Dawson, I can call any 01/02 landline number thru BT in the evening for about 6p for a call lasting up to an hour. Please show me how I can call an 0870 number thru BT at the same time for the same price? It's impossible.
Have a look at your BT bill which will identify that you are on a BT Together tariff.
I have posted the standard rates for BT residential customers
Even with BT, I think you are way out of date. I understood that everyone is on option 1 (or higher) now, no choice, and the per minute rate on that for geographical calls is way lower that the rate for 0870 numbers.
Oh dear, more incorrect information there I'm afraid - no not all BT residential customers are on BT Together packages.
...and don't forget the BT business customers either!
Have a look at your BT bill which will identify that you are on a BT Together tariff.
I have posted the standard rates for BT residential customers
But there are no 'standard rates' now, BT put everyone on at least option one ages ago.
You really need to take a step back and look at how you're handling this. You seem to be utterly obsessed in trying to get everone to accept that a number they have to pay a premium rate to call is not a premium rate number.
Note 'have to'.
You don't 'have to' pay the so called BT standard rate to call a geographical numer you can pay way less, or even nothing.
You do 'have to' pay at least 7p a minute to call a premium rate 0870 number in the daytime. And day or night, weekday or weekend 0870 numbers are charged at a premium rate by virtually every supplier out there.
Thank goodness for that. Now perhaps you'll stop tilting at windmills and accept what has been perfectly obvious to everyone else from the start.
When there are a whole range of suppliers who will let you make normal phonecalls to landlines for 0p, 1p or 2p per minute, paying 7p pre minute, whether to BT or to an 0870 provider means that you are paying a whopping great premium.
But there are no 'standard rates' now, BT put everyone on at least option one ages ago.
There is still a national rate chargeband for calls made by BT customers not on a BT Together tariff, and as I previously posted here, not all BT residential customers are on BT Together tariff (admittedly most are now, but not all)
As I'm bored of repeating myself, perhaps this thread will enlighten you
not all BT residential customers are on BT Together tariff (admittedly most are now, but not all)
Dawson. Show me how to get off the BT Together, please. But I think you'll find it's impossible. They put EVERYBODY onto a BT Together plan some time ago (unfortunately).
I don't call 070, 0845, 0870, 0871 or 09 numbers - because, regardless of whether they're premium rate (or not) according to anyone else's definition, they'd cost me extra to call.
There is still a national rate chargeband for calls made by BT customers not on a BT Together tariff, and as I previously posted here, not all BT residential customers are on BT Together tariff (admittedly most are now, but not all)
Dawson, your desparation is palpable.
Your assertion that not all residential customers are on a BT Together tariff was contradicted about five minutes ago by BT sales who confirmed that there is no non together package now. Everyone was converted in one go. There was no choice, it was just done.
As I'm bored of repeating myself
Not half as bored as we are of hearing your increasingly desparate attempts to convince us that black is white.
perhaps this thread will enlighten you
It only serves to show that there are one or two other people who are confused by the way the English language works and would prefer to have their mode of communication dictated by a quango. Rather sad, I would say.
Dawson. Show me how to get off the BT Together, please. But I think you'll find it's impossible. They put EVERYBODY onto a BT Together plan some time ago (unfortunately).
No they haven't. Have you read the thread I linked to? I think you even posted in it at the time.
as I previously posted here, not all BT residential customers are on BT Together tariff
Dawson, would you care to check that and perhaps post a link to a reliable source to back that up?
Everyone was switched and BT used that as an excuse to put the line rental charge up £1.
Unless you can provide a link to some BT site that explains how you can have a residential line and not be on a together plan I think you'll have to accept that you are mistaken.
And perhaps, from there it wouldn't be too big a jump to just admit that you've had hold of the wrong end of the stick all along
Your assertion that not all residential customers are on a BT Together tariff was contradicted about five minutes ago by BT sales who confirmed that there is no non together package now. Everyone was converted in one go. There was no choice, it was just done.
Funny, my mother is a BT residential customer and she is NOT on a BT Together tariff. I think the BT sales-person gave you some incorrect information, or was perhaps referring to your own circumstances.
Details of the scheme my mother is on (and I referred to in that linked thread I posted) is available from the BT website.
No they haven't. Have you read the thread I linked to? I think you even posted in it at the time.
I've waded though a few posts but it doesn't tell me anything new.
Except that even then people were (correctly) telling you that you were talking drivel.
Are you now contending that because a very special class of user on the Light User Scheme have to pay a premium over what the vast majority of the country pay to call geographical numbers we should now consider the LUS rate to be the standard?
God, give me strength.
For the vast majority of people calling an 0870 number during the daytime means they have to pay a premium of at least 3p.
I don't call 070, 0845, 0870, 0871 or 09 numbers - because, regardless of whether they're premium rate (or not) according to anyone else's definition, they'd cost me extra to call.
Not necessarily, it depends which tariff and company you use to initiate the call from. If you read my posts you will understand.
All numbers beginning 09 are classed as premium rate services.
Funny, my mother is a BT residential customer and she is NOT on a BT Together tariff. I think the BT sales-person gave you some incorrect information, or was perhaps referring to your own circumstances.
Details of the scheme my mother is on (and I referred to in that linked thread I posted) is available from the BT website.
I've waded though a few posts but it doesn't tell me anything new.
Except that even then people were (correctly) telling you that you were talking drivel.
Are you now contending that because a very special class of user on the Light User Scheme have to pay a premium over what the vast majority of the country pay to call geographical numbers we should now consider the LUS rate to be the standard?
God, give me strength.
For the vast majority of people calling an 0870 number during the daytime means they have to pay a premium of at least 3p.
It's a premium rate number. End of story.
BT prices for residential calls are given here on the BT website
When BT first brought out their "Together", like a fool I went on to it because "National" calls would be 4p not 8p. Imagine my fury at my first bill which had 0870s charged at 8p. "Ah, but Sir, those are Premium Rate Calls (sic)" I pursued this with Ofcom etc. etc. etc. The definition was "Premium Rate Calls charged at National Rate". And that is how they get away with it. I promptly reverted to the previous tariff. Now I've no choice I have to be on option 1. I'm sorry @Dawson but we are being ripped off and your calculations of a call centre employee costing 7p/min are an irrelevance. The owners of 0870 numbers get a cut and people are daft enough to use them.
There's a whole section referring to their call costs for non BT Together residential customers.
You have now moved from pig headed stupidity into the realms of straightforward dishonesty.
You know full well that those rates are only charged to a tiny handful of customers.
For the overwhelming majority of customers, both BT and other, calling an 0870 number involves paying a significant premium over calling a geographical number.
No one wants to read all your posts because most of them, on this topic at least, are as daft as the ones you've been making here.
I think it's time to join Heinz and give up on this idiot now.
He'll obviously say anything, true or false to try and prove his ridiculous assertion.
I think anyone reading the thread so far will clearly see that all logic points to 0870 numbers being premium rate no matter what some unelected jobsworth has decided.
However there are others who clearly disagree with the facts, post unsubstantiated claims to the contrary and resort to insults when all else fails. Oh well, there's no debating with some is there...
I think everyone is giving up on debating with you because you have moved from poor logic and poor English language comprehension into acting in a completely disingenuous manner.
It matters not a jot that you can dig up obscure tarriffs and show that under some circumstances it possible to pay more than x pence for y type of call.
What matters is (as I and others have stated over and over again):
For the vast majority of people, calling an 0870 number involves paying a real premium over calling any geographic number.
You can wheedle and worm all you like, nothing will change the truth of that and that is why: 0870 numbers are premium rate numbers.
Comments
I have posted the standard rates for BT residential customers
Oh dear, more incorrect information there I'm afraid - no not all BT residential customers are on BT Together packages.
...and don't forget the BT business customers either!
You really need to take a step back and look at how you're handling this. You seem to be utterly obsessed in trying to get everone to accept that a number they have to pay a premium rate to call is not a premium rate number.
Note 'have to'.
You don't 'have to' pay the so called BT standard rate to call a geographical numer you can pay way less, or even nothing.
You do 'have to' pay at least 7p a minute to call a premium rate 0870 number in the daytime. And day or night, weekday or weekend 0870 numbers are charged at a premium rate by virtually every supplier out there.
That's what makes them premium rate numbers.
When there are a whole range of suppliers who will let you make normal phonecalls to landlines for 0p, 1p or 2p per minute, paying 7p pre minute, whether to BT or to an 0870 provider means that you are paying a whopping great premium.
Please check your facts. BT mandatorally changed everyone on a standard package to together one some time ago.
If you visit the BT website and check the cost of a 5 min phone call to a notional number it is now 15p.
For an 0870 number you have to pay a significant premium.
That's why it's a premium rate number :cool:
As I'm bored of repeating myself, perhaps this thread will enlighten you
http://www.digitalspy.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?t=357976
Dawson. Show me how to get off the BT Together, please. But I think you'll find it's impossible. They put EVERYBODY onto a BT Together plan some time ago (unfortunately).
I don't call 070, 0845, 0870, 0871 or 09 numbers - because, regardless of whether they're premium rate (or not) according to anyone else's definition, they'd cost me extra to call.
Your assertion that not all residential customers are on a BT Together tariff was contradicted about five minutes ago by BT sales who confirmed that there is no non together package now. Everyone was converted in one go. There was no choice, it was just done.
Not half as bored as we are of hearing your increasingly desparate attempts to convince us that black is white.
It only serves to show that there are one or two other people who are confused by the way the English language works and would prefer to have their mode of communication dictated by a quango. Rather sad, I would say.
Everyone was switched and BT used that as an excuse to put the line rental charge up £1.
Unless you can provide a link to some BT site that explains how you can have a residential line and not be on a together plan I think you'll have to accept that you are mistaken.
And perhaps, from there it wouldn't be too big a jump to just admit that you've had hold of the wrong end of the stick all along
Details of the scheme my mother is on (and I referred to in that linked thread I posted) is available from the BT website.
http://www.bt.com/customerservices/downloads/light_user_scheme.pdf
Except that even then people were (correctly) telling you that you were talking drivel.
Are you now contending that because a very special class of user on the Light User Scheme have to pay a premium over what the vast majority of the country pay to call geographical numbers we should now consider the LUS rate to be the standard?
God, give me strength.
For the vast majority of people calling an 0870 number during the daytime means they have to pay a premium of at least 3p.
It's a premium rate number. End of story.
All numbers beginning 09 are classed as premium rate services.
Trying to use that scheme to prove that 0870 numbers cost the same as geograpical ones is not only stupid, it's dishonest.
BT prices for residential calls are given here on the BT website
http://www.downloads.bt.com/pricing/UKInternationalprices.pdf
There's a whole section referring to their call costs for non BT Together residential customers.
As are 0870, 0871 and several others to anyone with half a brain who understands the meaning of the words: 'premium' and 'rate'.
You know full well that those rates are only charged to a tiny handful of customers.
For the overwhelming majority of customers, both BT and other, calling an 0870 number involves paying a significant premium over calling a geographical number.
That's why they're premium rate numbers.
Why does it cost more to call a mobile phone with a T-Mobile sim in it than it does to call that same mobile with an O2 sim in it using BT?
These were the points that I made way back in post#7. My posts are substantitaed with links to reliable sources where appropriate or requested.
However there are others who clearly disagree with the facts, post unsubstantiated claims to the contrary and resort to insults when all else fails.
Oh well, there's no debating with some is there...
He'll obviously say anything, true or false to try and prove his ridiculous assertion.
I think anyone reading the thread so far will clearly see that all logic points to 0870 numbers being premium rate no matter what some unelected jobsworth has decided.
It matters not a jot that you can dig up obscure tarriffs and show that under some circumstances it possible to pay more than x pence for y type of call.
What matters is (as I and others have stated over and over again):
For the vast majority of people, calling an 0870 number involves paying a real premium over calling any geographic number.
You can wheedle and worm all you like, nothing will change the truth of that and that is why: 0870 numbers are premium rate numbers.