent the next Doctor has then. :-)
While "villains" may have been a bit harsh, RP speakers are routinely portrayed as cold and flawed characters who lack the emotional honesty and integrity shown by those with regional "working class" accents. Inverted snobbery is pretty much the norm in TV Drama these days.
Comments
I think you're slightly missing my point. It's not about whether or not an individual actor is asked to use his own natural accent or not (after all, these are actors - change of accent is part of the skillset for the job).
What I'm questioning goes a bit deeper than that....
Have you ever thought to wonder why the Matt Smith was not asked to play the Doctor with a different accent? Why the (vaguely) southern England accent is just accepted as being suitable for the Doctor as a sophisticated, educated character? Is it OK that DT was asked to play the Doctor with a southern English accent? Of course an accent has to be chosen, but why is it usually that accent for educated characters?
Ever wondered why the "bad characters" in the TV version of "Wind in the Willows" or "Tales of the Riverbank" all spoke with "working class" accents, and the nice characters had posh accents? (Both old examples, I know, but there's still quite a lot of it about)
Ahm jus sayin, is all....
You could equally make the point about people with shaved heads are rarely intellectuals, comparing CE with DT and MS's floppy hair.
The more likely possibility - and the one that has been reported as the real reason - is that the casting and choice of accent wasn't made as an attempt to confirm/contradict stereotypes, but because they wanted to contrast someone with a strong regional accent against someone without one.
It's a shame that he only did one season but it would appear there were very good reasons for that.
And everyone I know who has been lucky enough to meet him has told me you couldn't hope to meet a nicer guy.
In fact, the 11th Doctor is one of the few RP-speaking heroes on TV. Received Pronunciation almost always identifies a character as a villain.
I don't think you understand at all. What you just said makes no sense. One of those is the accepted stereotype. The other plays against it. Why would I give plaudits for reverting to the stereotype?
Not really. We're talking about accents, not hairstyles.
Qutie possibly. I'm not suggesting there's a conspiracy, just a tendency. They could have gone for a different "strong regional accent" - to use your words.
And, by the way, a southern accent is also a "strong regional accent". Now who's buying into the stereotypes?
It's almost impossible to discuss this subject without buying into one prejudice or another....
For being blind to the stereotype. For saying that an intellectual can be a Northerner or a Southerner, equally - by following one with the other.
Subverting a stereotype is a difficult thing to do without drawing attention to it.
If we'd had, say 5 new Doctors with 5 different regional (and I include "southern" as regional, BTW) accents, then I might agree with you. Since we've actually had 3 new Doctors, 2 of which had southern accents, then I think your case falls down (the ratio gets worse if you include classic Doctors).
That's hardly "subverting the stereotype". That's "going with the tendency". Hence, I make the distinction of praising them for CE and not praising for DT and MS. Further, I criticise them for asking DT to use a "received pronunciation" accent.
Indeed, but that's no argument for not trying to subvert the stereotype. And, in fact, drawing people's attention to an issue and making them think about it is the first step towards dealing with it.
Matt Smith is the first Doctor since Colin Baker to speak in RP or "BBC English" as it was known in the days before its speakers were mainly portrayed as villains.
OK, so it's still southern. It's actually going with the accent the largest group in the English population use. Since the south east is where the largest part of the population lives.
And it's usually US productions that have RP English accented villains.
Let's see what accent the next Doctor has then. :-)