So my opinion, because it is not the same as yours or wonkeydonk, is rude?
It may be a generalisation and a few people may have a medically sound reason for being overweight, but the fact is that for the vast majority of people in mobility scooters, they are only in them because they have eaten too much, done absolutely no exercise and now need help to get around because their legs can no longer carry them.
I really cannot be bothered to argue the toss with a bunch of self rightious, holier than thou, sanctimonious posters.
This is my opinion - true - and it would be a boring world if we all thought the same, but I am answering the OP's original question. No - obese people should not be considered disabled.
I wasn't arsed about your opinion. It was your condescending and insulting tone, not to mention childish name-calling, that I deemed rude.
But the causes of obesity may be a sickness. Depression, lack of self worth etc. Like saying you know smoking is bad for you so give it up! Not so easy, and the resultant effects may then cause disability. How's that any different?
That's what I meant by the first part of my post ... some factors that cause obesity may be a sickness or a disability - but I don't think that obesity itself is a sickness/disability, it could be the result/side effect of one though.
In my very humble opinion, as a general rule of thumb, obesity should not be classed as a disabilty.
Any underlying medical conditions that caused/contributed to the obesity problem and/or any medical conditions that are a result of the obesity should be judged on a case by case basis - but a blanket descriptoin of 'being obese = being disabled' shouldn't be the 'normal' prognosis.
Obesity is NOT a sickness - it is just a case of eating too much crap and not getting enough exercise.
Agree. Very sensible post.
Ive been veering between the rudness of some folk making blanket judgements and others making excuses - that post just about sums it up on how I feel about it.
Get over yourself Wonkey. Jesus, are we in the presence of a bloody saint?
Why would anyone wonder "with sympathy" what has led an obese person to be in a mobility scooter. What a crock of shite.
They are overweight due to years of overeating and no exercise. They are now in a scooter because their bodies can no longer support them. They can no longer see their fricking feet for christ sake, and you say a kinder, more tolerant person would wonder what has led them to that state. No. Anyone would look and think exactly the same - they are fat because they eat crap, and are in a scooter because they cannot be bothered to help themselves and get on a bloody diet. Idiot.
Gosh your little world is black and white isn't it? where everyone falls into little boxes of what you think they are.. just by looking at them.. yes people do get fat/obese by overeating. but the reason for it each persons overeating needs to be addressed in order for food not be their freind even though clearly its their enemy..
There are some people who can as wonkeydonkey says look at people and care.. and then their are those who just don't want to see or care.. which is ok. as we are all different..
But to say someone should get over themselves for being a caring person who can see beyond peoples fat/ looks/ is kinda rude...and arrogant to say the least..
That's what I meant by the first part of my post ... some factors that cause obesity may be a sickness or a disability - but I don't think that obesity itself is a sickness/disability, it could be the result/side effect of one though.
Point was well made and executed Was just trying to draw attention to the fact that some disabilities have their roots in self harming type past times.
In my very humble opinion, as a general rule of thumb, obesity should not be classed as a disabilty.
Any underlying medical conditions that caused/contributed to the obesity problem and/or any medical conditions that are a result of the obesity should be judged on a case by case basis - but a blanket descriptoin of 'being obese = being disabled' shouldn't be the 'normal' prognosis.
Obesity is NOT a sickness - it is just a case of eating too much crap and not getting enough exercise.
As I have already said, no one in the world is saying that obesity should be classified as a disability. So what is the point in people attacking such a far-fetched notion? A lot of obese people are perfectly fit and active. The suggestion in the OP seemed to be that people with disabilities who are obese should somehow be put in a different category from people with disabilities who are not obese; it was never clear what punitive action should be taken against the first. Possibly they should be poked with a pointy stick every time they try to go out on their mobility scooters. As has also been pointed out several times, it is in the nature of some disabilities that they tend to lead to obesity. It is hard for the very immobile to take exercise, and high doses of steroids prescribed for severe arthritis tend to pile on the fat. Still, I reckon the pointy sticks are only fair. Being fat in a public place has always made someone a 'revolting pig' as a kindly forum member suggested.
Being fat in a public place has always made someone a 'revolting pig' as a kindly forum member suggested.
I didn't say that, if you wish to quote things that I have said then please do so in an appropriate manner. Some people do eat like revolting pigs, in which case it's their own fault if they become obese through doing so. That is a fact, albeit an unpleasant one. I don't go round pointing at fat people and suggesting that ANY of them eats like a pig. I would appreciate it if you would stop picking parts out of sentences to make it out to be something completely different.
I happen to be at the other end of the spectrum here, I am disabled - no mobility scooter although will probably need one at some point due to a worsening health condition - and I am extremely thin. I have complete strangers come up to me in the street to ask if I have an eating disorder which is hurtful so I don't grant other people the same hurt by asking about their eating habits. I probably eat more than people who are overweight. We are all different. I don't give a flying f**k what weight people are, but if you are someone who puts weight on easily and you carry on eating more than you ought to and THEN become disabled because of it, then there's something wrong there. None of that has ever caused me to poke fun at people who are fat, or suggest that a larger person in a mobility scooter is there through their own doing and you keep on making posts which assume that I have said these things. I haven't.
As I have already said, no one in the world is saying that obesity should be classified as a disability. So what is the point in people attacking such a far-fetched notion? A lot of obese people are perfectly fit and active. The suggestion in the OP seemed to be that people with disabilities who are obese should somehow be put in a different category from people with disabilities who are not obese; it was never clear what punitive action should be taken against the first. Possibly they should be poked with a pointy stick every time they try to go out on their mobility scooters. As has also been pointed out several times, it is in the nature of some disabilities that they tend to lead to obesity. It is hard for the very immobile to take exercise, and high doses of steroids prescribed for severe arthritis tend to pile on the fat. Still, I reckon the pointy sticks are only fair. Being fat in a public place has always made someone a 'revolting pig' as a kindly forum member suggested.
To be honest, I got sick of reading some of the revolting posts on here, so just gave my opinions on the topic rather than respond to the ignorant and insulting FM's.
You can't take a subject like obesity and generalise it - you can't put every obese person in the same basket (they wouldn't fit for a start ) and categorise them all as either lazy, fat pigs or unfortunate victims of circumstance/illness.
Obesity is not an illness - but can be caused by an illness.
Lots of obese people do not suffer with any disability, are perfectly mobile and have no heart or breathing difficulties blah blah blah.
The issue surrounding the question seems (to me) to really be whether or not those who are disabled due to their obesity should be entitled to the associated benefits and assistance from the state that goes with the condition.
In my opinion, those who are disabled due to their obesity caused by overeating should not receive the benefits afforded to others. I do not include those who are disabled because of some other condition and just happen to be obese, or those who have become disabled due to obesity caused by a recognised medical condition (I do not include depression or lack of self esteem in this category).
I am sorry if this view seems harsh or extreme but there is a finite amount of rescources that this nation can spend on those in need. Further, those who have eaten to such an excess so that they are immobile have to accept responsibility for themselves. Further still, obesity is an expanding and serious problem in today's society. I would be in favour of, as a society, paying for stern measures to reduce a person's weight, but not for paying them to continue to eat to the point of making themselves disabled.
Lots of obese people do not suffer with any disability, are perfectly mobile and have no heart or breathing difficulties blah blah blah.
The issue surrounding the question seems (to me) to really be whether or not those who are disabled due to their obesity should be entitled to the associated benefits and assistance from the state that goes with the condition.
In my opinion, those who are disabled due to their obesity caused by overeating should not receive the benefits afforded to others. I do not include those who are disabled because of some other condition and just happen to be obese, or those who have become disabled due to obesity caused by a recognised medical condition (I do not include depression or lack of self esteem in this category).
I am sorry if this view seems harsh or extreme but there is a finite amount of rescources that this nation can spend on those in need. Further, those who have eaten to such an excess so that they are immobile have to accept responsibility for themselves. Further still, obesity is an expanding and serious problem in today's society. I would be in favour of, as a society, paying for stern measures to reduce a person's weight, but not for paying them to continue to eat to the point of making themselves disabled.
So, where do you draw the line on this?
Will people who have been disabled by smoking or drinking or drug abuse be excluded from disability benefits too?
What about people injured doing hobbies such as sport's related disabilities? What about the guy who falls while messing about during rock-climbing and breaks his back?
Will people's own lack of sense or misfortune be held against them when deciding who gets disability benefit and who does not?
Will people who have been disabled by smoking or drinking or drug abuse be excluded from disability benefits too?
What about people injured doing hobbies such as sport's related disabilities? What about the guy who falls while messing about during rock-climbing and breaks his back?
Will people's own lack of sense or misfortune be held against them when deciding who gets disability benefit and who does not?
Setting a VERY dangerous precedent with that view
I haven't set forward a manifesto on which to be voted into power, just my view on what I think is right or not. I accept it may be pretty unworkable.
As for smoking and drinking - medical treatment for their illnesses is different, and would be for overeaters as well. I don't include health care as benefits (although the argument about whether or not smokers should pay for their own health care often rears its head in the press). I take your point though about those who have reached a point where they have become disabled and are on benefits although I can't think of any now (and I don't need to have a gazillion examples thrown at me I accept there will be some).
As for sports or accidents causing injuries, I think obesity disability is easily distinguished. My view is taken on the basis that obesity caused by overeating (and not by medical conditions etc) is essentially a reversable condition. That's what moulds my (to some maybe unpalatable) view about it.
I haven't set forward a manifesto on which to be voted into power, just my view on what I think is right or not. I accept it may be pretty unworkable.
As for smoking and drinking - medical treatment for their illnesses is different, and would be for overeaters as well. I don't include health care as benefits (although the argument about whether or not smokers should pay for their own health care often rears its head in the press). I take your point though about those who have reached a point where they have become disabled and are on benefits although I can't think of any now (and I don't need to have a gazillion examples thrown at me I accept there will be some).
As for sports or accidents causing injuries, I think obesity disability is easily distinguished. My view is taken on the basis that obesity caused by overeating (and not by medical conditions etc) is essentially a reversable condition. That's what moulds my (to some maybe unpalatable) view about it.
Sounds like a bit of a cop out to me ...
'I know it isn't workable, you can't really PROVE that somebody's obesity isn't down to an underlying illness, but at least it gives me the opportunity to rail against fat people as much as I like'
I am extremely thin. I have complete strangers come up to me in the street to ask if I have an eating disorder which is hurtful so I don't grant other people the same hurt by asking about their eating habits. I probably eat more than people who are overweight. .
Fair enough. It is extremely rude imo to go up to strangers and question them about their health or eating habits, and that applies equally whether they are fat or thin.
I don't think it is at all useful to name-call people with extremely disfunctional eating habits. The girl who recently got so much publicity as 'the country's fattest teenager' was said to have reached 30,000 calories a day. There are various words that could be used of someone who shovels 30,000 calories a day into their mouth, but personally I think words such as 'greedy' and 'pig', let alone 'revolting' miss the mark by a very long way. 'Ill' seems more like it. Teenagers are often pretty greedy, in the sense of eating what they want when they want; they are still young, they metabolise food better than they ever will again, and they are not very good at deferring their gratification. But ask an average, even greedy, teenager to eat 30,000 calories and they will feel very sick indeed. Massive overeating is a form of self-harming, comparable to repeatedly cutting onself with a piece of broken glass, and is no more deserving of abuse and name-calling. No one 'chooses' to be covered with scars in the sense of a healthy, considered choice; no one 'chooses' to become so fat that they can't walk. Same.
People are obese because they eat to much. So no, they are not disabled as they have got themselves to that point. Obesity happens over a long time, and it is something which can be changed. I do not think it is fair to put genuinly disabled people in the same category as someone who's greed has caused them health problems.
People are obese because they eat to much. So no, they are not disabled as they have got themselves to that point. Obesity happens over a long time, and it is something which can be changed. I do not think it is fair to put genuinly disabled people in the same category as someone who's greed has caused them health problems.
Are mental health issues a possible disability in your world? Do you think the person who is involved in an accident for instance, where they were breaking the law by speeding and became disabled is any more deserving than someone who is depressed and eats?
Are mental health issues a possible disability in your world? Do you think the person who is involved in an accident for instance, where they were breaking the law by speeding and became disabled is any more deserving than someone who is depressed and eats?
Yes, much more deserving 'in my world'. :rolleyes:
Someone who makes a silly misjudgement and disables themselves for the rest of thier lives, i feel sorry for.
Someone who is depressed, so sits and eats and eats for months on end, entirely aware of what they are doing, i am not.
Bring depressed does not get rid of your logic. You eat too much, you get fat. If they know that being obese will make them more unhappy, but they carry on eating too much, IMO they have no interest in getting better.
Yes, much more deserving 'in my world'. :rolleyes:
Someone who makes a silly misjudgement and disables themselves for the rest of thier lives, i feel sorry for.
Someone who is depressed, so sits and eats and eats for months on end, entirely aware of what they are doing, i am not.
Bring depressed does not get rid of your logic. You eat too much, you get fat. If they know that being obese will make them more unhappy, but they carry on eating too much, IMO they have no interest in getting better.
But it's not like that though.
Once you are overweight, you tend to become quite sad and comfort eat.
A lot of overweight people struggle because they either have no self-worth, no self-control or an underlying health issue.
None of those 3 things is going to make the situation any better - so it becomes a feedback loop and they get bigger and bigger.
The bigger they get, the harder it is to lose weight and the more isolated or sad they might get, so they eat even more !
I would say having 'no interest in getting better' is not further from the truth.
No - but at the same time, people shouldn't be eaing crisps, pies, cakes, chips, kebabs, chocolate, biscuits every single day...
I disagree with this. 99% of the time (except for rare medical conditions) the overweight person actually thinks they don't eat a lot - and the thin person thinks they eat loads.... when as a matter of fact it's the other way around. This has been proven on TV documentaries, when they had their diets monitored.
It isn't. But surely everyone want to look the best the possibly can?
And more than anything... It's also important for medical reasons...
That's a very good point. I remember seeing a programme about an overweight woman who claimed she ate 'hardly anything', when monitored it turned out that she snacked on crisps all day between meals - when called on this she said that she didn't count crisps as they had 'hardly any calories' :eek:. While people are living a free life in a society where food is plentiful and they have enough money to buy it and ample access to it, everything has to be taken with a pinch of salt. Obsesity is a problem in the rich West with our junk food and fat/sugar rich diet, I suspect in third world countries it isn't something many poor people have to worry about. And i think it's far to say that most people - despite claims that they can't lose/gain weight actually do when they are in hospital and where their real food intake can be carefully monitored.
Yes, much more deserving 'in my world'. :rolleyes:
Someone who makes a silly misjudgement and disables themselves for the rest of thier lives, i feel sorry for.
Someone who is depressed, so sits and eats and eats for months on end, entirely aware of what they are doing, i am not.
Bring depressed does not get rid of your logic. You eat too much, you get fat. If they know that being obese will make them more unhappy, but they carry on eating too much, IMO they have no interest in getting better.
So....someone who not only risked their own health and life but those of others in their selfish, arrogant actions is more deserving than someone who has possibly a chemical imbalance in their brain through no fault of their own? Glad I'm not in your world.
Once you are overweight, you tend to become quite sad and comfort eat.
A lot of overweight people struggle because they either have no self-worth, no self-control or an underlying health issue.
None of those 3 things is going to make the situation any better - so it becomes a feedback loop and they get bigger and bigger.
The bigger they get, the harder it is to lose weight and the more isolated or sad they might get, so they eat even more !
I would say having 'no interest in getting better' is not further from the truth.
Lots of people get sad. Lots of people over eat.
If when they realise thier clothes don't fit, and they don't curb their eating, then they put themselves in that postition. You can't blame it on depression.
So....someone who not only risked their own health and life but those of others in their selfish, arrogant actions is more deserving than someone who has possibly a chemical imbalance in their brain through no fault of their own? Glad I'm not in your world.
Everyone has made a bad judgement call and 'speeded' in one way or the other - done something wrong. You do not deserve to have a lifelong disability because of a breif fail of concentration.
Eating until your obese takes time, effort and money. Depressed people are still spending on food, taking the time to go out and buy it, cook it, buy new clothes and eat it. It is very much a conscious decision and something they have willingly done.
I'd be insulted if i were disabled and someone tried to put me in the same catagory as someone who has ate themselves obese. My nan is wheelchair bound, she is by no means comparable to the morbidly obese woman who lives down the road, whom i regularly see in the local fish and chip shop.
Yes, much more deserving 'in my world'. :rolleyes:
Someone who makes a silly misjudgement and disables themselves for the rest of thier lives, i feel sorry for.
Someone who is depressed, so sits and eats and eats for months on end, entirely aware of what they are doing, i am not.
Bring depressed does not get rid of your logic. You eat too much, you get fat. If they know that being obese will make them more unhappy, but they carry on eating too much, IMO they have no interest in getting better.
I have to ask the line i have underlined in your post.. you know this how?
i know someone who is depressed and tried to comit suicide is this logical thinking...?
being depressed can show in many ways , overeating, is one of them.. having no regard for ones life , worthless feeling,, but then again depression is the symptom.. there is usually something that triggers the depression to start with...
I have to ask the line i have underlined in your post.. you know this how?
i know someone who is depressed and tried to comit suicide is this logical thinking...?
being depressed can show in many ways , overeating, is one of them.. having no regard for ones life , worthless feeling,, but then again depression is the symptom.. there is usually something that triggers the depression to start with...
I meant logic in the sense that you still understand if you over eat, you will gain weight. Meaning it is still a 'decision' you are making, as you are aware of what your actions will cause.
I meant logic in the sense that you still understand if you over eat, you will gain weight. Meaning it is still a 'decision' you are making, as you are aware of what your actions will cause.
i know what your saying but, when your depressed,, you may be aware of the logic, but your thought processes change.. you may not care.. at that moment in time that your eating for all the wrong reasons..
Do you apply this logic to people who cause car crashes by speeding , they too should understand the logic ... also smokers, and people who drink to much ,, drug addicts.. they all know the logical outcome of there actions yet still do it..
same as people with anorexia... it all comes down to the state of mind your in...
The mind can be a devious sod at times... you can carry on fooling yourself everything is fine ,, until you breakdown and realise your life is shit..
i know what your saying but, when your depressed,, you may be aware of the logic, but your thought processes change.. you may not care.. at that moment in time that your eating for all the wrong reasons..
Do you apply this logic to people who cause car crashes by speeding , they too should understand the logic ... also smokers, and people who drink to much ,, drug addicts.. they all know the logical outcome of there actions yet still do it..
same as people with anorexia... it all comes down to the state of mind your in...
The mind can be a devious sod at times... you can carry on fooling yourself everything is fine ,, until you breakdown and realise your life is shit..
If you are sitting down, in your XXXL trousers and you dial a pizza, you are aware of what you are doing. Depressed or not.
If you speed to get home 5 mins faster, and you spin out of control and crash, you did not realise this would happen before you started speeding.
If you light up a ****, you are aware it may give you cancer, but it's a chance, not a definate.
Comments
I wasn't arsed about your opinion. It was your condescending and insulting tone, not to mention childish name-calling, that I deemed rude.
That's what I meant by the first part of my post ... some factors that cause obesity may be a sickness or a disability - but I don't think that obesity itself is a sickness/disability, it could be the result/side effect of one though.
Agree. Very sensible post.
Ive been veering between the rudness of some folk making blanket judgements and others making excuses - that post just about sums it up on how I feel about it.
Gosh your little world is black and white isn't it? where everyone falls into little boxes of what you think they are.. just by looking at them.. yes people do get fat/obese by overeating. but the reason for it each persons overeating needs to be addressed in order for food not be their freind even though clearly its their enemy..
There are some people who can as wonkeydonkey says look at people and care.. and then their are those who just don't want to see or care.. which is ok. as we are all different..
But to say someone should get over themselves for being a caring person who can see beyond peoples fat/ looks/ is kinda rude...and arrogant to say the least..
Point was well made and executed
As I have already said, no one in the world is saying that obesity should be classified as a disability. So what is the point in people attacking such a far-fetched notion? A lot of obese people are perfectly fit and active. The suggestion in the OP seemed to be that people with disabilities who are obese should somehow be put in a different category from people with disabilities who are not obese; it was never clear what punitive action should be taken against the first. Possibly they should be poked with a pointy stick every time they try to go out on their mobility scooters. As has also been pointed out several times, it is in the nature of some disabilities that they tend to lead to obesity. It is hard for the very immobile to take exercise, and high doses of steroids prescribed for severe arthritis tend to pile on the fat. Still, I reckon the pointy sticks are only fair. Being fat in a public place has always made someone a 'revolting pig' as a kindly forum member suggested.
I didn't say that, if you wish to quote things that I have said then please do so in an appropriate manner. Some people do eat like revolting pigs, in which case it's their own fault if they become obese through doing so. That is a fact, albeit an unpleasant one. I don't go round pointing at fat people and suggesting that ANY of them eats like a pig. I would appreciate it if you would stop picking parts out of sentences to make it out to be something completely different.
I happen to be at the other end of the spectrum here, I am disabled - no mobility scooter although will probably need one at some point due to a worsening health condition - and I am extremely thin. I have complete strangers come up to me in the street to ask if I have an eating disorder which is hurtful so I don't grant other people the same hurt by asking about their eating habits. I probably eat more than people who are overweight. We are all different. I don't give a flying f**k what weight people are, but if you are someone who puts weight on easily and you carry on eating more than you ought to and THEN become disabled because of it, then there's something wrong there. None of that has ever caused me to poke fun at people who are fat, or suggest that a larger person in a mobility scooter is there through their own doing and you keep on making posts which assume that I have said these things. I haven't.
To be honest, I got sick of reading some of the revolting posts on here, so just gave my opinions on the topic rather than respond to the ignorant and insulting FM's.
You can't take a subject like obesity and generalise it - you can't put every obese person in the same basket (they wouldn't fit for a start
Obesity is not an illness - but can be caused by an illness.
Lots of obese people do not suffer with any disability, are perfectly mobile and have no heart or breathing difficulties blah blah blah.
The issue surrounding the question seems (to me) to really be whether or not those who are disabled due to their obesity should be entitled to the associated benefits and assistance from the state that goes with the condition.
In my opinion, those who are disabled due to their obesity caused by overeating should not receive the benefits afforded to others. I do not include those who are disabled because of some other condition and just happen to be obese, or those who have become disabled due to obesity caused by a recognised medical condition (I do not include depression or lack of self esteem in this category).
I am sorry if this view seems harsh or extreme but there is a finite amount of rescources that this nation can spend on those in need. Further, those who have eaten to such an excess so that they are immobile have to accept responsibility for themselves. Further still, obesity is an expanding and serious problem in today's society. I would be in favour of, as a society, paying for stern measures to reduce a person's weight, but not for paying them to continue to eat to the point of making themselves disabled.
So, where do you draw the line on this?
Will people who have been disabled by smoking or drinking or drug abuse be excluded from disability benefits too?
What about people injured doing hobbies such as sport's related disabilities? What about the guy who falls while messing about during rock-climbing and breaks his back?
Will people's own lack of sense or misfortune be held against them when deciding who gets disability benefit and who does not?
Setting a VERY dangerous precedent with that view
I haven't set forward a manifesto on which to be voted into power, just my view on what I think is right or not. I accept it may be pretty unworkable.
As for smoking and drinking - medical treatment for their illnesses is different, and would be for overeaters as well. I don't include health care as benefits (although the argument about whether or not smokers should pay for their own health care often rears its head in the press). I take your point though about those who have reached a point where they have become disabled and are on benefits although I can't think of any now (and I don't need to have a gazillion examples thrown at me I accept there will be some).
As for sports or accidents causing injuries, I think obesity disability is easily distinguished. My view is taken on the basis that obesity caused by overeating (and not by medical conditions etc) is essentially a reversable condition. That's what moulds my (to some maybe unpalatable) view about it.
Sounds like a bit of a cop out to me ...
'I know it isn't workable, you can't really PROVE that somebody's obesity isn't down to an underlying illness, but at least it gives me the opportunity to rail against fat people as much as I like'
Fair enough. It is extremely rude imo to go up to strangers and question them about their health or eating habits, and that applies equally whether they are fat or thin.
I don't think it is at all useful to name-call people with extremely disfunctional eating habits. The girl who recently got so much publicity as 'the country's fattest teenager' was said to have reached 30,000 calories a day. There are various words that could be used of someone who shovels 30,000 calories a day into their mouth, but personally I think words such as 'greedy' and 'pig', let alone 'revolting' miss the mark by a very long way. 'Ill' seems more like it. Teenagers are often pretty greedy, in the sense of eating what they want when they want; they are still young, they metabolise food better than they ever will again, and they are not very good at deferring their gratification. But ask an average, even greedy, teenager to eat 30,000 calories and they will feel very sick indeed. Massive overeating is a form of self-harming, comparable to repeatedly cutting onself with a piece of broken glass, and is no more deserving of abuse and name-calling. No one 'chooses' to be covered with scars in the sense of a healthy, considered choice; no one 'chooses' to become so fat that they can't walk. Same.
Are mental health issues a possible disability in your world? Do you think the person who is involved in an accident for instance, where they were breaking the law by speeding and became disabled is any more deserving than someone who is depressed and eats?
Yes, much more deserving 'in my world'. :rolleyes:
Someone who makes a silly misjudgement and disables themselves for the rest of thier lives, i feel sorry for.
Someone who is depressed, so sits and eats and eats for months on end, entirely aware of what they are doing, i am not.
Bring depressed does not get rid of your logic. You eat too much, you get fat. If they know that being obese will make them more unhappy, but they carry on eating too much, IMO they have no interest in getting better.
But it's not like that though.
Once you are overweight, you tend to become quite sad and comfort eat.
A lot of overweight people struggle because they either have no self-worth, no self-control or an underlying health issue.
None of those 3 things is going to make the situation any better - so it becomes a feedback loop and they get bigger and bigger.
The bigger they get, the harder it is to lose weight and the more isolated or sad they might get, so they eat even more !
I would say having 'no interest in getting better' is not further from the truth.
That's a very good point. I remember seeing a programme about an overweight woman who claimed she ate 'hardly anything', when monitored it turned out that she snacked on crisps all day between meals - when called on this she said that she didn't count crisps as they had 'hardly any calories' :eek:. While people are living a free life in a society where food is plentiful and they have enough money to buy it and ample access to it, everything has to be taken with a pinch of salt. Obsesity is a problem in the rich West with our junk food and fat/sugar rich diet, I suspect in third world countries it isn't something many poor people have to worry about. And i think it's far to say that most people - despite claims that they can't lose/gain weight actually do when they are in hospital and where their real food intake can be carefully monitored.
So....someone who not only risked their own health and life but those of others in their selfish, arrogant actions is more deserving than someone who has possibly a chemical imbalance in their brain through no fault of their own? Glad I'm not in your world.
Lots of people get sad. Lots of people over eat.
If when they realise thier clothes don't fit, and they don't curb their eating, then they put themselves in that postition. You can't blame it on depression.
Everyone has made a bad judgement call and 'speeded' in one way or the other - done something wrong. You do not deserve to have a lifelong disability because of a breif fail of concentration.
Eating until your obese takes time, effort and money. Depressed people are still spending on food, taking the time to go out and buy it, cook it, buy new clothes and eat it. It is very much a conscious decision and something they have willingly done.
I'd be insulted if i were disabled and someone tried to put me in the same catagory as someone who has ate themselves obese. My nan is wheelchair bound, she is by no means comparable to the morbidly obese woman who lives down the road, whom i regularly see in the local fish and chip shop.
I have to ask the line i have underlined in your post.. you know this how?
i know someone who is depressed and tried to comit suicide is this logical thinking...?
being depressed can show in many ways , overeating, is one of them.. having no regard for ones life , worthless feeling,, but then again depression is the symptom.. there is usually something that triggers the depression to start with...
I meant logic in the sense that you still understand if you over eat, you will gain weight. Meaning it is still a 'decision' you are making, as you are aware of what your actions will cause.
i know what your saying but, when your depressed,, you may be aware of the logic, but your thought processes change.. you may not care.. at that moment in time that your eating for all the wrong reasons..
Do you apply this logic to people who cause car crashes by speeding , they too should understand the logic ... also smokers, and people who drink to much ,, drug addicts.. they all know the logical outcome of there actions yet still do it..
same as people with anorexia... it all comes down to the state of mind your in...
The mind can be a devious sod at times... you can carry on fooling yourself everything is fine ,, until you breakdown and realise your life is shit..
If you are sitting down, in your XXXL trousers and you dial a pizza, you are aware of what you are doing. Depressed or not.
If you speed to get home 5 mins faster, and you spin out of control and crash, you did not realise this would happen before you started speeding.
If you light up a ****, you are aware it may give you cancer, but it's a chance, not a definate.
These are not comparable situations.