I think Dr Who has become a different show. It's certainly not fit to watch with young children and if some young children were allowed to watch this series I would disagree with that decision.
It's not that it's been particularly brutal or scary, more the concepts on display: suicide, murder. Don't forget this entire series has been about death.
It's an evening fantasy drama now for adults. Often in bad taste and always gimmicky.
Maybe the BBC asked Steven Moffat to go in that direction to fill a vast programming void?
On the one hand it was brilliant, with Michelle Gomez playing a quite excellent interpretation of The Master. The Cybermen (for most of the story) weren't treated as second rate enemies who are there just to get their asses whooped by The Daleks. More of a 'horror' treatment of the Cybermen, with some spooky scenes which point to more potential in future stories. Still not a straight Cyberman story though. They're still robots slaves of somebody else at the moment and don't as yet feel as though they're on the path of their own destiny.
But on the other hand half of it seemed to be mawkishly sentimental bullshit that felt like it was lazily chucked in to try to make viewers feel sad. For example the Brigadier Dalek saving his daughter Kate. What ridiculous nonsense that was. If felt like it was crowbarred into the story and there was no need for it to even be there. There were a couple of unnecessary scenes like that.
So to me it felt like both a brilliant episode and an embarrassingly poor one, both at the same time. But that doesn't mean that I could rate it as average just to balance both extremes, because what was good about it was just too good. I just don't know how to rate it. Brilliant, but very very flawed indeed.
I didn't want asthma lady to die. I don't think it was necessary to bring her back to kill her, as she seems like a good background character to develop at UNIT.
I don't want Clara to leave yet. I like her and it feels like her tenure on the show has been cut short. I certainly didn't want her leaving like that. It just felt wrong. Has it been reported that Jenna Coleman has really left?
Father Christmas at the end told The Doctor that it isn't all right with her and Danny
There was also some great writing in many lines of dialogue. Example: "Why don't you like hugging Doctor?" ..."Never trust a hug. It's just a way to hide your face".
What a great line that is. Writing like that is always going to lift the quality.
A little less conversation a little more action would have been good for the finale, I think. Very flat. I had no real involvement with anyone or anything.
I cannot tell you how much I hated the Brig becoming a Cyberman.
I agree some people are so blinded by their MoffHate that they can't accept a great episode/series when they see one.
No, dear, it's the other way round - if Moffat gave us great episodes/series, we would all love him. He doesn't, so we don't.
This was the very reason I wasn't looking forward with anticipation to this week's episode. As has previously happened, it's all set up brilliantly and expectations are raised, then it's a damp squib.
Not terrible, just not much of anything, really.
Oh well, at least it's Nick Frost at Christmas. Love him!
If you can see and admit to blatant flaws in an episode and overarching writing then you are not a strict fanboy/girl.
If Moffat can do no wrong then that is when fanboy/girl ism takes a turn for the worst
Explain these points.....
-How to Danny and Clara have kids now
-Why did Missy pick Clara
-Why can Cyber men now fly
-If (as fan theory is having it) Missy was teleported and not disintegrated, why did the Brig save her
-Can you take Santa Vs Aliens seriously (even given the tradition of slightly silly Xmas specials)
And one more point
"al those people suffering in Dalek camps, you can save them now"
Cybermen get trashed by Daleks... would not work even if the Doc was so inclined to try
Yeah, and how did the TV cameras fit inside that plane anyway?
That's probably because they were posting messages when they should have been paying attention...
I agree. People whinging on about how crap an episode is whilst it's being aired lose any sort of credibility (IMO!) as they're obviously not giving it their full attention.
Disliked: "you could be a queen" and the Doctor agreeing.
I get the feeling Moffat thinks the Doc being female is inevitable and he wants to be the one to suggest it. But I don't think he will personally pull the trigger. Who ever does that will be a brave showrunner. He is the general. Won't get his hands dirty,
I look at this episode, and then I think of how The Doctor and The Master parted ways at the end of S3. That scene alone was better than the entirety of Missy's run this series.
Moffat brought nothing new to the table, he gave The Master tits for a bit of publicity. I'm honestly ready for him to leave now.
Why could Danny Pink and Brigadier Lethbridge Stewart do what they wanted as Cybermen?
Why didn't The Master regenerate? After all he's a timelord.
How did the Master survive/escape in the first place?
Why did the bodyguards just stand there like idiots when Missy was counting down?
Those are just 4 questions I've thought quickly at the top of my head.
In the case of Danny Pink I thought it was because he had not yet deleted his emotions in the Nethersphere, which presumably most other people had as that was the point of it. Perhaps the Brig also didn't delete his emotions because he's the Brig and he's awesome.
The Master didn't regenerate because (s)he didn't have time.
How did the Master survive/escape? Don't know, don't care. Not important to the story. The Master frequently died in the classic series but always came back.
The bodyguards just stood there while Missy counted down because they were just extras and not paid enough to have more active or speaking roles They presumably hadn't realised that Missy had removed her handcuffs so didn't take her threats seriously.
disappointed after last week had expected better but it became a bit of a dogs dinner trying to do too many things in my opinion .
No need to kill off the Master again she should have just teleported away (although no saying she didn't) and as for Osgood that was just for shock value.
Is that the last Clara episode ? I really hope it is,
so Missy wandered thru history grabbing the minds of people just before they died , and then these minds were downloaded into rotting corpses in tanks , then into corpses in the ground (only the recently buried would have any kind of body left wouldn't they ?)
and the minds of the dead have to delete themselves , but if they love someone its okay anyway ... ?
Well in Dannys case because he didn't delete his emotions in the nethersphere was my interpretation.The Brig? because he's awesome of course
Because he/she didn't have time to
He/she always escapes usually with no explanation
Because the master had hyponotised them
Pretty much this.
In particular it's often been the case that the master somehow escapes without it being explained properly. Surely any long standing fan of the show would know this. And to me clearly since the beam was a different colour clearly she was not disintegrated but teleported therefore she wouldn't have regenerated.
I agree. People whinging on about how crap an episode is whilst it's being aired lose any sort of credibility (IMO!) as they're obviously not giving it their full attention.
I thought it was a below average episode though.
I watched the whole episode without posting on here and thought it was dire. No feeling, emotion or attachment to anything. The whole railroading the Brigader into the episode was an attempt to patch those gaping holes of emotion.
As I didn't post during the episode, does that make my opinion more valid?
what about future Danny? Or was he from an alternate universe?
Im assuming you mean the first human time traveller? That wasn't Danny. That was ORSON pink, his and Clara's descendant. You obviously do not pay attention when watching, which is why you appear to not understand what is going on in the episodes....
Clara was going to tell Danny something last week before he died, she was going to tell the Doctor something at the end tonight, but we do not find out what. I bet that, as we probably find out at Christmas, is that she's pregnant.
Missy and Danny both had the same idea about the Dr; that he was a Dictator-in-Waiting, who would be corruptible by the promise of ultimate power.
The Oncoming Storm perhaps..
But he's just a madman with a box, as we knew all along :cool:
This. She was trying to corrupt the Doctor with power.
I thought it was blindingly obvious. Obviously some people were so busy typing comments on here (or complaining) they were not concentrating on what was happening on screen.
I agree. People whinging on about how crap an episode is whilst it's being aired lose any sort of credibility (IMO!) as they're obviously not giving it their full attention.
If it was worth paying full attention to that`s what people would have done. It was dogshit, that runny mustard coloured kind from a dog just about dead.
Comments
It's not that it's been particularly brutal or scary, more the concepts on display: suicide, murder. Don't forget this entire series has been about death.
It's an evening fantasy drama now for adults. Often in bad taste and always gimmicky.
Maybe the BBC asked Steven Moffat to go in that direction to fill a vast programming void?
On the one hand it was brilliant, with Michelle Gomez playing a quite excellent interpretation of The Master. The Cybermen (for most of the story) weren't treated as second rate enemies who are there just to get their asses whooped by The Daleks. More of a 'horror' treatment of the Cybermen, with some spooky scenes which point to more potential in future stories. Still not a straight Cyberman story though. They're still robots slaves of somebody else at the moment and don't as yet feel as though they're on the path of their own destiny.
But on the other hand half of it seemed to be mawkishly sentimental bullshit that felt like it was lazily chucked in to try to make viewers feel sad. For example the Brigadier Dalek saving his daughter Kate. What ridiculous nonsense that was. If felt like it was crowbarred into the story and there was no need for it to even be there. There were a couple of unnecessary scenes like that.
So to me it felt like both a brilliant episode and an embarrassingly poor one, both at the same time. But that doesn't mean that I could rate it as average just to balance both extremes, because what was good about it was just too good. I just don't know how to rate it. Brilliant, but very very flawed indeed.
I didn't want asthma lady to die. I don't think it was necessary to bring her back to kill her, as she seems like a good background character to develop at UNIT.
I don't want Clara to leave yet. I like her and it feels like her tenure on the show has been cut short. I certainly didn't want her leaving like that. It just felt wrong. Has it been reported that Jenna Coleman has really left?
There was also some great writing in many lines of dialogue. Example: "Why don't you like hugging Doctor?" ..."Never trust a hug. It's just a way to hide your face".
What a great line that is. Writing like that is always going to lift the quality.
I cannot tell you how much I hated the Brig becoming a Cyberman.
No, dear, it's the other way round - if Moffat gave us great episodes/series, we would all love him. He doesn't, so we don't.
This was the very reason I wasn't looking forward with anticipation to this week's episode. As has previously happened, it's all set up brilliantly and expectations are raised, then it's a damp squib.
Not terrible, just not much of anything, really.
Oh well, at least it's Nick Frost at Christmas. Love him!
hee hee
Yeah, and how did the TV cameras fit inside that plane anyway?
sweet buttery jesus on a stick.
Well in Dannys case because he didn't delete his emotions in the nethersphere was my interpretation.The Brig? because he's awesome of course
Because he/she didn't have time to
He/she always escapes usually with no explanation
Because the master had hyponotised them
I agree. People whinging on about how crap an episode is whilst it's being aired lose any sort of credibility (IMO!) as they're obviously not giving it their full attention.
I thought it was a below average episode though.
Liked: Clara's eyebrows in the titles.
Disliked: "you could be a queen" and the Doctor agreeing.
I get the feeling Moffat thinks the Doc being female is inevitable and he wants to be the one to suggest it. But I don't think he will personally pull the trigger. Who ever does that will be a brave showrunner. He is the general. Won't get his hands dirty,
Moffat brought nothing new to the table, he gave The Master tits for a bit of publicity. I'm honestly ready for him to leave now.
In the case of Danny Pink I thought it was because he had not yet deleted his emotions in the Nethersphere, which presumably most other people had as that was the point of it. Perhaps the Brig also didn't delete his emotions because he's the Brig and he's awesome.
The Master didn't regenerate because (s)he didn't have time.
How did the Master survive/escape? Don't know, don't care. Not important to the story. The Master frequently died in the classic series but always came back.
The bodyguards just stood there while Missy counted down because they were just extras and not paid enough to have more active or speaking roles
Was the 5th one 'what's for tea'?
No need to kill off the Master again she should have just teleported away (although no saying she didn't) and as for Osgood that was just for shock value.
Is that the last Clara episode ? I really hope it is,
*Yawn*
[/review]
and the minds of the dead have to delete themselves , but if they love someone its okay anyway ... ?
... what ?
Hardly that would be Donna...made me stop watching the show for sometime during that season....shiver...
Pretty much this.
In particular it's often been the case that the master somehow escapes without it being explained properly. Surely any long standing fan of the show would know this. And to me clearly since the beam was a different colour clearly she was not disintegrated but teleported therefore she wouldn't have regenerated.
LOLOL!!! naughty
I watched the whole episode without posting on here and thought it was dire. No feeling, emotion or attachment to anything. The whole railroading the Brigader into the episode was an attempt to patch those gaping holes of emotion.
As I didn't post during the episode, does that make my opinion more valid?
Oops
Yes
His emotions were deleted yet he was still hugging Clara. What gives?
Because he's awesome? Brilliant.
What do you mean by time? Normally when timelords get shot they regenerate.
It still doesn't make sense.
With what and how did she hyponotise both of them in quick succession?
Im assuming you mean the first human time traveller? That wasn't Danny. That was ORSON pink, his and Clara's descendant. You obviously do not pay attention when watching, which is why you appear to not understand what is going on in the episodes....
Clara was going to tell Danny something last week before he died, she was going to tell the Doctor something at the end tonight, but we do not find out what. I bet that, as we probably find out at Christmas, is that she's pregnant.
Well you missed the greatest series by not watching her, she was wonderful and she will always be the most important person in the universe.
Oh YES !
This. She was trying to corrupt the Doctor with power.
I thought it was blindingly obvious. Obviously some people were so busy typing comments on here (or complaining) they were not concentrating on what was happening on screen.
If it was worth paying full attention to that`s what people would have done. It was dogshit, that runny mustard coloured kind from a dog just about dead.