"Never cruel or cowardly. Never give up, never give in."
- Doctor's vow.
Very well, but all of the other things.
All the same, I still feel The Doctor has had moments of cruelty since he made that vow now and again. Very few, but he's had his moments.
He also opted to be a "coward, any day" over being a killer when confronted by the Dalek Emperor. He chose to be a coward in that moment, and were it not for Bad Wolf Rose coming to save the day, perhaps it would have been a second consecutive Doctor who refused to use the title, if he were to stick to his own vow.
Interesting Theory.... except, of course, and wishful thinking aside, the 2005+ series remains non canon to the original 1963-89 series.
Ah, are you the guy who also said that the missing episodes are non-canon?
You're either a troll or completely stupid. Probably both. Of course it's canon. There have been loads of references to the past and no matter how hard you try, there is absolutely no grounds for this absurd theory of yours.
Back on track - I really doubt that PC will be the Valeyard. Just as some people really want every female baddie to be the Rani, now it seems that anytime a 'darker' Doctor is mentioned we get calls for the return of the Valeyard. Very few people, outside of the hardcore of fandom, remember or care who the Valeyard actually was, so it would be a rather unlikely plot twist to rely on the revelation of a villain that appeared just once, 25 years ago.
Why can't Peter Capaldi simply play the next incarnation of the Doctor?
Agreed. Bringing The Valeyard back would be a dumb mistake that Moff wouldn't make.
All the same, I still feel The Doctor has had moments of cruelty since he made that vow now and again. Very few, but he's had his moments.
He also opted to be a "coward, any day" over being a killer when confronted by the Dalek Emperor. He chose to be a coward in that moment, and were it not for Bad Wolf Rose coming to save the day, perhaps it would have been a second consecutive Doctor who refused to use the title, if he were to stick to his own vow.
True, but you could say that to destroy half of the population of Earth to destroy the Daleks would be as cowardly as destroying Gallifrey to do the same. It's OK to be a coward if the alternative is to be a killer-coward.
I've said before that I think that Capaldi would be totally convincing as a Valeyard/Dream Lord type of character. That split second shot of him in Day of the Doctor hardly changed my mind - it didn't make him look like the most welcoming of Time Lords (low bar, it's true). His eyes looked very stern at best - almost evil! Of course it was just one shot and a smile can work wonders. However, compared to Matt who has children queuing up for a cuddle, he looked like someone who you'd want to be rescued from, rather then be rescued by...
That's the problem - a Valeyard/Dream Lord character is basically a baddie, it's far too much of a departure to make the Doctor take on that sort of a role.You'd have to have a 'normal' Doctor as well, to be the morally sound guardian of the weak etc etc, while fighting the Valeyard.The Valeyard is more likely to form an Alliance with the Master/other baddies then try to stop them.
The only way Capaldi could be the Valeyard or similar, is if there's a unknown 'proper' Doctor planned to run concurrently - unless Matt is secretly staying on. Capaldi as Valeyard could be brilliant if they could pull all that off, but it's more likely that he'll just be a 'dark and gritty' normal Doctor, whatever that means.
It's a big family show airing primetime on a mainstream channel, so I doubt they'll go too dark. But I think what is really needed is substance to the character of the Doctor. He doesn't have to be a secret baddie but he should feel like someone with a past.
I'm not a fan of the show so I won't even attempt to delve into the nitty gritty but I think that the appeal of the show is that the Doctor is a hero, so it would be a bit mean-spirited to make him into a villain.
It's a big family show airing primetime on a mainstream channel, so I doubt they'll go too dark. But I think what is really needed is substance to the character of the Doctor. He doesn't have to be a secret baddie but he should feel like someone with a past.
I'm not a fan of the show so I won't even attempt to delve into the nitty gritty but I think that the appeal of the show is that the Doctor is a hero, so it would be a bit mean-spirited to make him into a villain.
They made the mistake of going unlikeable with Colin's Doctor. I really hope they don't do that again!
They made the mistake of going unlikeable with Colin's Doctor. I really hope they don't do that again!
Colin's Doctor didn't get the time to show his true colours. Colin says repeatedly that he had a plan for his doctor's character, but the hiatus put paid to it. Apparently on the Big Finish Audios Colin's doctor has completed his development, and is one of, if not the most popular Doctors on audio.
True, but you could say that to destroy half of the population of Earth to destroy the Daleks would be as cowardly as destroying Gallifrey to do the same. It's OK to be a coward if the alternative is to be a killer-coward.
Also, I think the Doctor more than anyone can see the bravery in backing down and saying im not going to do this.
Colin's Doctor didn't get the time to show his true colours. Colin says repeatedly that he had a plan for his doctor's character, but the hiatus put paid to it. Apparently on the Big Finish Audios Colin's doctor has completed his development, and is one of, if not the most popular Doctors on audio.
Yes, I love Colin's Doctor in Big Finish and I know the intention was for him to mellow bur it took too long, IMO.
It should have been over two or three episodes not two series!
Hmm wonder how that fits with what he did to the family of blood?
Not sure after all of the evil acts that the family of blood did compared to where they ended up could be considered cruel?
The family murdered countless numbers both out of the village and with their space ship firing on the planet.
Harrassed and intimidated the school with the implication that they murdered school children in their search for the doctor (not shown but extrapalated from what was going on at the time but also from the bodies of the four that the family were inhabiting/controlling at the time one of which was a child)
I would argue that their punishment was more righteous than cruel but this is of course depending how you interpret the doctors acts.
The doctor in my view is always quick to anger when innocent people are involved but doubly so when it involes children.
Yes, I love Colin's Doctor in Big Finish and I know the intention was for him to mellow bur it took too long, IMO.
It should have been over two or three episodes not two series!
There simply wasnt the patience or the story to back it up back then in the late 80's for Colin Bakers Doctor to be shown as relaxing the aggressive aspects.
If this was done maybe afew years previous with a strong storyline ark going through the episodes / series then this may have changed his popularity and be remembered as a better liked doctor.
Thankfully Big Finish audio has managed to right those wrongs to the point where (at least for me anyway) Dr 6 is just as fantastic as all the other doctors.
Valeyard was mentioned in The Name of the Doctor and Moffat has hinted that Capaldi would be a short lived Doctor. Some have speculated that he will run only half a series when he finds Gallifrey. If we have a very dark Doctor than it should be short. Also I have been think what if it turns out that the dark Doctor ends up becoming parallel and Matt’s has a second Doctor ends up having to fight the dark one.
Can't see any of that happening really. It would be terribly exciting for the fans, of course (sounds amazing!) but don't forget this is a mainstream family show. We've just had a year of amazing fan service for the 50th. I expect things to return to being more mass-market friendly now.
Comments
Very well, but all of the other things.
All the same, I still feel The Doctor has had moments of cruelty since he made that vow now and again. Very few, but he's had his moments.
He also opted to be a "coward, any day" over being a killer when confronted by the Dalek Emperor. He chose to be a coward in that moment, and were it not for Bad Wolf Rose coming to save the day, perhaps it would have been a second consecutive Doctor who refused to use the title, if he were to stick to his own vow.
Ah, are you the guy who also said that the missing episodes are non-canon?
You're either a troll or completely stupid. Probably both. Of course it's canon. There have been loads of references to the past and no matter how hard you try, there is absolutely no grounds for this absurd theory of yours.
Agreed. Bringing The Valeyard back would be a dumb mistake that Moff wouldn't make.
Hmm wonder how that fits with what he did to the family of blood?
One reason why if they do go down a 'darker' route, the companions will be so important to bring out the 'humanity' and compassion of the doctor...
True, but you could say that to destroy half of the population of Earth to destroy the Daleks would be as cowardly as destroying Gallifrey to do the same. It's OK to be a coward if the alternative is to be a killer-coward.
That's the problem - a Valeyard/Dream Lord character is basically a baddie, it's far too much of a departure to make the Doctor take on that sort of a role.You'd have to have a 'normal' Doctor as well, to be the morally sound guardian of the weak etc etc, while fighting the Valeyard.The Valeyard is more likely to form an Alliance with the Master/other baddies then try to stop them.
The only way Capaldi could be the Valeyard or similar, is if there's a unknown 'proper' Doctor planned to run concurrently - unless Matt is secretly staying on. Capaldi as Valeyard could be brilliant if they could pull all that off, but it's more likely that he'll just be a 'dark and gritty' normal Doctor, whatever that means.
Like Rose
I'm not a fan of the show so I won't even attempt to delve into the nitty gritty but I think that the appeal of the show is that the Doctor is a hero, so it would be a bit mean-spirited to make him into a villain.
They made the mistake of going unlikeable with Colin's Doctor. I really hope they don't do that again!
The clips shown in documentaries were terrifying! It was like a psycho Ronald McDonald/Will Ferrell. The children must have been sobbing!
Colin's Doctor didn't get the time to show his true colours. Colin says repeatedly that he had a plan for his doctor's character, but the hiatus put paid to it. Apparently on the Big Finish Audios Colin's doctor has completed his development, and is one of, if not the most popular Doctors on audio.
Also, I think the Doctor more than anyone can see the bravery in backing down and saying im not going to do this.
Yes, I love Colin's Doctor in Big Finish and I know the intention was for him to mellow bur it took too long, IMO.
It should have been over two or three episodes not two series!
Not sure after all of the evil acts that the family of blood did compared to where they ended up could be considered cruel?
The family murdered countless numbers both out of the village and with their space ship firing on the planet.
Harrassed and intimidated the school with the implication that they murdered school children in their search for the doctor (not shown but extrapalated from what was going on at the time but also from the bodies of the four that the family were inhabiting/controlling at the time one of which was a child)
I would argue that their punishment was more righteous than cruel but this is of course depending how you interpret the doctors acts.
The doctor in my view is always quick to anger when innocent people are involved but doubly so when it involes children.
There simply wasnt the patience or the story to back it up back then in the late 80's for Colin Bakers Doctor to be shown as relaxing the aggressive aspects.
If this was done maybe afew years previous with a strong storyline ark going through the episodes / series then this may have changed his popularity and be remembered as a better liked doctor.
Thankfully Big Finish audio has managed to right those wrongs to the point where (at least for me anyway) Dr 6 is just as fantastic as all the other doctors.
I love the idea that Rose has shacked up with The Valeyard.
I heard that it was said, but I don't believe he did. Much as I'd love a surprise regeneration though like Tennant's fake regeneration was.
Here we go again...
Can't see any of that happening really. It would be terribly exciting for the fans, of course (sounds amazing!) but don't forget this is a mainstream family show. We've just had a year of amazing fan service for the 50th. I expect things to return to being more mass-market friendly now.
The reason for the Valeyard being evil? He killed all them Daleks, and then lived with Rose!