12 Monkeys (Season 1 *US Pace*)
T.K.
Posts: 19,502 Forum Member
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I couldn't find a US Pace thread for 12 Monkeys, so thought I'd make one for those who've watched the show and wanted to post their views about the latest episodes.
Anyway, I'm enjoying the series so far. It's nothing spectacular, but it's still very good and entertaining. Hopefully it can build into a great show for years to come. As I mentioned in the UK Pace thread, it's not completely faithful to the 1995 film and is a retelling of that story. However, it does stick to the basic premise and setup of the movie. I do feel some of the changes were needed to make it work as a TV show, so I fully support the creators on this.
I have a feeling they may go the mystical/sci-fi route with this version of 12 Monkeys.... just a hunch I got from the spontaneous appearances of the monkey symbols in major cities across the world - how are they connected to the outbreak of the plague? Is it some form of subliminal messaging to activate sleeper agents to spread the virus?
And then there was that freaky guy in a gas mask that Jennifer Goines saw at the end of episode 2 when she was being held captive by the bad guys. It's easy to miss, but if you pause it, you'll catch a glimpse of this guy in the shadows. Who or what was that?
Feel free to post your views.
Anyway, I'm enjoying the series so far. It's nothing spectacular, but it's still very good and entertaining. Hopefully it can build into a great show for years to come. As I mentioned in the UK Pace thread, it's not completely faithful to the 1995 film and is a retelling of that story. However, it does stick to the basic premise and setup of the movie. I do feel some of the changes were needed to make it work as a TV show, so I fully support the creators on this.
I have a feeling they may go the mystical/sci-fi route with this version of 12 Monkeys.... just a hunch I got from the spontaneous appearances of the monkey symbols in major cities across the world - how are they connected to the outbreak of the plague? Is it some form of subliminal messaging to activate sleeper agents to spread the virus?
And then there was that freaky guy in a gas mask that Jennifer Goines saw at the end of episode 2 when she was being held captive by the bad guys. It's easy to miss, but if you pause it, you'll catch a glimpse of this guy in the shadows. Who or what was that?
Feel free to post your views.
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Comments
I do also wonder whether The Witness is something else (rather than Human); or if not, then a Time Traveler himself, trying to create yet another future.
Additionally, we caught more close-up glimpses of the freaky guy in the gas mask, who is dubbed "The Witness" as mentioned by Flash525. Looks like he's the Big Bad behind the Army of the 12 Monkeys, the guy doesn't seem human to me
I really liked the part of the episode where Railly starts hallucinating the red forest and the Witness, I found it very eerie and haunting. Would love to know what on earth is going on though
Anyway, good stuff. Looking forward to the next episode very shortly.
Things are a bit too messy to understand what is going on. I don't need things sign posting but I would like to have some idea that the show has a direction rather than making it up as it goes along.
Time travel shows work best when they've been planned out properly.
I'll carry on with it but may have to watch it in one go when the season finishes.
So, to cover up its illegal goings on and to silence the Snowden-style whistleblower, the CIA decided to go with an OTT assassination plan involving the illegal use of a insanely deadly bioweapon, rather than send in SEALs or use a drone... only to end up having to use a drone anyway after it was pointed out how insanely risky it was to have used such a virus.
What kind of idiot would have come up with such a plan?
And of course we know that Cole will have splintered at the last second, and we know that there will still be more of the virus out there somewhere for the 12 Monkeys to acquire...
He's already getting nosebleeds each time he jumps and used up three jumps in the latest episode alone.
His next jump will no doubt be the 1987 one and he'll probably have one or two jumps in each of the remaining episodes of Season 1.
So by the end of the season he'll probably have jumped something like 10 - 20 times since Jones told him he had a limited amount of jumps left.
Are they planning for Cole to die at the end of this season as I Don't think they would have introduced the idea of a limited amount of jumps so early on in the show if they were planning on Cole still jumping in Seasons 2, 3, 4 etc.
I think Cole will end up staying permanently in Cassie's timeline to avoid dying from jumping back and forth, and then maybe Ramse will start jumping and act as a go between for the past and future teams
So you think this will differ totally from the movie? And the 12 monkeys are a group actually interested in the virus?
Remember the whole ironice point of the 12 monkeys in the movie is that they where just an animal liberation group and they set some animals free from the zoo.
To have the 12 monkeys now be the actual group who release the virus would be a massive shift.
Isn't that the paradox?
They future team created the Army of the 12 Monkeys by trying to find them in the first place just because of a name they found.
In the scenes in the night room when Cole got close to the human remains that were the origins of the virus he got bad head pains.
This was because he was standing so close to himself!
Cole is the original origin of the virus, it was his remains!
Yes that would make sense and be a good idea.
I think it's already clear that the TV series has undergone this "massive shift".
In the film, there was *one* person who wanted to use the virus to wipe out humanity, one lone nut, while the "Army of the 12 Monkeys" were just a bunch of animal rights protesters led by Goines' son.
In the TV series, it has already been clearly shown that there is actually a full-on conspiracy, with a sinister group behind the efforts to acquire the virus and use it to wipe out humanity, a sinister group called the Army of the 12 Monkeys.
The series is already quite radically different from the film in that regard and in others.
Yup, I think that's probably going to be the case. It's an obvious twist.
Those remains have also been torched now (in the past-present anyway). Furthermore, how would someone who is immune to the virus be the cause of it? I wouldn't half be surprised if that scene was intended to get people speculating this way, and that the headache was a mere side effect of time jumping.
Then again, even if this is the case, couldn't it all change? This is a show about time travel and paradoxes after all.
I think it'll be revealed sooner rather than later, as they seem to be moving the story along quite quickly - plus they're already discussing Cole not having many jumps left.
Maybe most of this will be wrapped up in this season, with Season 2 (if there is one) launching into a whole new story.
He could be an asymptomatic carrier - like "Typhoid Mary" was.
Not even the CIA would be stupid enough to unleash such a deadly virus, just to kill ONE lone traitor. All feels a bit shoehorned in and contrived.
If they're going down a new route, and with a different story, then what's the point of the story - if that makes sense.
The current plot is to stop a virus that will destroy a vast majority of humankind, and in turn resetting the future (or rather, resetting the past so that the future turns out differently). Right? So if the virus situation is all figured out, they've got the future that they've always wanted. If a new threat comes about, they're still going to have a different (virus free) future. Where's the endgame?
This is why time travel shows don't always work out as they could/should; there's not enough forethought into the elements of changing time. The future that Kol accidentally visited where his mate was in charge, how do we know that isn't suppose to be the 'true' future? By definition, they could forever be jumping through time trying to create paradise, when paradise is never going to exist. There needs to be an endgame.
Hmm. True.
We will probably soon find out that the CIA intended for the virus to get out elsewhere, they (or rather, an organization from within) just used this guy as an initiation tool.
That would be a good twist and would certainly explain why the CIA were so keen on using the virus for Operation Troy. There has to be more to this storyline.
I also thought it was interesting that the Snowden wannabe seemed to know about the 12 Monkeys, maybe the real reason he left the CIA is because he knew the 12 Monkeys infiltrated the agency?
Yup.
Oh sure, they thought that it would be OK because it kills in a few hours and so nobody would make it to a populated area in time to infect more... but they clearly didn't consider that the Chechens would radio for help, which was surely an obvious possibility?
Why on earth use such a *deadly* virus? Utter madness, no matter how desperate they were to silence the whistleblower.
Hell, if a drone or other airstrike was not feasible as a first option, due to risk of angering Russia, and sending in special forces was also a no no, why not just stick a BOMB in the briefcase, given that they had compromised the courier anyway? Better a bomb than a doomsday virus!
I've no idea.
I just figured that as it hasn't been renewed yet (AFAIK), they would have planned at least some resolution to aspects of the current story.
I can't imagine it being able to stick with 'we must stop the virus' for 3-4 seasons, they're going to need to develop it somehow, I suspect it'll be something to do with that red forest figure (The Witness?)
I'm half expecting this series to be another LOST; at least in the sense that they'll plan each series out, shoot and produce them, and there will be no definite ending. That's one of the problems with time travel shows; there's always the potential to go back (or forward) in time (again) and undo whatever has been done to change the timeline in the first place.
In this show, it's Kol's mission to go back and stop a virus to make a better future, yet by doing so, for all anybody knows, that may make an even worse future. Truth be told, nobody knows what the future is suppose to be, and if they're forever changing it depending on what they change in the past, then which future is the prime/true one?
Baffling stuff.
btw, when you next get a splinter, do you immediately try to remove it or think "hey, maybe the future stemming from me leaving that piece of wood inside me will be better than the one in which I removed it" and then leave it in you ?
Forgive my pedantry, but it's Cole not Kol.
If it irritates me, it's coming out.
I've been watching The Originals too, there's a character in that called Kol; the two names are similar.