American Politics; A Disgrace
Coming from the UK and having watched the government shutdown happen in the United States, I am somewhat disgusted by the level of party politics presently existing in the United States. Ordinary folks no longer come first. Nor does compromise. Both parties should be ashamed of themselves. And the President, well, the buck has to stop with him - he might have a right-wing Republican house to tackle but Mr Obama has been elected for hard times like this, to show the kind of leadership that comes with the title commander in-chief. Thoughts?
http://reviewingpolitics.blogspot.com/2013/10/american-politics-becoming-disgrace.html
http://reviewingpolitics.blogspot.com/2013/10/american-politics-becoming-disgrace.html
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I only have a cursory knowledge of this. It seems as if some disgruntled people are trying to halt the progress of something which has already been scrutinised and agreed.
LOL, what on earth has any of it got to do with capitalism?
This is the US political constitution - working as designed, funnily enough.
Regards,
Cypher
The US is the prime Capitalist state.
If any supposed Socialist state was throwing hundreds of thousands of its workers out on unpaid leave and the state itself could shortly go bust then you would be crowing about the shortcomings of the system.
I seem to recall you going on about shortages of toilet paper in Venezuela, for instance (which isn't even Socialist) - compared to this such a thing isn't worth mentioning!
Politics rather than capitalism, surely?
Some pointers as to why it's happening here.
Well the blame rests with all of them as they didn't come to a negotiated agreement before they hit the debt ceiling.
Funny how shortcomings in any Socialist -type states are always the fault of the system, rather than internal politics there, isn't it?
The Capitalist system can do no wrong, seemingly - it's "just politics".
Unfortunately the right wing of the Republican party have become so consensus averse that the system doesn't work at the moment. The Right (The Tea Party) have a kamikaze approach to the Democrats and their policies (and particularly this president) and unfortunately the more moderate members of the Republican Party are going along with them, because if they don't they know a Tea Party candidate will be run against them at the next election and either beat them, or split the vote so that the Democrat candidate wins. It is terrible politics, but it is being driven by a fringe group and isn't really a systemic issue imo
How government organises and conducts itself has got nothing to do with capitalism.
Capitalism, as I'd define it, means private ownership and free markets; you see it more as defining a relationship between employer and employees.
So what's a crisis of government got to do with anything?
Wasn't me...
Regards,
Cypher
I don't think the debt ceiling measures run out until Oct 22nd. I'm not sure why its having an effect right now.
That seems about right. This isn't a Democrat vs Republican problem but one that is between the Republican moderates and the Tea Party nutcases.
Obamacare has been passed by Congress and has been upheld by the courts. It's a nasty compromise of a law with many, many, problems but it's not worth crashing the US economy over. If the lunatics want to bring it down then they can wait until the next election to do it.
I hope this is over soon if only to stop hearing the word "defunding" used on the news.
So if there is a governmental crisis in any Socialist state you wouldn't extend that as being a condemnation of the system?
Good.
The ACA has passed into law, it has been voted on, revised, legally challenged by the Republicans over 40 times and is now in effect.
As far as I can tell a certain section of the Republican party seem to be saying 'repeal ACA or we will f*ck up the American economy', there is no room for negotiation.
What I found most surprising when researching the situation was that ACA was in fact a Republican idea, they're holding their country hostage trying to repeal a bill which their own party came up with. It beggars belief.
The capitalist system can certainly "do wrong" - but that's not what we have here. We have politicians playing the time-honoured game of brinkmanship and I'm sure that also happens in socialist-style governments.
If it's having a negative effect on production that would otherwise be in private hands, then yes.
Regards,
Cypher
Indeed. One of the state healthcare systems that Obamacare was based on was the Massachusetts health care reform law (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Massachusetts_health_care_reform) signed into law in 2006 when the Governor was...err.... Mitt Romney. In some ways, Massachusetts' "Romneycare" goes further than Obama's ACA. MA consistently comes near the top of comparisons of state healthcare systems in the US: http://www.americashealthrankings.org/rankings
Most definitely - but I am constantly told by certain posters on here that any shortcomings, even when caused by political machinations and failings, is endemic to the system.
Sorry, you've lost me again.
If something happened negative in a (hypothetical) Socialist state that was caused by political infighting you would see that as a failing in the whole system?
That's probably because politics and the system are comprehensively interlinked in socialist-style states. It really is the ultimate top-down management structure. The arrangement is obviously very different in most capitalist countries.
JMO obv.
What I don't understand is why the moderate Republicans don't vote with the Dems to break the logjam.
It's ridiculous to blame Obama - he has only 2 options - to roll over and accept, or to tough it out.
I love Bill Maher on the Tea Baggers.
"They named themselves after a gay sex practice that involves one man dragging his testicles across the face of his partner. To think - they've taken that and turned into something depraved".
BREAKING: Obama: House Speaker John Boehner is the only thing keeping the government shut down.
No, it really isn't.
You are confusing Soviet-style state Capitalism with what a modern democratic Socialist state would be like, with its mix of direct state control together with workers co-operatives and a private sector.
But I don't want to go into another "What is Socialism" thing!
I like it a lot:D