I think you'll find that in most cases when a new actor plays a character, the character is usually written different. This has happened in all the soaps throughout the years. It's not fair to single out EE at this moment in time just to suit some people's agenda's.
Not fair to single out EE?
Some people's agenda's?
It's Eastenders we're discussing. Not any other soap.
It's like banging your head against a brick wall with the pro BK group. Their arguments just don't make any sense.
The thing that really concerns me about this storyline is that BK has said that EE consulted experts to make it as realistic as possible, NOTE: not to research what the character of Ronnie was likely to do in reality!
Also even if we can take the huge jump and believe that nobody notices that the babies look different don't they do tests on babies who suddenly die?- there must be something in medical records that doctors would pick up on as odd, and even if there isn't shouldn't the health visitor notice that it's a different baby?- or are we also supposed to believe that they are the same height and weight as well as looking partically identical?!?!!
No. It's a soap opera. It's television. It's fiction. Ronnie doesn't exist. Neither does Kat or Alfie or their babies.
If you don't like what is going to happen, then don't watch as you know you will get upset. Me, I can tell the difference between television and reality; and I've sat through a lot worse and not been affected. I'll watch and I'll be gripped/entertained (hopefully).
It's fiction. How can there possibly be anything wrong with it.
The complaints about this story line are completely invalid.
1. It's fiction.
2. The people complaining haven't even seen it yet!
Fiction doesn't hurt anybody. And if something doesn't hurt anybody there's nothing wrong with it.
Complaining about a fictional storyline and kowtowing to those complaints is just mind baffling insanity I can't get my head around.
It's a drama. It's supposed to be D-R-A-M-A-T-I-C.
If you don't like it you can f*ck off and watch something else.
Art of any kind is between it's makers and the people who want to see it. If you don't like it it's nothing to do with you.
People have a right to see what they want to see.
Well complainers, are you happy now?
Kirkwood kowtowed to the complainers.
And now it's even more of a pansy ass show than it already was under him.:mad:
There go's another blow to freedom of expression in Britain.
That is a very insensitive comment. Who are you to say that people who are unhappy with this are wrong.
As a person who has lost a child to SIDS I find that utterly insulting.
Also, from experience, I can tell you the post mortem results, 6 weeks after death would proove the child was not related to the mother - they take blood from the mother to cross reference to see if the mother passed any infection such as syphilis or any other condition... this swap story is not possible!
Fiction doesn't hurt anyone? That is just wrong! Of course it does and can.
That is a very insensitive comment. Who are you to say that people who are unhappy with this are wrong.
As a person who has lost a child to SIDS I find that utterly insulting.
Also, from experience, I can tell you the post mortem results, 6 weeks after death would proove the child was not related to the mother - they take blood from the mother to cross reference to see if the mother passed any infection such as syphilis or any other condition... this swap story is not possible!
Fiction doesn't hurt anyone? That is just wrong! Of course it does and can.
But if Ronnie & Kat are the same blood type - someone posted recently, that neither Kat or Alfie have to be the same blood type of the baby.
But if Ronnie & Kat are the same blood type - someone posted recently, that neither Kat or Alfie have to be the same blood type of the baby.
No the blood tests would be much more detailed screening than merely blood type. In our case there was genetic screening done where blood was taken from both of us to compare. It didn't give us answers, but it would have shown if either of was not a natural parent.
No the blood tests would be much more detailed screening than merely blood type. In our case there was genetic screening done where blood was taken from both of us to compare. It didn't give us answers, but it would have shown if either of was not a natural parent.
It's a 'jump the shark' development
oo fair enough - i didn't know that.
But yano - this is soap, it's not always relastic.
No. It's a soap opera. It's television. It's fiction. Ronnie doesn't exist. Neither does Kat or Alfie or their babies.
If you don't like what is going to happen, then don't watch as you know you will get upset. Me, I can tell the difference between television and reality; and I've sat through a lot worse and not been affected. I'll watch and I'll be gripped/entertained (hopefully).
But yano - this is soap, it's not always relastic.
But the issues raised are real.
It makes me laugh that people defend EE by saying "It's not real"... then they'll see EE is the most realistic and gritty... not for many years.
If Danielle came back and said she pretended to be dead people would dismiss it as ridiculous... this swap is equally ridiculous... the idea that staff wouldn't listen to Kat say it isn't her child is not believable either
False or not its an appauling storyling to tackle i really wont be watching it, i know alot of people will think ooo she said this now but will watch but really i wont be, its a very very difficult issue and one that hits far to close to home for many people.
Wether they handle it sensitively or not infant deaths on screen are usualy responded to negativly by the public. I will be interested to see how kats massive blood loss goes as someone who has been through that after the birth of my first daughter i KNOW how this works and should be screened because i almost died from it. Needed various transfusions and all within the space of a few hours... one min i was fine next i was close to death...
I think the issue of cot death is far too near the knuckle for some people but going on about it must make the producers and brian very happy. more negative press equals more ratings. i PERSONALLY and this is just my opinion so no one shoot me down for it , i think the whole plot should be re shot and NOT include any infant deaths, i know this is probably rewriting years worth of baby swap material but that was really unrealistic anways .... as the mother of 2 kids i REFUSE to believe that any mother wouldnt know their own child by sight and sound after even minutes of the birth
I dont see this working long term and the fact they have ronnie go to the funeral is just insulting. i for one would have been happy they just tackled the massive blood loss of kat, with all the other things happening in the soap there is really no need for a cot death.
I really hope they seriously take peoples opinion into consideration, as i understand it has already underwent some changes to the scenes but it really needs to be scrapped. i hope they rethink this sad storyline. Its just a bit too near the knuckle and sensitive for me to watch
False or not its an appauling storyling to tackle i really wont be watching it, i know alot of people will think ooo she said this now but will watch but really i wont be, its a very very difficult issue and one that hits far to close to home for many people.
Wether they handle it sensitively or not infant deaths on screen are usualy responded to negativly by the public. I will be interested to see how kats massive blood loss goes as someone who has been through that after the birth of my first daughter i KNOW how this works and should be screened because i almost died from it. Needed various transfusions and all within the space of a few hours... one min i was fine next i was close to death...
I think the issue of cot death is far too near the knuckle for some people but going on about it must make the producers and brian very happy. more negative press equals more ratings. i PERSONALLY and this is just my opinion so no one shoot me down for it , i think the whole plot should be re shot and NOT include any infant deaths, i know this is probably rewriting years worth of baby swap material but that was really unrealistic anways .... as the mother of 2 kids i REFUSE to believe that any mother wouldnt know their own child by sight and sound after even minutes of the birth
I dont see this working long term and the fact they have ronnie go to the funeral is just insulting. i for one would have been happy they just tackled the massive blood loss of kat, with all the other things happening in the soap there is really no need for a cot death.
I really hope they seriously take peoples opinion into consideration, as i understand it has already underwent some changes to the scenes but it really needs to be scrapped. i hope they rethink this sad storyline. Its just a bit too near the knuckle and sensitive for me to watch
After experiencing SIDS, I have no problem with them covering it. I may not watch though. However it's trying to outdo it with this swap thing... it's gross in the extreme
It makes me laugh that people defend EE by saying "It's not real"... then they'll see EE is the most realistic and gritty... not for many years.
If Danielle came back and said she pretended to be dead people would dismiss it as ridiculous... this swap is equally ridiculous... the idea that staff wouldn't listen to Kat say it isn't her child is not believable either
Fiction and how realistic something is is not the same thing. A soap will always be fiction, but it can portray events that really do happen and portray them realistically. Whether EastEnders is realistic or not right now doesn't even come into this discussion, however.
I don't know if hospital staff in real life would do that, but as far as they're concerned Kat's baby has died and she's exhausted and not in a good mental or physical state, so it's not too unfair to assume she's delusional.
Fiction and how realistic something is is not the same thing. A soap will always be fiction, but it can portray events that really do happen and portray them realistically. Whether EastEnders is realistic or not right now doesn't even come into this discussion, however.
I don't know if hospital staff in real life would do that, but as far as they're concerned Kat's baby has died and she's exhausted and not in a good mental or physical state, so it's not too unfair to assume she's delusional.
I understand what you mean and you are 100% right about dramatic license.
It's the use of a SIDS as a plot device that I can't approve of. I find it offensive.
I understand what you mean and you are 100% right about dramatic license.
It's the use of a SIDS as a plot device that I can't approve of. I find it offensive.
But its not a plot device?!!? its about a mother finding her child dead and becoming mentally ill as a result.
Its more about mental health than it is SIDS IMHO and EE constantly wins the Mind award every year so their research team know their stuff.. I have complete faith in them.
To say SIDS is a plot device is basically saying every plot is a plot device IMO. Every storyline on EE, and other soaps, leads to more storylines and something bigger (In this case, Ronnie's mental health, swapping a child and Kat and Alfie's grief). So I don't think it's right to say the cot death part of this story is a plot device.
But its not a plot device?!!? its about a mother finding her child dead and becoming mentally ill as a result.
Its more about mental health than it is SIDS IMHO and EE constantly wins the Mind award every year so their research team know their stuff.. I have complete faith in them.
The SIDS aspect is a plot device to enable the swap. The mental health issue could be explored as a result of the SIDS. The swap is offensive to me because it is using SIDS for sensationalism.
Mind awards are not relevant to that.
I have no faith in this storyline. From personal experience I think it's inappropriate and I think it shows an EP who is more interested in creating controversy than anything else.
To say SIDS is a plot device is basically saying every plot is a plot device IMO. Every storyline on EE, and other soaps, leads to more storylines and something bigger (In this case, Ronnie's mental health, swapping a child and Kat and Alfie's grief). So I don't think it's right to say the cot death part of this story is a plot device.
I've no problem with plot devices. They are necessary of course.
I have a problem with using SIDS as a plot device for an offensive and ridiculous storyline, when they would be better served using the SIDS as the dramatic storyline. All Ronnie elements could be explored that way too.
I can't take anyone seriously who slates a storyline before its aired. All those who seen the episodes praised them to the hilt. I think some soap fans from other soaps might be rather envious.
I've no problem with plot devices. They are necessary of course.
I have a problem with using SIDS as a plot device for an offensive and ridiculous storyline, when they would be better served using the SIDS as the dramatic storyline. All Ronnie elements could be explored that way too.
But why? I don't want to offend you or anything because I've read about you losing a child (which I'm sorry to hear about btw ). If there had only been a baby swap, no cot death, it wouldn't make sense to viewers. The death of Ronnie's baby is about her struggle, she's had this happen before with Danielle and the baby she lost, so I really think if they wanted to do a swap, the baby dying is the only way it could happen. It's a sad storyline, but so are most plots on EE and a lot of people can be affected by them.
IMO they have gone too far with this storyline and i think it's unfair to the character of Ronnie. That being said i'm still going to watch it but instead of people complaining about it, just don't watch it. The rest of my family aren't watching it.
I can't take anyone seriously who slates a storyline before its aired. All those who seen the episodes praised them to the hilt. I think some soap fans from other soaps might be rather envious.
Absolutely not. This is a silly statement as any comments made have been very specific, and there are many people who don't like this.
Comments
Not fair to single out EE?
Some people's agenda's?
It's Eastenders we're discussing. Not any other soap.
It's like banging your head against a brick wall with the pro BK group. Their arguments just don't make any sense.
Also even if we can take the huge jump and believe that nobody notices that the babies look different don't they do tests on babies who suddenly die?- there must be something in medical records that doctors would pick up on as odd, and even if there isn't shouldn't the health visitor notice that it's a different baby?- or are we also supposed to believe that they are the same height and weight as well as looking partically identical?!?!!
Give me a break!!!
It's fiction. How can there possibly be anything wrong with it.
The complaints about this story line are completely invalid.
1. It's fiction.
2. The people complaining haven't even seen it yet!
Fiction doesn't hurt anybody. And if something doesn't hurt anybody there's nothing wrong with it.
Complaining about a fictional storyline and kowtowing to those complaints is just mind baffling insanity I can't get my head around.
It's a drama. It's supposed to be D-R-A-M-A-T-I-C.
If you don't like it you can f*ck off and watch something else.
Art of any kind is between it's makers and the people who want to see it. If you don't like it it's nothing to do with you.
People have a right to see what they want to see.
Well complainers, are you happy now?
Kirkwood kowtowed to the complainers.
And now it's even more of a pansy ass show than it already was under him.:mad:
There go's another blow to freedom of expression in Britain.
If you don't like what is going to happen, then don't watch as you know you will get upset. Me, I can tell the difference between television and reality; and I've sat through a lot worse and not been affected. I'll watch and I'll be gripped/entertained (hopefully).
That is a very insensitive comment. Who are you to say that people who are unhappy with this are wrong.
As a person who has lost a child to SIDS I find that utterly insulting.
Also, from experience, I can tell you the post mortem results, 6 weeks after death would proove the child was not related to the mother - they take blood from the mother to cross reference to see if the mother passed any infection such as syphilis or any other condition... this swap story is not possible!
Fiction doesn't hurt anyone? That is just wrong! Of course it does and can.
But if Ronnie & Kat are the same blood type - someone posted recently, that neither Kat or Alfie have to be the same blood type of the baby.
No the blood tests would be much more detailed screening than merely blood type. In our case there was genetic screening done where blood was taken from both of us to compare. It didn't give us answers, but it would have shown if either of was not a natural parent.
It's a 'jump the shark' development
oo fair enough - i didn't know that.
But yano - this is soap, it's not always relastic.
Why do you have to spoil it, EE is real.
True
But the issues raised are real.
It makes me laugh that people defend EE by saying "It's not real"... then they'll see EE is the most realistic and gritty... not for many years.
If Danielle came back and said she pretended to be dead people would dismiss it as ridiculous... this swap is equally ridiculous... the idea that staff wouldn't listen to Kat say it isn't her child is not believable either
Wether they handle it sensitively or not infant deaths on screen are usualy responded to negativly by the public. I will be interested to see how kats massive blood loss goes as someone who has been through that after the birth of my first daughter i KNOW how this works and should be screened because i almost died from it. Needed various transfusions and all within the space of a few hours... one min i was fine next i was close to death...
I think the issue of cot death is far too near the knuckle for some people but going on about it must make the producers and brian very happy. more negative press equals more ratings. i PERSONALLY and this is just my opinion so no one shoot me down for it , i think the whole plot should be re shot and NOT include any infant deaths, i know this is probably rewriting years worth of baby swap material but that was really unrealistic anways .... as the mother of 2 kids i REFUSE to believe that any mother wouldnt know their own child by sight and sound after even minutes of the birth
I dont see this working long term and the fact they have ronnie go to the funeral is just insulting. i for one would have been happy they just tackled the massive blood loss of kat, with all the other things happening in the soap there is really no need for a cot death.
I really hope they seriously take peoples opinion into consideration, as i understand it has already underwent some changes to the scenes but it really needs to be scrapped. i hope they rethink this sad storyline. Its just a bit too near the knuckle and sensitive for me to watch
After experiencing SIDS, I have no problem with them covering it. I may not watch though. However it's trying to outdo it with this swap thing... it's gross in the extreme
Fiction and how realistic something is is not the same thing. A soap will always be fiction, but it can portray events that really do happen and portray them realistically. Whether EastEnders is realistic or not right now doesn't even come into this discussion, however.
I don't know if hospital staff in real life would do that, but as far as they're concerned Kat's baby has died and she's exhausted and not in a good mental or physical state, so it's not too unfair to assume she's delusional.
I understand what you mean and you are 100% right about dramatic license.
It's the use of a SIDS as a plot device that I can't approve of. I find it offensive.
But its not a plot device?!!? its about a mother finding her child dead and becoming mentally ill as a result.
Its more about mental health than it is SIDS IMHO and EE constantly wins the Mind award every year so their research team know their stuff.. I have complete faith in them.
The SIDS aspect is a plot device to enable the swap. The mental health issue could be explored as a result of the SIDS. The swap is offensive to me because it is using SIDS for sensationalism.
Mind awards are not relevant to that.
I have no faith in this storyline. From personal experience I think it's inappropriate and I think it shows an EP who is more interested in creating controversy than anything else.
I find this deeply offensive.
I've no problem with plot devices. They are necessary of course.
I have a problem with using SIDS as a plot device for an offensive and ridiculous storyline, when they would be better served using the SIDS as the dramatic storyline. All Ronnie elements could be explored that way too.
But why?
Absolutely not. This is a silly statement as any comments made have been very specific, and there are many people who don't like this.