Teach an old dog new tricks? to whom does the title refer? Surely Eddie Rix, maybe Mu (!) Steele being reconciled to HighTrees, but possibly also to Martin tentatively trying to move toward Louisa -- temporarily blocked by Danny.
The great earthquake openining -- I think we've heard of green finches in other episodes. but can't remember. Is it the episode with Peter Cronk and Mrs. Porter's broken bird tables?
Interesting that this sequence takes place, unusually, before the credits. And when in time is the wake-up scene supposed to happen? DM tussling with the dog in the street below Louisa's bedroom, dressed in the suit he will be wearing when he pays his 8:30 a.m. visit to Mrs. Steele -- but why walking down the street at that hour? surely his car is parked next to the surgery? And how did the dog get the stethescope in the first place? quibbling, I know, but I think this is an example of a piece of business that doesn't stand up on closer examination.
Why on earth Mrs. Steele so unpleasant to Martin? and wouldn't Martin have been at least vaguely aware of Danny from his childhood summers in PortWenn, if Mrs. Steele was familiar enough with him to "wipe the choc-ice" off his face?
Did you catch Bert's reference to playing on the "Wadebridge Water Polo team" with Pauline's mother, Dawn?
Loved the bit where Martin was eavesdropping on the conversation that Pauline and Al were having with reference to Elaine dumping him -- "too shy,always waiting for permission, and when he got permission, messing it up" -- which Martin seemed to think was meant about him and the joke is, that of course it fits perfectly.
His mood does seem slightly darker, but he came oh, so close, to trying to make things right with Louisa when Danny interrupted.
Oh, and what is the time sequence here between the taxi scene and Louisa buying out Mrs. Tishell's supply of mouthwash? One would have thought she would have been at that straightaway, but she remarks to Martin how impressive it was that he had managed to avoid her, implying that some time had elapsed. Just another thing that doesn't quite stand up to closer scrutiny, it seems to me
(I actually am quite prepared to go with the flow here, as Bert would say, and I think that no-one really expected the episodes to be this closely parsed.)
Teach an old dog new tricks? to whom does the title refer? Surely Eddie Rix, maybe Mu (!) Steele being reconciled to HighTrees, but possibly also to Martin tentatively trying to move toward Louisa -- temporarily blocked by Danny.
The great earthquake openining -- I think we've heard of green finches in other episodes. but can't remember. Is it the episode with Peter Cronk and Mrs. Porter's broken bird tables?
Interesting that this sequence takes place, unusually, before the credits. And when in time is the wake-up scene supposed to happen? DM tussling with the dog in the street below Louisa's bedroom, dressed in the suit he will be wearing when he pays his 8:30 a.m. visit to Mrs. Steele -- but why walking down the street at that hour? surely his car is parked next to the surgery? And how did the dog get the stethescope in the first place? quibbling, I know, but I think this is an example of a piece of business that doesn't stand up on closer examination.
Why on earth Mrs. Steele so unpleasant to Martin? and wouldn't Martin have been at least vaguely aware of Danny from his childhood summers in PortWenn, if Mrs. Steele was familiar enough with him to "wipe the choc-ice" off his face?
Did you catch Bert's reference to playing on the "Wadebridge Water Polo team" with Pauline's mother, Dawn?
Loved the bit where Martin was eavesdropping on the conversation that Pauline and Al were having with reference to Elaine dumping him -- "too shy,always waiting for permission, and when he got permission, messing it up" -- which Martin seemed to think was meant about him and the joke is, that of course it fits perfectly.
His mood does seem slightly darker, but he came oh, so close, to trying to make things right with Louisa when Danny interrupted.
Oh, and what is the time sequence here between the taxi scene and Louisa buying out Mrs. Tishell's supply of mouthwash? One would have thought she would have been at that straightaway, but she remarks to Martin how impressive it was that he had managed to avoid her, implying that some time had elapsed. Just another thing that doesn't quite stand up to closer scrutiny, it seems to me
(I actually am quite prepared to go with the flow here, as Bert would say, and I think that no-one really expected the episodes to be this closely parsed.)
Hello, NewPark--Biff and I just watched this episode tonight.
1. Why is Martin out?---I just naturally assumed that Martin had been called to a home early in the morning, before his own office hours began, to investigate a sick person, and that's why he was up so early.
2. Old Dogs--The Rix are old dogs having begun learning new sexual tricks. Mrs. Steele learned that her trick of not urinating in her underwear by being dehydrated was a bad idea, and that the new idea of living at High Place was a good. Danny seems to have the new idea of trying again with LG. Poor DM is stuck in his old ways, though is learning to accept his new office gal. (Ding Dong The Witch is Dead! Which Old Witch? Elaine the Witch! ) LG is a bit lost--she obviously is not that interested in Danny, and obviously is interested in DM, but simply does not know what to do about either of them this episode.
3. Being Mean to Martin--I noticed also how common it is for adults who knew Martin as a child to speak so badly to him as an adult. John Slater does that, Mrs. Steele does that, even Aunt Joan does that at times. (How pleasant that Aunt Ruth doesn't). Martin doesn't answer back, which is quite mature of him. One wonders what is the matter with those adults doing that. I found it very rude (as did DM) and mean of Mrs. Steele. She was not at first a very likeable character.
4. Choc-ice--okay, thanks for that. Biff and I heard "Choc-eyes", which had us scratching our heads. Looking that up, I see it's like a Klondike bar. I guess he ate those as a child until he figured out ice cream made his teeth hurt.
5. Time Lapse--I don't think much time has passed between the taxi and their meeting; maybe a few days, perhaps a week. But, in a small town, when we know DM used to walk around to catch a "glimpse of her", it probably was unusual for them not to meet by chance. After all, we see DM literally run by chance into LG two times alone in this episode: on the street with Danny and Aunt Joan, and by the gourmet shop with Danny.
Teach an old dog new tricks? to whom does the title refer? Surely Eddie Rix, maybe Mu (!) Steele being reconciled to HighTrees, but possibly also to Martin tentatively trying to move toward Louisa -- temporarily blocked by Danny.
The great earthquake openining -- I think we've heard of green finches in other episodes. but can't remember. Is it the episode with Peter Cronk and Mrs. Porter's broken bird tables?
Interesting that this sequence takes place, unusually, before the credits. And when in time is the wake-up scene supposed to happen? DM tussling with the dog in the street below Louisa's bedroom, dressed in the suit he will be wearing when he pays his 8:30 a.m. visit to Mrs. Steele -- but why walking down the street at that hour? surely his car is parked next to the surgery? And how did the dog get the stethescope in the first place? quibbling, I know, but I think this is an example of a piece of business that doesn't stand up on closer examination.
Why on earth Mrs. Steele so unpleasant to Martin? and wouldn't Martin have been at least vaguely aware of Danny from his childhood summers in PortWenn, if Mrs. Steele was familiar enough with him to "wipe the choc-ice" off his face?
Did you catch Bert's reference to playing on the "Wadebridge Water Polo team" with Pauline's mother, Dawn?
Loved the bit where Martin was eavesdropping on the conversation that Pauline and Al were having with reference to Elaine dumping him -- "too shy,always waiting for permission, and when he got permission, messing it up" -- which Martin seemed to think was meant about him and the joke is, that of course it fits perfectly.
His mood does seem slightly darker, but he came oh, so close, to trying to make things right with Louisa when Danny interrupted.
Oh, and what is the time sequence here between the taxi scene and Louisa buying out Mrs. Tishell's supply of mouthwash? One would have thought she would have been at that straightaway, but she remarks to Martin how impressive it was that he had managed to avoid her, implying that some time had elapsed. Just another thing that doesn't quite stand up to closer scrutiny, it seems to me
(I actually am quite prepared to go with the flow here, as Bert would say, and I think that no-one really expected the episodes to be this closely parsed.)
Title - surely refers to the Rix's
Muriel Steele had to be forthright and direct in her first meeting with DM...to show how her behaviour was affected by her dehydration later in the day; the contrast had to be obvious when witnessed by the same person.
Green Finches - wasn't it a green finch that was dead and rotting in the old man's bag, causing the malodours ?
Did anyone else notice the difference in LG's bedroom ? When she hears the rumpus in the street below with the dog and the stethoscope, she jumps up from a very flowery, pastel bed and setting ( and isn't the bed by the window ? ). Later, post-Holly and ' THE Night of Passion ' her bedroom is all vampy, red and black with red sheets on the bed...and the bed is more centrally placed...
Maybe she went to B & Q ( DIY warehouse ) in between ?
One of many things I liked about S2 was DM more or less staying at the sidelines while LG sorted out her feelings about Danny. He knew she had an attraction to him, almost at the first meeting with him at the interview at the Castle Hotel. LG saw the great differences between these two men, (she wanting an older man, possibly going back to her childhood and her own father's less than stellar role as a responsible parent?). It was she who made the move to the doc, telling him "It's over" between she and Danny and then inviting him to drink with her--she wasted no time in her quest to loosen the doc up by drinking.
Did anyone else notice the difference in LG's bedroom ? When she hears the rumpus in the street below with the dog and the stethoscope, she jumps up from a very flowery, pastel bed and setting ( and isn't the bed by the window ? ). Later, post-Holly and ' THE Night of Passion ' her bedroom is all vampy, red and black with red sheets on the bed...and the bed is more centrally placed...
Maybe she went to B & Q ( DIY warehouse ) in between ?
Different house :-)
Remember that she was in the tall house at the top of Rose Hill for S1 & 2 and then moved into Rose Cottage in S3. I suspect that she bought Rose Cottage after becoming Head Teacher because she probably got a substantial raise in pay.
Wonder if her change in style in the bedroom has anything to do with her growing passion for a certain someone?:rolleyes:
Hello, NewPark--Biff and I just watched this episode tonight.
1. Why is Martin out?---I just naturally assumed that Martin had been called to a home early in the morning, before his own office hours began, to investigate a sick person, and that's why he was up so early.
2. Old Dogs--The Rix are old dogs having begun learning new sexual tricks. Mrs. Steele learned that her trick of not urinating in her underwear by being dehydrated was a bad idea, and that the new idea of living at High Place was a good. Danny seems to have the new idea of trying again with LG. Poor DM is stuck in his old ways, though is learning to accept his new office gal. (Ding Dong The Witch is Dead! Which Old Witch? Elaine the Witch! ) LG is a bit lost--she obviously is not that interested in Danny, and obviously is interested in DM, but simply does not know what to do about either of them this episode.
3. Being Mean to Martin--I noticed also how common it is for adults who knew Martin as a child to speak so badly to him as an adult. John Slater does that, Mrs. Steele does that, even Aunt Joan does that at times. (How pleasant that Aunt Ruth doesn't). Martin doesn't answer back, which is quite mature of him. One wonders what is the matter with those adults doing that. I found it very rude (as did DM) and mean of Mrs. Steele. She was not at first a very likeable character.
4. Choc-ice--okay, thanks for that. Biff and I heard "Choc-eyes", which had us scratching our heads. Looking that up, I see it's like a Klondike bar. I guess he ate those as a child until he figured out ice cream made his teeth hurt.
5. Time Lapse--I don't think much time has passed between the taxi and their meeting; maybe a few days, perhaps a week. But, in a small town, when we know DM used to walk around to catch a "glimpse of her", it probably was unusual for them not to meet by chance. After all, we see DM literally run by chance into LG two times alone in this episode: on the street with Danny and Aunt Joan, and by the gourmet shop with Danny.
Actually regarding #5: He also meets her by chance in the Pharmacy.
So, not seeing her at all for any length of days is no doubt uncommon.
I disagree that we can be sure the marriage proposal was impulsive. We had many moments during their separation when DM was seriously contemplating his being alone, his loneliness without LG and the misery of his life without her.
I mean, we even saw it interfere with his doctoring, which says a great deal, as DM's whole identification was in his doctoring. He could not even take a woman's BP, the most basic of skills, due to his being lost in his misery.
So, I'm not so sure it was an impulsive question. The moment he asked it seemed correct and sudden, just then, but I think DM had been wondering how to get LG back into his life, for good, and came to realize that by "moving forward", since DM is not good at the grey, mostly understanding black and white, marriage had to be the next step.
Every now and then you and I disagree, and this is one of those times. I do think the proposal was completely impulsive. Yes, it's true he was obviously giving a lot of thought to how he might restore the relationship with LG. First he went to her place and knocked, but chickened out and ran away when she came to the door. Then he tried the charming and pleasant route, but it was so obviously not "him" that Louisa described his behavior as "smarmy". The idea of proposing could have been in the back of his mind throughout all of this, but I don't believe he had made a decision to definitely go for it. After Martin and Louisa together experienced the tense and dramatic scene with Holly, I think their emotions were in a heightened state. Clearly he's been devastated by losing her. After they cleaned up the broken glass and he was headed out the door, Louisa told him he was an extraordinary man. She initiated the break-up, but in this moment we see that she's definitely still in love with him. Based on the dejected way in which he responded, "No, I'm not", I think even at that very moment he hadn't decided to propose. I think it popped into his mind between that response and when he arrived at the door, on the verge of leaving.
About Louisa's asking the next morning if he regretted it and wanting him to repeat it, I suspect it was a combination of her insecurities due to absent and unreliable parents and her realization that the proposal was impulsive. She wanted to be sure of him. And that business about repeating it, well, we see that again in S5, don't we? She seems to have a need for lots of verbal reassurance (and she picked the Doc, oh my!).
By the way, those scenes you mentioned when poor Martin was grieving the loss of Louisa were so amazing, weren't they? The blood pressure scene, not eating, tears in his eyes, sadly sitting there on his couch, not registering what AJ said to him when she first came in. Wow.
Actually regarding #5: He also meets her by chance in the Pharmacy.
So, not seeing her at all for any length of days is no doubt uncommon.
Actually, I still think the scene doesn't compute.
I think, if LG were going to rush out and buy mouthwash, it would have been the next day. And she was still freshly angry. It's also the case that she says he's been avoiding her, implying that it's been some days since the incident and that it took some effort on his part.
I suppose we have to think that she brooded on the incident for several days before deciding to buy mouthwash by the gallon, but I think it would have been a very next day purchase. And the two pieces just don't fit together, in my mind at least.
OTOH, thanks for pointing out the other green finch reference (ugh), and that DM must have been on an early morning housecall, and that LG had actually moved to a totally different house by S3. Someone, I had missed that.
Interesting that this sequence takes place, unusually, before the credits.
I think most of the 1st episodes of a new series start with a scene before the credits, don't they? S3 doesn't, but I think the others all do. Well, at least I know S1, S2, and S5 all start before the credits. S3 doesn't and I can't remember right now how S4 E1 begins.
Loved the bit where Martin was eavesdropping on the conversation that Pauline and Al were having with reference to Elaine dumping him -- "too shy,always waiting for permission, and when he got permission, messing it up" -- which Martin seemed to think was meant about him and the joke is, that of course it fits perfectly.
It does fit perfectly! That's one of my favorite scenes in this episode. I know he thought they were talking about him (he almost dropped his coffee cup!), but I wonder if what Pauline said really registered in his brain, that this is something he could actually try to improve, to act on.
His mood does seem slightly darker, but he came oh, so close, to trying to make things right with Louisa when Danny interrupted.
I wonder what he intended to say. All he got out was, "Louisa", when Danny popped up. Louisa, I was wrong to tell you your breath was bad. Louisa, I want to be with you. Louisa, let's talk. ?????
Every now and then you and I disagree, and this is one of those times. I do think the proposal was completely impulsive. Yes, it's true he was obviously giving a lot of thought to how he might restore the relationship with LG. First he went to her place and knocked, but chickened out and ran away when she came to the door. Then he tried the charming and pleasant route, but it was so obviously not "him" that Louisa described his behavior as "smarmy". The idea of proposing could have been in the back of his mind throughout all of this, but I don't believe he had made a decision to definitely go for it. After Martin and Louisa together experienced the tense and dramatic scene with Holly, I think their emotions were in a heightened state. Clearly he's been devastated by losing her. After they cleaned up the broken glass and he was headed out the door, Louisa told him he was an extraordinary man. She initiated the break-up, but in this moment we see that she's definitely still in love with him. Based on the dejected way in which he responded, "No, I'm not", I think even at that very moment he hadn't decided to propose. I think it popped into his mind between that response and when he arrived at the door, on the verge of leaving.
About Louisa's asking the next morning if he regretted it and wanting him to repeat it, I suspect it was a combination of her insecurities due to absent and unreliable parents and her realization that the proposal was impulsive. She wanted to be sure of him. And that business about repeating it, well, we see that again in S5, don't we? She seems to have a need for lots of verbal reassurance (and she picked the Doc, oh my!).
By the way, those scenes you mentioned when poor Martin was grieving the loss of Louisa were so amazing, weren't they? The blood pressure scene, not eating, tears in his eyes, sadly sitting there on his couch, not registering what AJ said to him when she first came in. Wow.
4. Choc-ice--okay, thanks for that. Biff and I heard "Choc-eyes", which had us scratching our heads. Looking that up, I see it's like a Klondike bar. I guess he ate those as a child until he figured out ice cream made his teeth hurt.
Yes, thanks, NewPark. I tried to figure out if she said, "chock eyes" or "chalk eyes" and wondered it this was a British slang term for, well, something. Choc-ice, good, makes sense now.
I think most of the 1st episodes of a new series start with a scene before the credits, don't they? S3 doesn't, but I think the others all do. Well, at least I know S1, S2, and S5 all start before the credits. S3 doesn't and I can't remember right now how S4 E1 begins.
Id:
Just checked -- S4 starts with DM walking down the street with the bag of dripping offal; S5 starts with "Previously...." and the birth scene, then the credits.
Old dogs.
The full expression is: You can't teach old dogs new tricks.
This refers to the Rix as they didn't change.
Mrs Steele did change regarding hydration but Joan didn't change her mind about nursing homes/retirement villages.
Could it refer to Danny too who appears to be about to change in this episode - and stay in Portwenn to pursue LG and be closer to his mother and then next episode...
Actually, I still think the scene doesn't compute.
I think, if LG were going to rush out and buy mouthwash, it would have been the next day. And she was still freshly angry. It's also the case that she says he's been avoiding her, implying that it's been some days since the incident and that it took some effort on his part.
I suppose we have to think that she brooded on the incident for several days before deciding to buy mouthwash by the gallon, but I think it would have been a very next day purchase. And the two pieces just don't fit together, in my mind at least.
Here's my solution. It's a few days later. She used up her own mouthwash first and is now stocking up. And she's still angry - something I think she can sustain for several days - but it's exascerbated by his not reaching out to her to apologize.
Every now and then you and I disagree, and this is one of those times. I do think the proposal was completely impulsive. Yes, it's true he was obviously giving a lot of thought to how he might restore the relationship with LG. First he went to her place and knocked, but chickened out and ran away when she came to the door. Then he tried the charming and pleasant route, but it was so obviously not "him" that Louisa described his behavior as "smarmy". The idea of proposing could have been in the back of his mind throughout all of this, but I don't believe he had made a decision to definitely go for it. After Martin and Louisa together experienced the tense and dramatic scene with Holly, I think their emotions were in a heightened state. Clearly he's been devastated by losing her. After they cleaned up the broken glass and he was headed out the door, Louisa told him he was an extraordinary man. She initiated the break-up, but in this moment we see that she's definitely still in love with him. Based on the dejected way in which he responded, "No, I'm not", I think even at that very moment he hadn't decided to propose. I think it popped into his mind between that response and when he arrived at the door, on the verge of leaving.
About Louisa's asking the next morning if he regretted it and wanting him to repeat it, I suspect it was a combination of her insecurities due to absent and unreliable parents and her realization that the proposal was impulsive. She wanted to be sure of him. And that business about repeating it, well, we see that again in S5, don't we? She seems to have a need for lots of verbal reassurance (and she picked the Doc, oh my!).
By the way, those scenes you mentioned when poor Martin was grieving the loss of Louisa were so amazing, weren't they? The blood pressure scene, not eating, tears in his eyes, sadly sitting there on his couch, not registering what AJ said to him when she first came in. Wow.
I'm not disagreeing that the moment was impulsive. I just believe that DM had realized that taking that step in his ruminations was the only way to get her back. I do not think he just suddenly thought "hey, let's marry LG". I think he realized that he needed to take that step to get her back as being himself as it was wasn't working, ergo the break-up, and putting on a thin veneer of a personality change also didn't work.
LG needed something bigger and better, and I believe DM realized all he could offer her, then, was marriage. Since he offered that to EM, and was rejected, I'm sure he was completely and utterly terrified of asking LG, too; we see him run away from a mere door ringing. This is his love and his life on the line.
But, sure, it's obvious that it is a sudden undertaking and he gains an touch of courage after the Holly crisis and LG saying he is an amazing man. Life wasn't going to give him a better moment than that, and yes, impulsively, DM took it.
Here's my solution. It's a few days later. She used up her own mouthwash first and is now stocking up. And she's still angry - something I think she can sustain for several days - but it's exascerbated by his not reaching out to her to apologize.
Actually regarding #5: He also meets her by chance in the Pharmacy.
So, not seeing her at all for any length of days is no doubt uncommon.
Yes, but he tried to run away when he saw her in there and was outed by Al. I think he has spent several days doing his best to avoid her after being thrown out of the taxi.
I think he is very nervous about his feelings toward Louisa and is embarrassed that things ended so badly when he returned her advances.
Yes, but he tried to run away when he saw her in there and was outed by Al. I think he has spent several days doing his best to avoid her after being thrown out of the taxi.
I think he is very nervous about his feelings toward Louisa and is embarrassed that things ended so badly when he returned her advances.
Yes, that has clearly been his strategy. But I think we see him having a bit of a re-think at his desk after overhearing the conversation between Pauline and Al, and it's after that little re-think that he does approach Louisa, only to be interrupted by Danny. So maybe he was also trying, in his way, to learn a "new trick?"
Here's my solution. It's a few days later. She used up her own mouthwash first and is now stocking up. And she's still angry - something I think she can sustain for several days - but it's exascerbated by his not reaching out to her to apologize.
I assumed it was slightly longer -- like a month. I think it's funny how in the first three episodes of S2 it's evident that Louisa is still dwelling on the Doc's oral hygiene remark. In S2E1 there is the mouthwash. In S2E2 she tells Peter Cronk as he's going upstairs to bed "be sure and brush your teeth" and then we see her breathing into Sandra Mylow's face in S2E3. To me this is totally realistic for a woman somewhat lacking in confidence, and may be the real reason why she doesn't get up close and personal with Danny:)
Thinking about the recent discussions of monkeys and weasels reminded me of the scene in Martin's kitchen during the optimal nutrition dinner.
I think the line, "Have some more salt" is the funniest line anyone has spoken on this show. I just laugh thinking of it.
That's a great line and a great scene. He follows up "have some more salt" by taking a drink of his water. In their relationship Louisa is the salty crisps and he is reaching for any means he can to stop him from having to take just one more...
One of many things I liked about S2 was DM more or less staying at the sidelines while LG sorted out her feelings about Danny.
If we see the Doc's journey in the series as one of detachment to attachment, I'm not so sure the way he stands on the sidelines is a positive. He's like Peter Cronk, unable to "speak up for himself," while festering inwardly with jealousy, when what Louisa so badly needs from him is one of those professions of his true feelings, which never seem to come bursting out until the 11th hour. Love will fight, and Martin doesn't seem to put up much of a fight for Louisa throughout S2. He's not happy about things, but he's too slothful and/or proud to do anything about it.
If we see the Doc's journey in the series as one of detachment to attachment, I'm not so sure the way he stands on the sidelines is a positive. He's like Peter Cronk, unable to "speak up for himself," while festering inwardly with jealousy, when what Louisa so badly needs from him is one of those professions of his true feelings, which never seem to come bursting out until the 11th hour. Love will fight, and Martin doesn't seem to put up much of a fight for Louisa throughout S2. He's not happy about things, but he's too slothful and/or proud to do anything about it.
Hellooooo, PoorRichard! Long time, no see. Good to see you back at the forum.
I agree with the first part of your post, that he's on the sidelines, not speaking up, and jealous as can be. I think I disagree, however, that the reason he doesn't do something about it is because he's slothful and/or proud. In my opinion, he simply doesn't know what to do or, if he could figure it out, he wouldn't know how to go about it.
Later in S2, when AJ prods him to go talk to Louisa because she's heard that Danny is "keen", he does go to talk to her, but mucks it all up. In that episode (not sure which one), Louisa gives him the perfect opening when she talks about admiring Mark for not holding back, for going for it. I think she's clearly giving Martin a big, fat hint. Just say it, Martin, and I won't be with Danny. I'll be with you. But he ends up saying something that upsets her, of course, because he's hurt and jealous and hasn't a clue how to read her clues.
Comments
The great earthquake openining -- I think we've heard of green finches in other episodes. but can't remember. Is it the episode with Peter Cronk and Mrs. Porter's broken bird tables?
Interesting that this sequence takes place, unusually, before the credits. And when in time is the wake-up scene supposed to happen? DM tussling with the dog in the street below Louisa's bedroom, dressed in the suit he will be wearing when he pays his 8:30 a.m. visit to Mrs. Steele -- but why walking down the street at that hour? surely his car is parked next to the surgery? And how did the dog get the stethescope in the first place? quibbling, I know, but I think this is an example of a piece of business that doesn't stand up on closer examination.
Why on earth Mrs. Steele so unpleasant to Martin? and wouldn't Martin have been at least vaguely aware of Danny from his childhood summers in PortWenn, if Mrs. Steele was familiar enough with him to "wipe the choc-ice" off his face?
Did you catch Bert's reference to playing on the "Wadebridge Water Polo team" with Pauline's mother, Dawn?
Loved the bit where Martin was eavesdropping on the conversation that Pauline and Al were having with reference to Elaine dumping him -- "too shy,always waiting for permission, and when he got permission, messing it up" -- which Martin seemed to think was meant about him and the joke is, that of course it fits perfectly.
His mood does seem slightly darker, but he came oh, so close, to trying to make things right with Louisa when Danny interrupted.
Oh, and what is the time sequence here between the taxi scene and Louisa buying out Mrs. Tishell's supply of mouthwash? One would have thought she would have been at that straightaway, but she remarks to Martin how impressive it was that he had managed to avoid her, implying that some time had elapsed. Just another thing that doesn't quite stand up to closer scrutiny, it seems to me
(I actually am quite prepared to go with the flow here, as Bert would say, and I think that no-one really expected the episodes to be this closely parsed.)
Hello, NewPark--Biff and I just watched this episode tonight.
1. Why is Martin out?---I just naturally assumed that Martin had been called to a home early in the morning, before his own office hours began, to investigate a sick person, and that's why he was up so early.
2. Old Dogs--The Rix are old dogs having begun learning new sexual tricks. Mrs. Steele learned that her trick of not urinating in her underwear by being dehydrated was a bad idea, and that the new idea of living at High Place was a good. Danny seems to have the new idea of trying again with LG. Poor DM is stuck in his old ways, though is learning to accept his new office gal. (Ding Dong The Witch is Dead! Which Old Witch? Elaine the Witch!
3. Being Mean to Martin--I noticed also how common it is for adults who knew Martin as a child to speak so badly to him as an adult. John Slater does that, Mrs. Steele does that, even Aunt Joan does that at times. (How pleasant that Aunt Ruth doesn't). Martin doesn't answer back, which is quite mature of him. One wonders what is the matter with those adults doing that. I found it very rude (as did DM) and mean of Mrs. Steele. She was not at first a very likeable character.
4. Choc-ice--okay, thanks for that. Biff and I heard "Choc-eyes", which had us scratching our heads.
5. Time Lapse--I don't think much time has passed between the taxi and their meeting; maybe a few days, perhaps a week. But, in a small town, when we know DM used to walk around to catch a "glimpse of her", it probably was unusual for them not to meet by chance. After all, we see DM literally run by chance into LG two times alone in this episode: on the street with Danny and Aunt Joan, and by the gourmet shop with Danny.
Title - surely refers to the Rix's
Muriel Steele had to be forthright and direct in her first meeting with DM...to show how her behaviour was affected by her dehydration later in the day; the contrast had to be obvious when witnessed by the same person.
Green Finches - wasn't it a green finch that was dead and rotting in the old man's bag, causing the malodours ?
Did anyone else notice the difference in LG's bedroom ? When she hears the rumpus in the street below with the dog and the stethoscope, she jumps up from a very flowery, pastel bed and setting ( and isn't the bed by the window ? ). Later, post-Holly and ' THE Night of Passion ' her bedroom is all vampy, red and black with red sheets on the bed...and the bed is more centrally placed...
Maybe she went to B & Q ( DIY warehouse ) in between ?
Different house :-)
Remember that she was in the tall house at the top of Rose Hill for S1 & 2 and then moved into Rose Cottage in S3. I suspect that she bought Rose Cottage after becoming Head Teacher because she probably got a substantial raise in pay.
Wonder if her change in style in the bedroom has anything to do with her growing passion for a certain someone?:rolleyes:
Actually regarding #5: He also meets her by chance in the Pharmacy.
So, not seeing her at all for any length of days is no doubt uncommon.
Every now and then you and I disagree, and this is one of those times. I do think the proposal was completely impulsive. Yes, it's true he was obviously giving a lot of thought to how he might restore the relationship with LG. First he went to her place and knocked, but chickened out and ran away when she came to the door. Then he tried the charming and pleasant route, but it was so obviously not "him" that Louisa described his behavior as "smarmy". The idea of proposing could have been in the back of his mind throughout all of this, but I don't believe he had made a decision to definitely go for it. After Martin and Louisa together experienced the tense and dramatic scene with Holly, I think their emotions were in a heightened state. Clearly he's been devastated by losing her. After they cleaned up the broken glass and he was headed out the door, Louisa told him he was an extraordinary man. She initiated the break-up, but in this moment we see that she's definitely still in love with him. Based on the dejected way in which he responded, "No, I'm not", I think even at that very moment he hadn't decided to propose. I think it popped into his mind between that response and when he arrived at the door, on the verge of leaving.
About Louisa's asking the next morning if he regretted it and wanting him to repeat it, I suspect it was a combination of her insecurities due to absent and unreliable parents and her realization that the proposal was impulsive. She wanted to be sure of him. And that business about repeating it, well, we see that again in S5, don't we? She seems to have a need for lots of verbal reassurance (and she picked the Doc, oh my!).
By the way, those scenes you mentioned when poor Martin was grieving the loss of Louisa were so amazing, weren't they? The blood pressure scene, not eating, tears in his eyes, sadly sitting there on his couch, not registering what AJ said to him when she first came in. Wow.
Actually, I still think the scene doesn't compute.
I think, if LG were going to rush out and buy mouthwash, it would have been the next day. And she was still freshly angry. It's also the case that she says he's been avoiding her, implying that it's been some days since the incident and that it took some effort on his part.
I suppose we have to think that she brooded on the incident for several days before deciding to buy mouthwash by the gallon, but I think it would have been a very next day purchase. And the two pieces just don't fit together, in my mind at least.
OTOH, thanks for pointing out the other green finch reference (ugh), and that DM must have been on an early morning housecall, and that LG had actually moved to a totally different house by S3. Someone, I had missed that.
It does fit perfectly! That's one of my favorite scenes in this episode. I know he thought they were talking about him (he almost dropped his coffee cup!), but I wonder if what Pauline said really registered in his brain, that this is something he could actually try to improve, to act on.
I wonder what he intended to say. All he got out was, "Louisa", when Danny popped up. Louisa, I was wrong to tell you your breath was bad. Louisa, I want to be with you. Louisa, let's talk. ?????
Yes, I agree the proposal was impulsive.
Yes, thanks, NewPark. I tried to figure out if she said, "chock eyes" or "chalk eyes" and wondered it this was a British slang term for, well, something. Choc-ice, good, makes sense now.
Just checked -- S4 starts with DM walking down the street with the bag of dripping offal; S5 starts with "Previously...." and the birth scene, then the credits.
The full expression is: You can't teach old dogs new tricks.
This refers to the Rix as they didn't change.
Mrs Steele did change regarding hydration but Joan didn't change her mind about nursing homes/retirement villages.
Could it refer to Danny too who appears to be about to change in this episode - and stay in Portwenn to pursue LG and be closer to his mother and then next episode...
Here's my solution. It's a few days later. She used up her own mouthwash first and is now stocking up. And she's still angry - something I think she can sustain for several days - but it's exascerbated by his not reaching out to her to apologize.
I'm not disagreeing that the moment was impulsive. I just believe that DM had realized that taking that step in his ruminations was the only way to get her back. I do not think he just suddenly thought "hey, let's marry LG". I think he realized that he needed to take that step to get her back as being himself as it was wasn't working, ergo the break-up, and putting on a thin veneer of a personality change also didn't work.
LG needed something bigger and better, and I believe DM realized all he could offer her, then, was marriage. Since he offered that to EM, and was rejected, I'm sure he was completely and utterly terrified of asking LG, too; we see him run away from a mere door ringing. This is his love and his life on the line.
But, sure, it's obvious that it is a sudden undertaking and he gains an touch of courage after the Holly crisis and LG saying he is an amazing man. Life wasn't going to give him a better moment than that, and yes, impulsively, DM took it.
That's what I mean.
works for me!
Yes, but he tried to run away when he saw her in there and was outed by Al. I think he has spent several days doing his best to avoid her after being thrown out of the taxi.
I think he is very nervous about his feelings toward Louisa and is embarrassed that things ended so badly when he returned her advances.
I think the line, "Have some more salt" is the funniest line anyone has spoken on this show. I just laugh thinking of it.
Yes, that has clearly been his strategy. But I think we see him having a bit of a re-think at his desk after overhearing the conversation between Pauline and Al, and it's after that little re-think that he does approach Louisa, only to be interrupted by Danny. So maybe he was also trying, in his way, to learn a "new trick?"
I'm with you, Shop Girl. That line (and the way he delivers it) cracks me up every time.
I assumed it was slightly longer -- like a month. I think it's funny how in the first three episodes of S2 it's evident that Louisa is still dwelling on the Doc's oral hygiene remark. In S2E1 there is the mouthwash. In S2E2 she tells Peter Cronk as he's going upstairs to bed "be sure and brush your teeth" and then we see her breathing into Sandra Mylow's face in S2E3. To me this is totally realistic for a woman somewhat lacking in confidence, and may be the real reason why she doesn't get up close and personal with Danny:)
That's a great line and a great scene. He follows up "have some more salt" by taking a drink of his water. In their relationship Louisa is the salty crisps and he is reaching for any means he can to stop him from having to take just one more...
If we see the Doc's journey in the series as one of detachment to attachment, I'm not so sure the way he stands on the sidelines is a positive. He's like Peter Cronk, unable to "speak up for himself," while festering inwardly with jealousy, when what Louisa so badly needs from him is one of those professions of his true feelings, which never seem to come bursting out until the 11th hour. Love will fight, and Martin doesn't seem to put up much of a fight for Louisa throughout S2. He's not happy about things, but he's too slothful and/or proud to do anything about it.
Hellooooo, PoorRichard! Long time, no see. Good to see you back at the forum.
I agree with the first part of your post, that he's on the sidelines, not speaking up, and jealous as can be. I think I disagree, however, that the reason he doesn't do something about it is because he's slothful and/or proud. In my opinion, he simply doesn't know what to do or, if he could figure it out, he wouldn't know how to go about it.
Later in S2, when AJ prods him to go talk to Louisa because she's heard that Danny is "keen", he does go to talk to her, but mucks it all up. In that episode (not sure which one), Louisa gives him the perfect opening when she talks about admiring Mark for not holding back, for going for it. I think she's clearly giving Martin a big, fat hint. Just say it, Martin, and I won't be with Danny. I'll be with you. But he ends up saying something that upsets her, of course, because he's hurt and jealous and hasn't a clue how to read her clues.