Thanks for your feedback - it would be interesting to hear more regarding your setup: could you provide a screenshot of a page with a 'screen and a half of adverts with no content'? For us, this is what the page looks like: http://i.imgur.com/XX1rwjc.jpg (6 articles are in view before any scrolling is required).
Hello DS
I apologise I should have been clearer, my issue with the spacing and ad placement relates to the forums but is notably worse today so I'm presuming there has been some knock-on effects. My screen resolution is 1680x1050 and my preferred browser of choice is Firefox. Here is what it looks like with IE since this will show up the ads. (I've merged 2 images together so you get a clearer idea). Some of the times it isn't too bad but the problem seems to be there are no "fixed" sizes for the ads. In this case a thinner header ad and a square on the right would have probably been OK.
If someone is seeing the same thing on a screen resolution of say 1024x768 it would be horrendous.
-edit
Just to add, its not just the Garmin ads that are doing this. There are only a few that appear to be (IMO) the correct dimensions.
Dont like it! Why is everyone obsessed with huge pictures! The layout is so messy and not easy to navigate. I like the headlines all together. I like to scroll down to each section and look at the news. I dont like scrolling down and having huge pictures of z celebs or reality stars filling my screen and then having look at which section Im actually in. Why make changes for change sake!!
Nice to see they bothered to test even the basics (switching from main to forums) before releasing the beta (which I think looks horrible - far to much wasted space/scrolling). This is even worse than the change from the old blue colour scheme.
There is absolutely nothing to like about this new look.
I apologise I should have been clearer, my issue with the spacing and ad placement relates to the forums but is notably worse today so I'm presuming there has been some knock-on effects. My screen resolution is 1680x1050 and my preferred browser of choice is Firefox. Here is what it looks like with IE since this will show up the ads. (I've merged 2 images together so you get a clearer idea). Some of the times it isn't too bad but the problem seems to be there are no "fixed" sizes for the ads. In this case a thinner header ad and a square on the right would have probably been OK.
If someone is seeing the same thing on a screen resolution of say 1024x768 it would be horrendous.
-edit
Just to add, its not just the Garmin ads that are doing this. There are only a few that appear to be (IMO) the correct dimensions.
Thank you s2k. Those adverts are only intended for the editorial site and aren't meant to display on the forums (certainly the tower one that is causing all the blank space). We shall pass this on to our ad team to look in to as those should be disabled on the forums.
Got caught with the forum-beta loop as well & had to delete all the digitalspy cookies.
I have to say the beta looks atrocious like most so called modern design sites, everything is squashed in the centre & way too much empty space. obviously it has been designed for mobile users & not desktop users.
Sadly they will go ahead with the changes no matter what the users say, GSMarena recently changed the look of their site & the regular users hate it now & are starting to go elsewhere.
Got caught with the forum-beta loop as well & had to delete all the digitalspy cookies.
I have to say the beta looks atrocious like most so called modern design sites, everything is squashed in the centre & way too much empty space. obviously it has been designed for mobile users & not desktop users.
Sadly they will go ahead with the changes no matter what the users say, GSMarena recently changed the look of their site & the regular users hate it now & are starting to go elsewhere.
Of course they won't listen to a word of what people say. They are just using people to debug it for them.
All way to liberal PC on here and no rolleyes emoticon in case it upsets someone with a weak liberal constitution. They is a whole thread on bringing back the rolleyes emoticon and they stuck two fingers up at everyone.
Still why pay for bug testers when they can get the users to do it free of charge?
I have a hudl2 and often have BBC radio player running in the back ground but this new site keeps muting the radio every 20 seconds or so. Just this website, no other ones.
DS Support basically admitted it is beyond their abilities to repair as the software is too old to sort out.
"Beyond their abilities" is a bit inaccurate. We're constantly having to evaluate the pros/cons of any change: to fix the search system the forum would have to go offline, potentially for more than a few days, while the search system recalibrates every single post (removed or otherwise). That's over 76,000,000 posts. Then it has to go through each individual user.
This can't be done on a live environment because of the number of posts made per minute. Then, because the forum software is old, there's no guarantee the fix would 'stick' once another (thousand? tens of thousands? hundreds of thousands?) posts were made.
Yes, search being broken is unfortunate and definitely not ideal, but from our data a very small % of users who view (and post) use search. Should we take the whole forum offline to fix something that is only affecting a small number of people? Is it worth potentially doing the same thing every few months?
As mentioned, we're always exploring options which are not beyond an alternative fix (either through software or otherwise) but it is not as simple as "They can't/won't/don't know how/don't care".
Surely the real test of any website design should be whether your users are happy with it?
The "we" umbrella extends to our visitors. It is not an "us" vs "them", we're all one happy family here. Any changes made will obviously be based on feedback from our readers, which is why we have opened up a beta process (something we haven't done on this scale before - as older forum members will attest to) to hear thoughts and feedback.
Thanks to everyone that has so far provided their thoughts. We will be going through this thread and passing everything we can use on. Things like "There aren't enough headlines on immediate display" and "Too much scrolling here, here and here" are incredibly valuable to us.
The "we" umbrella extends to our visitors. It is not an "us" vs "them", we're all one happy family here. Any changes made will obviously be based on feedback from our readers, which is why we have opened up a beta process (something we haven't done on this scale before - as older forum members will attest to) to hear thoughts and feedback.
No offence but this will almost certainly be proven false when the feedback remains overwhelmingly negative and the site presses on with all the changes anyway, just like last time. And the time before. And the time before that, etc...
There's a mandate from above to pander to the mobile crowd and they simply won't be swayed from that course, no matter how disastrous the site becomes to browse.
1. Other forums search engines. Why not take a copy of the entire set up and mount it somewhere else where it is online but not being used by users. That way it can be worked on and the search function can scan all old posts for as long as it wants without affecting anyone. Then go live with it and take DS off line one night for a few hours in the AM so that it can update any new posts.
2. Just when will you take the leap to new software? You are patching up this rust-bucket and keep using duct tape to try and hold the wheels on. There comes a time when repair is not the right thing to do and it's time to move on.
3. With a whole thread with many many people saying that they hate the new emoticons and that they want the rolleyes emoticon back so that light hearted sarcasm can be indicated. It clearly shows that all you are listening to is technical feedback on your beta test as that is helpful to you and saves you employing people to do it. You are not listening to anything else as shown by your inactions. The emoticons are within your power to change, but you chose to ignore posters and just go with what you think.
4. You referred to people using the site in your last post as "visitors": That's rather insulting as we are now even users or forum members but just ships that past in the night; visitors. It's clear the value of anyone here to Hurst Magazines is just a churn-over of people to which you can sell advertising on the backs of their numbers. That's their only value to you it would seem. Useful to do your beta testing but went it comes to anything else, ignored.
Dear DS
Forum Support- if I were you I would take that' Visit our new Beta site and tell as what you think of it' strip from the top of the old site until it's a lot further along in development- there's beta and beta, this is nowhere near ready to be unleashed on unsuspecting forum members.
No offence but this will almost certainly be proven false when the feedback remains overwhelmingly negative and the site presses on with all the changes anyway, just like last time. And the time before. And the time before that, etc...
There's a mandate from above to pander to the mobile crowd and they simply won't be swayed from that course, no matter how disastrous the site becomes to browse.
Great post. That is exactly what they are doing and they know it but just carry on.
They see the fact that as they are a private company and can legally do as they wish translates to whatever they do is correct. That is not the case. Not to mention highly arrogant.
Individuals don't matter here, it's just to keep a churn of people here that they can use to sell to advertisers. They don't care if some don't like it as they will move on and they will attract some more lucrative teens to sell to the market forces.
You say that this is not the first time DS have not listened to feedback and I have seen nothing to contradict that this time.
This is not a friendly place and all moderation and interaction is hidden: Why do that if they have nothing to hide? They flatly refuse to answer generally on the forums so it would seem that the 'one big happy family' nonsense is just that, pie in the sky. Say one thing and do the other.
Now we are downgraded to just "Visitors" (Passing visitors to sell advertising to)
No offence but this will almost certainly be proven false when the feedback remains overwhelmingly negative and the site presses on with all the changes anyway, just like last time. And the time before. And the time before that, etc...
There's a mandate from above to pander to the mobile crowd and they simply won't be swayed from that course, no matter how disastrous the site becomes to browse.
Hi Tony,
Those expecting complete redesigns are going to be disappointed. We've had some positive feedback and some negative feedback (this thread is not entirely indicative: we're running a feedback form as well as through other avenues such as Twitter, Facebook, emails and the Contact Us Form).
That doesn't mean we can't tweak things based on feedback. For example we are already pushing for more content to made visible and reducing the amount of "blank" space. Another piece of feedback we have heard (not visible in this thread, but something a lot of people have emailed in about) is the lack of structure on the Soaps page. This is something we're going to fix.
Great post. That is exactly what they are doing and they know it but just carry on.
They see the fact that as they are a private company and can legally do as they wish translates to whatever they do is correct. That is not the case. Not to mention highly arrogant.
Individuals don't matter here, it's just to keep a churn of people here that they can use to sell to advertisers. They don't care if some don't like it as they will move on and they will attract some more lucrative teens to sell to the market forces.
You say that this is not the first time DS have not listened to feedback and I have seen nothing to contradict that this time.
This is not a friendly place and all moderation and interaction is hidden: Why do that if they have nothing to hide? They flatly refuse to answer generally on the forums so it would seem that the 'one big happy family' nonsense is just that, pie in the sky. Say one thing and do the other.
Now we are downgraded to just "Visitors" (Passing visitors to sell advertising to)
Well this is the place that took away the *Rolls eyes* smilie because we weren't using it right or some nonsense.
I personally can't see the need for the change so soon, when the site it perfectly ok as it is layout wise. The new beta is just terrible from every angle.
Surely it would be better to spend time fixing the existing broken things like the search function on here, rather than unnecessary website redesigns?!
Comments
I apologise I should have been clearer, my issue with the spacing and ad placement relates to the forums but is notably worse today so I'm presuming there has been some knock-on effects. My screen resolution is 1680x1050 and my preferred browser of choice is Firefox. Here is what it looks like with IE since this will show up the ads. (I've merged 2 images together so you get a clearer idea). Some of the times it isn't too bad but the problem seems to be there are no "fixed" sizes for the ads. In this case a thinner header ad and a square on the right would have probably been OK.
If someone is seeing the same thing on a screen resolution of say 1024x768 it would be horrendous.
-edit
Just to add, its not just the Garmin ads that are doing this. There are only a few that appear to be (IMO) the correct dimensions.
Nice to see they bothered to test even the basics (switching from main to forums) before releasing the beta (which I think looks horrible - far to much wasted space/scrolling). This is even worse than the change from the old blue colour scheme.
There is absolutely nothing to like about this new look.
Thank you s2k. Those adverts are only intended for the editorial site and aren't meant to display on the forums (certainly the tower one that is causing all the blank space). We shall pass this on to our ad team to look in to as those should be disabled on the forums.
Surely the real test of any website design should be whether your users are happy with it?
I have to say the beta looks atrocious like most so called modern design sites, everything is squashed in the centre & way too much empty space. obviously it has been designed for mobile users & not desktop users.
Sadly they will go ahead with the changes no matter what the users say, GSMarena recently changed the look of their site & the regular users hate it now & are starting to go elsewhere.
Of course they won't listen to a word of what people say. They are just using people to debug it for them.
All way to liberal PC on here and no rolleyes emoticon in case it upsets someone with a weak liberal constitution. They is a whole thread on bringing back the rolleyes emoticon and they stuck two fingers up at everyone.
Still why pay for bug testers when they can get the users to do it free of charge?
Strange for a magazine company who just will not listen to its customers.
Way too big for their boots and arrogant.
If you're thinking of forum search, then no it doesn't.
DS Support basically admitted it is beyond their abilities to repair as the software is too old to sort out.
"Beyond their abilities" is a bit inaccurate. We're constantly having to evaluate the pros/cons of any change: to fix the search system the forum would have to go offline, potentially for more than a few days, while the search system recalibrates every single post (removed or otherwise). That's over 76,000,000 posts. Then it has to go through each individual user.
This can't be done on a live environment because of the number of posts made per minute. Then, because the forum software is old, there's no guarantee the fix would 'stick' once another (thousand? tens of thousands? hundreds of thousands?) posts were made.
Yes, search being broken is unfortunate and definitely not ideal, but from our data a very small % of users who view (and post) use search. Should we take the whole forum offline to fix something that is only affecting a small number of people? Is it worth potentially doing the same thing every few months?
As mentioned, we're always exploring options which are not beyond an alternative fix (either through software or otherwise) but it is not as simple as "They can't/won't/don't know how/don't care".
The "we" umbrella extends to our visitors. It is not an "us" vs "them", we're all one happy family here. Any changes made will obviously be based on feedback from our readers, which is why we have opened up a beta process (something we haven't done on this scale before - as older forum members will attest to) to hear thoughts and feedback.
Thanks to everyone that has so far provided their thoughts. We will be going through this thread and passing everything we can use on. Things like "There aren't enough headlines on immediate display" and "Too much scrolling here, here and here" are incredibly valuable to us.
There's a mandate from above to pander to the mobile crowd and they simply won't be swayed from that course, no matter how disastrous the site becomes to browse.
1. Other forums search engines. Why not take a copy of the entire set up and mount it somewhere else where it is online but not being used by users. That way it can be worked on and the search function can scan all old posts for as long as it wants without affecting anyone. Then go live with it and take DS off line one night for a few hours in the AM so that it can update any new posts.
2. Just when will you take the leap to new software? You are patching up this rust-bucket and keep using duct tape to try and hold the wheels on. There comes a time when repair is not the right thing to do and it's time to move on.
3. With a whole thread with many many people saying that they hate the new emoticons and that they want the rolleyes emoticon back so that light hearted sarcasm can be indicated. It clearly shows that all you are listening to is technical feedback on your beta test as that is helpful to you and saves you employing people to do it. You are not listening to anything else as shown by your inactions. The emoticons are within your power to change, but you chose to ignore posters and just go with what you think.
4. You referred to people using the site in your last post as "visitors": That's rather insulting as we are now even users or forum members but just ships that past in the night; visitors. It's clear the value of anyone here to Hurst Magazines is just a churn-over of people to which you can sell advertising on the backs of their numbers. That's their only value to you it would seem. Useful to do your beta testing but went it comes to anything else, ignored.
That's my feedback.
Forum Support- if I were you I would take that' Visit our new Beta site and tell as what you think of it' strip from the top of the old site until it's a lot further along in development- there's beta and beta, this is nowhere near ready to be unleashed on unsuspecting forum members.
Irritating beyond words.
Great post. That is exactly what they are doing and they know it but just carry on.
They see the fact that as they are a private company and can legally do as they wish translates to whatever they do is correct. That is not the case. Not to mention highly arrogant.
Individuals don't matter here, it's just to keep a churn of people here that they can use to sell to advertisers. They don't care if some don't like it as they will move on and they will attract some more lucrative teens to sell to the market forces.
You say that this is not the first time DS have not listened to feedback and I have seen nothing to contradict that this time.
This is not a friendly place and all moderation and interaction is hidden: Why do that if they have nothing to hide? They flatly refuse to answer generally on the forums so it would seem that the 'one big happy family' nonsense is just that, pie in the sky. Say one thing and do the other.
Now we are downgraded to just "Visitors" (Passing visitors to sell advertising to)
Hi Tony,
Those expecting complete redesigns are going to be disappointed. We've had some positive feedback and some negative feedback (this thread is not entirely indicative: we're running a feedback form as well as through other avenues such as Twitter, Facebook, emails and the Contact Us Form).
That doesn't mean we can't tweak things based on feedback. For example we are already pushing for more content to made visible and reducing the amount of "blank" space. Another piece of feedback we have heard (not visible in this thread, but something a lot of people have emailed in about) is the lack of structure on the Soaps page. This is something we're going to fix.
Thanks.
Well it is terrible.
Well this is the place that took away the *Rolls eyes* smilie because we weren't using it right or some nonsense.
Surely it would be better to spend time fixing the existing broken things like the search function on here, rather than unnecessary website redesigns?!