Video Editing - New PC Required!!

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  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 625
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    TheBigM wrote: »
    That will be a highly capable machine. You are paying a lot of premium for that i7 over an overclocked i5. I would have saved the CPU premium money and put it towards an SSD with 256GB capacity and chosen a GFX card with 2GB RAM, and I'd have tried to pay less too.

    I see where you're coming from with the i7, however it can also be overclocked to speeds beyond the i5.

    SSD could be bigger, but I'm planning to purely run OS and Vegas from it, nothing else. Also not going to really be doing anything that's going to require more than 1GB graphics. Vegas isn't intensive on this at all unless you wanted to use it for rendering purposes, but I don't plan to do this.
  • TheBigMTheBigM Posts: 13,125
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    quinnyyy wrote: »
    I see where you're coming from with the i7, however it can also be overclocked to speeds beyond the i5.

    SSD could be bigger, but I'm planning to purely run OS and Vegas from it, nothing else. Also not going to really be doing anything that's going to require more than 1GB graphics. Vegas isn't intensive on this at all unless you wanted to use it for rendering purposes, but I don't plan to do this.

    I'm interested to know why you don't intend to take advantage of GPU acceleration for your rendering?
  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 625
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    Don't feel the need with the spec of the machine, plus the PC needs to do the work so I can still use the machine and multitask during rendering. Let the graphics card do its normal job.
  • noise747noise747 Posts: 30,695
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    jonner101 wrote: »
    Well using an SSD made a big difference for me.

    Obviously a laptop isn't the ideal solution if you're mainly going to use the computer to do video editing. All I was saying is that a 2011 macbook pro with and SSD boot and big external drive can handle HD video editing pretty well. And these are .MTS AVCHD 1080p 50 fps clips I edit in final cut pro + 1080p 30, and 24fps clips.

    For me the portability benefits outweigh the negatives. I just no longer require a desktop PC at home.

    In 'home work' mode for the odd bit of video editing, and iOS/Android developing and photo editing I just connect a nice big monitor, separate keyboard and mouse, and I love the fact that in general operation the macbook runs silent.

    A SSD will make a bit of a difference if you stick the clips you are working with on it, but the difference is not that much. Saying that Final Cut may work in a different way to Vegas. what vegas needs is grunt and plenty of it if you doing HD.

    It is not so much the editing part, it is when you play back the preview that is the problem.
  • noise747noise747 Posts: 30,695
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    quinnyyy wrote: »

    Vegas 9 at the moment, but moving to 11.

    Why not 12? i want to get 12, but saving up for a new camcorder.
    Ok so I did allot of online research and kept finding pages like this which inspired me, http://www.custompcreview.com/computer-builds/best-photo-video-editing-pc-under-1400-january-2013/17122/

    I need to get a decent build, spend some money, and go for the SSD as it can make a huge difference. I decided to bite the bullet and pay for a meaty machine. I’ve gone with an online company: cyberpowersystem.co.uk, they will build the machine for me as I’m in a bit of a rush to get editing a particular video – They’ve allowed me to buy the machine and pay over 12 months interest free, so no need to use the credit card. I’ve spent just over £1100 on just the box and this is what I got for my money: (with no fancy case with extra lights, of no interest to me)

    Xion Predator 970 Gaming Series Mid Tower Case w/ 2 External Removable HDD Bays
    Intel Core i7-3770K
    16GB RAM - 16GB (4x4GB) PC12800 DDR3/1600mhz Dual Channel Memory
    SSD 128 – to run OS and Editing software - 128 GB Crucial M4 Series SATA III
    2TB SATA III Drive
    Bluray Burner - CD:Pioneer BDR-208DBK 15X BLU-RAY Burner & 16X DVD±R/±RW Drive
    Motherboard - Gigabyte GA-Z77-HD3 Intel Z77 Chipset, ATX Mainboard w/ 4 RAM slot, UEFI DualBIOS™ Technology, EZ Smart Response, Ultra Durable4 Classic, 7.1 HD Audio, GbLAN, 2 x Gen3 PCIe x16, 2xPCIe x1 & 2xPCI ***Overclockable S&S***
    750 Watts Power Supplies [+21] (Corsair 750 Watts CX750M Gaming Modular Power Supply, 80+)
    NVIDIA GeForce GTX 650 1GB 16X PCIe 3.0 Video Card (Major Brand Powered by NVIDIA)
    Windows 8 64 bit – This was needed for them to fully test the machine before delivery, and as I said, I need it working, QUICK!
    WARRANTY:STANDARD WARRANTY: 3 Year Labour, 1 Year Parts, 1 Month Collect and Return plus Life-Time Technical Support

    Yes Yes I know I’ve gone completely overboard, but the next step will be buying a prober HD Camcorder soon and I want to future proof myself for a couple of editing years.

    Now let me hear you all pick the faults. 

    A mate of mine swears by Gigabyte, i never got on with them myself. I had two one after the other and both had problems, which is why I changed to Asrock. Never had a problem with Asrock. Even when a friends PSU went belly up, her Asrock motherboard was fine apart from the power LED stopped working. got a new LED and it is working fine now. Took the memory out mind you, had to buy some more of that.

    I don't know a lot about Intel chips these days as I lost interest in them in the P4 days, but I do know of one person who got a I7 and thought it would be good for rendering, it was fast, but the quality was pretty naff for some reason, so they added a graphics card and got better results, but that knocks out the hardware acceleration of the I7, I think.

    I did find a couple of minor problems with windows 8 and vegas 10, but then sony did a update and the problems seem to have gone now, but sine you are going above 10 it will not affect you.

    i presume this is a pre-built machine, shame as you could have gone for a larger SSD, while it will not make a huge difference, it does help with the files you are working on.

    I saw in another of your post you are not going to use hardware rendering from the video card, , best to if you can, take a fair bit of load from the CPU. I know my CPU is not as powerful as the one you are getting and the video card I have got is a bit of a budget one, but the card still helps.


    What camcorder are you looking at? i want to get something a bit larger than what I have got, and then I got to start using it more. I got a small JVC HD one at the moment, which takes good video, but is a pain to change anything as it is menu driven.

    i like JCV, but their semi pro camcorders don't seem to offer what I want.
  • TheBigMTheBigM Posts: 13,125
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    SSDs should have reduced benefit for storing video as videos are usually large, sequential files where seek time is less of an issue and it's more about throughput.

    An SSD for the OS and applications plus a large capacity HDD (which has high storage density) is what you want for editing HD video, particularly when it is uncompressed video. The cache in the HDD would make a bigger difference probably. Go for one with a 32MB cache.
  • noise747noise747 Posts: 30,695
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    TheBigM wrote: »
    SSDs should have reduced benefit for storing video as videos are usually large, sequential files where seek time is less of an issue and it's more about throughput.

    You could be right, but a SDD still helps, but as I said before, not by much.
    An SSD for the OS and applications plus a large capacity HDD (which has high storage density) is what you want for editing HD video, particularly when it is uncompressed video. The cache in the HDD would make a bigger difference probably. Go for one with a 32MB cache.

    that is what I have done, apart from the fact my larger drive is a hybrid, not large enough that is the problem, need to get a larger one.

    Very few people use uncompressed video these days apart from professionals and a lot of them don't either.

    i would love to, but the amount of space required would be enormous. the computer would cope better.
  • subversivesubversive Posts: 2,969
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    quinnyyy wrote: »
    Yes Yes I know I’ve gone completely overboard, but the next step will be buying a prober HD Camcorder soon and I want to future proof myself for a couple of editing years.

    Now let me hear you all pick the faults. 

    Check out videos shot using DSLR, the quality is way better than a camcorder. I have a toppish camcorder, but the quality of the video is nothing compared to my DSLR (I have canon 650d, my first dslr)

    oh and i like your spec, it should do the job well and leaves enough room for upgrades...
  • rottweilerrottweiler Posts: 2,569
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    £1100

    You could have bought a 2012 27" imac for that

    Wow
  • jonner101jonner101 Posts: 3,410
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    subversive wrote: »
    Check out videos shot using DSLR, the quality is way better than a camcorder. I have a toppish camcorder, but the quality of the video is nothing compared to my DSLR (I have canon 650d, my first dslr)

    oh and i like your spec, it should do the job well and leaves enough room for upgrades...

    It's much tricker to get non shaky and focused video from an DSLR though hand held. The pros tend use custom rigs to really get the pro film quality results.

    A good compromise is something like the high end P&S compact RX100 from Sony which almost matches the quality from a DSLR and has the ease of use of a cam-corder It also has has an amazing active steady shot mode which makes the video look like it was taken on of those rigs.
  • TheBigMTheBigM Posts: 13,125
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    rottweiler wrote: »
    £1100

    You could have bought a 2012 27" imac for that

    Wow

    a) Where can you get a brand new 27" iMac with 3 year warranty for that price without being a student?

    b) She decided to get something much more powerful than an iMac with laptop components. Go and look at any Ars Technica graph comparing the performance of a desktop CPU and GPU to their 'M' equivalents - the difference is massive. Desktops are also upgradable unlike your iMac which can only take more RAM.

    c) Give it a rest will you, it's not even like you're earning any sales commission from these posts.
  • noise747noise747 Posts: 30,695
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    jonner101 wrote: »
    It's much tricker to get non shaky and focused video from an DSLR though hand held. The pros tend use custom rigs to really get the pro film quality results.

    A good compromise is something like the high end P&S compact RX100 from Sony which almost matches the quality from a DSLR and has the ease of use of a cam-corder It also has has an amazing active steady shot mode which makes the video look like it was taken on of those rigs.


    correct, i got a small camcorder HD, give great results, but even that can be difficult to hold sometimes, which is why I got myself a shoulder support for it, cheap as well, but it does help in keeping the camcorder steady.

    Not sure about DSLR's to be honest, they are not really made for video and while I have seen some that takes ok video, i don't think they can cope fast enough to the ever changing environment they are in for video.


    I would love to see what the sony can do, but I have also seen what some of these anti shake things do.
  • jonner101jonner101 Posts: 3,410
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    noise747 wrote: »
    correct, i got a small camcorder HD, give great results, but even that can be difficult to hold sometimes, which is why I got myself a shoulder support for it, cheap as well, but it does help in keeping the camcorder steady.

    Not sure about DSLR's to be honest, they are not really made for video and while I have seen some that takes ok video, i don't think they can cope fast enough to the ever changing environment they are in for video.


    I would love to see what the sony can do, but I have also seen what some of these anti shake things do.

    This was done with the pocket Rx100 camera which I think is quite impressive.

    Edited in FCPx. At the risk of TheBigM accusing me of being a troll FCPx is for me the best video editing software out there but afaik only runs on macs.
  • rottweilerrottweiler Posts: 2,569
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    Who said you can't upgrade an imac ?
    I have just added an ssd and a 3tb hard drive
    The i5 processor is more than enough for video editing
  • noise747noise747 Posts: 30,695
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    jonner101 wrote: »
    This was done with the pocket Rx100 camera which I think is quite impressive.

    Edited in FCPx. At the risk of TheBigM accusing me of being a troll FCPx is for me the best video editing software out there but afaik only runs on macs.


    That is pretty good I must admit, some good editing there as well.

    FCPx does only run on Macs, Not sure if I would call it the best video editing software, but it is good. Certainly easy to use, easier than Avid anyway :)
  • noise747noise747 Posts: 30,695
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    rottweiler wrote: »
    Who said you can't upgrade an imac ?
    I have just added an ssd and a 3tb hard drive
    The i5 processor is more than enough for video editing

    Try doing that on a Imac. I upgraded the hard drive in a older Imac and that was a pain, the last two models i think is almost impossible.
  • MaxatoriaMaxatoria Posts: 17,980
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    In the latest imacs don't you need to buy a specially modded apple drive or the fan will run all the time?

    and lets not talk about upgrading graphics support ;)
  • TheBigMTheBigM Posts: 13,125
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    jonner101 wrote: »
    This was done with the pocket Rx100 camera which I think is quite impressive.

    Edited in FCPx. At the risk of TheBigM accusing me of being a troll FCPx is for me the best video editing software out there but afaik only runs on macs.

    Final Cut does only run on Macs and does seem to be very popular. I'm not anti-Apple everything. I bought an iPad, for my work phone I chose an iPhone 5 and it's highly possible I will buy a mac for my next PC.

    I only call out people when they make certain statements which they should know better about.

    If the OP had said they really like FCP then I would have said to stick with it too. One big reason to stick to a Mac would be to use the Elgato Turbo stick for H.264

    However, the OP is a PC user and her problem is a lack of performance capability, for £500 she can get a highly capable PC compared to the ickle Mac Mini you can get for the same money.

    I don't think FCP is significantly superior these days to PC video editing suites. The thing is there was a time when video editing was good on a Mac and people who are used to FCP may as well stick with it as there are often no significant advantages to switching to a PC and windows and a new suite and losing all the timesavers learned for FCP and Mac (this argument works the other direction too however).
  • TheBigMTheBigM Posts: 13,125
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    rottweiler wrote: »
    Who said you can't upgrade an imac ?
    I have just added an ssd and a 3tb hard drive
    The i5 processor is more than enough for video editing

    Were your additions to a 2012 iMac or an earlier one?

    Because your previous post referred 2012 iMacs. They are not designed for user-replaceable components.

    The 27" allows RAM replacement and the 21.5" doesn't allow any user replacement/upgrade whatsoever.
  • jonner101jonner101 Posts: 3,410
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    TheBigM wrote: »
    Final Cut does only run on Macs and does seem to be very popular. I'm not anti-Apple everything. I bought an iPad, for my work phone I chose an iPhone 5 and it's highly possible I will buy a mac for my next PC.

    I only call out people when they make certain statements which they should know better about.

    If the OP had said they really like FCP then I would have said to stick with it too. One big reason to stick to a Mac would be to use the Elgato Turbo stick for H.264

    However, the OP is a PC user and her problem is a lack of performance capability, for £500 she can get a highly capable PC compared to the ickle Mac Mini you can get for the same money.

    I don't think FCP is significantly superior these days to PC video editing suites. The thing is there was a time when video editing was good on a Mac and people who are used to FCP may as well stick with it as there are often no significant advantages to switching to a PC and windows and a new suite and losing all the timesavers learned for FCP and Mac (this argument works the other direction too however).

    You previously called me a troll as I said I would find it hard to go back to a plasticky laptop after owning a MBPro which you read as 'windows laptop' so all I ask is you actually read what people say and not let your bias get in the way and make false assumptions
  • neo_walesneo_wales Posts: 13,625
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    jonner101 wrote: »
    This was done with the pocket Rx100 camera which I think is quite impressive.

    Edited in FCPx. At the risk of TheBigM accusing me of being a troll FCPx is for me the best video editing software out there but afaik only runs on macs.

    Thats a lovely video, wonderful stuff :)
  • TheBigMTheBigM Posts: 13,125
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    jonner101 wrote: »
    You previously called me a troll as I said I would find it hard to go back to a plasticky laptop after owning a MBPro which you read as 'windows laptop' so all I ask is you actually read what people say and not let your bias get in the way and make false assumptions

    You specifically referred to the MB Pro rather than a metal laptop, implying that the alternative to an MB Pro was a plasticky laptop.

    Given that almost all non-Mac laptops are Windows laptops, what else do you want me to call them. Besides, you know it wasn't a comment about Windows as an OS but about the alternative of Mac vs non-Mac.

    I was happy with your modification of comparing metal laptops to plastic ones.

    Oh, and please tell me what MY bias is?
  • jonner101jonner101 Posts: 3,410
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    TheBigM wrote: »
    You specifically referred to the MB Pro rather than a metal laptop, implying that the alternative to an MB Pro was a plasticky laptop.

    Given that almost all non-Mac laptops are Windows laptops, what else do you want me to call them. Besides, you know it wasn't a comment about Windows as an OS but about the alternative of Mac vs non-Mac.

    I was happy with your modification of comparing metal laptops to plastic ones.

    Oh, and please tell me what MY bias is?

    Well no you are getting yourself mixed up. The majority of laptops are PC compatible or whatever the term now is for IBM compatible, and that includes the Macbook Pro which can also run windows natively, but obviously it gets pre-installed with Mac OS.

    Most laptops are PC's that just happen to be running windows, and indeed you can easily buy a laptop with no operating system and install Linux. You could even run MS-DOS if that still took your fancy. You can even run Mac OSX on some of them. (Hackintosh)

    My impression is that you're biased against Apple and in favour of Microsoft which is absolutely fine we all have our preferences but I think this has made you misinterpret my post as an anti Microsoft post, when it was more a pro metal laptop post and I object to being called a troll when I had no intention of winding up anyone.

    I only ever state my opinion on these boards which people can either ignore, disagree or agree with.
  • TheBigMTheBigM Posts: 13,125
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    jonner101 wrote: »
    My impression is that you're biased against Apple and in favour of Microsoft which is absolutely fine we all have our preferences but I think this has made you misinterpret my post as an anti Microsoft post, when it was more a pro metal laptop post and I object to being called a troll when I had no intention of winding up anyone.
    .

    I think you're getting hung up on me calling them windows laptops. It was just a common way of referring to non-Mac laptops. I wonder what %age of laptops are sold without Windows (nearest hint is that Chromebooks have less than 0.02% marketshare) or are even available to buy without Windows?

    It was an odd thing to get hung up on when the thrust of that post was clear - plastic = cheap laptops and, if you pay for it, you can get quality laptops whether they are Apple or non Apple.

    In any case, I'm now happy that you didn't intend to troll and just said MB when your main point was quality metal laptops versus plasticky ones. I've been on DS a long time now and historically it has been a troll-heavy place - especially when it comes to old posters like Vallhund who were Apple lovers and WUMs. You seem to be quite balanced, and that video you linked to that you took was nicely cut :) (although seems white balance wasn't always great).

    In light my last post where I said I've bought an iPad (with my own money), I chose an iPhone 5 rather than a Blackberry or top-range Android for my work phone and I'm considering buying a Mac - I'm not sure how you can call me biased towards MS and anti-Apple?

    If you look at my post history on Mobile forum for example, I've recommended all kinds of phones: Blackberries, Androids, Windows Phones and iPhones.
  • jonner101jonner101 Posts: 3,410
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    TheBigM wrote: »
    I think you're getting hung up on me calling them windows laptops. It was just a common way of referring to non-Mac laptops. I wonder what %age of laptops are sold without Windows (nearest hint is that Chromebooks have less than 0.02% marketshare) or are even available to buy without Windows?

    It was an odd thing to get hung up on when the thrust of that post was clear - plastic = cheap laptops and, if you pay for it, you can get quality laptops whether they are Apple or non Apple.

    In any case, I'm now happy that you didn't intend to troll and just said MB when your main point was quality metal laptops versus plasticky ones. I've been on DS a long time now and historically it has been a troll-heavy place - especially when it comes to old posters like Vallhund who were Apple lovers and WUMs. You seem to be quite balanced, and that video you linked to that you took was nicely cut :) (although seems white balance wasn't always great).

    In light my last post where I said I've bought an iPad (with my own money), I chose an iPhone 5 rather than a Blackberry or top-range Android for my work phone and I'm considering buying a Mac - I'm not sure how you can call me biased towards MS and anti-Apple?

    If you look at my post history on Mobile forum for example, I've recommended all kinds of phones: Blackberries, Androids, Windows Phones and iPhones.

    Fair play. Can't say I'm familiar with those posters.

    I must say I don't bother reading the posts on the mobile forum very often as they just seem to be constant apple v android fan wars on there. I happen to have an iPad 4 and a Nexus 4 a laptop. ( or PC laptop running windows ! ) so I'm in all camps

    To try and get back slightly on topic, I would go with an iMac if I were in need a 'dedicated' video editor as I've got FCPx and that would work for me. Otherwise I'd guess the PC option would be the best bang per buck option.

    One thing to bear in mind if you do buy a Mac is the excellent re-sale value. This can make a big difference if you know you're likely to refresh your system every 2-3 years. There is a new refresh of the processors to haswel rumoured for June so buying a mac now would be bad timing
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